posted on October 29, 2000 07:25:04 PM
The seller will actually get an email telling them you have went to there check out and it will give then all the info you filled in just as if you replyed to a personnal EOA they will get your shipping address your payment method and all.
its actually pretty neat amost the same as when you send a payment through paypal buyer leaves all there shipping info the seller get the paypal notice with the info.
Get use to it all auction managers includeing AW are moveing in this direction and soon paypal will have the shopping cart feature as well .
I will admit even though I uses services that send out automated EOAs for me I still fallow up with a personnal note.
WWW.dman-n-company.com
posted on October 29, 2000 07:30:14 PM
Yes, I've done a couple of Andale auctions. Everything worked out ok, meaning, The seller got paid and I got my stuff.
The Andale auctions I won were a long time ago. I don't like the automated check out either, and now avoid these auctions. I don't really care about whether or not the seller has written me as much as I care about giving all of my information to a third party web site.
It's one thing if I choose to go to a web site and give that site my information. It's another for someone else to choose a web site I have to go give my info to.
Now, if I absolutely MUST have something from someone that uses andale. (Hasn't happened in a looong time.) I won't go through the automated check out. I'll e-mail the seller directly with all of my information and tell them I prefer not to use andale.
posted on October 29, 2000 07:31:57 PM
Oh I agree with you. I am primarily a seller but a buyer as well and I've won 2 auctions from Andale sellers. The first one I remember because it stands out in my mind as a very un-human transaction. It went smoothly and I got my item very quickly, so I really have no complaints, and I left the seller positive feedback, but I didn't get one single 'human' email from this guy... all automated stuff from a 3rd party. Didn't like that. The second was just a couple of weeks ago and when I got that Andale notification with that form to fill out, which is a few extra steps for me anyway, since I always pay by Paypal and include the item number and shipping address so it's all in one place, I got that same creepy feeling...felt like knocking on the monitor with a 'hello? Is there a person involved in this transaction?' lol
This was the subject of discussion not too long ago and my take on it is that I prefer to contact each of my bidders personally with a cheery "Hi!"... might seem like a little thing but it makes a world of difference, especially when you think of all the bidders out there who will return to a seller because they were nice and they like them. Hard to like a machine.
posted on October 29, 2000 07:36:40 PM
I received one of the Andale automated payment invoices from a seller and I refused to use it. I emailed the seller with the necessary EOA details and told him that I valued my privacy and did not intend to give my info to a third party for them to SELL to the direct marketers.
Sellers should include the option of NOT using these third party web based forms in their EOA emails or they should mention the fact that they use these forms in their auction TOS so those of us who are concerned about privacy can avoid their auctions.
I have recently decided to email the seller before I bid to be sure he doesn't use one of these third party automated invoice systems and I really resent being put in that situation. Whatever happened to the friendly person to person auction format?
posted on October 30, 2000 04:08:43 AM
jwoodcrafts -
Read their privacy policy! they have all kinds of things about how they protect the SELLER, but do not mention the buyers at all. I refuse to use a third-party website auction manager, and avoid bidding on auctions that say they use it.
If I get stuck with one who doesn't advertise that they use a web-based management system, I email them and say that if they want pauid, they will get my email address OUT of the website database and that the transaction will happen via email.
posted on October 30, 2000 07:10:05 AM
I've used Andale for a little over a month now after previously using AW, eBud, and Goto and have had nothing but positive experiences. The mistake some of the sellers described here may be making is not making it clear in their listings that they are Andale merchants. By having "Andale" all over my listings I thankfully avoid buyers who have agendas other than completing their sale and getting their item, such as making more online buddies or pushing their political bent.
The only real difference in my feedback so far has been increased praise for my professionalism and the fact that I now sometimes get positive feedback from buyers before I even ship their item. I've only had a handfull of people not use the checkout and they were just generally confused about the whole auction process and needed some extra help. As a small time seller (800+ sales) that wants to grow an online BUSINESS I've found Andale to be extremely responsive in terms of adding requested features and addressing problems. As a paying user I not only have the ability to complain but the right. If I wanted to keep it free though it would be AW all the way.
As for personal emails I'm curious as to how a generated email from eBud or AW could be considered any more "personal"? Andale emails are also customizable and will be more so soon, but in any case unless you know the person you're writing to its never "personal."
posted on October 30, 2000 08:17:11 AM
As a buyer, I never bid on an Andale auction. In an age where far too many companies sell out their customers to direct marketers, I simply am not interested in turning over my information to additional parties beyond the minimum normally necessary to complete a transaction, namely the seller (and by consequence, the seller's bank).
