posted on September 5, 2000 12:57:40 PM
Okay, I bought a product from an auction the person sent it to me, bookrate wrapped in a brown piece of paper over a priority box. I am getting tired of this. I sell most of the time and I don't want priority postage to go up. This kind of thing in the long run I believe hurts us all, but most of all hurts the honest sellers. So, I called local postage inspection and I spoke to one of the inspectors. They clearly told me this isn't allowed and should have been stopped at the window. She told me if I wanted to I could forward the package minus the book I bought and she would be more them glad to take up the matter to nab the offender. It is actually a federal offense to do what this seller has done. Unless someone can give me a good logical agrument why not to I am going to turn the seller in (I know that isn't going to make me real popular here but hey I am not here to be popular just to learn from other sellers) . I can't think of a reason not to turn this seller in at this point. This is not a new seller. I am not trying to be mean and I know this person can get into some serious trouble because it sounds like the postal inspection office is just as tired of this as I am, but I can't think the person didn't know it was allowed otherwise they wouldn't have wrapped it in brown paper right. . . ? Anyway thanks for your responses ahead of time
posted on September 5, 2000 01:07:35 PM
Traceyg,
Even though this seller isn't new, they may not know better.
I admit that I had done the same thing and nobody ever told me (boy, was I naive). I really didn't know and I found out here.
Write to the seller and let them know how you feel about their shipping methods and choice of materials. I realize that I may be giving this seller too much credit, but you just never know.
Write them and find out first before turning them in.
posted on September 5, 2000 01:11:44 PM
A good logical reason? Try this: no one likes a rat. If you got what you paid for, why should you want to hurt the seller? If you want to start doing your public duty and turn in everyone that commits a very minor Federal offence, then you have probably come to the wrong place.
The other good logical reason, of course, is retaliation. The seller may not be a fine, upstanding, law-abiding citizen like you, and may find some rather severe ways to get even.
Igoring this is NOT like ignoring someone getting beat up, or ingnoring someone stealing a car (thought I'd add this for the benefit of the flames I'M gonna get!)
If it will make you feel better, I'll send the USPS a nickel to cover the cost of the box - that'll give them a 100% markup of\n their cost
posted on September 5, 2000 01:16:13 PM
Write to the seller and let them know how you feel about their shipping methods and choice of materials. I realize that I may be giving this seller too much credit, but you just never know. >>
I think they know and I don't think I am going to hear back from the seller about this issue. I think it is one of those I don't care attitude sellers and you will just go away if I don't answer you.
Why would they remove the window clerk? I can see them warning the window clerk but removing them I don't think so, after all they were not being dishonest. . . ?
posted on September 5, 2000 01:18:34 PM
As an afterthought, and this will make me even more unpopular, perhaps the USPS should start charging users for these supplies. Then, you can use them however you want. As far as I can tell, yours is the only country in the world that provides these supplies for free. In Canada, we have to pay for the box, envelope, and the packing tape.
Also, I have received items many times in these boxes. I re-use them (not to satisfy the environmental terrorists, but because they are convenient and the perfect size). Who's to say the one you got wasn't recycled ... or, is that against Federal law too ...
And, about the window clerk not being dishonest. If s/he knowingly allowed this major Federal crime to occur, s/he is just as guilty. Bye bye job
posted on September 5, 2000 01:21:17 PM
I have received several packages from sellers in a priority box turned inside out or covered in brown paper. It bugs me, but not a lot. I don't do it, but if someone else wants to do it, that's between them and the post office. However, my postal clerk does notice and everytime I get a package this way she writes down the originating post office and sometimes the sellers' address. What she does with this, I don't know and I have never asked. She's good to me, extremely helpful, and goes above and beyond whenever I have problem and I am not one to question.
posted on September 5, 2000 01:21:18 PM
Postal Clerk will get the sack...Poor babies will go hungry..Husband and wife will fight over money problems...Divorce lawyer will take all of the couple's saving for divorce fee...Husband will kill wife...or the other way round, and will go to Jail...family members will demand "revenge" (Vendetta)...relatives living abroad will join in the feud...Then: 3rd World War....
And all that over a BOX?...
******************** Shosh http://www.oldandsold.com/cgi-bin/auction.cgi?justdisp&Rifkah
posted on September 5, 2000 01:23:55 PM
It very possible they didn't know better, I didn't until learning so here, and just recently got a letter from USPS and having to sign a statement before supplies were shipped.
I think you already had your mind made up, just wanted someone to validate your decision, to me your being to extreme, especially without contacting the seller first, but guess you wouldn't want to be identified would you?
ASK ! Better safe, than sorry!
posted on September 5, 2000 01:24:20 PM
I would guess that the seller will get a warning from the USPS, which is probably a good thing. I can't imagine a first offense on this type of thing drawing anything more. And if it's not a first offense, he deserves what he gets.
