posted on August 25, 2001 12:16:34 PM
Or let it be?
Typical story. Auction ended 46 days ago but the bidder strung me along. After 28 days went by I told him we needed to get this wrapped up and he said that same day he was sending payment, but that was 18 days ago. Still no payment. So I negged the guy this morning after his payment didn't show in today's mail.
He sent me an irate email today, saying among other things, that he sent the payment express mail (from Canada) 4 days ago, not 18 days ago (surprise surprise), and he sent 3 times the final price as compensation for taking so long (huh?). I would think this is more bullsh*t but he provided a tracking number and a 1-800 phone number to check up on it. No, I haven't checked up on it. But I finally filed an NPB request 3 days ago and he never responded to that. He is also amazed that I would give him a neg over a $5.95 auction. "You weren't out that much" he says. Which is true, but...
1. Should I respond to his email and take a chance on making him even more irate? He hasn't negged me yet and I'd like to avoid this if possible.
2. Should I send his entire payment back (if and when it shows) and cancel the deal, or just send back the amount he overpaid and send him the merchandise?
posted on August 25, 2001 12:41:50 PM
I checked. The tracking number is a good one, but it doesn't give any details as to where it is going, when it's expected to be delivered or anything like that. The site says it was mailed 3 days ago, not 4.
If he would have communicated that payment was sent he would have avoided the neg. But I'm the one in the wrong, according to him. Oh well.
posted on August 25, 2001 01:25:06 PM
I think that is part of the problem: buyers have gotten into their heads that it's only $5.00, or it's only $6.00. They do not think about the listing fees and final value fees that sellers are out when they don't pay, not to mention all the time we spend chasing them around the country trying to collect from them! They get so used to putting things back at Wal-Mart and the grocery store they don't think anything of doing it on Ebay auctions. I wonder what he really expected after all this time? Was he a newbie? I'd wait a few days and see if the payment arrives, send him the item and refund his overpayment. You can always go back under the neg and leave a note that he finally paid: put auction ended xx/xx and payment was finally received xx/xx despite many emails.
posted on August 25, 2001 01:35:38 PM
loosecannon,
The neg you left was well deserved. I wouldn’t feel guilty about it even if it does show up in the next few days.
I Have had this happen several times where people do not respond to ebays notice, my invoice, non-paying bidder form but when a FVF report is filed then I hear from them with every excuse under the sun. You know “My grandmother died” “The dog ate your address” etc., etc., etc.
Sometime I’ve even received payment months after an auction and I don’t even have the item anymore. I either re-listed it or it was sold at a yard sale or swapmeer.
You waited long enough. I don’t know what people are thinking when they do this but I can assure you if their paycheck was shorted by $5.00 or $6.00 they certainly would let their boss know it wouldn’t they?
posted on August 25, 2001 01:41:38 PM
Not much [OK, no] sympathy for him. If you left a Neg that said "auction closed X/01, no payment by XX/01" then it's factual, true, and dispassionate.
What would bother me is having left a neg and then relisted or disposed of the book, then having the payment show up. I guess the only way to forestall that is to send email saying "I am cancelling this transaction" but I admit that I rarely do that [usually because the buyer never answers email].
posted on August 25, 2001 02:39:13 PM
My experience shows that the people who do end up paying are the one's who didn't get irate, instead they apoligze profusely because they know they are in the wrong. This guy sounds like a crock, I wouldn't believe him. I'd bet the money never arrives.
posted on August 25, 2001 03:36:00 PM
What is total BS? What he says about sending payment? Could be but he has that tracking number which is good on that Canadian Postal website. 'Course it could be a payment going to someone else.
[ edited by loosecannon on Aug 25, 2001 03:45 PM ]
posted on August 25, 2001 04:55:21 PM
Yeah, I know. That part sounds incredible to me too. I guess I'll know for sure in a few days, but I'm starting to think he just had to bamboozle me one last time.
posted on August 26, 2001 04:27:43 PM
My answer and question is #1 You negged Before you followed the ebay outline of NPBA and then FVF, WHY. Set a plan of time limits and then follow through with that and the ebay outline, you might have a recorse with ebay about a retalitory neg in return (mabe).
