posted on August 22, 2001 07:33:53 PM
Hi, everyone. I need some good and serious
advise. I tried a chat on ebay and all they
were doing is "having fun". I am a seller
primarily on ebay. I sold a violin on ebay
for $550. It is a nice instrument and I had
been playing it for a long time prior to
selling it. The lady received the violin
with the violin neck loose. She accused me
of not describing it in my description and
wanted to return it. It took me days to convince her that the damage occurred in
shipping and to file a claim. I started the
claim because I had the insurance receipt. She took the violin and box in but they
would not honor the claim because she had
removed the old tags off the box. She just
sent me a message saying that she sent the
violin back today. There is $500 damage to
this instrument. She thinks that she is
getting her purchase price back. What is
fair here? Sorry this is so long!
posted on August 22, 2001 07:42:29 PM
She is responsible. If you had the item insured, and she was stupid enough to rip off the shipping tags she is out some $$$. If she sent the violin back DONT accept it. The post office will return it to her. You have the insurance slip so dont worry. She should have taken the package to another post office. Maybe your postmaster can call her post office and verify the claim.
posted on August 22, 2001 07:59:23 PM
Thank you so much, you all, for the replies.
As I mentioned, I tried to get some input on
ebay in the "cafe" and there was just off
color conversation going on a mile a minute.
Someone did say that I could re-sell it.
To really get fixed right, as she describes
it, it would cost $500. I checked. I can do
minor repairs but not that. I told her over
and over to take it in just as she received
it. I told her over and over about the box
and the stuffing, etc. But the nerve to just
go ahead and mail it without my approval. I
do not have the receipt. When I started the
claim, they took it and sent it to her with
the forms that I had filled out to be taken
in with the violin. She said that that was
all coming back with the violin. She
expects to get a refund and I am sitting here
with an instrument that has lost its entire
value!
posted on August 22, 2001 09:48:32 PM
Possibly you were posting on the wrong board? You mentioned the cafe, where you should be going for help is the Q&A board.
Found in the site map, under "Help" heading (bottom left of screen). The "User to User eBay Q&A Board".
And personally, I think you should just refuse the package.
posted on August 22, 2001 09:58:03 PM
You are almost certainly going to get a negative feedback on this sale, so do the right thing for yourself in this situation.
Email the buyer that you will refuse the package when it shows up. Remind her that the damage occurred in shipping and that she paid for insurance for just such a situation. If she really did include the paperwork in the package, she should at least try to start the process at a different post office and see if she can get her money back.
BUT...do not refund! As far as I can tell, you did everything right here, and she screwed up by destroying part of the original packing and box so that she's going to have trouble collecting on the insurance she paid for.
I really hope she can work something out with the P.O., but if not, that's not your problem. Good luck.
What are the odds that she might have switched your good condition instrument for her bad condition one? It happens. Maybe that is why she doesn't want to go through the proper post office procedures. Hmmmmm...
posted on August 23, 2001 04:39:43 AM
I had this happen on two items (not nearly $500 though, but over $50). In both instances, either a spouse, or a parent (her leg was broken, she wasn't a kid) threw away the boxes before the buyer could tell me that anything was broken.
One got pissed, but ultimately must have understood that I was pretty much unable to do anything for her without the box. She was pretty hostile in her emails, but ultimately didn't neg me.
The other one was a sweety, we spoke by phone and I'm pretty sure her husband slept on the couch for a week. (Her words: My husband is the center of this screw-up for sure.)
posted on August 23, 2001 05:08:26 AM
Thanks, again, everyone for your comments. I
just do not know if I have the "nerve" to
refuse the box. Part of this woman's attitude is that she has not believed at all
that the instrument was damaged in shipment---she thinks that I sent her a broken violin!
Also, this was a "Buy It Now" purchase as
she was headed out of town, and I think that
she felt that it was not worth her $550. I
have 224 positive feedbacks and no negatives
and atleast half of those are violin sales
of mine. I took one back with a refund upon
request without a problem. Her belief that
I just plain sent her a broken instrument has
set the pace for her "lack of cooperation",
I think. What kind of trouble can I expect
if I refuse the box or/and do not give a
refund---that is alot of money?
How or what she thinks is not your problem. As long as you know that you sent it out as described.
Since she blew it with the insurance, I wouldn't think that there is much more she can do. Except make threats!
You will probably get a neg but you can calmly reply the facts in a response to her neg.
I know if I paid that amount of money for something I certainly wouldn't be destroying anything until the matter was seattled.
Do you still have the tracking number for the insurance you purchased? Did you make a copy of the receipt before you sent it to her?
With her being a problem from the get-go I'd certainly would have made copies.
Refuse the package. Unless she paid by CC, I think she will just be out the money.
SAVE all email exchanges in case she files fraud and/or insurance with eBay then you will be able to present your side by showing them the emails she sent you.
In the meantime, send her one last email telling her your refusing the package because she dropped the ball on the insurance claim. Then block her emails to you.
Thats what I'd do.
Some people you just can't ever please and I certainly wouldn't take it in the shorts for that amount of money.
posted on August 23, 2001 07:56:55 AM
IMO the buyer is attempting to "force" the issue by returning the item under the described circumstances. Seller should refuse the package and calmly tell her to do the insurance thing. The failure of the buyer to perform the required insurance tasks is not the seller's responsibility. Certainly unfortunate but not the seller's fault. Keep emails in a file. Expect a neg. I wouldn't respond to the neg as it quite possibly would be an endless exchange.
posted on August 23, 2001 10:14:45 AM
Stringed instruments are built with no screws or nails...it's all glue and tension that holds them together. If a string or two broke in transit, the neck would not receive enough tension and it could come loose. Or a strong jarring might do it, even if the instrument itself isn't damaged. Poor packing could also contribute to the problem, but isn't necessarily the only cause. A severe change in humidity can affect the wood and glue to the point where the soundpost could become detached or the neck could come loose.
