posted on August 14, 2004 11:44:23 PM new
Logansdad said;
I do not feel sorry for the wife at all. Why? because she will walk away with big fat settlement at the end of all this.
I think this is a cold and calous statement, to make money the lowest common denominator in all of this. Has it been said in any of the news reports that there will be a divorce??
Did any of you think that possibly the reason why she stood up with him at the news conference was/is because she still loves him and Logansdad did you ever think that she may have married for love and NOT money?? I mean hey he is the father of her children. Yes he did something bad, very bad in some peoples opinion, not so bad in others. Is this reason enough to just stop loving your spouse because you find he is homosexual.
All I'm saying is how can anyone possibly know what she is going through. Sure you can use your own experiences to try to understand this, but still you can't possibly know exactly how she feels about him.
And now for my little bit-o-humour that I feel that I must add to this thread, my typing fingers are itching and I just can't help myself. I sure hope he burned that blue suit rather than keeping it for a momento.
posted on August 15, 2004 07:57:50 PM new
When I found out, AIDS was just hitting the news. From what I understood, you could carry HIV for up to 8 years, without having AIDS. That means I slept with EVERYONE HE SLEPT WITH AND EVERYONE THEY SLEPT WITH FOR 8 YEARS.
logansdad- The callousness of your attitude toward his wife is also how you feel about anyone in that position, including myself and my children. They put our lives in danger and let me tell you, I sweat those 8 years through no fault of my own. I wonder how many "innocents" contracted this disease because a spouse couldn't keep it in his pants or another's out of his mouth. Kind of makes me wonder if you have put another in this position...would explain alot.
posted on August 15, 2004 08:33:17 PM new
I think I can understand what you went through for all those years, twig. It's a nightmare...according to the two women I know that this also happened to.
One of them never suspected her husband was gay....she swears she never saw any thing that led her to believe he was anything other than a 'red blooded American male'. They both were heavily involved in their church....were still having normal sexual relations...and she didn't find out until he was dying from AIDS.
She has shared the oh-so-mixed-emotions she went though. Here you love this man, he's the father of your young children, he's now seriously ill and dying and you feel obgligated to take care of him...want to take care of him.....BUT you have such unbelievable anger and hurt to deal with....along with [she shared] the reaction of those suppose 'friends' when they find out what your dying husband is drying from. They avoid you, him and your family like they never knew you....they're scared...you're scared...and you have all these mixed emotions to deal with while continuing to work, raise your children, get through all the emotional stuff...etc.
She's 11 years down the road now....her husband died quickly...and she shares she still ocassionally deals with bouts of anger at what he put them all through with his 'secret lifestyle'.
But she was a survivor, like you....and she did make it though....but with worry the whole time what would happen to her children IF she did become 'positive' herself.
posted on August 16, 2004 04:42:14 AM new
Yellow: Has it been said in any of the news reports that there will be a divorce??
No, but it is almost a given. How many women do you know that have stayed "married" to their husbands after the husband admitted they were gay.
Did any of you think that possibly the reason why she stood up with him at the news conference was/is because she still loves him and Logansdad did you ever think that she may have married for love and NOT money??
I know she still loves him and care about him, just like I feel he still loves and cares about her. However the love that he needs he can not get from her. There is a difference between "loving someone" and "being in love with someone". Clearly he in not love with his wife.
Let's have a BBQ, Texas style, ROAST BUSH
------------------------------
YOU CAN'T HAVE BULLSH** WITH OUT BUSH.
------------------------------
We the people, in order to form a more perfect Union....
.....one Nation indivisible, With Liberty and Justice for ALL.
posted on August 16, 2004 05:03:37 AM new
twig: When I found out, AIDS was just hitting the news. From what I understood, you could carry HIV for up to 8 years, without having AIDS. That means I slept with EVERYONE HE SLEPT WITH AND EVERYONE THEY SLEPT WITH FOR 8 YEARS.
...just like you slept with everyone he did before you got married to him. You do not know if he slept with 2, 20, 200 or none before you were married. Did you know his sexually history? Did you ask him? If you did how do you know he told the truth? If you are going to be sexually active then you need to have an HIV test done regularly.
logansdad- The callousness of your attitude toward his wife is also how you feel about anyone in that position, including myself and my children.
