powerg1
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posted on September 23, 2000 10:21:46 AM
Payppal is now screwing use on the free $5 for the referral because the new customer doesn't register their bank account number. What a rip off. We get them a new customer, they use the service and send someone payment and because they don't register their bank account - we don't get our referral fee. I have written them to tell them how unfair that is, and I think everyone else should too.
We did our part getting them a new customer and we don't get our fee for that - HOW RUDE!!! We can bring a horse to water, but we can't make them drink!!!
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mballai
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posted on September 23, 2000 02:39:47 PM
I had someone sign up and about a week later I got my referral fee and the guy then paid me too. It is also holding up payments as well if this becomes a common event. It's a stinko idea PayPal! I wonder if PayPal Damon has anything to say about it. I would suggest that only biz users really need this bank account feature. Buyers do not.
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watafind
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posted on September 23, 2000 02:59:56 PM
I signed up for the business account when it first appeared and it was optional.
Being a home based business, I felt it was only right. Besides, it was the only way that I could take advantage of putting PayPal on my webpages and for the daily sweep to my account.
I have since decided to not use the daily sweep option, but I really like the PayPal payment feature on my webpage. It has more than paid for itself.
Another benefit I quickly found by being a business account was that when I had a problem, they responded to my e-mails faster and I believed it was not a form-letter response.
Personally, I feel a lot better about PayPal now that I am paying my way...No such thing as a free lunch and all that...
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mzalez
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posted on September 23, 2000 03:25:17 PM
Yeah! I referred someone who did go and sign up and I didn't get my $5. I don't like that either!
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coonr
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posted on September 23, 2000 06:45:48 PM
The rules for the referral bonuses are plainly stated, so I don't really see what the beef is. What does it take to get a referal fee from eBays Billpoint?
I also don't see how this is slowing down payment. Bank Account does not have to be verified, before a payment can be made.
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margaretc
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posted on September 23, 2000 06:49:57 PM
Well, now, I have received 3 referral fees since the requirement that the person referred register bank account. The people I referred all agreed with me (and PayPal) that it seemed a reasonable expectation. It does take a little longer than before.
Of course, when I signed up for PayPal, the bonus was $10, so I suppose I could still whine because it is only $5.....
All new businesses (and other entities) go through some changes. Do you still have exactly the same way of listing auctions or of bidding as when you first started on eBay?
Whine whine whine. I get very tired of all the whining here. In fact, I am not sure why I am bothering to write to this thread at all ......
Sell it all! I SAID SELL IT ALL!
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uaru
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posted on September 23, 2000 06:59:38 PM
Think about it. If PayPal gave out $5 referrals to everyone that signed up without verifying the person with something other than an email address it would be so easy to make hundreds of dummy accounts.
If there is a program that pays for referrals where new members don't have to supply a credit card information, bank information, or some other physical address verification method let me know. You could collect a referral fee for every free email address you could make up.
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margaretc
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posted on September 23, 2000 07:15:29 PM
Good comments, coonr & uaru!
Thanks. I feel better already!
Sell it all! I SAID SELL IT ALL!
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glasshappy
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posted on September 23, 2000 09:36:00 PM
Just one more reason to drop them
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powerg1
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posted on September 23, 2000 10:44:20 PM
UARU - maybe my point is being missed. Yes they have to have more than just an email for referrals - I agree. But when I get a buyer to sign up; give them their credit card number and then pay me via their credit card - I think I did my part and got them a new customer and I deserve my referral fee. The guy has used them so he is verified, just not his bank account but he registered his VISA.
So my bottom line is if a buyer registers his email; registers his credit card; and then uses that card thru Paypal to pay me - he's now a customer of Paypals who had been referred to by me and I should get the referral $$, no matter if he registers his bank or not - he's now a customer!!!
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uaru
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posted on September 23, 2000 11:27:54 PM
powerg1, yes I see your point, in fairness to X.com I don't think it's out of line to make such a requirement. I think X.com wants the bank verification because it appears to be a more reliable verification, it also gives them a customer that could use X.com's services in a more profitable manner (transactions via bank accounts instead of credit cards).
Since X.com has been taking the loss on stolen credit cards wouldn't it add insult to injury if the buyer used a stolen credit card. X.com's out the funds and to top it off has to pay a referral on top of it?
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fountainhouse
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posted on September 23, 2000 11:38:15 PM
Um, unless I'm missing something here, it DOES take more than an email addy to join any of the online payment services.
Although I suppose it would be possible to create more than a few alternate mailing addresses with which to open a paypal account, how many extra checking/charge accounts would one need to open to make it worthwhile to pull a $5 scam? I'm presuming, of course, that paypal requires unique information for multiple accounts.