I read so many things on this board that do not seem to have a set of rules for the seller (set by themselves) for adverse sales that I am astounded. Make a business plan and attempt to follow through with it, it gives you a plan of action and allows you plenty of leeway for personal choices for the individual moment. I personally would never neg without going through the required protocal (that protocal protects me) and when I do neg I spell it out; auction end date, notified seller date; NPBA date; FVF date; and sometimes even the lenghth of time from beginning to end, when neg is left. I am not bashful about leaving a deadbeat buyer negative feedback,(full steam ahead and damn the torpedoes) that protects me, prospective sellers to that buyer, as well as prospective buyers from that seller; but I have found that when you follow certin guidelines the hammer blow back is not nearly as difficult. (better to eat you with my dear)
I would not answer the buyer, and when/if the payment shows, document your shipping with proof and send back the over payment, why should you lose because of the buyers neglect.
posted on August 26, 2001 04:59:59 PM
LC, I'm with Orsen on this to some extent; I never post a neg until after I've filed for my FVF (not NPB). And frequently, it isn't necessary; I'm always hoping my FVF is the one that ends the spree. I get no pleasure out of posting a neg - only do it out of 'duty'. So if the so-and-so is kicked off, I'm just as happy, if not more so.
But if you do repsond at all (which is your question, and I'm inclined to think I would) then keep it business-like and unaccusing, which you are very good at, I know. (Maybe even slightly regretful.)
Whatever the time frame of this particular transaction is, explain that it is your 'standard'.....for instance "We routinely file NPB at 35 days, and if there is no response within three days, we post negative feedback. It has been our experience....blah, blah, blah." Totally impersonal and inoffensive. Maybe even preface it with "Gee, wish you had emailed us that payment was on the way so we could have made an exception, as we rountinely...."
Two good reasons:
#1 - You are on eBay to sell, and you may be able to pull this one out yet, and
#2 - You may be able to avoid a retaliatory and undeserved neg yourself by being such a nice guy.
posted on August 26, 2001 05:17:13 PM
I figured someone might bring this up.
Have you forgotten the fact that I waited 46 days before I negged this clown? The only reason it took me that long is because the guy lied and strung me along, otherwise he would have had his neg 2 or 3 weeks ago.
Here is what eBay's standard NPB email says (the one they send out when you file an NPB request):
If you have already sent payment or intend to pay soon, please contact xxxxx at xxxxxx immediately. Simple misunderstandings are often resolved through direct communication.
Notice the use of the word "immediately". That means now, not 3 or 6 or 10 days from now.
Yes, it also says:
You and your seller are encouraged to work things out in the next 10 days. If this situation is resolved during this time, the matter is dropped and you do not need to take any further action.
I gave him 3 days to contact me after the NPB request, not 10, this is true. But I had the patience of a Saint with this guy and he stretched it to the limit.
He got what he freaking deserved.
If I would not have negged this guy do you think I would have ever heard from him again? Doubtful.
posted on August 26, 2001 06:05:34 PM
When I neg and trust me its not very often.
I always state the dates with an apology.
Something like:
6 weeks no contact, no payment...sorry!
And...the last one that reniged, by the time I got around to neg him/her they were NARU'D.
I'm soooooo glad I don't usually have that problem. In 3-1/2 years of selling I'll bet I've only given LESS then a 1/2 dozen negs. And most don't retaliate.
Well, as its been said here a 100 + 1 times before IT DEPENDS ON WHAT YOU SELL
posted on August 26, 2001 07:30:38 PM
I leave negs mostly after I collect a FVF. One exception was a newbie who got a neg when he said he wasn't able/going to follow through. No need to waste time playing a game with that one.
posted on August 26, 2001 07:55:10 PMI figured someone might bring this up.
Oh, LC, please don't take my post as a criticism. I did read the dates etc., and realize he messed you over pretty badly.
I was merely saying that I probably would respond to this irate person, in an attempt to defuse him for my own benefit.