It is my opinion and I am sorry you don't like it. I tell it like it is. I don't sugar coat anything. Sometimes people need a dose of reality. This is the 21st century and not the "Leave it to Beaver" world you want to live in.
I wonder how many "innocents" contracted this disease because a spouse couldn't keep it in his pants or another's out of his mouth.
This disease has been around for over 20 years now. If you do not know how it is contracted then you should not be having sex. "Innocents" do not get HIV, stupid people who do not practice safe sex get it, drug users who share needles get it. Innocent people that get it are people who get it via a blood transfusion (rare now these days), babies who get it from their mothers, or people who contract it from a physician through accidental blood exchange.
It sounds like you and your husband didn't practice safe sex
Let's have a BBQ, Texas style, ROAST BUSH
------------------------------
YOU CAN'T HAVE BULLSH** WITH OUT BUSH.
------------------------------
We the people, in order to form a more perfect Union....
.....one Nation indivisible, With Liberty and Justice for ALL.
"It is my opinion and I am sorry you don't like it. I tell it like it is. I don't sugar coat anything. Sometimes people need a dose of reality. This is the 21st century and not the "Leave it to Beaver" world you want to live in."
Having consideration for other people and your family is still a part of our world, logansdad. Your callous insisitivity toward women in particular has been demonstrated several times in this thread.
posted on August 16, 2004 07:40:07 AM newYour callous insisitivity toward women in particular has been demonstrated several times in this thread.
Helen, if you look I never said I approved of what the governor did. My opinions are that of what those who claim the wife was a vicitim and what she may or may not have contracted. If she is having sex she has to assume everyone is HIV+ and has to protect herself.
I am sure if the situation was reversed where the wife cheated on the husband many here would not be saying the husband is a victim.
Let's have a BBQ, Texas style, ROAST BUSH
------------------------------
YOU CAN'T HAVE BULLSH** WITH OUT BUSH.
------------------------------
We the people, in order to form a more perfect Union....
.....one Nation indivisible, With Liberty and Justice for ALL.
posted on August 16, 2004 08:15:35 AM new I am sure if the situation was reversed where the wife cheated on the husband many here would not be saying the husband is a victim.
In the same situation, I would. But then I am more sensitive than most people. And I don't consider that quality a weakness but an admirable characteristic of any human being...male or female. In fact, lack of sensitivity contributes to the intolerance that results in unfair treatment of gays.
This is not a personal attack on you but, very frankly, it is people LIKE YOU that cause McGreevy to marry even though they know they are gay. YOU and YOUR right wing bible thumping conservative bigots caused this. If we lived in a society where a person could be themselves, without having to fit into the "norm" then this would have not happened. However, because of people like you, it happens and will continue to happen until society is more accepting of gay men and women and the issue of gay marriage. When will these people ever learn it's NONE of their business who sleeps with whom.
As I have said before, I live in Michigan. I have a gay friend who managed an gay oriented bookstore. He once told me there are so many gay men that work in high corporate positions for the Detroit auto makers and who are married. The reason? They excel MUCH FASTER in the corporate world when they are married. The gay man looks like he belongs to the typical American family when he has a wife and a couple of kids. Again, a lie. He is gay as them make them. This of course caused by the standards of society.
Since gay people aren't going to go away, society needs to change the attitude towards them.
Also, the population of children born with AIDS in Africa is about 40 percent.
About two months ago, Detroit TV station WDIV did a story about teenagers with AIDS. The story was about these kids who were born to mothers who passed the AIDS virus to them at birth. Now these kids, who were kept alive by the advances in AIDS drugs, are aged 14 and 15 are becoming sexually active. The problem is they are now spreading the virus to their partners. This of course will only get worse. Also, about half of all new AIDS cases are among the 25 and under crowd.
It seems to me that everyone should recall and consider the fact that Jimmy Swaggart, a married religious leader, paid for sex and spent a night with a trashy hooker too. This only differs in the fact this was short term employment.
Bigots are miserable people. Prevent Bigotry through Education.