After spending time analyzing feedback, studying the item's condition, debating whether I truly want the item, and fixing a proxy bid price, I simply am not interested in also having to debate whether an additional company's privacy statement is respectable (and how likely they themselves are going to respect the words and "spirit" of their statement).
While I could bid and then refuse to send to anyone but the seller, I don't want to disobey a seller's EOA either, and I also suspect some sellers would give my information to the third-party anyway.
----
What's being done in the name of direct marketing nowadays is crazy.
The above are all just my opinions, except where I cite facts as such.
Oh, I am not dc9a320 anywhere except AW. Any others are not me.
Is eBay is changing from a world bazaar into a bizarre world?
[ Minor grammatical fix. ]
[ edited by dc9a320 on Oct 30, 2000 11:14 AM ]
posted on October 30, 2000 08:27:48 AM
Andale was great when they gave away $5 per auction listing. However, I like many other sellers no longer use them because of the problems you mentioned. Most bidders did not want to go thru the checkout process. If I recall correctly, there is a link on Andale that you can use, to change the default on your auctions, whereby you still send out your notices and bypassing the checkout process. However, this negates many of the benefits that Andale provides. The auto-relisting was the most useful function in my opinion, but not worth the extra money that I had to pay.
posted on October 30, 2000 08:39:01 AM
I am a seller who has been using Andale for approx. 6 months, and love it. 99% of my customers do as well...I get compliments all the time about the professionalism of the process. I do have a few customers who don't want to go through the Andale checkout, and that is fine with me...I have a note on my auctions which states "If you have any questions or problems email me direct.", and they do if the need arises. Customers love the auctomatic features...the email that tells them when item has been shipped, and the automatic feedback that I leave when the item is shipped. I have been able to more than double my auctions with this service...well worth its fees. As for people who are paranoid re getting on email lists via Andale...it is pretty easy to get email addresses from Ebay as well.... Reminds me of people who don't want to give credit card numbers over the web, but have no problem whatsoever giving a credit card to a waiter at a restaurant, who disappears with it for 10 minutes....
posted on October 30, 2000 09:15:42 AM
I really don't mind the auction services companies, but I am curious. Why pay for Andale when Auctionwatch is free? They do the same thing. I even downloaded their offline auction manager and its basically a clone of Auctionwatch's, right down to the user interface.
posted on October 30, 2000 09:36:03 AM
I buy & sell on eBay....When buying, I do avoid Andale auctions....IMO it says "hey, I'm too busy to bother with YOU, my customer, so you do the work (eg. goto the website (the links provided NEVER work) and deal with the form"...Nope don't like it one bit....
As a seller, I do not use automated services when dealing with my customers...Does it cost me in sales?, Probably....can't process as many....Does that bother me?...Nope, in an environment such as the Internet, I beleive that human contact is important...And that is was I choose to run my business.....Just as those with Andale & other automated services choose (and have every right to choose) their business practices...
posted on October 30, 2000 10:10:48 AM
"Human Contact" - what a joke, unless you personally know the person your trading with the only thing you're contacting is your keyboard. As for telling my customers that I'm to busy for them, I suppose that the audience I target isn't so starved for affection that they need to get it from me, however if they need to email me for a heart to heart they are invited to do so. I explain to my customers in the EOA email that by typing in the shipping address themselves they help to insure accuracy since I use one of the CC'd emails I get as the mailing label, in addition they can get as total (bid,shipping,tax,etc.) right away without having to wait for me to get back to the computer (I actually leave it sometimes).
AW is a great free (for now) service, but its not as feature rich as Andale, a fact that is becoming more and more true. AW also has a somewhat contentious relationship with eBay whereas Andale has cultivated a close one. Andale implements new features in direct response to its user community (and fairly quickly too!). I'm trying to build a business and don't realistically expect my main service providers to be free, be that my ISP, PayPal, Auction Management, etc. If AW decides to close your seller account today and delete your records you have no recourse exactly because they are free and owe you exactly squat despite what you may want to believe.
posted on October 30, 2000 11:49:11 AM
"AW is a great free (for now) service, but its not as feature rich as Andale, a fact that is becoming more and more true"
Really? I've used both, and found Auctionwatch to have more features than andale. What am I missing?
As for their "contentious" relationship- simply because AW doesn't kiss ebay's proverbial backside and pay them money to be on their site? Frankly I prefer a site that outright endorses multiple venues instead of snuggling up to the dominant player. Maybe that's just me though.