If I didn't think it would help me in any way, I would just politely ignore him and his emails. But I would never engage in a war of emails and/or retaliation with him, and I don't think you would either.
If 3x the payment did show up in my mailbox, I would keep every penny of it (for my aggravation) and ship if I still had the item. If I had sold the item, I would probably destroy his payment wordlessly, as if it had never come, and let him wonder awhile.
Dirty pool huh? Hope I'm not put to it. (Note I said "probably".)
My post was directed more toward orsen than you. I understand he was trying to give me some direction in how I might want to handle this kind of thing in the future.
Let me say that, upon reflection, I should have waited until after filing the FVF to leave a neg. A few days longer would not have made much difference. Unless of course he got off his dead a** and actually sent a payment in that time. Orsen's and your points did not go in one ear and out the other. I did take exception however, to the inference that I did something wrong here.
In this case I had just had my fill of this particular person and situation, and reacted--finally.
And no, I will not keep his money.
I may however, do a follow-up on the neg I left him. He responded to it the very day, perhaps the very hour that I left it, saying that he sent 3 X the money owed and all that. If the payment never shows, I might go back and say so, just like I might if the payment did show.
If I post a negative follow-up however, he will surely retaliate with a neg of his own, then.
posted on September 1, 2001 05:02:42 PM
LC, sorry if I made you feel that you did something wrong, was not my intent. I have been selling on ebay of and on for about 4 years now and my response was from hard learned experience.(not a big seller but I try and be constant) When I set my business plan I actually 'sat down and wrote it out' while considering the past pros and cons, and I am constantly adjusting said plan to fit what is happening now. I do not like leaving a neg, but since that is the only information/feedback I can find, I feel it is necessary. I have a 10 day receive payment in my TOS clearly explained, I usually wait a couple of days past, then send a 2nd notice for payment with a 48 hour request for response, then I send a 3rd request with 24 hour request for response, then within my own timeframe I request a NPBA. Approx 2 days before NPBA is over and I have not heard from buyer I send Another email stating I intend to file a FVF and leave a neg. The time frame for this long procedure is usually 10 day for payment, 2 day for response, 1 day for response, 10 day for NPBA = 23 days. I am usually a few days behind on exact, but that is more than enough time for the buyer to contact/pay, usually if they have not in that time they wont, and that is 5 seperate requests to the buyer for payment. I do listen to my custonmers about what their problem is and try and accomadate them, because most come through with what they say, but they have to contact me and be on the square with their payment timefram. I attempt to never make my contacts with a buyer a personal, name calling thing, only the facts of the sale. When you get to the point of you said, he said, she said, thats over the business line and nobody ever wins there, and I absoultly do not need that hassel in my life.
The only thing you did "wrong" was lose your cool and put step c before step b, which only hurts yourself. Glad you neged the deadbeat, so when 'it' comes to my door I will at least have some warning.
posted on September 1, 2001 05:37:38 PM
And of course he is upset! I am sure he is used to lying to his friends and relatives and coworkers and few of them call him and rub his nose in it like you.
I feel pretty bad for him being embarrassed like that when EVERYBODY lies like crazy - right?
posted on September 1, 2001 07:27:50 PM
Forget about it! Neg bidders are a ruesome bunch. Cut your losses and move on. Sorry.
"Anything the mind of man can believe and conceive, it CAN ACHIEVE!"
posted on September 1, 2001 07:36:05 PM
Notice how ticked off people are when the truth doesn't meet with their delusion. I'd ignore the guy. Relist and go on with your life. If the money ever shows up, you can return it less the postage for doing so.
Yes, I received payment and he did send way over what he owed as "compensation".
But I refunded him the amount of overpayment ($17.00) and sent him the merchandise. Also, I made a note in his feedback that he finally did pay.
It did take him over 50 days to get payment to me, and if I wouldn't have filed an NPB he probably would never have acted and sent payment. But I was wrong. I should have waited longer to neg and this thing would have had a happier ending.
He really is not a bad bloke, he just had other priorities, I guess.
