We had a discussion about this on the OTWA Auction Universe board. Are they ever going to add a radio category under collectibles? The way radios are listed now, would not lead a radio collector to them. Also, when I do a search for radio, I get a ton of things not remotely related to radios. Below is the suggestion that I previously submitted to you:

Collectibles:
Radios:
Books-Manuals
Miscellaneous
Test Equipment
Transistor Radios
Tube Radios
Tubes
 

Yes, I recall. Glad you posted your suggestion here.

I suspect that the only problem is that we don't have a collectible's category, per se.

We've got a "Sports Collectibles and Cards" and then another "Other Collectibles" and, of course the Entertainment, music and TV category (where radio now resides.)

My impression is that we can probably get the radio sub-categories you suggest but the change from the Entainment, music and TV category may not happen, at least in the short term.

neomax

Well if it doesn't happen soon all my current inventory of radios will have sold on eBay where many are listed now. I do have a long list that I could place on Auction Universe but I won't tie them up when they would be buried in the wrong category.

I had a hard time finding the one radio that is listed in the current radio category, and I was specifically looking for them.

As I indicated in our previous discussion, the collectible radio buyers won't come if they aren't listed properly and easy to find.

It takes lots of radio listings to bring the buyers. That means competition for me, but that is what it takes.

Please talk to the PTB and see if anything can be done. I have radios ready to list right now. I'm going to place them somewhere today. I need to move merchandise.
 

It'll be raised then, just by pointing here.

I first requested the radio categories on Thursday, October 08, 1998 at 14:08:46 (MDT) on the OTWA Auction Universe discussion board. All mine and your posts regarding this issue can be found in the archives at:

http://club99.otwa.com/archives/1006-110798au.html

It will soon be two months since I requested the categories. I have to tell you that if someone was essentially begging me to do something so they could spend their money at my business, I wouldn't take anywhere near that long.

Point of reference:

On Mon, 16 Nov 1998 15:50:38 -0700, I requested a radio category from VegasToday and on
Mon, 16 Nov 1998 17:42:12 -0800, I was notified that the category was in. I have since sold one radio and one Super Mouse on their site.

Next point of reference:

On Sun, 15 Nov 1998 14:41:56 -0700, I made a similar request for a radio category on One Web Place. On Sun, 15 Nov 1998 17:37:32 -0800, I was notified that the category was in place. I haven't sold anything on OWP yet, but they are putting forth the effort with good customer service to attract more users.

The point of all of this is to show you what other sites are doing to give sellers the proper categories in which to sell their merchandise in a prompt fashion, without board meetings.

I really want to list my radios on AU but I ain't gonna do it if they are buried where they don't belong. I just as well bury them in the bottom of boxes and have a garage sale indicating to potential customers that I have radios somewhere in these boxes, but you'll have to find them.

[This message has been edited by games (edited 11-28-98).]
 

Four hours since my last post to you without a response. Thanks!

This may be small potatoes to you but it is important to me. And I requested this almost 2 months ago.

Of course, if it had been a post on any other thread (including an eBay thread) where you could jump in and spam about all the virtues of AU, there would have been a quick response.

Sorry, but I'm pissed. You keep posting everwhere about AU and their quick response to customer requests as opposed to eBay. Show me! I haven't seen the action yet. But, I have seen a lot of words from you.

You would probably never guess, I am not a happy camper.

I could go on, but I won't. If you or AU are not going to respond to user requests within a reasonable amount of time, then say so. Don't keep spamming all the threads about AU customer support and response when it doesn't happen.

One of your llllloooooonnnnnnngggggg responses would be appreciated. But please, just state the facts. No hype about AU.
 

First, I have to admit I thought the radio thing was taken care of. We went through a change about two weeks ago (When Self-Indulgence was nixed) and I thought that your request was on the list.

I'm not in that loop but I had communicated that need -- maybe not as effectively as I should have. Mea culpa.

Now as to the delay in getting back with you, gosh, I already feel like I work 24/7 ... and it appears that you might do the same.

