posted on October 11, 2005 04:44:16 PM new
Been thinking of selling using the dropshipping method. It might save packing time and going to the post office, but I'm sure there are some other trade-offs.
I've got a spare eBay account with 100+ feedback that I used to use for buying, so I could use that account exclusively for dropshipping. Any thoughts on dropshipping? Good or bad experiences? (besides of course being at the mercy of the dropshipper). Some some products lend themselves better to this?
Thanks for your thoughts.
[ edited by powerwebmedia on Oct 11, 2005 04:45 PM ]
posted on October 11, 2005 05:49:06 PM new
I'd never try it. I like to have the item in-hand. I want to know the exact quality of what I'm sending to my customer. I inspect everything. I've gotten a number of new items with flaws and some that have been broken. I don't want to have to deal with a dropshipper when it comes to customer satisfaction.
posted on October 11, 2005 06:16:48 PM new
If you are offering to sell something you don't have, you are committing fraud. There will be a deluge of dropship sellers here shortly to dress up the practice and try to pass it off as respectable, but the fact remains, if you don't own it or have it in your possession as a consignment item, and you try to sell it, you are running a scam. Not a lot different than what Billy Sol Estes did in Texas. He's still in prison.
A $75.00 solid state device will always blow first to protect a 25 cent fuse ~ Murphy's Law
posted on October 11, 2005 06:43:20 PM new
I haven't had experience dropshipping in cyberville but have had in the brick and mortar world. It can make a lot of sense and it isn't fraud - large retailers do it all the time. If you have a close relationship with the drop shipper and they have a stellar reputation and a dedicated customer service team, I wouldn't hesitate. It saves on shipping costs, inventory costs and environmental costs. I used drop shipping very successfully but only worked with one company. It was a win-win-win for us and the consumer.
"Pre-sale listings are those that describe items for sale that are not in the control or possession of the seller at the time of the listing. These listings generally consist of items that are sold in advance of a delivery date to the public.
eBay permits Pre-sale listings only on a limited basis. The seller must guarantee that the item will be available for shipping within 30 days from the date of purchase (i.e., the day the listing ends or the date the item is purchased from a store front listing). The seller must also clearly indicate within the listing the fact that the item is a pre-sale item with a delivery date that indicates the item will be shipped by the 30th day from the end date of the listing. Additionally, this text must be no less than the default font size of the eBay Sell-Your-Item form. Currently, the default font size is HTML font size 3."
I'd venture a guess that MOST electronics & PCs sold on eBay (and the whole internet, for that matter) are "drop-shipped!"
When you buy from "THE SHARPER IMAGE," (or whoever...) do you think THEY ship direct tp you?
Look at catalog sales, etc. When you purchase, they always state that multiple items may ship at different times in different packages -- betcha they be drop-shipping.
Didn't AMAZON get rid of their warehouses because the COST was too high? BETCHA AN AWFUL LOT OF ITEMS SOLD THERE ARE "DROP-SHIPPED" and on and on, etc,etc
The major problem with drop-shipping is FINDING A GOOD ONE!
There are many out there that are just plain horrible!
OTOH: there are also many out there which are fantastic companies which provide excellent support & service for both the merchant & consumer!
NEVER have I ever read anyplace, anywhere, at anytime this blanket assertion of yours that drop-shipping constitutes "fraud"
Please cite the relavant case law and precendents for this assertion.
I think ye be full of Billy Sol Estes's "product"
[ edited by tOMWiii on Oct 11, 2005 06:50 PM ]
[ edited by tOMWiii on Oct 11, 2005 06:51 PM ]
posted on October 11, 2005 07:53:35 PM new
True, I can't see it being constituted as fraud, as I know many sellers do it on eBay. I bet in most cases, they customer doesn't even know the item was dropshipped unless they look at the return address or postmark (and even then, the return address might be your own, not the dropshippers). I'd say, as long as the customer gets his or her item in a reasonable amount of time, it's ok, especially if the time it takes to receive is roughly what it would have taken had I shipped it myself.
I was just looking to save some time (packing and going to the post office) and space (currently converting the spare bedroom back into a spare bedroom, not a warehouse, aka the "eBay room". My schedule is quite hectic with a fulltime job and elderly parents to spend some time with, and I need to make some more money. Thought dropshipping might be a good idea, so I wouldn't have to stock a lot of merchandise, pack the stuff and go to the post office (or UPS, FedEx, etc). Even if it means a smaller profit per transaction, it's a lot less work for me.