I've seen AW respond to user feature requests as well. As for deletion, I've never seen them delete anyone's account, and think it's pure paranoia to imply otherwise. Simply because you pay good money to andale makes them more reputable in that regard?
posted on October 30, 2000 11:54:00 AM
I bid on and won a couple of auctions posted through Andale. When I got the invoice, I replied back to the seller that I did not want my information input into their database, either by me or by them.
The first seller tried to reassure me that it was fine and safe, etc., but I was persistent and she gracefully made an exception in her procedures for me, and it was a very nice transaction. The second seller responded with "I understand completely, here's the information you need. Thanks!" That one ended up being a very nice transaction also.
posted on October 30, 2000 11:58:35 AMsusiegirl: Actually, I'm not so concerned with security of credit card numbers (though some well-publicized online incidents do make it clear that companies keep card information for too long and/or in the wrong places sometimes), as I am thoroughly sick of companies selling me out to direct marketers, whose junk and pushiness I never want or use. These are two different, albeit related concerns (both of which do, however, fall under the label of "privacy" ).
It is true, though, that the waiter walking your card into the back for five minutes is a risk, albeit apparently minimal. I'd guess restaurants are careful about this, so they don't end up getting known as a site of fraud, though I'd imagine there are exceptions. For those concerned about waiters, however, I suppose maybe the best thing is to only give cards where the machine is in plain sight, such as when you have to walk to a check-out counter. This would probably cut down (but not completely eliminate) the chance of fraud.
I don't want to underplay the importance of the security aspects of "privacy" of information too much, however. There are reportedly 750,000 cases of "identity theft" each year, mostly from criminals "dumpster diving" for unshreded SSN, account, and CC info, and other overuse of SSN information. Some reasonable degree of care with such info would be beneficial.
And yes, it is easy -- too easy -- to get email addresses from eBay. At very minimum, eBay should hide bidder addresses from all but the sellers of items they're bidding on. I see no need for anyone else to get these addresses.
Nonetheless, the more places that your address is obtainable, the more junk lists you'll end up on, which in general is the reason I also avoid Andale. I don't personally have a specific complaint about Andale in itself, I just don't feel like spending time trying to figure out if such additional third parties are going to use my information in a respectful way. So many don't that I just assume the ones that do are rare exceptions. Some posters have stated in this thread, however, that Andale says little on whether it would protect bidder information, like it spells out on seller information.
A feature by feature comparison would be useless since I'm not interested in convincing you to change your preference. Suffice it to say that I am confident in my assertion.
As for AW not kissing eBay's butt, who cares? I don't really care about sticking it to eBay or any other company since that doesn't put money in my pocket. eBay once screwed me out of a $530 sale that was on its way to $1200. I still use them because of market realities, I also sell on Yahoo! and Amazon (all of which Andale supports btw) as well as Half.com. I'm not interested in building anyone's business but my own.
You misread my statement about AW deleting accounts if you saw paranoia there, it was merely an illustration of what they could do since they owe you nothing. My experience with AW has been nothing but positive.
I know it must be disconcerting to read an opinion that dissents from that of the usual suspects around here, but I think the lurkers deserve one. I really sometimes think that one of things that may curtail bidding on eBay is bidders visiting boards like this and being exposed to the unrelenting negativity.
posted on October 30, 2000 02:29:19 PM
Here we go again bashing Andale. I think it's kinda funny when folks fear giving personal info to Andale, but not to eBay, PayPal, et al, but I understand those who choose to send Andale sellers their shipping info directly, happens to me all the time - and it's no problem for me. I certainly respect a person's desire to keep that info private. The reason I use Andale is to ensure that all my transactions are completed in a timely manner. For example, I am usually at work when my auctions end, and I want my EOA's sent out ASAP. I would rather deal with an automated EOA than deal with the sellers who require the buyer to contact them within three days. Please quit accusing us Andalites of the "I'm too busy to deal with my customers" attitude. It does not apply to all of us.
That's Miss Tex to you!
posted on October 30, 2000 05:37:40 PM
Actually, I've never given info to PayPal, and am rather glad of it now. I've not been that happy with eBay either, as it allows bidder email addresses to be exposed to any other registered user (including spammers), instead of just the sellers of auctions they bid on. They also brought DoubleClick in, which shows a lack of respect, in my opinion.
I minimize who I give out my address to, and as a result, got only 6 spams in 19 months -- until recently.
I think I'm now being spammed due to my bidding on eBay, as I'm not signed up at many places because of companies (online and offline) tending to sell such information without my explicit permission.
