posted on November 10, 2004 08:32:15 PM
And logansdad....the Iraqi's ARE fighting ..right along side our troops. It's the **terrorists** - that are killing them too and blowing up police stations...buildings that are working to recruit more Iraqi's for the police force and fighting soldiers...and taking hostages of those trying to get a government of their own formed.
You need to get straight just who the 'bad guys' are. And we're not it...nor are the Iraqi's who ARE willing to fight for their own country.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Four More Years....YES!!!
posted on November 10, 2004 08:46:54 PMOkay.. so after all that diarrhea of the mouth, all the pretty words, all the mutual stroking and ass kissing..all to say what Tweedledee said in one sentence....
if it was so, it might be; and if it were so, it would be; but as it isn't, it ain't. That's logic.'
posted on November 10, 2004 08:53:30 PM
Maybe I should make my opening post more clear as I wrote it very late last night. Now when I see the direction of the thread I'm thinking that perhaps some think my words 'fighting back' was about the Iraqis joining the terrorists? I realize now it was the wrong words for me to use.
What I mean about 'fighting back' is a growing feeling of resistance by some of the Iraqi people over the way things are going in Iraq.
Though I have heard that some are becoming violent and perhaps joining the insurgents I get the impression that many of the citizens are upset at the occupation and rape of their country and they don't want to just sit back and pretend it's 'liberation' because it's not.
pandorasbox has posted on EO before and has a refreshing unique style.
posted on November 11, 2004 06:35:50 AM
Linda: The polls show that the majority of Iraqi citizens DO NOT want the troops to pull out. They want us to remain and stabilize their country and help them get their elections going. The majority are looking forward to that. And in order for that to happen places like Fallujah have to be 'dealt' with. We have to gain control over the terrorists hiding out there.
Please post your current poll results if that is what you believe is the case.
And I love how supportive you sound about our soldiers who are and have put their lives on the line. Taking our enemy's side and calling our guys the terrorists
Linda why don't you read what I posted. Nowhere did I say I considered the American troops terrorists like you are claiming I did say. I said some Iraqis could consider the troops terrorists for their actions.
You can keep painting this rosy picture of what is going on there, but this war is not going well as the Bush administration has suggested.
Current polls in Iraq suggest that the Iraqi people do not feel their government is representing their interests and do not have faith in the current Iraqi minister.
Q. What's the difference between the Vietnam War and the Iraq War?
A. George W. Bush had a plan to get out of the Vietnam War.
--------------------------------------
There's an old saying in Tennessee — I know it's in Texas, probably in Tennessee — that says, fool me once, shame on — shame on you. Fool me — you can't get fooled again." —George W. Bush, Nashville, Tenn., Sept. 17, 2002
---------------------------------- "Give it up for George W. Bush, the best friend international jihad ever had."
posted on November 11, 2004 06:41:43 AMAnd logansdad....the Iraqi's ARE fighting ..right along side our troops. It's the **terrorists** - that are killing them too and blowing up police stations...buildings that are working to recruit more Iraqi's for the police force and fighting soldiers...and taking hostages of those trying to get a government of their own formed. You need to get straight just who the 'bad guys' are. And we're not it...nor are the Iraqi's who ARE willing to fight for their own country.
Linda, I guess you have not read this story or choose to ignore it since it does not fit in with your agenda:
BAGHDAD -- U.S. military officials said Monday that at least 200 Iraqi troops had deserted their posts in the American-led offensive on Fallujah.
The troops supporting the nation's interim government are facing pressure from some Iraqi religious groups and threats from insurgents.
Prominent Iraqi Muslim clerics, including influential Sunnis and top aides to rebel Shiite cleric Moqtada Sadr, condemned the Iraqi troops serving alongside Americans in Fallujah. The insurgent council that has controlled Fallujah for the past six months threatened to behead Iraqi troops who entered the city to "fight their own people."
The U.S. military and Iraqi commanders estimated that up to 200 Iraqi troops had resigned, with another 200 "on leave."
If the Iraqi people believed in their cause they would fight to the end, regardless of what threats other groups may do or say. If the Iraqi people truly believe in democracy than they should be fighting and not deserted their posts.
Where would America be today if this is the attitude we had in 1776 when we fought against the British to gain our independence.