If not, then the get-rich-quick scenario above wouldn't be prevented by "verification" anyway.
I think it's crummy they're welshing on their referral fees. But I guess, as paypal complaints go, there's worse things that can (and have and will continue to) happen...
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kerryann
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posted on September 24, 2000 12:58:52 PM
When I signed up for PayPay a long time ago, when bonuses were still $10. the only way you got the referral bonus was if the person signing up provided their credit card info.
Signing up only was not sufficient.
Not Kerryann on eBay
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feistyone
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posted on September 24, 2000 09:11:05 PM
Before this verification thing we used to get 1 - 2 referral bonuses a week. Since verification we have received 0 referral bonuses. Damon said that this would help to offset our costs. Hogwash!
The facts are we have several pending referrals and these people will probably never verify a bank account. The verification thing will not work because people will not grant PayPal access to their bank accounts.
PayPal is no longer a Pal to us!
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tuition44years
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posted on September 24, 2000 10:38:40 PM
When I signed up .. way back when? .. I had to wait for a snail mail to complete the sign up process. They have all my bank account and credit card info, PLUS the address confirmation that came via snail mail. I have the $2000 limit supposedly available only to those who are verified. I haven't gotten many referal fees but those I have gotten have gone through. What am I missing? .. this doesn't add up!
I haven't finished the verification process (because the $#&# hit the fan in the middle of it and I'm not sure I'm going to use them anymore) but they sent me a little over $1.50! Multiply that by the number of verified users!
Maybe if they hadn't been so generous with the referal bonuses and weren't now sending people deposits totaling over $1 for verification they could have managed on the float ... their original 'business plan' (using the term loosely)!!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I have a memory like a steel trap .. unfortunately it's rusted shut!
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jumpup
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posted on September 25, 2000 06:04:17 AM
we dropped paypal like a HOT POTATO. first they said FREE FOREVER! then they sold out to x.com.then x.com had a link for us to register,when no one paid any attention to the link they came up with the verify feature to bully us into submission.we felt the verify feature wasnt needed as they had our bank info all along and we had made plenty of good transactions allready.then when that wouldnt work they bullied us into thinking we had to upgrade to a business account.well that was the final straw! we decided we wernt getting enough online payments to deal with all the changes.I guess they figured since we put up with all the bull at ebay and are still there we would just buckle and do whatever x.com decided ..........WRONG!
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abingdoncomputers
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posted on September 25, 2000 10:43:04 AM
powerg1, yes I see your point, in fairness to X.com I don't think it's out of line to make such a requirement. I think X.com wants the bank verification because it appears to be a more reliable verification, it also gives them a customer that could use X.com's services in a more profitable manner (transactions via bank accounts instead of credit cards).
Surely you're joking. A slice of swiss cheese has fewer holes than this "verification" process.
According to PayPal, the reason for verifying a bank account is because only the real account holder would have knowledge of the 2 small verification deposits. Therefore this "verification" method is more secure than just depositing money into the user's bank account. This is completely untrue and illogical.
No thief in the world would have money deposited into an account that he doesn't have access to. Why would he? The purpose of requesting an ACH transfer into your bank account is to be able to SPEND THE MONEY. If you have no way to retrieve the money from the account, then you have no reason to request the ACH transfer in the first place. After all, a crook isn't going to go to the trouble (or risk going to jail) just so that SOMEONE ELSE can have more money in their bank account.
If a crook has access to an account which allows him to withdraw money from it, then the crook also can "verify" the 2 small deposits from PayPal, in which case PayPal has just "verified" a crook.
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uaru
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posted on September 25, 2000 11:07:17 AM
"Surely you're joking"
Nope, I assure you my sense of humor is better than that. If you slapped your knee and laughed then it was unintentional.
"According to PayPal, the reason for verifying a bank account is because only the real account holder would have knowledge of the 2 small verification deposits. Therefore this "verification" method is more secure than just depositing money into the user's bank account. This is completely untrue and illogical. No thief in the world would have money deposited into an account that he doesn't have access to. Why would he?"
First off, we are talking 'verification' there are many PayPal users that have never made a deposit to their bank, so the issue of verifiying via normal deposits the member makes won't fly if the member is a buyer only.
The issue of the 'deposit verification' has been beat do death. I did it on a lark when I found out I could verifiy my bank so I could make withdrawals without having to send them in a canceled check, which is what they required at one time.
I guess my biggest confusion over the 'deposit verification' is the fact that it is an issue. It doesn't take but a few seconds, and it doesn't cost a dime. It also takes care of the issue with people giving the wrong routing number or checking account info and then later making panic phone calls and panic posts "PAYPAL STOLE MY MONEY!!!" after they've tried to make a electronic withdrawal.
