posted on February 14, 2001 12:15:42 PM new
I have checked these boards and heard some really bad stuff about PayPal. I have been using PayPal since they first started. At a point when I was getting $10 a referal and most sellers were not accepting it. I never had problems with PayPal; until now.
I called up to complain about their referal bonus program. Now you will only get if the refered person signs up for a money market account, gives their SS# and transfers $100 from their bank to their PayPal account! I thought that was too much and that people who promoted the service did deserve more than that since they were making more money off fees, intrest, etc.
Anyway, the customer service rep on the phone was TOTALLY RUDE to me. He just kept repeating their terms of agreement "We have the right to change our agreement at anytime..." Then he would not let me speak. He kept yelling at me and said "if you don't like the service, I dare you to find one better." I asked him to put me through to a supervisor and he refused. I said I would not put up with this $hit and he called me an a$$hole and hung up!
I could not believe this happened. I am a so-called "Premier-Seller" who pay's a load of money in fees. I have refered at least 500-1000 people, and only used PayPal last year even though I would have been better off using BillPoint or just plain money orders! I called back and got an apology, but they were not likely to do anything about it. PayPal's service is getting progressively worse from what I have been reading.
Anyway, I am just blowing off some steam as this really pissed me off. Since I started using BillPoint I have recieved most of my payments through that(though I hate giving eBay more of my money through fees). I decided that instead of putting up with this, its best to just not promote PayPal, accept it only if the customer wants it, and downgrade to a "Personal" account. Then, if I meet my limit I could always use my wife's accont and I won't have to worry about paying fee's anymore! I use to turn over about $1000-$2000 per month on PayPal and since I started using BillPoint, I only get about $400-$500 anyway.
posted on February 14, 2001 12:23:28 PM newdigitalmaster:
Sorry to hear that!! I have unfortunately had very similar experiences with their ex-partners X.com. Yes, I'm still having problems with my X.com account that was closed 3 months ago. Those people can't get ANYTHING straight!
Anyways, I contacted X.com (which is now Paypal) and they put me through to the people taking care of all the old X.com accounts. The guy on the phone had me nearly in tears, he was SO RUDE! At one time he even made the statement "those X.com people are morons". After going around with him about my account that should have been cleared up months ago, I finally asked him to put his supervisor on and he said "THAT'S THE BEST NEWS I'VE HEARD ALL DAY!" and then hung up on me. When I called back he answered and wouldn't put me through to his supervisor - just wouldn't quit yelling at me, etc. I had to call back 3 times and had my mother get through for me before I could contact his supervisor. When I finally got the supervisor I told him how rude the other guy was and he ignored me and said "so what can I do for you?". UGH!
I realize they are not the *exact* same company as Paypal but they are all affiliated if you ask me and it reflects on the entire operation.
I've never seen such poor customer service in my whole life.
posted on February 14, 2001 12:33:29 PM new
I would like to get rid of PayPal.
Problem is, all I hear about is bidder/buyers, NOT seeing NO PayPal.
And then I hear some say bidders just go ahead and send it to them.
I still have it up on the last 2 items I have now, but would like to close my account now, I think I've heard and read enough to convince me.
I know its ebays thing; Billpoint. But I do seem to like it better. I don't know, I feel better when bidders use it. I know its not good on smaller sales with the fees charged, but higher priced items it seems like the best one so far.
I know PayPal is trying to push me into their debit card, and I don't want it, esp. having to open up a money market acct. Now they want any referrals to open one, AND they have to deposit $100 in?
I remember before X.com closed down, they were going to require keeping $100? not sure in their checking account, or it would be closed, and then not long after that, they were gone. Not looking good at all for PayPal.
But how do you get bidders to NOT use it on your auctions? The buyers seem to love it....
posted on February 14, 2001 12:45:30 PM new
I can honestly say I've never called up BillPoint and had a bad experience. Then again I've never seen BillPoint post a phone number.