“Our enemies are innovative and resourceful, and so are we! They never stop thinking about new ways to harm our country and our people, and neither do we.” ~ George W. Bush, 8/5/04
posted on August 16, 2004 01:51:08 PM new
Yeager, although I agree with your statement that the majority of Society does not accept Homosexuality, I disagree that you can put the blame on Society for the actions of the individual.
An individual whether he is gay or straight, knows the difference between the truth and a lie. The individual chooses to live a lie..Society's pressures may influence his decision, but basically when it comes right down to it.. he/she chooses to live in truth or lie.. When a homosexual chooses to live a lifestyle which is a lie, that lie often wrecks the lives of those he has lied to.
I think that Homosexuality acceptance has changed so much in my lifetime alone. I remember as a youngster, only hearing whispers of this lifestyle.. let alone ever seeing a gay couple, out in the open.. Now, it is in the open, even on our TV programs.. .. just think about this.. we see gay couples on TV much more often than we see black and white couples! So, I think Society is learning to be more accepting... DRdo
posted on August 16, 2004 02:05:49 PM new
Herpes is more common among the younger generation today than AIDS.
-sig file -------we eat to live,not live to eat.
Benjamin Franklin
Choice is made difficult and in some cases impossible, for example in the case of marriage, by a society that is intolerant and discriminates. When there is unequal opportunity it's the fault of society. Although it's true that you can't legislate beliefs, it is possible to legislate fair and equal treatment of all members of a society. Better education is the only answer to the underlying problem, ignorance, that leads to such intolerance in our society.
posted on August 16, 2004 02:57:17 PM new
logansdad- Well, gee, it never dawned on me, at 18, when you never heard of HIV, to ask my fiance, who asked me to marry him, if he was a homosexual, or if he carried the AIDS virus. When he told me I was his "First Love", I believed him. BTW, I wasn't a big "slutbag" either. And yes, we discussed what I thought was "everything". So when he made his "revelation", it came as a shock. Also, I don't know how many times YOU'VE been married, but a married person, whose spouse is supposedly faithful, doesn't use a condom everytime they have sex, especially if they are starting a family. And by "innocents" I mean faithful spouses who contract ANY disease from one who is not.
Why don't you ask Vanna if you can buy a vowel, you have no clue.
posted on August 16, 2004 03:07:45 PM new"Innocents" do not get HIV, stupid people who do not practice safe sex get it, drug users who share needles get it.
So...according to you all people, including gay men, who have contacted HIV/aids are stupid huh?
Wonder where all the gay marriage supporters are now with their talk of hateful comments.
-----------------------
yeager -
it is people LIKE YOU that cause McGreevy to marry even though they know they are gay.
No you are so very wrong. Many people who are gay are out of the closet and honest with those around them, especially in this day and age. It's not at all my fault at he lacked the personal character to be truthful and not lead a deceptive lifestyle. There are many gays who are honest with everyone....and he chose to lie about it. His actions are his own responsibility - show his own lack of character, yeager.
YOU and YOUR right wing bible thumping conservative bigots caused this.
Nope, HIS action caused this - no one else is to blame. And besides that, I'm not a Bible thumper.
When will these people ever learn it's NONE of their business who sleeps with whom. When they quit asking the government [read taxpayers] to pay for their resulting illness - which their stupid actions [according to logansdad] have caused it in the first place.
posted on August 16, 2004 03:16:35 PM newSo, I think Society is learning to be more accepting...
DrD
I'm not so sure that I totally agree with that. Could it be that just certain areas of society is more accepting like in the media? As far as the rest of society and the media viewing public the homosexual lifstyle is being forced on us weather we like it or not.
They are forcing their lifestyle on us in other ways as well like with their homosexual pride parades. You don't see anyone have heterosexual pride parades, why is that?? The answer is that heterosexuals don't need to shove their lifestle in anyones face.
"They are forcing their lifestyle on us in other ways as well like with their homosexual pride parades. You don't see anyone have heterosexual pride parades, why is that?? The answer is that heterosexuals don't need to shove their lifestyle in anyones face."