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jtland
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posted on September 25, 2000 11:16:53 AM
Why would a buyer care if they were verified or not? If I were only a buyer, there is no way I would provide Paypal with access to my checking account, because I wouldn't be doing deposits to that account. It's hard enough convincing buyers that it's safe to provide their credit card numbers!
And since the buyers won't be verified, the sellers won't get the referral bonus. Thanks a lot, Paypal.
Lisa
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magazine_guy
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posted on September 25, 2000 11:17:28 AM
They've changed their referral offer, but burried the notification deep inside the site. Until recently, you got your $5 referral as soon as a new PayPal user registered with PayPal and paid with a CC. No longer. Now they've gotta do the bank account verification. Most buyers don't.
Check your referral log. Refferal: Referral log. You'll likely have a bunch of pending referrals since 8/18, and few prior.
Here's their admission that they've changed the referral offer:
******
New Referral Bonus Policy
We have modified our referral bonus requirements. The individuals you refer must confirm their email address and bank account for you to get $5. To increase the security of the PayPal service, we are encouraging all of our users to verify their identity by confirming a bank account.
*******
Steve
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abingdoncomputers
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posted on September 25, 2000 11:21:17 AM
First off, we are talking 'verification' there are many PayPal users that have never made a deposit to their bank, so the issue of verifiying via normal deposits the member makes won't fly if the member is a buyer only.
If this is the case, why does PayPal insist that long-term users with multiple completed deposits into their bank account go through this "verification" process? This is completely illogical. And just because a user is new to PayPal doesn't mean that he/she is not a crook who just happens to have ACCESS to a bank account, which may or may not be "theirs".
Owning a bank account and having access to a bank account are entirely separate things. I will repeat what I said earlier as it is still valid: If a crook has access to a bank account (which happens quite often), the crook can verify the 2 small deposit amounts. Therefore, PayPal has just "verified" a crook. It makes no difference if the crook is a new PayPal user or not.
I am VERY MUCH in favor of a fair and VALID verification process, as it would go a long way toward making a credit card transaction via PayPal safer for all parties involved. But this "verification" scheme is seriously flawed and there are more reliable ways to address the issue of verification.
The reason that the bank account verification is still debated is because it is worthless as far as its' intended purpose is concerned. But we all know by now that the reason for it as stated by PayPal is not the real reason at all.
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paypaldamon
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posted on September 25, 2000 12:38:01 PM
Hi,
All users that were opt-in on receiving notification emails were advised of this change, as well as the change being placed on the web site back in August.
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mboyko
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posted on September 25, 2000 01:44:03 PM
Oh yeah Paypaldamon? Well I think it sucks! I have quit referring people to PayPal. Yes me, probably your most prolific referrer prior to the change. I used to refer 5 people or more every week! Well you can kiss those new members goodbye.
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magazine_guy
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posted on September 25, 2000 03:56:28 PM
Damon:
I get emails from PayPal, but didn't receive anything on this. Just checked my old email. I received the monthly "PayPal News" on June 13 and again on July 15. Nothing since.
If I email you, can you send me the edition of PayPal News that contained this announcement?
Steve
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paypaldamon
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posted on September 25, 2000 04:04:38 PM
Hi magazine_guy,
I had posted the email earlier, but it is probably buried within one of the threads. I will try to track it down again. Did you change your profile at all about notifications under your profile? If this was changed it would not have sent it to your email address.
The date, while foggy in my head, was August 18th or so.
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HJW
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posted on September 25, 2000 04:12:54 PM
I did not receive this notice and based on the number of equally
surprised members of PayPal, I don't believe that the email was sent.
[ edited by HJW on Sep 25, 2000 04:14 PM ]
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slr101
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posted on September 25, 2000 04:19:55 PM
Damon,
You state:All users that were opt-in on receiving notification emails were advised of this change, as well as the change being placed on the web site back in August.
I currently have *17* "pending" people in my referral log, ALL DATED BEFORE AUGUST 1 and the oldest dated March 25.
Any chance of this $85 being credited to my account?
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paypaldamon
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posted on September 25, 2000 04:28:54 PM
Hi slr101,
The same criteria would have applied when the referral bonuses were in effect with credit card registration. They would remain pending until the party had done so.
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slr101
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posted on September 25, 2000 04:39:26 PM
Damon,
Thanks for responding to that...although I didn't keep a log of this (until recently), I know that at least some of the people who joined paypal through me had to have given CC information.
But since I didn't keep a log of who was a buyer, and who was someone I bought from, I won't pursue it further...thanks for responding...
Shannon
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jumpup
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posted on September 25, 2000 04:55:30 PM
paypaldamon____ Just wondering how long after you cancell an account dureing a transfer does it take paypal to send a check for the money that was pending being sent to your account that was cancelled
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