posted on August 17, 2001 08:10:22 PM new
I got an e-mail from paypal explaining its great seller protection policy against chargebacks. It outlined an 7-8 step process
on how to protect myself. Here are ny questions:
1) Is paypal's seller chargeback protection
really as great as they say assuming you follow the steps?
2) Is billpoint's seller protection policy
as good, better, or worse than paypal's?
BTW, what is their policy?
3) Has anyone ditched billpoint in favor of
paypal?
One more question and then I will shut up.
4) Is it possible for a seller to do a chargeback will bidpay (which uses a Western Union MO)?
FYI, here is the link to paypal's seller protection policy:
posted on August 17, 2001 09:06:00 PM new
I take both Pay Pal and Billpoint, although I won't let Billpoint put it's garish logo at both the top and bottom of my listings.
I think both systems have their faults. I dislike Billpoint because I think it is difficult to work with. You have to know what shipping options the buyer wants before you can create the invoice so it drags things out. I keep it because Billpoint got to the international buyers first and most of my international buyers use it.
I hate the fact that they won't gather up a week's worth of payments into one deposit and charge me a fee to put my money in my bank account.
Gerald
"Oh but it's so hard to live by the rules/I never could and still never do."
posted on August 18, 2001 07:39:34 PM new
We have processed over 10,000 BillPoint invoices over the last year and have had exactly 2 chargebacks against our account. One was resolved, the other was a fraudelent card that we lost out on.
It cost us around $100.00 because of the chargeback but we have received over $250,000 from BillPoint sales so it has been more than worth it.
We do not accept PayPal and do not intend on accepting PayPal any time in the future.
posted on August 18, 2001 07:48:43 PM new
BillPoint works fine. I added it as a PayPal alternative, even dropped them for awhile on my auction listings. I might get my money from PayPal sooner, but I have no misdirected funds with BillPoint and no idiotic promotional emails telling me to drop their competitors.
posted on August 18, 2001 08:24:27 PM new
I haven't had any problems with billpoint over the approx 2 years I've used them. I also find their chargeback protection roughly equivalent with PayPal's, but without the irritating, and frankly distorted, emails PayPal keeps sending.
I'm currently in the midst of fighting for the merchant rate on PayPal. The ONLY way I even qualify for it is that Billpoint gives me that rate. I have to tell you, the service via email from PayPal has been atrocious. One communicates with the central service@paypal email only, so I've gotten many, many different responses from many, many different people, when I queried why anyone would need my driver's license. Damon has been trying to help, but what a complete nightmare. My experience leads me to credit many of the PayPal customer service horror stories I've seen posted. For example, a woman from PayPal actually telephoned me. I returned her call (long distance, heaven forbid they use tollfree numbers) and never heard back. Golly, I wonder what she wanted...
Do NOT ditch billpoint, it will put you at the mercy of PayPal. And while you'll likely have no problems, IF they freeze your account, you're going to be in deep kimchee.
posted on August 18, 2001 08:55:30 PM new
Try going on the eBay Billpoint board and ask a rep if addresses they pass to the seller match the card address (domestic only). Then listen to the crickets as they don't reply. I recently lost a chargeback due to fraudulent card use that I wouldn't have under Paypal (a couple of other seller's got burned too). Billpoint doesn't list any contact info on their site and takes about a week to reply if you have any questions about a chargeback (some other sellers from the board also confirmed this). Btw, I have a Billpoint merchant account.
PayPal gives you numerous options for automatically refusing payments which when used intelligently can help to protect you as well.
I haven't closed my Billpoint account yet, partly because of the merchant rate but mostly because I can't get any information from them on how to do it. Paypal provides a link for this on their site (hint for the disgruntled).
posted on August 19, 2001 02:36:58 AM new
Many of my winning bidders are confused into thinking they must use Billpoint. I send them an invoice at EOA; they then switch and pay me with Paypal (strange). In my opinion, Ebay and Billpoint are too closely entwined. I also agree that I've never reached a live human being at Billpoint (only generic emails), but have immediate access to a PayPal rep.
posted on August 19, 2001 07:47:22 AM new
I like billPoint I don't have to go to billpoint for a withdrawl of my money its transfered automatically..
