posted on May 22, 2001 12:14:41 PM
I have just had my first mangled mail incident. The insured padded mailer arrived by my postal carrier in a plastic bag. It was mangled/shredded actually. She asked to call her supervisor and I gave her the phone. He said I could not open the package unless I was agreeing to accepting it in it's condition! I was allowed to feel the package to see if anything was in it. Then he suggested I simply refuse the package and it would be returned to the sender and he could file for the insurance. That didn't seem quite right to me. I am the one entitled to the insurance to cover my purchase price. I know I can request the seller to file and when he gets paid he send me my money. I am just concerned that I have no proof at all that I received the item mangled. They didn't give me any kind of paper/receipt. Has anyone had this happen before? Would it have been better for me to have accepted the shredded mailer and kept it in my possession until the claim was paid??? I have emailed the seller and let them know what was going on, but I have not heard back from the yet. Any advice would be greatly appreciated....Thanks! Sulyn
PS: The reason I am asking for advice is I am having second thoughts about having refused the package and am considering running to the local PO and trying to intercept it. I sure wish the postal carrier would have waited until I talked to you guys before making me make a decision like that!
[ edited by sulyn1950 on May 22, 2001 12:17 PM ]
posted on May 22, 2001 12:26:20 PM
In the event this happens again (which I hope not), accept it.
Then notify your seller who has to file a claim with his/her post office.
The seller must initiate the claim unless they send you the slip in which case they also have to send a letter stating you can get the refund.
There is a place on the form in which they fill out who gets the reimbursement. I usually (and this happened just once) fill in the bidder's info.
Then the claim is sent to your post office. You have to bring the package in, including the wrapping, etc and fill out your portion of the form. If the seller says you can have the refund, and it's $50 or under, you get a refund right there. If not, it has to be sent to St. Louis for a decision.
In either case, you must relinquish the package to the post office first. You can't expect a refund unless you do. Even if the seller requests the refund be made to him or her, you still have to give up the package and yes, they should give you a receipt at that time.
I've never heard of a situation where you couldn't open the package to inspect the goods! What if they were okay? If they are chances are you will not get a refund from the seller.
We received a package via UPS last week in which the box was mangled and wet. The item inside, however was in good shape. I couldn't file a claim for a damaged package, but I could have filed a claim if the item was damaged. The driver told me to open the package.
posted on May 22, 2001 12:30:32 PM
Contrary to popular belief, insurance actually covers the seller, not the buyer.
Regardless of whether you accepted or refused the package, the insurance claim will have to be filed/initiated by the seller. He/She purchased the insurance and filled out the insurance forms. As such, the Post Office will insist in dealing only with them. The buyer only gets involved when package inspections need to take place.
Given the circumstances surrnouding your transaction, your seller is going to have to wait until the packaged is returned refused. He/She will then need to initiate a claim. If granted, they will then be reimbursed by the Post office for the insured value (subject to claims adjustment) of the contents.
You may want to contact your seller and advise them of the situation. It would show good faith on your part as a responsible buyer. Offer to assist them in any manner you can and then the two of you can work towards having the claim accepted. Work TOGETHER!
As a seller, whenever I've run into this type of situation, I always immediately make good with the customer. I either reship or refund right away. I then take the reponsibility of fighting with the Post office on the claim. It's a customer service issue with me and my policy may not be shared among other sellers.
posted on May 22, 2001 12:35:31 PM
I had a gut feeling I should have accepted it. Since doing as the PO suggested I also had the thought about return postage! If they send this plastic baggy back, the sender will probably have to pay the postage! It seems silly to me to send an obvious empty/mangled item back. What happens if it gets LOST on the way back? Then what? I did think not letting me open it was silly, but they explained once opened REFUSAL was no longer an option. They are the ones that suggested refusal.
The item was over $50.00. It's also something the seller would not be able to simply replace with another one like it.
I have emailed seller and told them I followed the USPS suggestion of refusing the package because I wasn't sure what else to do. Still haven't heard from them, but I am sure I will. It just may be too late to intercept at the PO if that is what they wanted me to do.
edited for typo/grammer
[ edited by sulyn1950 on May 22, 2001 12:42 PM ]
posted on May 22, 2001 12:52:59 PM
I've only had one occassion where we had to file an insurance claim with the post office, AND it was the buyer who initiated the claim, although I was the one who requested the insurance.
The buyer immediately brought the broken item to the post office with all the packing material. They filled out their portion of the PS Form 1000, and it was forwarded on to me via mail.
I had the option when completing the rest of the form to have the money refunded to myself or the buyer.
The insurance was for an amount under $50 in this case.
posted on May 22, 2001 01:22:09 PM
Well, you would think the USPS would know the best way to handle an INSURED damaged item. WRONG! I just got off the phone where I talked to 3 different people! I eventually got to the local postmaster. Each person I spoke to acted like this was the first time anything like this had every happened and they really didn't know what to do! I eventually got to the local postmaster and he said he didn't think the sender would have to pay return postage, but he wasn't sure! If the postmaster isn't sure, no wonder you get different answers from every person you ask.
Then I totally confused him by asking what happens if the severly mangled package, stuck in a plastic bag, doesn't make it back to the sender. How would that affect the claim process. He didn't know.
I asked if it would have been better for me to have accepted the package, notified the sender to start a claim and then waited to be notified to bring the item to the local PO for "examination". He said the sender needed to take the package to his PO when he got it back....Duh! Definetly a "failure to communicate" going on here.