"Why is that?" That may be because heterosexuals don't need to reinforce pride that has been denied them throughout history. As you suggested, heterosexuals don't need to fight to have their life style affirmed. Just look around and you will see that so much is based on heterosexual concerns. Look at advertising, for example. It's difficult to find an advertisement that is not either deliberately or subliminally focused on the heterosexual.
posted on August 16, 2004 04:04:16 PM new
Twig: Well, gee, it never dawned on me, at 18, when you never heard of HIV, to ask my fiance, who asked me to marry him, if he was a homosexual, or if he carried the AIDS virus. When he told me I was his "First Love", I believed him. BTW, I wasn't a big "slutbag" either
First I was not trying to imply you slept around, but if you are sexually active you should be aware of HIV. You might have been his first love, but not the first person he slept with.
No, I have not been married, but I did enough dating to know how to protect myself from HIV and other STD's. Even though you were trying to get pregnant it is always a good idea to be tested before getting pregnant as the baby can contract HIV from the mother.
Oh and by the way I did date someone that was HIV+ and I am still negative today. So I do have a clue about what it takes to remain negative. I educated myself about HIV before becoming sexually active.
Let's have a BBQ, Texas style, ROAST BUSH
------------------------------
YOU CAN'T HAVE BULLSH** WITH OUT BUSH.
------------------------------
We the people, in order to form a more perfect Union....
.....one Nation indivisible, With Liberty and Justice for ALL.
posted on August 16, 2004 04:09:13 PM newSo...according to you all people, including gay men, who have contacted HIV/aids are stupid huh?
Wonder where all the gay marriage supporters are now with their talk of hateful comments.
Yes I would say that to anybody who contracts HIV today. The virus has been around for over 20 years. There is enough education and public awareness on how one contracts the virus and how you can prevent yourself from contracting it. If you do contract HIV you have no one to blame but yourself (unless you are raped or injected with a needle without your consent). So if contract HIV today - whether gay, straight or bisexual, 18 or 80, you are stupid for not protecting yourself.
Let's have a BBQ, Texas style, ROAST BUSH
------------------------------
YOU CAN'T HAVE BULLSH** WITH OUT BUSH.
------------------------------
We the people, in order to form a more perfect Union....
.....one Nation indivisible, With Liberty and Justice for ALL.
posted on August 16, 2004 04:13:57 PM new
Yellow: They are forcing their lifestyle on us in other ways as well like with their homosexual pride parades. You don't see anyone have heterosexual pride parades, why is that?? The answer is that heterosexuals don't need to shove their lifestle in anyones face.
So I suppose the Irish are shoving their ethnicity in everyone's faces for having the St. Ptrick's day parade. The same can be said for every other ethnic group in America that has a parade. What about the Catholics shoving Chritianity in everyone's faces during the Christmas Day parade? Recently we just had a back to school parade, I guess all the parents are shoving the fact they have kids in school in everyone's face - making fun of all the people that do not have kids???
As I said before these parades are for celebrating who people are. If you want to organize a "Heterosexual pride parade" go ahead, nobody is stopping you.
Let's have a BBQ, Texas style, ROAST BUSH
------------------------------
YOU CAN'T HAVE BULLSH** WITH OUT BUSH.
------------------------------
We the people, in order to form a more perfect Union....
.....one Nation indivisible, With Liberty and Justice for ALL.
posted on August 16, 2004 04:24:25 PM newNo you are so very wrong. Many people who are gay are out of the closet and honest with those around them, especially in this day and age. It's not at all my fault at he lacked the personal character to be truthful and not lead a deceptive lifestyle. There are many gays who are honest with everyone....and he chose to lie about it. His actions are his own responsibility - show his own lack of character, yeager.
Yes today many people are out of the closet and honest with those around them. But 30-40 years ago this was not the case. If you remember people that homosexuality was a disease/illness. Homosexuals were shun, they were forced to hide who they were. And because of this some forced themselves to deny who they were and "married" a woman in order to "blend into society" in order to live "the traditional" life society expected.
It is only through fighting over the past 30-40 years for equal rights that gay people are free to live their live according to who they are. They no longer have to pretend to be someone they are not. That is why you have more and more teenagers come out at an early age. That is why you people coming out at work. Thirty years ago you would never have had this.
I wouldn't be surprised if the governor actions "inspire" more gay men who are "married" to come out of the closet.
.
