posted on September 28, 2002 10:02:19 PM new
How many times do you email a non-paying bidder asking for payment? In the past 30 days I've had 5 different winning bidders that still had not paid after the auction had been over for 2 weeks. I kept emailing them and kept getting excuses and promises from all of them. 3 of them finally paid and 2 didnt (for a loss of $140 in sales). I am torn between feeling like I shouldnt have to 'baby' these people by emailing them 10 times trying to get my money and just treating them like adults, sending and EOA, then if they dont pay in 2 weeks, NPB and finally a FVF if they still dont pay. How do you feel about winning bidders like these?
posted on September 28, 2002 11:09:28 PM new
Hi bubblewrap,
My opinion! I don't put up with it. If they haven't sent me a payment by the 7th day after closing of the auction, then I file a "nonpaying bidder" notice with eBay. I also give them fair warning that I am going to do this, too. The only way you can recoup your listing fees for an auction that didn't get any money is to file against them. If they don't pay after I submit them to ebay, then I wait the additional 10 days and file the final notice with eBay. At that juncture, I give them a negative feedback. My mistake is that I don't always check the feedback of my bidders before the auction has closed. There are some sellers who will cancel an auction if a buyer has a negative feedback. I don't do that, but I make it real clear to them what happens if they don't pay. A lot of times they will pay after they get that first letter from eBay.
I had one gal, though, that had bought three items from me and then decided not to pay. She didn't even email me. She had several negative feedbacks, but apparently no one had ever filed a "nonpaying bidder" notice on her. I emailed, emailed, and emailed. I wanted to make sure she was aware of what I was going to do. I guess she didn't believe me. The first 7 days came around and no payment, so I filed with eBay. I waited 14 days and sent the final letter with eBay. Remember she had bought three items from me - that's 3 letters from eBay. Each item is a separate auction and will produce 3 transactions. 3 letters from eBay and you are terminated!!! I didn't plan it that way, but that's what happened. And you know what.....she got terminated over $6.44! I wonder if it was worth it for her.
I just wish more people would file against these people as they are becoming more and more abundant. I don't mess with them myself. I hope this has helped you. Good luck in collecting that money!
PatR
posted on September 28, 2002 11:12:36 PM new
Oh yes, forgot.....before you do anything...block those guys from bidding immediately. Don't even give them the chance to do it again. That's the first thing I do when I have a problem bidder. I don't need it.
posted on September 28, 2002 11:46:45 PM new
Thanks for the input, Pat. Your way sounds good to me. I guess the part I'm torn about is that if I didnt keep after the 3 bidders that finally did pay, I dont think they would have paid either, leaving me losing more than $400 in sales instead of just $140. I have found that lately, if the winning bidder doesnt pay right away with Paypal or within 3 or 4 days by mail, they never pay, unless I keep after them for the payment, and then only some of them finally pay.
posted on September 29, 2002 07:15:30 AM new
Slow payers and non payers are a normal part of doing business, and have always been.
How much energy and time you spend chasing the money would depend, I guess, on whether you think it is worth it. Some sellers, like Pat, keep a tight reign on bidders and come down like a ton of bricks after ten days. This is too soon in my opinion, and too harsh.
I send a reminder at ten days, and do not file the NPB form until a week later. Like you, I get a certain percentage of people who finally act after a reminder. It is extra work, but so is finding a new customer, and we do not get back the original insertion fee we paid, just the final value fee.
I also agree with Pat that filing for the FVF ten days after the NPB is important, as is leaving negative feedback to warn other sellers. Most sellers are fearful of leaving a negative comment for fear of a retaliatory on their own, but the tone of the feedback helps minimize this possibility.
Feedbacks should be cooly professional, with the facts, which are less likely to get the bidder into a fighting mode. "Never paid for purchase. EOA 6/1, REM 6/11. NPB 6/20, FVF 6/30" is calm, reasoned and yet contains all the essential facts to make your neg credible in case of a retaliatory.
I find that one third of my NPB/FVF's are going to NARU buyers anyway, so I can't leave a neg in any case.
The quality of the ebay buyer has steadily declined as ebay marketing seems to have the wrong sort of people targeted in their promotions. They seem to want to capture the KMart shopper instead of the more upscale customers. The bottom feeding crowd will wreck a store in no time, and they will ruin ebay too. Wish ebay had more promotional smarts. It is quality, not quantity that counts.
posted on September 29, 2002 11:04:02 AM new
The "quality" eBay buyer - you said it right there. Yes, we have lost some of them, but not all. I do crack down on the nonpaying bidders, because most of the time they don't even bother to email me. I think a person can get a gut feeling about something that is going to happen or isn't. There have been a few that have surprised me, however. I got sick of the whole mess awhile back - who needs it. They think you are just kidding them - I can just hear them saying...what can they do about it! I had one gal who won my auction for a bangle bracelet - she didn't pay. I went into her feedback and lo and behold found out she had bought almost the identical bangle bracelet for $.50 cents cheaper!! So...I found out the answer why she didn't pay me. At that point I was even more inclined to get that negative feedback on her account. She never did pay for the thing - those are the ones that gall me.