He also said that since I had already refused it and the carrier had entered it into the scanner it was too late to change my mine. I guess nobody knows how to cancel information once entered. Wonder what happens if they make a typo/mistake when entering data? Does incorrect become correct simply because it has been entered that way and once in there it can't be changed????
I'm just upset and venting, because I have been looking for an item like this for more than a year. It matches one I have exactly and I really wasn't sure I would ever find another one. I was so excited when I did found it that I could hardly wait for the auction to be over. I have been watching the mail box like a little kid. It breaks my heart that it's gone!
Ironically this seller charged a $1.50 for packing material over priority/insurance cost to "ensure your package arrives safely".
Guess he wasn't considering the USPS might drop the ball.
posted on May 22, 2001 01:42:46 PM
I sympathize with your situation.
With all of the unknowns with the Post office, you can easily see why disputes arise among buyers and sellers when things like this happen.
You are clearly an honest person and have the interest of both parties in mind in your resolution. With this type of attitude, I'm betting that the problem will be able to be easily resolved.
Keep an eye out on ebay, as there's a good chance your unique item will show up again. You may also want to ask your seller if they have another one available for you to purchase.
posted on May 22, 2001 02:00:32 PM
Again either buyer or seller can initiate the claim. I initiated it as the buyer one time and as a seller, I initiated it as well. There is a place on the form you can where you can specify who gets the refund. I'd rather my buyer get it.
Sulyn, since you haven't heard from your seller it's not a good sign. Why not request their information and call to explain what happened. This way it won't look like you arbitrarily refused the shipment.
Good luck and let us know how this turns out please.
posted on May 22, 2001 02:38:40 PM
Sulyn, As long as your seller is honest, I think your situation will work out just fine. Have you ever joined one of those mail-order clubs like BMG, or other music or book clubs? If so, maybe you would have experienced the occasional shipment of merchandise that you didn't want but didn't get your response card sent back in time to prevent? All you have to do is mark it "Refused" and the postal service ships it back to the sender at no extra cost AS LONG AS IT WASN'T OPENED. So your mangled package should arrive on your seller's doorstep within a few days and then they can process the claim and send your refund.
You will probably hear back from the seller tomorrow, but if not, perhaps they are waiting receipt of the package before they respond. (It's possible that they may be skeptical about what you told them -- when the package arrives they'll know what you told them was true.)
I recently had a similar experience -- only the package wasn't mangled -- the glass inside was broken. I could hear it rattle when I moved the package. So rather than open it and begin the claim process, I just refused it and it was shipped straight back to the seller, who then refunded my money. (That saved one of us the shipping charge one way. And I didn't have the hassle of filing the claim -- which I felt was the seller's responsibility under the circumstances.)
Violetta
(Not known by this nickname anywhere but here.)
posted on May 22, 2001 03:36:53 PM
Well, I heard from my seller and he, of course, is as upset as I am. This will be his first claim too.
The only problem I forsee is IF my PO doesn't necessarily speak "Postalnese" the same way my seller's does. I can see how that is a distinctive possibility since they don't seem to even speak it the same within their own units.
I really want a trace started immediately to see if they can find my item before it turns up on a USPS auction! I want the item not the money! Of course, that may not be possible.
I think it really would have been better for me to have signed for the item, notified the seller and had him start a trace/claim on his end tomorrow! It just felt odd signing for a package that was so obviously empty! As it is, we have to wait until the mangled, empty, baggie wrapped, scotch tape sealed item gets back to him.
He said he would contact his local PO and see if a trace could be done without the damaged package being in hand or having to wait 10 days since we know that this item will not make it to me without some help. He did not have an address inside the box he put the item in before placing it in the padded mailer.
Thanks for your words of wisdom and good wishes.
As I said in my original post, if the Postal Carrier had been willing to wait for me to post here before making a decision, I could probably have saved myself and the seller some time!
posted on May 22, 2001 08:26:35 PM
When the carrier scanned the item they have to enter that the condition of the package was 'visible damage'. This way you could have accepted it and 'damaged' condition is noted. Even after you had refused it you could have had it redelivered. That is if you were able to get hold of the carrier before the package was sent along its way back to the sender.
The package now will be scanned by senders carrier as delivered (when they accept it). Since it has to be scanned it must have been insured for over $50, therefore a signature is required.
If you got the insured # you can keep track of its progress back to sender via the postal website.
posted on May 22, 2001 09:43:10 PM
They were not able to "scan" the blue insurance receipt because it was mangled. They did key it in, but were not really sure they had the number right. I wasn't able to make out 2 of the numbers, but the carrier entered something! I did not sign the insurance card. I was not asked to. It's on it's way back now, and the seller knows why I refused it. I guess we just have to wait and see.
Thanks everyone for your imput. I have read on these threads, USPS claims are slow to be paid (on lost items anyway). I'm about to find out.
posted on May 23, 2001 07:20:08 AM
The supervisor was, as usual, ignorant of post office insurance procedure. You should have accepted the package to see if the contents were damaged.
Computerboy is wrong re who has to file. The recipient can file, although the PO will send a form to the shipper to be signed.
It's unfortunate that the PO doesn't have a booklet on insurance claim procedure, not only for the public but for their ignorant employees, but I guess they don't want to admit packages do get lost or damaged. Hell if that's their position why do they sell insurance?
[ edited by sulyn1950 on May 22, 2001 12:17 PM ]
