posted on October 24, 2004 07:05:32 PM new
kiara - please try and get it though your very thick head...that I post what I read. I'm not the one who makes these alligations....I just post them.
There are at least 20 different investigations going on at the present time. Different reports say different things. Some swear that France wasn't involved either in the O-F-F program. And, of course ALL are denying any wrong doing.
The final reports will show more of what's true and what turned out not to be true.
But for now....I post what I read and just because you don't like it...doesn't change what's being reported.
And you're one to speak about slandering anybody or any country.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"And they, the interrogator went through all of these statements from John Kerry. He starts pounding on the table. 'See here, this naval officer, he admits that you are a criminal.'" Excerpt from "Stolen Honor"
- James H. Warner Former Vietnam POW
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"I will never submit America's national security to an international test. The use of troops to defend America must never be subject to a veto by countries like France. The President's job is not to take an international poll -- the President's job is to defend America." --President George W. Bush
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ Re-elect President Bush
posted on October 24, 2004 07:06:09 PM new
Linda, are you saying Bush hasn't changed his position umpteen times in the past?? Also, if Kerry is the bottom of the barrel and is ahead of Bush in the polls, what does that say about Bush?
posted on October 24, 2004 07:13:42 PM new
KD - Let's narrow it down to just which issue you personally think he's changed his position on.
Then we can talk.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"And they, the interrogator went through all of these statements from John Kerry. He starts pounding on the table. 'See here, this naval officer, he admits that you are a criminal.'" Excerpt from "Stolen Honor"
- James H. Warner Former Vietnam POW
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"I will never submit America's national security to an international test. The use of troops to defend America must never be subject to a veto by countries like France. The President's job is not to take an international poll -- the President's job is to defend America." --President George W. Bush
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ Re-elect President Bush
posted on October 24, 2004 07:35:22 PM new
Did someone say flip-flop?
Social Security Surplus
BUSH PLEDGES NOT TO TOUCH SOCIAL SECURITY SURPLUS... "We're going to keep the promise of Social Security and keep the government from raiding the Social Security surplus." [President Bush, 3/3/01]
...BUSH SPENDS SOCIAL SECURITY SURPLUS The New York Times reported that "the president's new budget uses Social Security surpluses to pay for other programs every year through 2013, ultimately diverting more than $1.4 trillion in Social Security funds to other purposes." [The New York Times, 2/6/02]
2. Patient's Right to Sue
GOVERNOR BUSH VETOES PATIENTS' RIGHT TO SUE... "Despite his campaign rhetoric in favor of a patients' bill of rights, Bush fought such a bill tooth and nail as Texas governor, vetoing a bill coauthored by Republican state Rep. John Smithee in 1995. He... constantly opposed a patient's right to sue an HMO over coverage denied that resulted in adverse health effects." [Salon, 2/7/01]
...CANDIDATE BUSH PRAISES TEXAS PATIENTS' RIGHT TO SUE... "We're one of the first states that said you can sue an HMO for denying you proper coverage... It's time for our nation to come together and do what's right for the people. And I think this is right for the people. You know, I support a national patients' bill of rights, Mr. Vice President. And I want all people covered. I don't want the law to supersede good law like we've got in Texas." [Governor Bush, 10/17/00]
...PRESIDENT BUSH'S ADMINISTRATION ARGUES AGAINST RIGHT TO SUE "To let two Texas consumers, Juan Davila and Ruby R. Calad, sue their managed-care companies for wrongful denials of medical benefits ‘would be to completely undermine' federal law regulating employee benefits, Assistant Solicitor General James A. Feldman said at oral argument March 23. Moreover, the administration's brief attacked the policy rationale for Texas's law, which is similar to statutes on the books in nine other states." [Washington Post, 4/5/04]
3. Tobacco Buyout
BUSH SUPPORTS CURRENT TOBACCO FARMERS' QUOTA SYSTEM... "They've got the quota system in place -- the allotment system -- and I don't think that needs to be changed." [President Bush, 5/04]
...BUSH ADMINISTRATION WILL SUPPORT FEDERAL BUYOUT OF TOBACCO QUOTAS "The administration is open to a buyout." [White House spokeswoman Jeanie Mamo, 6/18/04]