I did go to Sam's with my family about 5 this evening and, when I returned about 7, I did dutifully log on and check my email and responded to a few. I didn't, however, visit all the various sites, choosing instead to spend a little time loading a new program for my son on the kids computer before breaking for SNL.

It is now about 1:15a and I happened to stop in here... several more hours after your last post.

I'm sorry that we haven't been able to accomodate your needs as quickly as I would personally like. But like I said in the first post, I will bring it up Monday and Tuesday in CT.

Even if the request is approved -- and I have to admit I like your logic regarding the sub categories much more than that currently used -- It could take a month to accomplish.

I really do appreciate your efforts to get us on board. Your relating the activities of the other web sites quite frankly says to me two things.

1. We are a bit hamstrung because we are growing and there are a lot of folks (committees) who have to check off on such a change. (We're not a one or two or five person operation like the folks you mention where one person says it and its done.) Still, our folks need to be able to see that stuff can be done in "real time" sted corporate time.

2. And that our best potential customers are passionate about what they're doing (as I'm passionate -- I do resent a bit the spam comments) -- and that when we don't react quickly, that builds frustration and resentment.

Jim, I'm here as much as an ombudsman for our site as anything else. And recognize that perfection eludes me as it does all other mortals.

But your passion for your business is an inspiration to me and ought to be for my collegues.

Truely my heart sank a little that day after I saw the category changes (Such as moving Jewelry and fashion to a top spot) but when I click on TV/radio, that category was unchanged. Dammit, I said. (Although I can point to the death of the "Self Indulgence" category as proof that it does happen and we do listen.)

I don't think you'll disagree when I say I agree, we need to do better. I know that you won't be convinced that is the case until you've got your categories.

BTW: Lee, I plan to have the PTB read this thread when I'm there.

Another month huh? That's disgusting! That would be almost 3 monts to do what two of your competitors did in less than (4) hours.

Based on the dismal customer service in this situation, If I were you, I wouldn't continue to expound the greatnes of the AU customer service all over the boards. I just might post the whole story of this request right behind you.

I had really hoped to start moving more of my business to AU, but based on this lack of customer support, that isn't going to happen.

Thanks anyway.
[email protected]
 

When the PTB sees this thread, I hope they understand that serious dealers are more than willing to help, set the categories up in a more effective manner.
Lee
 

Nice post. Clearly you are more rational than me at this time. I'm tired of being ignored, all the while having to digest post after post describing the greatness of AU support and customer service. Customer support response regarding my requests to this point have a big fat 0, after almost 2 months.

AU and Pat are doing everything they can to pull users from eBay. I want to come. I have begged them to ad my category, to no avail.

I guess the only way that I will get a category for my items is to fly east and attend a board meeting. A board metting to add a category, too much like applying for a loan for me. If every decision is made by committee, then change is going to be slow to come.

From what Pat has described of the ownership of AU, they are spread all over the country. How can you possibly run a business on the Internet the old way of board and committee mettings. We are here because things are supposed to be fast.

I'm just really upset. After joining AU for the first 99 cent auction, I made a request of Pat for a radio category under collectibles. I also included a breakdown of sub-categories. I was somewhat assured that this would happen soon. It is now almost 2 months latter and nothing has happened.

Now, do you think that I'm going to refer my customers, friends, and neighbors to AU after this? I think not!

After doing their very best to proclaim their differences from eBay, here we are. Same deal. I have never receive one email regarding my request for categories, but I do receive spam every day advertising other peoples auctions.
 

Jim, I think you're a little confused about what constitutes customer service in this case.

Customer service is staying open an extra 15 mintues to accomodate a customer, responding to an email in under an hour instead of a couple days hence. Customer service is not going to a 24-hour format because one customer can't get by the store one night after the regular 7 p.m. closing.

Customer service is also not adding a category for green olives, war ordinance or sadistic pornography in four hours because some one asks for it (although I'm sure that some auctions might.)

Jim, you know I don't have the authority to trot over to our programming outfit and order the change in just the form you said. We've had this discussion before and I never said or implied that I did.

If I did and I were inclined to do so, I'm sure that it would be a <4 hour job. I wish that it were.