Q. What's the difference between the Vietnam War and the Iraq War?
A. George W. Bush had a plan to get out of the Vietnam War.
--------------------------------------
There's an old saying in Tennessee — I know it's in Texas, probably in Tennessee — that says, fool me once, shame on — shame on you. Fool me — you can't get fooled again." —George W. Bush, Nashville, Tenn., Sept. 17, 2002
----------------------------------
"Give it up for George W. Bush, the best friend international jihad ever had."
[ edited by logansdad on Nov 11, 2004 06:42 AM ]
posted on November 11, 2004 08:41:15 AM
logansdad -
When I said I hate the word insurgents, and called them terrorists you said:
I am sure the Iraqi people feel the same way about American troops busting into their homes in the middle of the night when they have done nothing wrong. I am sure the Iraqi people feel the same when American troops who are there to give them freedom are torturing Iraqi citizens while in prison.
I don't think I've misread your statement at all. You said you're sure they see us, the same way as the terrorists....and you said we're torturing them - again, focusing on such a small group of those who acted inappropriately rather than the 145,000 that haven't done so. Quite clear how you view the actions of our troops, logansdad...so don't deny what you said. That certainly is NOT a supportive statement about the actions of what our troops are there to accomplish ...it's a statement that gives understanding and sympathy to those shooting and killing our soldiers. You know, aiding and abetting THEIR cause - rather than supporting our own troops and their mission.
As far a my link goes....I've already posted it very recently...to balance the 'bad news' that the left only choses to focus on here. Obviously you chose not to read it.
As far as MY agenda goes.... It's OUR COUNTRY'S agenda. To get control over cities like Fallujah so that the election process can take place in January.
And I resent your continued implication that I think everything's 'rosey' over in Iraq. I have never said that...all I do is focus on what's going well...going right...while the left here only focuses on all the negative. There are positive advances being made...and there are Iraqi's that are glad we're there...don't want us to leave...you choosing to ignore them doesn't change that fact.
And again, on you choosing to focus only on the negative...the 200 Iraqi's that did run...you ignore the thousands that stayed and fought for their country...and the Iraqi's along with American soldiers who have died bringing freedom to Iraq and who are fighting the terrorists who don't want to see that happen.
Iraqi's have always ran during their wars - they have a past history of doing so. A **few** doing so now is a GREAT improvement over the way they've acted in the past. Even our commanders are giving them praise on how much BETTER they're doing in that regard.
So...you continue to focus on all the negative and I'll continue to focus on the end result we're trying to accomplish over there. OUR COUNTRY'S AGENDA.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Four More Years....YES!!!
posted on November 11, 2004 09:54:43 AMSo...you continue to focus on all the negative and I'll continue to focus on the end result we're trying to accomplish over there. OUR COUNTRY'S AGENDA.
You are making it sound like the entire country is behind BUSH'S WAR. It is not OUR COUNTRY'S AGENDA - It is BUSH'S WAR. Bush and company planned this war and suggested Saddam's removal well before the 2000 elections.
Again you take the easy way out Linda by not providing the links to backup your claim of how the Iraqi people want the US troops there.
Q. What's the difference between the Vietnam War and the Iraq War?
A. George W. Bush had a plan to get out of the Vietnam War.
--------------------------------------
There's an old saying in Tennessee — I know it's in Texas, probably in Tennessee — that says, fool me once, shame on — shame on you. Fool me — you can't get fooled again." —George W. Bush, Nashville, Tenn., Sept. 17, 2002
---------------------------------- "Give it up for George W. Bush, the best friend international jihad ever had."
posted on November 11, 2004 10:14:39 AM
No, it's YOU who refuse to understand how he was given approval by our elected officals in our Congress to take this country to war in Iraq. It's you who refuse to hold any of the dems who voted and supported removing saddam the same credit. It's you who refuse to see that no one in Congress is calling for our troops to be withdrawn. The majority have made statements we must win this war....including dems.
And if you're too lazy to read the link I've already provided...that's your issue...but you can't say I didn't provide my proof, because I did. I'm just not going to keep reposting it.....after all President Bush won re-election so he'll be the one deciding if and when we leave Iraq.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Four More Years....YES!!!
posted on November 11, 2004 10:49:21 AM
linda's ""Four More Years....YES!!!""