4. North Korea
BUSH WILL NOT OFFER NUCLEAR NORTH KOREA INCENTIVES TO DISARM... "We developed a bold approach under which, if the North addressed our long-standing concerns, the United States was prepared to take important steps that would have significantly improved the lives of the North Korean people. Now that North Korea's covert nuclear weapons program has come to light, we are unable to pursue this approach." [President's Statement, 11/15/02]
...BUSH ADMINISTRATION OFFERS NORTH KOREA INCENTIVES TO DISARM"Well, we will work to take steps to ease their political and economic isolation. So there would be -- what you would see would be some provisional or temporary proposals that would only lead to lasting benefit after North Korea dismantles its nuclear programs. So there would be some provisional or temporary efforts of that nature." [White House Press Secretary Scott McClellan, 6/23/04]
5. Abortion
BUSH SUPPORTS A WOMAN'S RIGHT TO CHOOSE... "Bush said he...favors leaving up to a woman and her doctor the abortion question." [The Nation, 6/15/00, quoting the Lubbock Avalanche-Journal, 5/78]
...BUSH OPPOSES A WOMAN'S RIGHT TO CHOOSE "I am pro-life." [Governor Bush, 10/3/00]
6. OPEC
BUSH PROMISES TO FORCE OPEC TO LOWER PRICES... "What I think the president ought to do [when gas prices spike] is he ought to get on the phone with the OPEC cartel and say we expect you to open your spigots...And the president of the United States must jawbone OPEC members to lower the price." [President Bush, 1/26/00]
...BUSH REFUSES TO LOBBY OPEC LEADERS With gas prices soaring in the United States at the beginning of 2004, the Miami Herald reported the president refused to "personally lobby oil cartel leaders to change their minds." [Miami Herald, 4/1/04]
7. Iraq Funding
BUSH SPOKESMAN DENIES NEED FOR ADDITIONAL FUNDS FOR THE REST OF 2004... "We do not anticipate requesting supplemental funding for '04" [White House Budget Director Joshua Bolton, 2/2/04]
...BUSH REQUESTS ADDITIONAL FUNDS FOR IRAQ FOR 2004 "I am requesting that Congress establish a $25 billion contingency reserve fund for the coming fiscal year to meet all commitments to our troops." [President Bush, Statement by President, 5/5/04]
8. Condoleeza Rice Testimony
BUSH SPOKESMAN SAYS RICE WON'T TESTIFY AS 'A MATTER OF PRINCIPLE'... "Again, this is not her personal preference; this goes back to a matter of principle. There is a separation of powers issue involved here. Historically, White House staffers do not testify before legislative bodies. So it's a matter of principle, not a matter of preference." [White House Press Secretary Scott McClellan, 3/9/04]
...BUSH ORDERS RICE TO TESTIFY: "Today I have informed the Commission on Terrorist Attacks Against the United States that my National Security Advisor, Dr. Condoleezza Rice, will provide public testimony." [President Bush, 3/30/04]
9. Science
BUSH PLEDGES TO ISSUE REGULATIONS BASED ON SCIENCE..."I think we ought to have high standards set by agencies that rely upon science, not by what may feel good or what sounds good." [then-Governor George W. Bush, 1/15/00]
...BUSH ADMINISTRATION REGULATIONS IGNORE SCIENCE "60 leading scientists—including Nobel laureates, leading medical experts, former federal agency directors and university chairs and presidents—issued a statement calling for regulatory and legislative action to restore scientific integrity to federal policymaking. According to the scientists, the Bush administration has, among other abuses, suppressed and distorted scientific analysis from federal agencies, and taken actions that have undermined the quality of scientific advisory panels." [Union of Concerned Scientists, 2/18/04]
10. Ahmed Chalabi
BUSH INVITES CHALABI TO STATE OF THE UNION ADDRESS...President Bush also met with Chalabi during his brief trip to Iraq last Thanksgiving [White House Documents 1/20/04, 11/27/03]
...BUSH MILITARY ASSISTS IN RAID OF CHALABI'S HOUSE "U.S. soldiers raided the home of America's one-time ally Ahmad Chalabi on Thursday and seized documents and computers." [Washington Post, 5/20/04]
11. Department of Homeland Security
BUSH OPPOSES THE DEPARTMENT OF HOMELAND SECURITY..."So, creating a Cabinet office doesn't solve the problem. You still will have agencies within the federal government that have to be coordinated. So the answer is that creating a Cabinet post doesn't solve anything." [White House spokesman Ari Fleischer, 3/19/02]
...BUSH SUPPORTS THE DEPARTMENT OF HOMELAND SECURITY "So tonight, I ask the Congress to join me in creating a single, permanent department with an overriding and urgent mission: securing the homeland of America and protecting the American people." [President Bush, Address to the Nation, 6/6/02]
12. Weapons of Mass Destruction