As far as the month time frame, I don't ever knowingly promise anything I can't deliver upon. I suspect that at least twice during that time period, the programming changes might be easy enough to accommodate your requests as we make other adjustments.

BTW: reliability is an important issue and typically, when changes are made, there is a period of time when we're on bug-fix patrol and nothing else is done.

But honestly, I don't know when it will happen and right now, I'm not sure if it will. I know when I asked for it before, it didn't happen. I think the reason is that I just didn't say it often enough to the people I deal with. When they talked to the exact right person at the exact right time (I wasn't privy to exact moment/time to make the request) my request on this was not at the top of their mind.

What does that mean? That we don't like you or some such? No, it means we are human beings.

You should recognize that as human beings we like the business we're in. Regardless no one, particularly me, likes being berated, spat upon and otherwise abused when we make a mistake. I'm not here to be a punching bag.

I'm beginning to suspect one other thing and that is you are never going to be happy until radios are in the "collectible" area.

I can guarantee you we ain't ever going to have a "plain" collectibles area with one type of item in it, "Radios."

So, I would ask at this point, it is even possible to make you happy or a satisfied customer?

I suspect the reason the changes didn't happen before is that when they read your posts, (I'd copied them in email) it was obvious that you were as intent on radio's in the collectibles area (which we don't have, per se) as any of the other sub categories.

No where at any time have you indicated any willingness what so ever to compromise in terms of major category.

The point is Jim there are ways to get things done and, you said it yourself, "Lee, nice post, Obviously you are more rational than I am at this point."

Relax Jim. I'm not trying to pick a fight but I do expect a little respect and civility.

Let me ask you directly, can we compromise on the location? You get the sub categories and we put leave it in the Music, TV, Entertainment area.

neomax

Actually, here is probably the best place.

The problem with the Club99 board is that it scrolls down into oblivion and is eventually archived.

As I recall it, the individual responsible for making the specific recommendation for changes in the radio category when changes were being made (Jewelry and Fashion were broken into its own category, for instance) looked a the Club99 but couldn't find it.(It had been archived.)

That is the reason I take a part the responsibility for, at least the failure to rename the subcategories. (Hence my mea culpa and the self-admonition that perfection has eluded me again).

The point is that we are listening. The new home-page test (See AW thread under AU) elsewhere is one example. The breakout of jewelry and fashion is another.

I know it seems that changes such as this could be done in a quick edit but you have to realize that stability of the software has to be our priority. Changes therefore are done on a copy of the existing software and the whole shebang changed out on a schedule.

What I really regret about this whole thread so far, is that this seems to be some sort of adversarial exercise. I know I've been put on the defensive.

Indeed, it seems that Jim may have a goodly amount of goods to sell, as do you.

Frankly, what might be a good idea is to inquire about a volume sellers agreement. Among the "accoutrements" of said VSA are your own account rep whom you'll get to know (and they you).

BTW: They are right there in CT and requests submitted through them benefit from interoffice banter whereas I'm in GA, far from the maddening crowd.

Go that route and who knows, you might end up with a deal like that of Mightie-Mike. (Mike has a front page button for his auctions -- categories ... he don't care 'bout no categories)

Mike also puts up at auction over $100,000 in merch each month and advertises at his expense, his auctions in various sports collectible magazines, etc.

But that kind of customer service, which is the next step up, does require you list a minimum 200 items.

Maybe you can't do it and maybe Jim can't. But I wouldn't be surprised if about five of the top sellers on eBay couldn't if they formed a partnership.

Who knows? We'd certainly have to check legalities, etc. and there would have to be a promotional plan on the part of the sellers. But as Spock said (and all Trekkies know), "There is always an alternative."

Let's start thinking about alternatives.

neomax

I didn't mean to start a new collectibles category. You allready have that. What I meant was to create the radio sub-categories under the existing collectibles category. There is everything under the sun in there now. Even bird cages.

Actually, it takes very little to make me a satisfied customer. I just want to sell my merchandise on AU, and I can't without a proper place to list it. That's all I'm asking.
 