Proves that she LOVES death, war and bloodshed.....she wants it to continue!
Well, she'll get her wish with the War President in office and dosen't that make her happy. The bush administration started planning for the war in Syria and Iran a long time ago, just in case they killed everybody in Iraq and ran out of victims.
Yup, got a problem with someone, well, just kill them.....it's linda's loving way!
Yes, this poll is a little outdated, but I could not find any other current ones. So Linda how does this support your conclusions.
BAGHDAD — Only a third of the Iraqi people now believe that the American-led occupation of their country is doing more good than harm, and a solid majority support an immediate military pullout even though they fear that could put them in greater danger, according to a new USA TODAY/CNN/Gallup Poll.
The nationwide survey, the most comprehensive look at Iraqi attitudes toward the occupation, was conducted in late March and early April. It reached nearly 3,500 Iraqis of every religious and ethnic group.
The poll shows that most continue to say the hardships suffered to depose Saddam Hussein were worth it. Half say they and their families are better off than they were under Saddam. And a strong majority say they are more free to worship and to speak. (Related item: Key findings)
But while they acknowledge benefits from dumping Saddam a year ago, Iraqis no longer see the presence of the American-led military as a plus. Asked whether they view the U.S.-led coalition as "liberators" or "occupiers," 71% of all respondents say "occupiers."
That figure reaches 81% if the separatist, pro-U.S. Kurdish minority in northern Iraq is not included. The negative characterization is just as high among the Shiite Muslims who were oppressed for decades by Saddam as it is among the Sunni Muslims who embraced him.
The growing negative attitude toward the Americans is also reflected in two related survey questions: 53% say they would feel less secure without the coalition in Iraq, but 57% say the foreign troops should leave anyway. Those answers were given before the current showdowns in Fallujah and Najaf between U.S. troops and guerrilla fighters.
The findings come as the U.S. administration is struggling to quell the insurgency and turn over limited sovereignty to an interim Iraqi government by the end of June. Interviews this week in Baghdad underscored the findings.
"I'm not ungrateful that they took away Saddam Hussein," says Salam Ahmed, 30, a Shiite businessman. "But the job is done. Thank you very much. See you later. Bye-bye."
'I would shoot ... right now'
Bearing the brunt of Iraqis' ill feeling: U.S. troops. The most visible symbol of the occupation, they are viewed by many Iraqis as uncaring, dangerous and lacking in respect for the country's people, religion and traditions.
Q. What's the difference between the Vietnam War and the Iraq War?
A. George W. Bush had a plan to get out of the Vietnam War.
--------------------------------------
There's an old saying in Tennessee — I know it's in Texas, probably in Tennessee — that says, fool me once, shame on — shame on you. Fool me — you can't get fooled again." —George W. Bush, Nashville, Tenn., Sept. 17, 2002
---------------------------------- "Give it up for George W. Bush, the best friend international jihad ever had."
posted on November 11, 2004 11:00:06 AMNo, it's YOU who refuse to understand how he was given approval by our elected officials in our Congress to take this country to war in Iraq. It's you who refuse to hold any of the dems who voted and supported removing saddam the same credit.
Bush persuaded Congress into going into war by presenting flawed intelligence reports. The information given to Congress did not accurately portray the real situation in Iraq. Furthermore if DICTATOR BUSH wants to win the war on terror he should be going after the one that started in - BIN LADEN. You would think with America being the greatest nation, with it's mighty military and great intelligence reports, with all the spy satellites in the sky, we would have been able to track down Bin Laden???
Our spy satellites were able to determine Saddam moved the so called WMD but they can not track down one old man. It has been three years, Bush has been fighting his war on terror in the wrong place.
after all President Bush won re-election so he'll be the one deciding if and when we leave Iraq.
Let's hope that will be before 2008 if he even has a plan other than "stay the course"
Q. What's the difference between the Vietnam War and the Iraq War?
A. George W. Bush had a plan to get out of the Vietnam War.
--------------------------------------
There's an old saying in Tennessee — I know it's in Texas, probably in Tennessee — that says, fool me once, shame on — shame on you. Fool me — you can't get fooled again." —George W. Bush, Nashville, Tenn., Sept. 17, 2002
---------------------------------- "Give it up for George W. Bush, the best friend international jihad ever had."