BillPoint hasn't changed its referral bonuses either.
posted on February 14, 2001 12:57:38 PM new
You could give a try to Yahoo! PayDirect, is free to buyer and seller, it can be used at any auction house and/or website. So far I had no problems!
posted on February 14, 2001 12:58:27 PM new
Of course there are no referal bonuses!
I don't know. I figure by at least moving to a personal account, your still hurting PayPal because they lose the fees and you can still accept PayPal payments. Seems like a good solution to me. If enough of us "down grade" they will want to make changes to get us back possibly.
posted on February 14, 2001 01:07:51 PM new
Hi digitalmaster and Executivegirl,
I do apologize for the problems you have had when calling customer service. You are more than welcome to send me any pertinent information and it will be directed to the appropriate heads of Customer Service.
The referral program has been changed for several months now and it applies to Business/Premier accounts only.Promotional items can have the terms and conditions change because they are promotional in nature and are not indefinite. We have not discontinued the program, but the qualifications have changed as to what qualifies as a referral and what will earn a referral bonus. In order to keep up on changes in the service,I would recommend checking the POLICY UPDATES after you log in to the account--it has a last updated date as well.
Social Security numbers are needed for those participating in the Money Market because the interest earned has to be reported to the IRS (our contract for the debit card also requires the social security number).
posted on February 14, 2001 01:20:02 PM new
I called and spoke with "Cathy," a manager, and complained. She was actually very nice. Regardless, I should not have been talked to in that manner. I will probably move to a Personal account either way because I see no need to continue promoting PayPal if there are no referals. BillPoint is much easier anyway according to my customers. Plus, since I started using BillPoint, I am not getting many payments to my PayPal account so with the money I save using a personal account, it will ballence out the fees I pay on BillPoint!
posted on February 14, 2001 01:32:23 PM new
You could give a try to Yahoo! PayDirect, is free to buyer and seller, it can be used at any auction house and/or website. So far I had no problems!
Rudy
USMarines
Semper Fidelis!>>
I dumped paypal a long time agao. Like you I have been using Paydirect both in my Yahoo and Ebay auctions etc. . . I am very happy with them and their customer service is excellent and no problem getting a phone number for them etc. . . when I first has some question. After using paypal I was a bit gun shy to try another service. I also was one of the winners of their contest. They beamed 100.00 right in my account. It isn't a million but made my day : )
posted on February 14, 2001 01:43:41 PM new
I completely missed the update on the Money Market for referrals. That's absurd. I was wondering why I had no referral fees lately. I think I will have to reconsider my use of PayPal.
posted on February 14, 2001 02:16:27 PM new
I strongly urge you to file a complaint using the Better Business Bureau's online complaint form. It will only take you a minute and the complaint will be forwarded to the BBB of Santa Clara County, CA. Paypal is located on University Ave. in Palo Alto. Don't worry, the BBB is already very familiar with Paypal. They field hundreds of complaints about Paypal every month and have already cancelled Paypal's BBB-approved status.
I quit Paypal a few months ago and they let me know in no uncertain terms I was not welcome back. Then, when the BBB began applying the thumbscrews, Paypal sent me a "how can we improve our service/won't you please come back? " email. What a load. Paypal could give a fig about my input. It was pure damage control so they could tell the BBB they're doing something to clean up their mess. I let them know exactly what I thought about their service. Paypal is a bunch of crooks. The response DM got was no doubt a result of handling thousands of complaints every day.
Paypaldamon, your "send me the info" shpiel is getting old. How about the thousands and thousands of customers who don't have access to these boards and must rely on telephone support? (If they can even find Paypal's hidden phone number.) PPD, your position here is pure damage control and a plain attempt to hush up complaints in this very public forum.
posted on February 14, 2001 02:26:08 PM new
Hi twinsoft,
I can only handle items brought to the attention in the areas that I go through.