Actually, we don't have a "collectibles" category... but only an "Other collectibles" category.

I'm just curious why it must be under "other collectibles" when doggone near every category is, by definition, a collectible category. (At least that is the way we look at it.)

neomax
 

We are all after all trying to accomplish the same goal. More sales on AU! :-)

 

To continue a little bit. If I were in your shoes, I'd be lobbying for a move from Music, TV, Entertainment to the "Electronics" category and I'd be wanting to avoid the Collectibles area if I could?

Why?

Just a lot less clutter and a lot fewer options for buyers to select from. After all, radios were among the first electronic gadgets.

What is your reasoning that radio's should be listed only under collectibles?

neomax

Because they are a true collectible, not modern day electronics. I just looked in the electronics other category and found Furbys in there.

This is my last post on this issue. As a radio collector, it is my opinion that collectible radios should be listed under that heading. Most of your competition must agree, as that is the way their categories are structured.

If the AU PTB don't agree, that's fine. I'll just stay where I am.
 

I can't believe Mike "Blew you off" ... although knowing Mike, I'm sure he didn't offer to run with the idea and become its greatest champion! Rather, I'm sure it was reported, registered and noted by his superiors.

As far as posting here, this is probably, from the standpoint of getting attention for your needs, as good a place as any.

Second, and you can imagine, I'm out here on the line, my identity known -- in many ways a public person. This is the type of exposure that not everyone needs or should have. (As a writer and editor I've always been there so this is no big deal for me. I've taken, and am used to taking a lot of heat for what I've written and said. I've even been threatened with bodily harm by Georgia Sheriff's which, if you know the region, could be a reason for not paranoia, but real fear.)

For those and other reasons I'm not going to be listing the members of this or that committee.

It is also helpful to know that I was probably the second person to be involved in the development of AU by Times Mirror. As Jim will note, my background extended even before that and included writing a zine about the online auction scene.

I'm also noted as a bit of a maverick and I can get away saying things, raising issues, that others who fit into the heirarcy differently just can't. (Without any of the trepidation I felt challenging that particular sheriff, whom I might add is now sitting in prison:-)

This is part of my job.

I would be remiss if I suggested the only way to communicate with me is to post me publicaly on board like this. No so, I do take private email. Post me a
[MAILTO][email protected][/MAILTO]

neomax

"Actually, here is probably the best place."

Here may be a good place to discuss changes, but it seems like a very poor place to make official suggestions. Why? Because it's out of AU's control. You had trouble before when all the official suggestions were on the Club99 board, and they scrolled off. Now you want the official suggestions made here, but what if AW changes its format and expires old messages, or its server goes down? AU has lost all those suggestions again!

I think AU needs to create its own respository for official suggestions. This could be as simple as an email address and a mail archive. I also think there should be a separate address for sending category suggestions.

And two to three months to change or add a category? That's just ridiculous. I want to see AU become a viable alternative to eBay, but with that kind of service, it ain't gonna happen. :-(
 

Actually, a post to [email protected] or [email protected] will elicit a personal response.

I would actually prefer that users present their complaints there as private posts don't alert everyone to this problem or that. (And, in an area such as online auctions, people also have opinions that some things that aren't problems are.)

As far as an onsite board, we're under the same restrictions of every online venue in that we can't edit public areas without incurring a great deal of legal liabilty for the one statement we "fail" to edit.

People also are, in my opinion, more likely to express their opinion on an independent site such as this as well.

As far as your opinion regarding how lame it is that it could take a significant amount of time to add a category is an opinion based on general observation, not the facts that we have to deal with regarding our software.

I might add that with 6000 categories in ourdatabase, our software is somewhat complex. Changes in the category tree are more, much more difficult than most imagine.

I thought it was/could be simple too until I asked and got more of an explanation than I counted on.

Thanks for the post and your opinion:-)

neomax

 

Yes, it was reviewed and it was discussed.

I do not expect anything to happen immediately on the suggested changes.

Technical issues are not an insignificant element as it would require a complete change in the category tree to move the category to the collectibles area, I am told.

neomax