Glue ages, strings break, etc. Older instruments need to be checked over routinely for this sort of thing.
posted on August 23, 2001 10:47:03 AM
I want to just comment about the packing of
the violin. The buyer requested that the
bridge be taken down and all tension be taken
off of the instrument. She did not mention
if the soundpost had fallen down or not.
After I released the tension, I put a wedge
under the fingerboard, something under the
tailpiece so that it would not scratch the
instrument, wrapped in bubble wrap and put in
a hard case. The case was put in a box and
surrounded with peanuts. The only explanation I have or can assume is that the
instrument was really jarred. The buyer said
that the box had no indication of damage,
however, I once saw my mailman purposefully
drop a box to the ground from waist height
and there was not a mark on the box. I have
also received shattered glassware and not a
mark on the box.
Again I urge you to seriously consider the possibility that this buyer may have had a fair condition instrument and had the intentions the whole time of "trading" it for your excellent condition one. It may not happen often, but it does happen. Keep an eye open. Some call me pessimistic, but I call it realistic.
posted on August 23, 2001 06:06:50 PM
I agree with squinkle99. I've had 2 or 3
people try that with me over the last
several years. Rare, but it does happen!
Refuse the package. Insist that she pursue
the insurance from her end, with your
cooperation as necessary. She'll probably
negative you. Return the favor and chalk
it up to experience.
Z
---
"Cannot say. Saying, I would know. Do not
know, so cannot say". -- Zathras (Babylon 5)
posted on August 23, 2001 06:26:04 PM
Well it could also be posable the person actually insured the return package !!!!..
now when you get it you have a package with it tags and papers...
what it comes down too is there is a chance this person trashed the box it was received in so there is no proof it was shipped or insured.
it also could be there is no damage to the Item or not as bad as the buyer thinks , or the buyer just had a change of heart or remorse and wants a refund.
posted on August 23, 2001 07:21:59 PM
Again, I thank you all for your serious input!!! I even shared with this buyer how
very fond I was with this instrument! When you play an instrument, I sent it off, to her
specifications, and told her how I needed to
play it again one more time!! But, I cannot
keep everything that I have purchased to
eventually re-sell. She would really be making a mistake if she tried to pass off some other instrument.!!! This is very old,
an antique, I know every scratch and repair,which was described in the description. My gut feeling is that, she was an impulsive buyer and the damage in transit just left the door open for her to
think that she could return it. A number of
people have suggested that she would pass off
an inferior return, but I do not see it that
way. I did not give any return policy, she
has a 4 in her feedback, buying from people
that I know and have dealt with myself in these last two years of doing ebay. She is
determined that I sent this violin broken!!
There certainly are people on ebay that sell
instruments broken----but they say it! This instrument was intact and playing!!!!! I
actually wrote her back and said that the
damage that she described may have been there
and I did not realize it but not glued correctly.! But the post office messed up. I thank you all so very
much, but I do not know if I cannot accept
the box!!!!! She deserves just that treatment, but I do not know if I can stomach that!!!! I even offered to pay for
the repair if we could not get her money back with the insurance claim!!!! I know
that I need someone to convince me of what is really FAIR here!!!! Yes, I am very
upset!!!!!
posted on August 23, 2001 08:09:03 PM
Just my 2 cents for what it's worth.....You said she bought it using "buy it now"....sometimes people can use that option impulsively.....what's to say that after she used that option, paid the money out and recieved it, she decided it was too much for her to be spending and she shouldn't have spent that much, then went ahead and did the damage herself (otherwise why wasn't the box showing any damage) and insisted that you shipped it to with damage to make you feel the pressure to pay her back for a purchase she was feeling regret over... Just my thoughts and easily done probably. I say what others have said.....since damage cannot be proven either way as to what caused it, this is why she paid for insurance. I would refuse the package and tell her that due to her neglect with presenting the post office with everything they required to process her claim (complete packaging intact), that it is up to her to find a post office willing to pay her claim since she is the one that defaced the package. Don't let her bully you into anything.......sounds like it was well packaged from your end. Even if she neg's you, people can trace the comment and know whether you are a good seller.....ebayers are smart and recognize when someone has been impossible. The first negative hurts the worst, but when you know you have done right by your buyers, your other positive feedback will override any negative comment she could post. I say refuse..
Another Ebay seller's opinion
Not "NanasTurtle" on ebay
posted on August 23, 2001 08:53:19 PM
I always thought that I was a "strong" person, the oldest of five girls", but this
has thrown me for a loop! What everyone
says is right, but even being "strong", I do
not know if I can just refuse the package.!!!
I am a teacher at heart---not a salesman or
womanlib!!! But this is business!!!!! I described the item truthfully and, exactly
what I could see. I was willing to fix it if
the post office would refuse the claim. I did not literally tell her that because my
senses told me that she wanted the least
bother or being put out. Yes, you folks are
absolutely correct---when the box arrives, I
need to have it sent right back to her! Thank you all for your sincere input, expect, some A H that decided to say something about paying the fiddler! A neg
feedback does not bother me the least since I have over 200 just positive feedbacks. I really never misrepresented this item one
ounce, and I need to remember THAT. kRIS
(fiddler54)
posted on August 23, 2001 08:57:00 PM
fiddler54.......Good for you, stick to your guns.....If you feel yourself weakening, then come back and read all the posting on this and it will give you strength! ~smile~
