posted on April 11, 2001 02:18:26 PM
I have a book that I have four copies of, so I put a little extra time and effort into the description. I wrote my own copy talking the book up, wrote out all the chapters and material to be found in the book, and also quoted the first couple paragraphs from the introduction, to give the author's description of the book. I also did a scan of the front cover of one of my books.
My first sale went well, it got a couple bids, nothing amazing, but I was happy. Then I relisted it. It didn't get a bid this time. So I relisted it again. In checking the market for the book, I took a look at another seller with the same title.
Upon research, it became clear to me that the seller stole:
1- my item description
2- my search description
3- my scan
I was sorta miffed about this. I sent an email, very polite but firm requesting the seller not do this in the future. I got a reply back saying she didn't take anything from me.
I sent another email enlightening her to the many ways in which she did take from me. She finally admitted it and apologized, but I don't think it was sincere....anyway, I guess what I want to know is, am I making too much of this? Is it not that big a deal to most sellers?
posted on April 11, 2001 02:22:26 PM
It's a big deal to me-- especially when your competition is using your copyrighted property to compete AGAINST you!
Have eBay end any such auctions. Join VeRO to make it easier next time.
posted on April 11, 2001 02:26:47 PM
Steve (or anyone else),
I have several questions about the VeRO program.
Is it limited to IP items only? Or can it include physical products?
For example, I've developed my own product line of items which I sell but aren't trademarked. To my knowledge, SO FAR, I'm the only one who makes & sells these items.
Can I register these types of items with VeRO & if so, what forms do I use? All the VeRO stuff on ebay seems to deal with filing infringements, where do I register to join & give a list or photo copy of the items I'd like to protect under VeRO.
There's nothing stopping someone from taking your idea, making similar widgets, and selling them on eBay. Your idea isn't protected.
It's the original words and images that are protected by copyright law, and eBay's VeRO is their way dealing with claimed infringements.
When you first apply for VeRO, you fill out a hard copy statement under penalty of perjury that you are an intellectual property owner (we all are-- of our descriptions and photos). Thereafter, eBay will accept your email complaints of infringement, and end infringing auctions pretty quickly.
They're not a substitute for the patent office, though. Anyone can copy your idea-- and your product.
posted on April 11, 2001 03:11:40 PM
That happened to me too but the guy stole the ENTIRE AUCTION CODE!! Copy, style, color, size, description, pictures EVERYTHING! Because he stole the code the pictures he was using were being hosted by ME, ON MY SERVER that I pay for, that I uploaded to.
Ebay said I had to show them proof it was my stuff. I told them to go LOOK. I guess that's just not enough proof.
*********************************
The statement below is true.
The statement above is false.
posted on April 11, 2001 06:30:07 PM
This happened to me about a week ago. I finally got eBay to pull the auction. I reported it the first day it was on to [email protected]. I e-mailed the person using my auction description and images, telling them to end their auction and relist using their own material, and cc 'd that to safeharbor. Waited a couple days and nothing happened. Then I printed off a copy of the VeRO Notice of Infringement form from eBay's site, filled it out and faxed it to them. Waited more days and nothing happened. Finally, with 1 day and about 12 hours to go on the stolen auction, I wrote an e-mail to [email protected] stating the problem again, outlining everything that I had all ready done, and asking why no action had been taken. They finally cancelled the auction. The seller relisted almost immediately still using some of my words but chopped up and scanned a picture out of a book instead of using my images. Not a perfect outcome, but at least the auction was ended. If it ever happens again, I will fax the VeRO form immediately. I don't think they will take any action without it. eBay's rules say that a user can be suspended for copyright infringement. Unfortunately, this didn't happen in my case. I was told by many people to just let it go and not waste my time on it, but it became a matter of principle with me. I plan on doing this every time someone uses my description or images. If enough people keep at it, maybe we can ge dishonest sellers off eBay, or at least slow them down a little.
posted on April 11, 2001 07:11:19 PMIf it ever happens again, I will fax the VeRO form immediately.
You only have to fax the first one. After that you just email the notice of infringement to [email protected]. The auction(s) will be ended in 1 to 2 hours.
posted on April 11, 2001 07:29:29 PM
I read somewhere on these boards where this same thing happened to someone else. They changed the picture to another one, not a very pleasant picture, and saved it with the same name. Now when the other persons auction comes up, instead of showing the stolen photo, something totally different shows up.