Let's have a BBQ, Texas style, ROAST BUSH
------------------------------
YOU CAN'T HAVE BULLSH** WITH OUT BUSH.
------------------------------
We the people, in order to form a more perfect Union....
.....one Nation indivisible, With Liberty and Justice for ALL.
posted on August 16, 2004 05:18:11 PM new
Logasdad
If you want to have a homosexual pride parade go ahead but for god's sake will you tell your people to put some damnn clothes on and what is going on with all those erect penis and vagina costumes. Is that all really neccesary?? I could go Google and show what I am talking about and post these sort of images but I won't.
Do you remember that one image that I posted in my thread titled; John Kerry's Real Band Of Brothers, where I guess I was suggesting that, that was you in the center wearing the vagina hat?? As I recall that image offended even you.
All these homosexual pride parades are really about shock and awe. like we are all going to be shocked into accepting your lifestyles.
At least when the Irish have their parades they don't walk down the street and every so often lift their kilts to show off their scantilly covered genitals.
Why do you think that McGreevy chose to live this lie, as you call it. Could it be because he wanted to fit in a society that required him to marry? Could it be that society would wonder if he wasn't married? You know, this type of gossip? "Wow, he's in his 40's and never been married, and he doesn't date. Have you ever noticed that you never see him with a woman either?" I am sure it's much easier for a guy like that to live the lie rather that be continuously judged by others.
Also, you should consider that AIDS IS A HUMAN DISEASE. I think that I pointed that out to you once in the past. Every living person can acquire the AIDS virus, that includes me and you too. I will bet that if you were raped, one of the first things that you would do is seek medical treatment and discuss AIDS with the medical service providers. Have you forgotten Ryan White, the 12 years old boy who died from AIDS?
Yellowstone says,
They are forcing their lifestyle on us in other ways as well like with their homosexual pride parades.
Apparently you don't know anything about other cultures. Any culture or group that wants recognition will do this. Gay people are a part of society, like it or not! I don't go to every parade that is in this area. Some don't interest me and they don't have any influence on me. The last parade that I went to was the Thanksgiving Day Parade in Detroit.
Here's a question for you. If a gay pride group had a parade 100 mile form your home, would it affect on you? What if the parade were 50 miles from your home? How about 25 miles? Would a gay pride parade 10 miles from you have a affect on you? How about 5 miles? What about 1 mile?
The answer to every one of those question is NO! You don't have to watch them. And they have no affect on you as a person, real or perceived. And I think if you are truly honest about it, you would admit it to yourself.
Bigots are miserable people. Prevent Bigotry through Education.
“Our enemies are innovative and resourceful, and so are we! They never stop thinking about new ways to harm our country and our people, and neither do we.” ~ George W. Bush, 8/5/04
posted on August 16, 2004 05:49:13 PM new
Yeager
I am glad that you asked me that question. For part of my answer look at my previous post to Logansdad. For the rest of my answer I will say that no I would not go to their parade and it would not effect me, per se. However, it effects all of society to have to view people parading down a street with their genitals scantilly covered or wearing erect penis and vagina costumes. These parades are not behind closed doors, they are performed on city streets where people along with their children can easilly view the spectacle or people are driving by with their children and they also view the spectacle. Again I say, is that all really neccesary.
ed to change 'and' to 'or'
[ edited by yellowstone on Aug 16, 2004 05:55 PM ]
I do agree with you that such displays are not needed to have any type of parade. I have never been to one, and would never go to one if that was going to be displayed. Even I have standards!
But the fact remains, gay men and women are citizens of this country and human being too. If they were properly recognized as that, there would be no such things as a gay pride parade.
I would rather watch a gay parade than a KKK parade.
Bigots are miserable people. Prevent Bigotry through Education.
“Our enemies are innovative and resourceful, and so are we! They never stop thinking about new ways to harm our country and our people, and neither do we.” ~ George W. Bush, 8/5/04
posted on August 16, 2004 06:20:37 PM newI would rather watch a gay parade than a KKK parade.
Yeager
But the question is would you take your children or if you have none then take your nieces & nephews to the homosexual pride parade?? Remember, you don't know beforehand what the spectacle will be.
Prevent Bigotry through Education.