Hey, KD...how many of Canada's soldiers are over in Iraq fighting? How much money has Canada given to the reconstruction of Iraq?
Maybe one of your military soldiers who have left their Canadian service and have gone over to both Afghanistan and Iraq, privately, can send you pictures.
[ edited by Linda_K on Sep 25, 2004 11:18 AM ]
list upon list of what we've done in Iraq. - Including giving work to Iraqi's.
http://www.usaid.gov/iraq/ayeariniraq.html
[ edited by Linda_K on Sep 25, 2004 12:04 PM ]
Here's a Photo Gallery....want more? want more recent? Then do a search on google under Iraq Photo Galleries.
posted on September 25, 2004 11:58:45 AM new
Linda,
How did the Brookings Institute come up with their 30-40% range? Where did they conduct their sample? Was it in one region or was it a sample of the entire country? At what point in time did they conduct their survey?
But the economy is improving only slowly, despite the supposed availability of more than $20 billion in U.S. aid and high oil prices. Unemployment appears to remain in the 30%-40% range; peak electricity production is up, but hours of service per day are down; the water and sewage infrastructure is improving slowly; health care facilities remain under-equipped; better telephone service and more accurate textbooks in schools cannot compensate for the general mediocrity of living conditions, which on balance are about where they were in Saddam's latter days.
The survey still does not mention how much these jobs are paying people. They could be making $4-$5 a day. Is that enough to provide for their family?
posted on September 25, 2004 12:10:36 PM new
logansdad - People like you crack me up. Are you an adult that doesn't have the ability to get this information for yourself? Like go to the source and READ.
posted on September 25, 2004 12:45:31 PM new
LindaK before you fly out squawking at me, remember this is a public forum and I can post also, even though you addressed it to Kraft.
You may need a memory jerk, Canada joined the real war on terrorism and sent their troops to Afghanistan where they are presently fighting and they are still sending troops. Things were progressing and then unfortunately President Bush had a brain fart and invaded the wrong country, Iraq. WHOOPS!
Last year Canada had committed over 100 million in humanitarian aid to Iraq and numerous churches and organizations are donating funds also. I don’t doubt that there is some reconstruction in Iraq but I hear of projects being destroyed again so I don’t think it’s as rosy as you believe.
BTW, your one link is the same one as your son posted and those pics are from a year ago. And your first link has pics of some talking heads. But come to think of it, you are so right in posting it, as that's much of the reconstruction that is going on in Iraq now……… just talk.
posted on September 25, 2004 02:02:06 PM new
Linda there is no source for the questions I asked because they do not exist. I already looked. You take your numbers as the truth but you do not question how they were derived. Yet you question the numbers from the "study" that quoted a 70% unemployment in Iraq because somebody asked the same set of questions I did.
Funny double standard there if you ask me.
DICK CHENEY SUPPORTS MY RELATIONSHIP: People ought to be free to enter into any kind of relationship they want to
Let's have a BBQ, Texas style, ROAST BUSH
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YOU CAN'T HAVE BULLSH** WITH OUT BUSH.
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posted on September 25, 2004 03:24:15 PM new
logansdad - The sourse being the Brookings Inst. You don't have to only use MY article...you can search their site to get your questions answered? Can you do that without mommy helping you?
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kiara - Out of $120 BILLION dollars....that's a drop in the bucket. But looks like none of your citizens were willing to risk their lives to aid in the reconstruction/building themselves [on a government level]....as they weren't to fight in Iraq either.
"Those who doubted whether Iraq or the world would be better off without Saddam Hussein, and those who believe today that we are not safer with his capture, don´t have the judgment to be president or the credibility to be elected president." - john kerry
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"These dizzying contradictions -- so glaring, so public, so frequent -- have gone beyond undermining anything Kerry can now say on Iraq. They have been transmuted into a character issue."