Yes, I make sure that the area of my job responsibility is handled to the best of my ability. I also make sure that specific customer concerns are brought to the attention of nearly the entire organization so that we can make improvements in the areas that could be impacting our customers in a negative manner and to make sure that notice is taken of the things our customers feel we are doing well. My job is not purely customer service.
posted on February 14, 2001 02:28:06 PM newI strongly urge you to file a complaint using the Better Business Bureau's online complaint form.
File with the BBB because PayPal changed the requirements for referrals 3 months ago? LOL... wow, we do have an axe to grind don't we.
Maybe you can file a complaint because BillPoint withdrew the free VISA payments also. While you're at it filed a complaint with the BBB because eBay was down earlier today.
Amazing
Notice Date: November 10, 2000 Effective Date: December 1, 2000
PayPal is changing its bonus requirements to promote our new Money Market Reserve Fund, which offers users Money Market rates of return on their money...
posted on February 14, 2001 02:51:16 PM new
Uaru, no not because Paypal changed their policy three months ago. Actually, Paypal changes their terms daily, that's why there's so much confusion.
The reason I suggested contacting the BBB is because a customer service rep has no business calling a customer an a$$hole and refusing to bring a supervisor. That is outrageous, or perhaps you feel that is adequate customer support?
The BBB is the only organization I know of that is in a position to exert pressure on Paypal to clean up their act.
posted on February 14, 2001 02:56:14 PM new
Hi twinsoft,
If things happened as stated with that customer... I agree 100% percent with you (that is why I asked for the information relative to the scenario).
Our terms of use changes are visible on the web site with a last modified date. Users that are opt-in will also receive notifications on policy changes. If a user is not opt-in and does not check the policy updates link after they sign in to the account they will not be aware of changes that can impact them.
The BBB issue is being handled by an executive (actually sits two seats from me) and my feedback is asked for on things I see on the forums.
posted on February 14, 2001 02:56:56 PM new
Okay, so how does one "downgrade" to a personal account from a business account? I've asked this of CS, but no reply yet.
posted on February 14, 2001 02:59:16 PM new
It is so sad to hear another case where customer service is not up to par but it is becoming more and more common. The longer I spend reading posts on this board about paypal.com the happier I am that I did not sign up for it. We may have lost bidders who wanted the convience of Paypal but I have always felt it was worth it.
posted on February 14, 2001 02:59:30 PM new
Hi misscandle,
You are allowed one downgrade. Log in to your account and go to contact customer service (the request is password protected and that is why you would need to log in). Type in a brief note asking to downgrade and it should be handled as quickly as possible (I do know that customer service has a slight backlog at the moment, but I would expect it to be done within several days)
posted on February 14, 2001 03:03:47 PM new
If Paypal is no longer affiliated with a real bank (XCom), how is Paypal able to offer Money Market accounts? What entity is investing the funds? Are these accounts secured by anyone?
posted on February 14, 2001 03:08:16 PM new
Twinsoft,
Without a transcript of the actual telephone I could be wrong on my assumptions here. But it seems like the original poster called just to voice a complaint about the changes made on Nov. 10th with the referral requirements. There doesn't seem to be any assistance he was seeking from his post, I'm not sure what the call was supposed to have accomplished. Was the rep suppose to change the referral policy to what it was 3 months ago?
While I do appreciate that PayPal offers a phone number to contact reps I can see some abuse of that when it becomes a complaint line on issues that can't be changed. I wonder how eBay's reps would have handled the phones when they changed their fee structure or when they make an announcement about the email privacy program.
posted on February 14, 2001 03:10:53 PM new
I'm not trying to defend Paypal, but I have had similar situations happen with the customer service reps at longstanding and reputable places many, many times. I think its just par for the course. Sometimes you get an idiot that could care less (Tried calling a certain computer company known for their customer service lately? nothing but problems). Sometimes you get the most wonderful, helpful person. Paypal does have its problems but they are not alone.
posted on February 14, 2001 04:02:32 PM new
Well this thread has been helpful. I yanked the PayPal logo and $5.00 sign-on mention off all of my auctions. My future ones will have a one line payment method with PayPal mentioned LAST.