I agree that the window clerk may be looking at some fairly serious problems, though. But if they can't spot a priority box, should they really be responsible for spotting other more serious "suspicious packages."
posted on September 5, 2000 01:27:08 PM
Well RB it is your kind of reasoning that makes me believe turning this seller in, is the correct thing to do and of course you offered no real logical reasoning. You just have confirmed what I was already leaning towards. As far retaliation as I live with a Marine whos past time is hunting bear, gators and the like (not that I like HIS hobby), but even if didn't fearing someone else actions never stopped me and never will. Actions motived by fear usually lead to an unhappy live. Anyway thanks for confirming what I think I already knew just was kind of hedging on because I don't really like turning in another seller. If that makes me a rat well I have been called worse <LOL> Thanks for the help and have a good evening
posted on September 5, 2000 01:27:19 PM
How could postal clerk see through brown paper? The seller needs to be turned in. People who turn their heads when they see something dishonest happen are just as guilty as the offendor.
posted on September 5, 2000 01:30:38 PM
You would turn in a person that you are not even sure they knew they were doing something illegal because you are afraid your postage may go up. For one box? How about the box of 50 priority boxes the post office left on my front doorstep in the pouring rain. All ruined and I didn't notice a rise in postage.
I would be more worried about the negative impact you might have on the life of this fellow seller and thier family. You do realize he or she could do jail time even if they did not know this was wrong or not?
I worked with the family's of inmates for a while. What this does to the family is shameful, but the children, I'm talking scares that last a lifetime.
I'm not a new seller but I just found out this is illegal myself. I always mail priority because I don't like people emailing me asking where there package is. So this could have been me until recently. I would not have known better. I have never been asked to ship book rate so I lucked out I guess?
I believe everything we do in life sends out ripples and effects the world in ways we cannot comprehend. What you are about to do is slam a boulder into the puddle of a strangers life and you know none of the consequences will do anyone any good.
I couldn't live with myself after doing something like that.
posted on September 5, 2000 01:31:19 PM
Shosh ... that's exactly what happened to my cousin in L.A.!!
He sent me a video tape in one of those boxes. Now, he is in jail, his poor, crippled wife, who used to be a postal clerk, has been fired (for allowing him to do this) and she has been forced to take a job driving a truck, the kids are dressed in rags (one of them was removed by Family Services due to malnutrition), their home has been repossessed, the dog is back at the Humane Society, and on and on and on ...
Woe are they.
To top it off, the video wasn't even that good
But, through every cloud a little ray of sunshine must appear. Thanks to the alert actions of a postal carrier concerned about protecting the public, a varmit law breaking scoundrel and his partner-in-crime have been stopped and punished accordingly. I am sure the population of L.A. is thankful for this person's efforts in keeping the cost of postage down.
posted on September 5, 2000 01:35:22 PM
While I certainly do not condone using free Priority materials for shipping other than Priority, I think turning the seller in is a little drastic.
I also have my doubts that a Postal Inspector would actually follow up on your complaint. In 15 years at the window, our office reported much more serious infractions than using a Priority box improperly, ones that were costing the USPS lots of money (including evidence of a carrier stealing a customer's money - he later became a supervisor!), and very rarely was anything ever done.
Also, nothing will happen to the window clerk who accepted the package. Not only did it get by this clerk, but also every clerk and mail handler from the acceptance office to the delivery office that saw the box, the clerks who sorted the parcels at the delivery office and the carrier that actually delivered it. At any point, one of them could have marked the box as postage due, but they didn't. So how do you punish just the window clerk? You don't.
I think a polite email expressing your surprise that the Priority box was used incorrectly would be more appropriate. But that's probably what I would just do.
posted on September 5, 2000 01:35:23 PM
Strange world we live in: How come no one reports the crack dealers at street corners, the child abuser who might live in the same apartment complex, the wife-beater, but someone is willing to report such a small thing as a box, without discussing it with the "offender"...I just don't get it....
******************** Shosh http://www.oldandsold.com/cgi-bin/auction.cgi?justdisp&Rifkah
posted on September 5, 2000 01:36:03 PM
When someone abuses a service that I enjoy it bugs me also. Maybe it shouldn't but it does. If I see someone cut in front of a line to get tickets I'm annoyed, and that's when I'm not even in the line myself. I know the world isn't fair, but I don't think I should have to turn a blind eye when I can take action.
posted on September 5, 2000 01:37:41 PM
traceyg - sellers misuse PM boxes at their own peril.
One time a woman pretended to be fawning over my baby, but she was actually creating a diversion while she shoplifted. I screamed "THIS WOMAN IS STEALING" at the top of my lungs. I did not want to be associated with what she was doing. I was furious.
I can understand why you want to turn the seller in, and would not blame you in the least if you did. The seller takes their chances, do whatever your gut says to, you've have done nothing wrong.