Bill point does Conferm addresses on International credit cards.paypal just takes there payment and tells you to its unconfermed ..
as far as charge back protection don't let any of them fool you there is no protection from it at all The Protection is all to the Credit card holder they can hcarge back at will and no merchant can stop them..
I use both paypal and billpoint I have no trouble with either one billpoint is far easyer they arent trying to play banker or hold your monet hostage...
posted on August 19, 2001 11:33:34 AM new
BillPoint offers no chargeback protection.
If you don't want chargebacks when using PayPal simply set up your account to accept payments via existing PayPal funds, refuse all credit card payments via PayPal, and follow PayPal's rules regarding proof of delivery and shipping to a confirmed address. You'll still be slammed with the 3+% PayPal fee per transaction, but at least you won't have to worry about chargebacks.
The reason I refuse to accept PayPal or BillPoint are the fees. Regarding PayPal fees, the 30 cents you pay on every transaction adds a few percentage points to their 2.9% fee. For example, on a $12 transaction (a transaction includes purchase price plus shipping fees), the 30 cents equates to an additional 2.5% fee on top of the 2.9% PayPal charges, so you're actually paying 5.4% to PayPal on a $12 transaction. Add that 5.4% to the 7.5% you pay eBay (30 cents plus 5% FVF) for the same transaction and you're out a whopping 12.9% on a $12 transaction! It's a tough way to make money when you're handing out nearly 13% on small transactions. If you're using auction management services, paying for picture hosting, etc., the figures get even worse!
Billpoint can't confirm International addresses since the AVS system doesn't work for International addresses and they certainly aren't membership based like PayPal which credits the International users cards which they then have to confirm.
Billpoint doesn't even confirm domestic addresses. The fraudster that got me used a card that had a billing address in Georgia but Billpoint told me to ship it to an address in Florida.
Forget who has chargeback protection or not, I prefer the one that at least let's me know if the address matches, PAYPAL. Like I said go to the eBay Billpoint board and check out the complaints for yourself. Billpoint is also plagued with technical problems (they are eBay after all) such as being down alot and payments being made but not credited to the sellers account, imagine what fun it is having to explain that to a buyer.
posted on August 19, 2001 11:53:39 AM new
They verifiy billing address and I do from time to time get a miss match the buyer gives one address billpoint sends another I alway write the buyer letting them know that the item will be sent to the billing address from billpoint.
if they write back and tell me not to send to the bill point address I insist on them sending me a money order and I refund the payment through billpoint.
posted on August 19, 2001 02:23:08 PM new
Both BP and PP have their problems. While I rate PP as "accept but use caution," I rate BP as unaccepable. BP does NOT verify addresses. I was able to open a BP account with the following steps:
-I created an ebay ID with a name and address in Chicago which I invented
-I opened a BP account and gave the same fictitious name and address. I used a cancelled credit card with a NY name and address. BP didn't even burp.
If I had used an active credit card and made a payment, I am sure that BP will send the seller the fake Chicago name and address. Then when the real cardholder charges it back, the seller will eat the fees. I have received a number of emails from sellers who were scammed in this way. In some cases, the same buyer used the same card multiple times over months. PP will at least restrict the account if the cardholder claims the card was stolen. BP doesnt seem to care as long as they get their fees and stick the seller with the costs. In some of these cases, it seemed pretty obvious that the cardholder was in cahoots with the buyer and discovered a great way to get free merchandise. TAG (the Auction Guild) has already sent out a letter to its members urging them to stop accepting BP. Already reports have come in that "underground" boards (where hackers and scammers hang out) are already spreading the word that BP lets you get free stuff.
I know that some reporters are working on a story about this and that a lawyer who was a victim is putting together a group lawsuit. I suspect that these complaints will multiply until some action is taken. Whether BP takes it on its own or whether it won't happen until BP loses a lawsuit or sellers en masse stop accepting it, remains to be seen.
If you're using auction management services, paying for picture hosting, etc., the figures get even worse!