BUSH SAYS WE FOUND THE WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION..."We found the weapons of mass destruction. We found biological laboratories...for those who say we haven't found the banned manufacturing devices or banned weapons, they're wrong, we found them." [President Bush, Interview in Poland, 5/29/03]
...BUSH SAYS WE HAVEN'T FOUND WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION "David Kay has found the capacity to produce weapons.And when David Kay goes in and says we haven't found stockpiles yet, and there's theories as to where the weapons went. They could have been destroyed during the war. Saddam and his henchmen could have destroyed them as we entered into Iraq. They could be hidden. They could have been transported to another country, and we'll find out." [President Bush, Meet the Press, 2/7/04]
13. Free Trade
BUSH SUPPORTS FREE TRADE... "I believe strongly that if we promote trade, and when we promote trade, it will help workers on both sides of this issue." [President Bush in Peru, 3/23/02]
...BUSH SUPPORTS RESTRICTIONS ON TRADE "In a decision largely driven by his political advisers, President Bush set aside his free-trade principles last year and imposed heavy tariffs on imported steel to help out struggling mills in Pennsylvania and West Virginia, two states crucial for his reelection." [Washington Post, 9/19/03]
14. Osama Bin Laden
BUSH WANTS OSAMA DEAD OR ALIVE... "I want justice. And there's an old poster out West, I recall, that says, 'Wanted: Dead or Alive.'" [President Bush, on Osama Bin Laden, 09/17/01]
...BUSH DOESN'T CARE ABOUT OSAMA "I don't know where he is.You know, I just don't spend that much time on him... I truly am not that concerned about him."[President Bush, Press Conference, 3/13/02]
15. The Environment
BUSH SUPPORTS MANDATORY CAPS ON CARBON DIOXIDE... "[If elected], Governor Bush will work to...establish mandatory reduction targets for emissions of four main pollutants: sulfur dioxide, nitrogen oxide, mercury and carbon dioxide." [Bush Environmental Plan, 9/29/00]
...BUSH OPPOSES MANDATORY CAPS ON CARBON DIOXIDE "I do not believe, however, that the government should impose on power plants mandatory emissions reductions for carbon dioxide, which is not a 'pollutant' under the Clean Air Act." [President Bush, Letter to Sen. Chuck Hagel (R-NE), 3/13/03]
16. WMD Commission
BUSH RESISTS AN OUTSIDE INVESTIGATION ON WMD INTELLIGENCE FAILURE... "The White House immediately turned aside the calls from Kay and many Democrats for an immediate outside investigation, seeking to head off any new wide-ranging election-year inquiry that might go beyond reports already being assembled by congressional committees and the Central Intelligence Agency." [NY Times, 1/29/04]
...BUSH SUPPORTS AN OUTSIDE INVESTIGATION ON WMD INTELLIGENCE FAILURE "Today, by executive order, I am creating an independent commission, chaired by Governor and former Senator Chuck Robb, Judge Laurence Silberman, to look at American intelligence capabilities, especially our intelligence about weapons of mass destruction." [President Bush, 2/6/04]
17. Creation of the 9/11 Commission
BUSH OPPOSES CREATION OF INDEPENDENT 9/11 COMMISSION... "President Bush took a few minutes during his trip to Europe Thursday to voice his opposition to establishing a special commission to probe how the government dealt with terror warnings before Sept. 11." [CBS News, 5/23/02]
...BUSH SUPPORTS CREATION OF INDEPENDENT 9/11 COMMISSION "President Bush said today he now supports establishing an independent
posted on October 24, 2004 08:06:17 PM new
Linda_k admits she posts only the propaganda she googles and reads from rag sites and she refuses to read anything from legitimate sources as she is afraid of the truth.
posted on October 24, 2004 08:07:38 PM new
Oh geez... sorry Linda!!!!! I was waiting to bid on something.
First off, his reasons for invading Afghanistan changed from getting Osama, to shutting down the terrorist camps, to getting rid of the Taliban, to liberating the country. Same deal with Iraq - WOMD, Saddam, Terrorists, WOMD, Liberation. This wasn't a path he followed, he actually changed his justification for invading on a weekly/monthly basis. Another easy one is when he said he was going to unite the country if elected. <<<< LoL on that one alone.
posted on October 24, 2004 08:16:36 PM new
Crow, I didn't post my reply right away and didn't see your post. I was going to mention that you posted the best list about Bush's "flip-flopping" (I hate that term now). Thanks!!
posted on October 24, 2004 08:22:13 PM new
kiara, I am bringing to your attention and to the other readers of this board attention the following words posted towards you. "please try and get it though your very thick head...that I post what I read. I'm not the one who makes these alligations....I just post them."