I have a lot of bidders who use PayPal, but I no longer wish to advertise for them. The idea of a referral promotion is to make it attractive to sign up and use a service, not to sign up and then use a secondary service that has nothing whatsoever to do with purchasing online.
posted on February 14, 2001 05:44:36 PM new
My point exactly. I will still might accept PayPal, but I will no longer promote them. Thus, I will get less payments through them and I can downgrade my account to personal and pay no fees.
Let me make one thing clear. I have known about the money market thing for about a month now. I called and complained about it before and the rep I spoke with (who was really nice) never called me, nor emailed me back (he said he would). So, I only called them again because I noticed that I could no longer access the "referal" section of their site.
When I checked my history it was fine but everytime I checked the referal history it logged me off my PayPal account. I found this strange and I called to voice my oppinion and complain about the referal policy again. I did not call to argue, nor was I irate or rude in the conversation. I was only suggesting to them that they should reconsider their referal policies. The rep who was rude would not transfer me to a supervisor. I called back and spoke with a really nice rep and talked to the supervisor Cathy who said she would do something.
Even though she will do something about he guy who cussed me out, I am sure nothing will be done about the messed up referal policy so why should we promote their service? There is no bennifit to furthur promote it in my oppinion! You can just as easily notify bidders after the auction that you will accept PayPal, but you prefer money order or BillPoint, or any other service.
The thing that bothers me is that on all my auctions I promote PayPal each and every day. I have TONS of referals that are "pending" that I feel I should have some sort of kick back for. This is not like BillPoint where a user just pays for an item. They are signing up for an account with PayPal. They are paying to use the service if they sell and are making PayPal money on interest.
Regardless, even if my reasoning is wrong, PayPal promotes itself with the referals. A lot of people who are just now considering signing up see the "Refer your friends and earn $5!" and they assume that they will really get a kick-back when in fact that is very unlikely. Also, not only does the user have to sign up with a money market account and give their SS#, the user has to do all the following:
1. Sign up for PayPal (no problem)
2. Confirm their email address (no problem)
3. Confirm a checking account (a little hassle)
4. Add $100 or more by electronic funds transfer into their PayPal account (on the phone I was told when they first sign up if they don't add $100 into their account at one time, We dont get any bonus!)
5.Sign up for a Money Market Fund (Most people don't need it, nor would want it!)
posted on February 15, 2001 12:08:21 AM new
Here is a tip.
Whenever I call Paypal (or any company I have a gripe with), I ALWAYS ask whom I am speaking with AND I record the phone calls !
I just hit the button on my answering machine and it records the conversation. I have done this with ebay, Paypal, Compaq, my phone company, etc...
This way if I get some jerk getting smart with me I have his name and the conversation taped ! I then call back later and I play it back for their supervisers !
I cannot even begin to tell you the bonuses I have recieved through this method ! But the real pleasure comes when the rep himself has to eat crow on the phone with me (which I always ask for a formal apology), that is priceless.
Just about any cheap answering machine will do this (the new ones do not even require a tape). You simply erase it if you have no problems, but if you do have a problem, it is EXTREMELY helpful !
posted on February 15, 2001 01:05:37 AM new
Just a note...in most states, you are required to ask the person you are recording if it is okay to do so, or alert him or her with a beep tone or something similar. I agree, this is a great way of having a record of telephone calls, but if you do try to use a recording that has been made illegally, you may be in big trouble.
posted on February 15, 2001 02:13:47 AM new
I think more emphasis and promotion among sellers should go into moneyzap.
Owned and operated by none other than
WESTERN UNION
They have been in the business of wiring funds for decades and now have an online service.
With all the problems of these uninsured companies and some of them with "ExchangePath" endings I'll give moneyzap a go and I have not started mentioning them in my auction ads.
http://www.lovepotions.net