Great idea huh
posted on April 11, 2001 07:43:32 PM
I had another seller take my pic and description recently-- and while I was waiting for eBay VeRO to do their thing (it took over 24 hours, for some reason), since the miscreant just linked to the pic on my server, I subbed in this (the item was a Motor Show Annual magazine in pretty good condition):
He got the message, I think.
S.
[ edited by magazine_guy on Apr 11, 2001 07:45 PM ]
posted on April 11, 2001 08:24:23 PM
magazine guy, your post actually got me to smile after a VERY long day at work.
I have a similar solution to picture copycats. If they're using a link to my server, I substitute my picture of a widget for a picture of a couple um...'interacting' with each other...how shall I put this...in the way that Monica Lewinsky was famous for.
Very graphic, and very effective. Have never yet done this and NOT found the auction cancelled in 24 hours or less.
Those bidders lookin' for books on sewing or needlework sure get a surrrrrrrprise!
posted on April 11, 2001 10:15:40 PM
I sell postcards and magazines. When I scan these items I have a small banner Taped accross my scanner bed that sez "Auctions by Pricefixer--If you see this photo on another Auction it is stolen!!" When I scan Imake sure it shows up
This has not caused my sales to slow down.
posted on April 12, 2001 07:48:17 AM
Thanks for the replies, folks. It makes me feel normal again. One question I have, though: is a scan of a book cover my property? Is that something I can complain about to VeRO? I mean, I didn't take the photo on the cover of the book. I didn't publish the book. I did the scan, of course, but what proprietary rights do I have beyond my own personal use?
posted on April 12, 2001 09:20:42 AM
Where the heck do I get the forms to JOIN VeRO? Everything on their page seems to deal with filing for an infringement but I don't see the ownership papers to be filed out.
Can anyone help me out w/a direct link to the blasted correct forms to fill out?!
The image you created of the item you're selling is your intellectual property, and has copyright protection as soon as you publish it. You publish it when you list your auction.
eventer:
Here's the relevant links:
How to join VeRO (this includes a link to download the infringement notice- for the first time you need to fax them back a hard copy; thereafter you can report infringements via email):
VeRO's got some bad press because of abuses by the big corporations. In my view, that's no reason not to join and use it (legally) to your advantage to protect your intellectual property. When others use my work to compete against me, that's not OK with me.
Thanks but I'm having some SERIOUS "almost 50" moments today.
I saw those but don't they just deal with reporting people for infringements? I didn't see anything on them where I can state I'm the rightful owner of XYZ & I'm just joining up in case anyone decides to steal my photos/descriptions.
Or do I use the same form & just note that no-one has YET stolen anything but I'd like to get my info on file?
posted on April 12, 2001 11:10:58 AM
Oh! I see....
Your join VeRo concurrent with your first notice of infringement. So when you discover an infringement, you join VeRO and give eBay notice of infringement at the same time.
Thereafter, you're a VeRO member, and it just takes an email with a similar format to the notice of infringement.
posted on April 12, 2001 11:40:20 AM
I wouldn't be too certain that scans of works other than your own can be copyrighted. There is no originality to the work. "Sweat of the brow" is not copyrightable.
A description of an item may not rise to copyright protection either. Where did you derive the description ? From the book introduction itself ? Sorry, not an original piece of work.
Unless the work has some modicum of originality, a copyright won't stand.
The scans raise another question. If the material scanned is still under copyright/trademark of the originator, are you infringing on the holder or is it fair use? If it is fair use, how can you claim infringement on the image when you're not the copyright holder? You have no standing to persue copyright.
posted on April 14, 2001 06:16:18 PM
I refuse to start a new thread on this topic, lately one of these threads are starting every week ~ I'll just let this one bounce!
So what is it? The YooHoo sellers coming over and plagiarizing? Was is harder to spot at YooHoo?
**venting**
I was copied (pic & description) by a newbie seller on 8 auctions today. Gee, don't I feel special? not really! I feel like a sucker! It was on my secondary ID ~ less than 50 FB
SOOO......
is it the newbie sellers doing this or are the newbie sellers [/b]the target[/b] for dirtbags to do this to?
(I look like a newbie with that ID).
any input??? theories???