Kiara, THE CONFUSED PERSON THE SAID THOSE WORDS JUST ADMITTED THEY CAN'T THINK FOR THEM SELF. Because of their ILLNESS they can only become PARROTS OF THE BUSH/CHENEY GANG'S LIE MACHINE. Like you said before these posters FEAR THE TRUTH. I PITY PEOPLE LIKE THIS.
posted on October 24, 2004 08:41:08 PM new
Yes, Bigpeepa....... we already knew she couldn't think for herself and that she can only post the crap she reads from rag sites but now she has openly admitted it to everyone in her very own words.... like it's something to be proud of.
posted on October 24, 2004 08:52:47 PM new
Kraft, that term, flip-flop IS silly!
But, Mom, they started it!
Ya, the neocons started that out of total ignorance of how laws are made by our legislators. Not many bills are introduced and zip through any body of lawmakers unless it's the bill to raise their salaries. Republicans "flip-flop", too, but WE realize it's just part of the "system" and procedures in Congress.
On the bill that earned Kerry his flip-flop title, the Republicans voted for it first before they voted against it.
That's not an error , that's the way things are done.
But then we're arguing with people who don't have much of an education and have a great deal of trouble reasoning.
posted on October 25, 2004 07:14:37 AM new
Another Bush flop.
President Bush said, "You can't distinguish between Al Qaeda and Saddam when you talk about the war on terror," before he admitted Saddam had no role in 9/11.
posted on October 25, 2004 07:30:30 AM new
Funny but whenever I post the list of bush's flip-flops....the neocons never address it....in fact they never came back to this thread.
It must be kraft's fault for keeping the DeathQueen waiting 16 minutes...she got mad at the rudness of keeping her waiting and left.
Kraft, did you get your head cut off yet for keeping her Hoghness waiting?
Oh my, I misspelled highness and look what I got!
I'm in here to edit but maybe it's more appropriate this way
posted on October 25, 2004 07:38:35 AM new
She left only because she knew that she couldn't answer. She has been here today, for example and overlooked your and Kraft's answers.
posted on October 25, 2004 07:43:30 AM new
LOL @ the 16 minute comment. Linda_k has kept me waiting a couple of days about the German troops being in Iraq yet she had time to run over and bump up another thread trying to tattle to another poster about me......... "kiara told a falsehood" .... tee hee.
Linda_k has got it mixed up.... she didn't realize it was US troops being deployed out of Germany from US bases but she doesn't want to admit her ignorance here.
But then she didn't know that US female troops were in Iraq now either.
In the meantime she can tell falsehoods with wild abandon since, when asked for a link, she refuses because as she has explained, "I refuse to pull up links for those I don't respect."
Hahaha!
So, in other words, she can say anything however preposterous it may be to those she doesn't respect without backing it up.
posted on October 25, 2004 08:27:50 AM new
LOL once again at the 16 minutes comment......... especially after this exchange.
Trai:
"Attacking children? On both parts, show me documented proof. I watch nature shows and I've spent a lot of time in the woods in my life. Mostly domestic dogs in neighborhoods attack children and adults, not wolves."
Linda:
"You know trai...I don't like the way you repeated DEMAND I do anything. I'd prefer to be asked in a nice tone of voice."
Trai......... who has only asked once:
"Linda, you must be reading a different tone in my posts as I did not consider it a DEMAND by any means. You made a statement and I asked you to show me documented proof."
posted on October 25, 2004 08:53:01 AM new
Linda_K asked for "just which issue you personally think he's changed his position on." For an answer she got close to 20 of Bush's flipflops.
I think her refusal to answer is a case of sensory overload.
Of course the neocons never answer. They just say it's a case of "the world has changed and you just don't understand." My understanding is they are pretty good at copy pasteing trite, regurgitated answers, but don't seem to be very good at thinking for themselves. Kind of like the man who likes to call himself President and says he doesn't have to give explanations or reasons for why he does what he does or thinks what he thinks.
On the other hand they are pretty good at taking things out of context and then spinning flat out lies.
posted on October 25, 2004 08:59:22 AM new
LOLOL Kiara!
Trai is a no nonsense guy but very gracious and tactful at the same time. The idea that he would raise his ""voice"" to Linda is so funny. BTW...he has won every argument too.
posted on October 25, 2004 10:09:47 AM new
Well, ya gotta hand it to linduh.....no matter how many times she's wrong, humiliated, makes a jackass of herself, burbles incoherently, has her butt kicked....no matter how many people show her she's wrong....she just keeps C&Ping....mostly Pee-ing.
linda has NOTHING but staying power.....kinda pathetic but let's give her a round of applause for being "steadfast" like her favorite dictator bush.