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"What kind of man, aspiring to the presidency, does not know his own mind about the most serious issue of our time?" - Charles Krauthammer
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posted on September 25, 2004 05:09:25 PM new
Linda_k, I guess when you refer to "my citizens" you mean Canada? Ya, 100 million is just pocket change to the likes of you but for a small country who also tries to help the rest of the world it's a fair amount. Besides, Canada still needs money for that electric fence at the border because you keep nagging them relentlessly about security.
It wasn't a matter of Canadian citizens not wanting to risk their lives, it was a government decision........ you know, kind of like when the Bush regime invaded the wrong country..... all the citizens of the US didn't really have a say and many are opposed to the actions or have you noticed yet.
As far as the rebuilding, Halliburton and those big guys took all the contracts and the rest of the world was told to screw off. I guess that's why they're not so anxious to spread around more money even though Bush is trying to suck up now that he's in such a big mess.
posted on September 25, 2004 05:16:30 PM new
Excuses, excuses....always excuses.
And kiara, read up...your country has promised more Iraq funding in order to get Canadian corporations in the rebuilding mix. Seems there's a touch of capitalism in some of your leaders too...at least enough to be motivated to give more funding so they could be included in some of the contracts. It ALL revolves around money. And your country was upset that our government wasn't going to allow Canada, Germany, France nor Russia in on the rebuilding....because you'd done little to nothing to help.
posted on September 25, 2004 05:24:33 PM new
Linda_K, get your facts straight.
Anyhow, I'm going out for awhile. BTW, don't you ever go outside? We spent the whole day out there except when we popped in for something to eat. Aren't you worried you may get hemorrhoids from sitting at the RT 24/7?
Before you or someone else says it, I should worry about my ass and you'll worry about your own, right?
posted on September 25, 2004 05:42:05 PM new
kiara - I wasn't aware you were elected BIG SISTER of our boards....keeping track of how long anyone's on here. OR maybe you just needed to again act petty as you so enjoy doing.
I'm like a lot of other regular posters here...I come and go..I'm on and off. Maybe to improve your accuracy, since so far you're batting ZERO, you should make a note of the times everybody's posting...when they stop...and when they start again....if they're gone for 1/2 days...or full days...or more than a few days in a row.
Might make your life less petty and won't make me feel like you're only OBSESSED when when I'm posting.
posted on September 25, 2004 08:54:29 PM new
Linda_K, I’m sorry. I couldn’t help but notice when I got caught up on the topics here that you were on almost all of them again today.
I apologize; I admit my remark was quite rude. When I'm outside in beautiful weather it makes me wacky. I'll try to be good from now on.
posted on September 25, 2004 09:30:05 PM new
"Last year Canada had committed over 100 million in humanitarian aid to Iraq" That doesn't mean they got. Iraq would like Canada to pay back the money they filtered out of the oil for food program. Shame on those Canadians for stealing food from the mouths of babes..
Fred
corrected spelling
[ edited by fred on Sep 25, 2004 10:38 PM ]
posted on September 25, 2004 10:08:22 PM new"Last year Canada had committed over 100 million in humanitarian aid to Iraq" That doesn't mean they got. Iraq with like Canada to pay back the money they filtered out of the oil for food program. Shame on those Canadians for stilling food from the mouths of babes..
Fred, your post is difficult to understand. You and your sister Linda_k are once again trying to take the focus off the war with Iraq and turn it into propaganda about Canada because you can’t show us pics of the new Iraq. Next thing Linda_k will be whining to me about the border security again and I’ll have to remind her about the cost of an electric fence and post a pic of a map of North America.
President Bush is telling us that things are going great in Iraq and now we all know that little Mary got a new schoolbook and Johnny can get a tattoo. But what about the infrastructure of Iraq, where are the pics of the new Iraq that they keep telling us about? Don't you think they'd be bragging with lots of pictures to show everyone if it was so true? They could gain more support and perhaps more votes that way.
posted on September 25, 2004 11:16:02 PM new
I believe it's neo-con propaganda, Fred but if you and linda_k wish to discuss it why don't you start a new topic about it and show some proof? I ask that because I was wrongfully accused of going off topic in the health thread. Linda_k is the one who brought Canada into this one because she is totally obsessed with the country and also because she can't show us pics of the new Iraq.