Another thing comes to mind. The people who sell for $1.00 and one penney - I tried that a few times and I really did get hung up with "nonpayers." Big time! I quit that real fast. I am not a powerseller, but I do have some good, steady customers that pay immediately after auction closing. I like those. The bad ones - block them and get them out of your way. There are too many people on eBay buying to worry about losing one or two bad ones.
posted on September 29, 2002 11:08:42 AM new
Oh yes, another thought. I don't spend a lot of time chasing these people. It only takes a second to click on that "nonpaying bidder" site. I have it marked!!!! I have a separate box where I keep the unpaid auction. I don't have that many to worry about so I don't extend a lot of time. We need to get rid of these people or at least send them a message. eBay certainly is not sending anyone a message except to get more "big" businesses on their auction.
posted on September 29, 2002 12:57:46 PM new
After sending a non-automated (personally done) WBN, it give it two weeks. If no payment, I send a second personal e-mail. If no response in two days. I file NPB. If a response I give one more week to get payment. If none, then file NPB. Then give it the 10 days required by both ebay or yahoo. If no payment, I file the FVF, give a neg and move on. NEVER E-MAIL SOMEONE THAT THE DEAL IS OFF AND YOU ARE GIVING THEM A NEGATIVE. THIS WILL MAKE THEM WANT TO GEVE A RETALITORY NEG. JUST DO IT AND MOVE ON. I have only received one retalitory neg in over three years of online auctioning. I have given probably in the range of 50 in that time frame. Mostly on ebay. If you had a second place bidder, give them the chance to purchase the item before relisting. You could get a sale without having to pay listing fees again.
posted on September 30, 2002 02:48:31 PM new
When I do list stuff on ebay--(not 2 much lately)and my auction closes w/ a winner--In my auctions TOS it clearly states that pymt must b received within 10 days after auction closes. In my EOA notice that I send to the winner is typical of most, however the last line CLEARLY SAYS >>>>please reply back with your name and address to confirm receipt of this notification<<<<.
Should the winner fail to reply within 3 days of my sending out the EOA notice, thats the ONLY red flag I need to realize I have a deadbeat bidder. I don't fret it to much and just request my FVF's back etc, and usually leave appropriate feedback for the loser. Happy to state that in all of my ebay sales I've had something like 4 NPB's and all of them were for miniscule amounts--like $10.00 or under. In addition I also continue to count my lucky stars cuz I've never had a buyers check bounce, and I've deposited several hundreds. (KNOCK ON WOOD)
Life's too short to chase/deal with the losers of the world--I say move on and exert your energies on a more positive note.
[ edited by getkicksonrte66 on Sep 30, 2002 02:52 PM ]
posted on September 30, 2002 06:42:30 PM new
I use AW's Post Sale features to identify non-paying bidders and I sent them payment reminders on a weekly basis...if at the end of 30 days, they haven't paid -- I write a very polite letter explaining that while I would rather not file a NPB and FVF with eBay, I will unless they contact me within 5 days.
It's a decent system -- most people pay within 30 days -- however, I do have somewhere between 5-10 winning bidders who I know I'm going to have to file against. But I knew that as soon as the auctions ended. When someone bids on three of the same item and sends you a "Request Payment Information" e-mail for the lowest priced item or claims that web site XYZ is offering the item for less, so they won't be purchasing the items from you and it turns out to be a lie -- you know you're not getting your money.
But, it's part of doing business -- an unpleasant part, but still a part of doing business.
Although the stories people will make up in order to get out of paying for a $40 Discman are quite amusing.
posted on September 30, 2002 07:28:03 PM new
My TOS states contact within 3 days, and pmnt within 10 days. My end of auction notice asks buyers to email complete shipping address, although I have already figured shipping and insurance for them.
If I don't hear from them within the 3 day period, I get a little nervous. After 10 days they get a NPB alert from eBay. The NPB alert usually brings a response. If still no response, the FVF request goes in, and the item gets relisted. I don't neg them, as the FVF does them more harm, and me less harm. The only negs I've received were retaliatory from bidders that I negged first.
posted on September 30, 2002 07:49:46 PM new
What I'm finding is most effective is the non-payer alert. I've had winning bidders who never responded to repeated e-mails BUT finally e-mailed me after the NPB. I'm thinking it might be a waste of my time sending out all those personal e-mail reminders and may just file the NPB after a reasonable time. Seems like the "official eBay notice" has a little more perceived clout than my "friendly reminders".
posted on October 1, 2002 11:54:11 AM new
1. After 7 days: I send a reminder to respond to my WBN (winning bid notice). The notice provides all required info to pay for the auction.
Still no response:
2. On the 10th day, I send a notice that the item will go to the next bidder (if more than one bidder) or will notify eBay of their disregarding attitude and so forth (single bidder).
3.On 14th day, no response, contact eBay. If more than one bidder, contact next bidder to offer item, in most cases they are very happy to buy the item.
4.Contact by email again telling the party the item goes to the next bidder, thank you for your troubles.
4a. If single bidder, continue the process through eBay.
5.Block from any further transactions, which I do translate to the dud.
I have a separate box where I keep the unpaid auction. I don't have that many to worry about so I don't extend a lot of time. We need to get rid of these people or at least send them a message. eBay certainly is not sending anyone a message except to get more "big" businesses on their auction.