Being wrong presents no problem for either one....just forge ahead being steadfast and wrong.
posted on October 25, 2004 12:19:54 PM new
Linda, although my list was lame compared to Crow's, I tried to make it easy. Do you remember how Bush changed his tune starting with Afghanistan? Even if he said from the beginning that liberation was the goal, has he accomplished this? What about Iraq? The war is "over" according to him but they're still fighting. Why are they fighting if Saddam was the objective? Why are they fighting if finding WOMD was the objective? So, if Saddam or WOMD isn't what this war is all about, what is it about in your opinion?
posted on October 25, 2004 03:48:14 PM new
linda, speaking of someone totality lacking in integrity......we were just discussing your total lack of anything except endurance.
posted on October 25, 2004 07:41:24 PM new
You kerry supporters could learn a lot from Trai, imo. He has the ability to disagree, discuss or debate and still be civil. A good trait that the four of you know absolutely nothing about.
KD - My statement that I was leaving was just to inform you that if you did respond, I wasn't going to be waiting any longer for you to reply. It was not meant as a demand, I of all people know we're all on and off of here at different times. Silly that it was taken in such a negative context....but I don't expect any better from the likes of kiara, helen nor cf.
posted on October 25, 2004 08:00:37 PM new
linda says,"kiara - please try and get it though your very thick head"
Then says,"You kerry supporters could learn a lot from Trai, imo. He has the ability to disagree, discuss or debate and still be civil. A good trait that the four of you know absolutely nothing about. "
linda, in the past you have proven you're quite capable of being very uncivil so take your phony "lecture" on civility and stuff it. The sample above is one of your milder replies, you've done much worse. Quit talking out of both sides of your mouth.
posted on October 25, 2004 08:37:06 PM newYou kerry supporters could learn a lot from Trai, imo. He has the ability to disagree, discuss or debate and still be civil. A good trait that the four of you know absolutely nothing about.
And she does??
Don't flatter yourself, Linda_k. Please note that Trai has been civil to all four of us too.
IOW, you ain't all that special.
You've called me a liar, a Socialist, a Communist, anti-American, a traitor, someone who supports the insurgents, someone who wishes death on the US troops, etc, etc ...... plus you've flamed me for not agreeing with Bush and for not finding humor like you do in body orifices and body excrement..... and you have the audacity to expect me to put up with that crap and remain civil? Shove it.
posted on October 26, 2004 06:50:21 AM new "And she does??"
That's what she wishes to imply. But we know that's not true. Thanks, Kiara for illustrating that her assumed holier than thou position is not her REAL modus operandi.
Linda, I'll bet that most posters here are tired of reading your daily insults and hearing you call posters liars and names simply because they don't agree with your fanatical neo conservative views. Anyone reading the "tone" of your posts will think twice about supporting the candidate or issue being promoted in your hysterical ranting. So there's no need to tell you to shove it...Your are stumbling away - just fine, all by yourself.
posted on October 26, 2004 06:56:21 AM new
linda, as usual your only defense is to segue off into something that doesn't matter at all.
Ya got your ass kicked in yet again another thread and all you have to talk about is the civility of others, which is what you always do when you lose an argument, or you call the winner a liar........you are so like bush ...totally unable to just say "I'm wrong".
Try reading from the top of this page all the way to the bottom and then go look in the mirror, sit down and have a good old-fashion talk with yourself. Do you REALLY like what you see?
posted on October 26, 2004 09:20:55 AM new
Looks like my disclaimer is necessary again....
Now...consider why you'd even ask me that question. I believe it's because kiara implied it in her post. So you took it to be true...for that reason only. And since I can't go around constantly correcting all the false statements she continues to make about me, nor all those that crowfarm makes, I don't respond...or I respond in a general way.
Then it appears to me the end result of that is that whatever they say is taken as gospel [fact]...when in fact they've stated lies or implied things I've never said.
Since neither kiara, crowfarm nor anyone else speaks for me, I'd really appreciate their conclusions be discounted when evaluating my own words or actions. It's a sick game they entertain themselves with....and it's quire childish, imo.
-------------------
The funniest lie that kiara told above...deserves "special mention". [That I'd called her a traitor]
Someone may be curious as to why she'd even lie about something like that. Me calling a Canadian a traitor to America.
...that was exceptional funny.
Excerpt from "Stolen Honor"