Fred, show us pictures of the new Iraq and perhaps send the word out to the Bush campaign that they should be promoting those same pics worldwide along with the speech about how well things are going.
posted on September 25, 2004 11:47:21 PM new
Why did Canada take money from the oil for food program?
Why did Canada commit to 100 million dollars and not live up to it?
Why does Canada protect terrorist cells?
posted on September 26, 2004 12:08:11 AM new
Still no pics of the new Iraq, Fred?
Perhaps Linda_K will be here first thing in the morning googling like a silly goose from Rev Moon's site or some other rag sheet to find all the propaganda she can about Canada since she is so obsessed with it and it will help you and her avoid this more serious topic.
posted on September 26, 2004 04:09:28 AM new
Kira, how much progress can they possibly make when the insurgents are at their every footstep and working to destroy any progress?
Even so...here is article posted as of 9/25 from a soliders POV. I think you're really giving them very little credit for their efforts. It's not like nothing is going on despite 'war' each day.
[url] http://www.registerguard.com/news/2004/09/25/d1.cr.iraq.0925.html[/ur]
September 25, 2004
Soldier says Iraq is turning around
By Greg Bolt
The Register-Guard
Like a lot of people who work in big cities, Lance Varney puts in long hours, goes to a lot of meetings and spends a lot of time stuck in traffic.
Unlike most people, Varney does his work in a war zone.
A major in the 1st Cavalry Division, Varney spends his days navigating the streets of Baghdad as part of the U.S. military's efforts to rebuild the city. And while Varney, the son of Florence residents Ben and Linda Stovall, doesn't make light of the dangers, he says Iraq isn't the scene of unrelenting chaos and destruction people might think from news reports.
"I think we're already seeing a turning point in most of the communities, despite what may be prevalent in the news," he said during a telephone interview following a long Friday on the job. "The markets are full of people shopping, driving. The open-air markets are completely full, the streets are packed with people driving up and down selling all kinds of stuff. Kids are back at school. Soccer fields are being used that used to be trash heaps."
As a member of what's called a governorate support team, he works closely with top advisers to Baghdad Mayor Alaa Mahmood al-Tamimi coordinating infrastructure projects. Since arriving seven months ago, his unit has been working to repair and improve water and sewer facilities, restore electric and garbage services, and get schools, police stations and fire stations back in operation.
The unit's marquee project is restoring Abu Nawas Street, a former boulevard of parks, restaurants and shops along the Tigris River that once was the gem of Baghdad. Crews recently finished clearing rubble from the two-mile riverside esplanade and are preparing to lay new water and electric lines before putting in new walkways, fountains and lawns.
After that, Iraqi contractors will begin repair and construction of shops and restaurants in the area. The project is a top priority for Tamimi, who sees it as a tangible example of the city's slow return to normalcy and proof of the U.S. military's commitment to rebuilding Iraq.
"He made a commitment to give that park back to the people of Baghdad," Varney said.
Although things are getting better in Baghdad, Varney said there's no question that dangers remain. Troops wear body armor and travel in armored vehicles whenever they leave the relative safety of the well-guarded international zone at the city's center, and when they're not carrying weapons they have them within easy reach.
"I'll just say this up front: There are some bad things that happen here in Iraq, no one can refute that," said Varney, whose unit is not involved in combat operations. "What that means, in our daily routine, is that we have to be extremely cautious when we go places outside our immediate secure area. We go fully prepared, we go with the right armored vehicle, we go with the right force protection, we go with the right personal protective equipment, because it's a lifesaver."