I'm not that particularly concerned about the "personal" or "impersonal" argument (though I realize others are).
i have deleted your post because it contained a link to a competitive site. Discussion of other sites and services in a non-promotional manner is acceptable, posting links or URLs is not.
posted on December 9, 2000 08:11:40 AM
Wow, I'm actually agreeing with Reddeer on something?
I won't use Andale, paypal or any other intermediary. When a seller emails me with directions I politely email back explaining that I won't have anything to do with it.
It's also a time thing. With Ebay's Billpoint or Amazon's One click it's fast and pretty Easy (especially One Click) but these other services are only sucking info to use or sell.
posted on December 9, 2000 08:22:09 AM
To Franko122,
Hi, you're right. But I'm only working part-time for them (or us), and I do have a regular job at a Voice Over Internet company, and I do still have a lot of spare time.
I guess that I should participate more actively here ...
See you soon ...
Charles
[ edited by charles927 on Dec 9, 2000 08:27 AM ]
posted on December 9, 2000 08:55:48 AM
I usually avoid Andale auctions as a buyer.
The problem is with javascript. Often, when I stumble on an Andale listing, my computer goes wild trying to load the script and sometimes it crashes.
Also, because of this javasript problem, I often turns off this feature on my computer. The only auction I won from an Andale seller resulted in my only NPB warning. Not because I did not pay. I did pay within 24 hours, the seller received my payment and ship the item and I received it. But I was never able to complete the check-out process. I simply printed the Andale check-out page and send it with payment. Then, I guess that since the check-out was never registered at Andale, the system automatically send the NPB warning plus later the FVF request and I received the warning from eBay, even though I mentionned to the seller that he did receive my payment and send the item.
posted on December 9, 2000 09:12:21 AMAll this to say that I now avoid Andale sellers.
Me too! The last one I won, I emailed the seller and told them I wouldn't use Andale and we could complete the transaction in the normal manner or he could sell to the next highest bidder.
Ain't Life Grand...
posted on December 9, 2000 09:31:45 AM
I am always amazed at how many whiney, negative comments I see posted here. If your're so hell-bent against automation, why do you use a computer, email, or any of the other time-saving, yet potentially impersonal ways of communicating and conducting your business? I have been using Andale for a very long time now, and absolutely love it. Most of my customers do too. I work full time and like the time saving features it offers me. But...and I find few people have mentioned it, Andale offers them my full name, address and phone #, along with my email address. I usually have several personal contacts with my customers, even if they use the check out. I have literally had a customer win an auction while I'm in bed, complete the checkout, pay me, and when I wake up, I check my email and slap the postage on it and mail it from work THAT SAME DAY....if I wasn't using the automated checkout there is no way this could happen. I do have a few customers who aren't able to figure it out (Floridians perhaps) or choose not to use it, which is fine. I will work with anyone to complete my sale in anyway they want if it is humanly possible for me to do so. So my final words to you nay-sayers is if you don't like it, you may have no choice in the future, because many, many sellers are trying to automate their sales as much as possible to help themselves and give YOU better service!
posted on December 9, 2000 09:52:03 AMcocacolacathy
There is a difference between whining and commenting.
Comments by buyers saying that they will not use Andale auctions is useful information, in my opinion, for any seller using or wanting to use a similar service. I think that they should be aware that by selecting this service they turn away many potentials bidders like me.
Of course, this is a business decision. The automation process for the seller is often worth the potential loss of customers. But having more information is better than less, I think, and reading comments like this surely helps me as a seller to make decisions.
You also say:
So my final words to you nay-sayers is if you don't like it, you may have no choice in the future, because many, many sellers are trying to automate their sales as much as possible to help themselves and give YOU better service!
I want to point out that buyers always have a choice to select what they think is in their own best interest and I certainly do not like to have any seller telling ME what is best for myself...
In my opinion, automation is not the problem. Automation that DOES NOT WORK is.
But I agree that the check-out pages from Andale look very professional.
posted on December 9, 2000 10:16:53 AM
cocacolacathy,
"In my opinion, automation is not the problem. Automation that DOES NOT WORK is."
COMPLETELT AGREE WITH YOU!!!
These service sites should offer much better automated, streamline checkout process -- e.g., automatically extract buyers' shipping information from buyer's reply emails, not asking them to click thru and go somewhere in a third-part website (no matter how nice the checkout form looks like.)
The technology is already available, and perhaps in a few months you'd be able to see one or two such service sites.