Regarding the clerk - he/she is not going to lose their job. It is impossible to lose a gov't job for one thing and secondly - the clerks are not required to open every box. Here again, it is the seller who erred, not the clerk. You cheat and cheat and cheat and they you get caught. If not today, then tomorrow, next week or next month. Song as old as time. If the seller does not want trouble he/she should not be using PM supplies wrapped in paper sent bookrate. Simple as that. I don't blame you if you do, don't blame you if you don't, but to sellers out there who do this - if/when you're caught you've got no one to blame but yourself.
posted on September 5, 2000 01:40:55 PM
common sense should tell anyone that boxes printed 'priority mail' should be used only for priority mail. these boxes aren't free--don't think for one minute that the cost of these boxes isn't figured into the postage fee. i wouldn't turn the person in, though. there are 'sins' and then there are 'sins.' this isn't anything to get your pampers into a knot over.
as far as recycling the boxes, i asked my postal clerk and she said that was perfectly legal as they were originally used for their intended purpose. i turn mine inside out. if anyone really wants to check, they'll see the old addresses and postage inside. they are very convenient and lord knows i buy enough from ebay to have a supply for the next millennium!
posted on September 5, 2000 01:47:05 PM
Unless the clerk at the window is extremely smart, they can't tell between a priority box and one wrapped in paper...unless you put them side by side...
Also, there is no way that they can post someone at every dropbox. 16 oz. or less means they can shove as many boxes as they can down that chute.
VeryModern: Ever thought about being a Store Detective? You'd be perfect in that role.
:\\\"Crystalline Sliver cannot be the target of spells or abilities.
posted on September 5, 2000 01:50:34 PM
RB: No one likes a rat....The other good logical reason, of course, is retaliation.
Translation: One's first concerns in making moral judgments should be (a) remaining among the "liked" and (b) avoiding "retaliation" (do you anticipate nasty emails, RB, or letter bombs?).
Nice yardstick for behavior you've got there, RB. Next time your car's broken into, or prices go up at the 7-11 because of shoplifting, remember your advice here.
traceyg - Go for it. Nice to see somebody's got some backbone around here. Semper fi to your DH - are you two going to Operation Arlington Ridge in DC on the USMC 225th birthday 11/10? Trying to get as many active and veteran Marines to show up at the Iwo Jima memorial as we can, just to celebrate and thank those folks who were NOT weenies, no matter how great the cost.
[ edited by HartCottageQuilts on Sep 5, 2000 01:54 PM ]
posted on September 5, 2000 01:57:49 PM
HCQ - I was expecting that from you That's why I put in my 'rider' that I do not equate ignoring this with ignoring real crime.
Someone else said something like there are sins and there are sins. Of course, you have NEVER broken a law ... right?? Never gone through a red light, never sampled a peanut or cherry at the grocery store, etc, ...
posted on September 5, 2000 02:00:01 PM
RB, believe me, I could tell you some USPS horror stories that are simply mind-boggling - probably every current and former employee can. Just two examples: There was the carrier who was having an affair with a clerk. They "rendezvoused" in the back of his mail truck while he was on his route. He later became Postmaster at his office! Another good one is the Postmaster who was embezzling money from her office using an intricate money order scam. Was she fired and sentenced to jail? No, she was demoted to clerk and transferred to another office.
At least all the crazy stories kept the job from being totally mind-numbing.
posted on September 5, 2000 02:02:01 PM
I'd love to know exactly how the post office is handling priority box scofflaws. Any official documentation other than the warnings we all know about?
posted on September 5, 2000 03:12:12 PM
RB-i'm not sure if you misread my meaning or if i misread yours. what i meant to say was some transgressions are very minor and not worth making a federal case of (pun intended). using priority boxes for non-priority mail is one of them. we all do the little naughties; i even ran a red light once (taking injured daughter to hospital). i guess my rambling should come to a point (besides the one on top of my head): save the squawking for when it really matters.
edited because . . . d'oh!
uh huh. that's what i thought!
[ edited by richel on Sep 5, 2000 03:14 PM ]
posted on September 5, 2000 03:13:08 PM
Traceyg said
"I think they know and I don't think I am going to hear back from the seller about this issue. I think it is one of those I don't care attitude sellers and you will just go away if I don't answer you."
Traceyg..you say you "think" this seller knows so you aren't going to do the decent thing and ask first. Instead you assume they know so you can turn them in with an easy conscience. How sad!!
It is not beyond possibility that this seller is not aware of the new postal regulations on this issue. It has been reported here at AW on a number of occasions long after these regulations went into affect of postal employees telling customers to turn the boxes inside out...some have even done it for the postal customer at the counter. It also has been reported here of postal employees advising people to cover the boxes with brown paper in order to ship regular mail...and if I remeber right, one poster told of a postal employee that did it for the customer, at the counter!
Some postal employees will tell you to turn used boxes inside out is agaisnt the rules, others will say it's not.
There are no signs at the post office (at least not in mine) that spell out the legal uses of the priority materials, much less that it is a crime to "misuse" these supplies.
If this seller does not post on the boards they may never have heard of these rules.
The point of laws is to stop behavior that society does not want. It isn't so people can get sent to jail or fined. From your own post you seem to want this behavior to stop. So why not take the high ground and go on the theory the seller was unaware of the rules and give the seller a heads up...let him know the rules and help him stop the inappropriate behavior...after all, isn't that the ultimate outcome you desire?
uh huh. that's what i thought!