That said, Varney asserts that most of the violence in Baghdad is caused by a very small number of people, many of them fighters from outside Iraq determined to thwart the American effort. The vast majority of Baghdadis seem to support the troops and their rebuilding projects, he said.
"When we drive by in our military vehicles going from Point A to Point B, the people for the most part, especially the kids, wave and give us the thumbs up sign," Varney said. "Women and children wave. That's kind of reassuring to see."
The city itself also is showing signs of recovery, he said. Trash and rubble are being cleared up, business are reopening and the streets are crowded. Even billboards are reappearing along major streets.
The effort has rehabilitated hundreds of schools, rebuilt a hospital and made noticeable strides in restoring basic services. Varney said Army units have put police and fire stations back in operation so that when attacks do occur, Iraqis often are first on the scene.
"Back in March, you didn't see any first-responders out there," he said. "Now when something unfortunate or tragic happens, all the things we would normally see (at home) are there immediately."
Varney works closely with the mayor's staff, so much so that he's made a number of close friends among the engineers and advisers helping to plan the infrastructure projects.
"The people I work with in the mayor's office endured the entire regime of Saddam Hussein," he said. "They talk to me about what it used to be like when everything was rationed, all decisions were micromanaged. There was a great amount of tyranny and fear among the people, and they were destitute, they had nothing. And now they have a lot."
Varney said there's no question that the American effort has a long way to go before life in Baghdad is anything like that in a modern democracy. But he said the people, by and large, believe it will happen.
"It's not a question of, do they trust us. They know exactly what we're trying to achieve, and for the most part we're partnering up to achieve what they want," he said. "They're optimistic. I think they're very optimistic."
..
.. Go'wan and row yer boat. And try to do it merrily, merrily, cause this life IS but a dream...
Attacks are now spreading to areas that were formerly peaceful. During the last two weeks 29 Americans have been killed...and in last two weeks, 250 Iraqi citizens have been killed. The average number of attacks are 70 per day.
The security situation has grown so dire that many of the few remaining nongovernmental aid organizations left in Iraq are making plans to withdraw. The United Nations, which was supposed to help organize the national elections, has just 30 employees in the country, all of whom are quartered in the U.S.-controlled, fortified Green Zone. Foreign journalists, who used to roam the country, are now largely restricted by safety concerns to Baghdad hotels surrounded with concrete walls and barbed wire.
With insurgents targeting not just U.S. troops but seemingly everyone in the country -- Iraqi security forces, Iraqis working for the interim government, foreign contractors, journalists, aid workers and others -- it is difficult for even ordinary Iraqis to ignore the threat.
"When we leave home, we never know if we're going to return home alive or not," said Mohammed Kadhim, a taxi driver.
How can reconstruction, elections or any normal activity go on in a War Zone like this?
posted on September 26, 2004 08:03:22 AM newHow can reconstruction, elections or any normal activity go on in a War Zone like this?
The answer is simple, you can not! Every time you build a new school, road, pipeline some dip comes along and blows it up.
It all comes down to a lack of control.
Has anyone else heard the CNN report that the U.S. [Bush] will pull out of Iraq as soon as the January elections are over? If this is true this would be one huge mistake as you will see nothing but a huge civil war.
That's true...Looks like a civil war is inevitable whether we leave or stay. Right now, Iraq is on the verge of that civil war with the U.S. forces in the middle of it.
posted on September 26, 2004 12:16:34 PM new"Hey, KD...how many of Canada's soldiers are over in Iraq fighting? How much money has Canada given to the reconstruction of Iraq?"
Although Kiara already answered, why would Canada join into fighting a war under circumstances they didn't buy? Should they have joined in just because the U.S. said so? Are those the real terms for being friends with the U.S.?
If you say we're being protected by the U.S., how so? If you can't even get a war right with a tiny country, how protected are we really? How protected are you since these wars?
posted on September 26, 2004 04:13:56 PM new
Well, ya gotta hand it to quaetermass, he sums up the way Republicans really feel.....such honesty from that side is refreshing.