Sounds like I need to very carefully choose who I will get to do my dropshipping. I will carefully consider each place and try to get references from current customers if I can, or in some way do a reference check to make sure it's a reliable company becuase it sounds like a lot of people have horror stories about this. And if I can't find a relaible dropshipper, I'll just keep things as I have until now.
posted on October 11, 2005 08:23:23 PM new
Tom...I'm aware of the fact that you have an extremely reliable supplier whom you have dealt with for years and with whom you trust the existence of your business implicitly. Therefore, it's only natural that you and I will both have different definitions of what constitutes fraud on behalf of a seller who engages in dropshipping. The Ebay policy on Presale does not address, nor does it even name dropshipping as included in the definition of "presale". What makes you think this is their authorization to allow sellers to engage in the practice? It's your interpretation, nothing more, nothing less. I would tend to belive it is directed at the thousands of sellers who sell home made, hand crafted or customized items. There are several who fall into this category who post right here in the EO. I suspect if Bizzy had a hot item that sold during the Holiday season, this would be a perfect way for her to list items that she may not have, but knew she could have ready by a certain date. I believe this is the type of seller the policy was established originally to accomodate. Those who have direct control over the availability of the items they list. Not sellers who deal with unknown and fly by night importers of cheap crap from China that even WalMart won't handle. I think you summed up the majority of opinions about dropshippers when you stated:
<< The major problem with drop-shipping is FINDING A GOOD ONE!
There are many out there that are just plain horrible!
OTOH: there are also many out there which are fantastic companies which provide excellent support & service for both the merchant & consumer!>>
As far as the "legal" part, you only have to look at the recent addition to the unpaid item dispute console. It's called the "undelivered item dispute". Looks like Ebay is getting tired of fielding the complaints and is ready to start booting a few sellers who don't deliver. The O.P. needs to remind himself that using a spare account for dropshipping offers no advantage other than for accounting. If you get a few complaints because you chose an unreliable supplier and Ebay decides to give you a suspension, they will take down all your accounts for the duration, not just the offending one.
A $75.00 solid state device will always blow first to protect a 25 cent fuse ~ Murphy's Law
posted on October 11, 2005 08:31:02 PM new
I have never tried drop shipping. However it is not illegal. It can be testy though if you do not informed the customer it is being shipped by a third party.It is vital to keep them(customer) informed to the degree possible the shipping date and certainly if there is a delay.
OAN-- I for one have always respected Tom and Ralphies advice on selling. They are quite savvy.
I do not know if they drop ship or not, but they are on the mark on the ins -and -outs.
I do wish they would get a better pix though of our Prez(smile)
*******************************************
Shoot for the moon. Even if you miss, you'll land among the stars
posted on October 11, 2005 08:48:33 PM new
My thoughts on using a separate account for my dropshipping was yes, partly for accounting, and partly to keep different types of merchandise separate. I have a lot of used automotive parts, for example, and suppose I had a dropshipper for women's lingerie... I wouldn't want to sell both those lines under the same user ID.
Plus, I thought that if I had dropshipper problems and incurred a few negatives, I wouldn't want that to reflect on my other sales, for which I have full control over. (And if I got any more than a few problems, I would not use that dropshipper any longer. I wouldn't wait for eBay to suspend me and all my accounts).
posted on October 11, 2005 09:48:13 PM new
What I have done was read an E-Book about drop shipping and the site I was at was approved by Ebay, the site also has contacted all the drop shippers that are in good standing and they all agreed to deal with ebay sellers.
Now what I did was purchase all the information on the good reliable drop shippers and I opened a business account with them. I made my initial investment so I could be in contact with reliable companies. There are hundreds and hundreds of companies with web sites that will work with ebay sellers.
I have already set up 20 business accounts but after investing money for all this information and spending time talking with the companies that I picked I'm afraid to do drop shipping........lol.......I feel it would be good to add more income but at the same time I'm worried that something might go wrong.
So what I was thinking of doing was purchasing a few items from them because I can get them wholesale. I'm still working on what I should do.
Like it was mentioned its still a worry when your not holding the item in your stock.
posted on October 11, 2005 10:23:51 PM new
Yes, as Tom says, find a good one & I'm not sure how you go about that. Everyone sounds good when their trying to sell you something.
But, on the other hand there are many honest drop shippers out there.
I've thought about it too & what stopped me was reading posts from sellers that sent large amounts of money to the drop shipper for items sold on eBay & the buyers received nothing.
You can see how much research tonimar put into drop shipping & still was leary of giving it a try.
While I didn't research it, I fee the same way she does...afraid to give it a try.
Do your homework & good luck, it could possibly pay off.
posted on October 12, 2005 04:00:28 AM new
After a lot of misery, I've developed RALPHIE'S METHOD for determining whether or not to sell for any particular company...
Two years ago, we thought we'd try D-S and signed up with some of the VD advertisers...WHAT A DISASTER!
1) COMPANY #1: totally disorganized + their inventory was rarely updated! We earned our FIRST NEG from that fiasco!
2) COMPANY #2: so bad, we turned them into the FBI to get our measley $20 back! And, it worked! The slime-ball sent a $20 bill to the COPS, & they mailed the $20 dollar bill to Ralphie!
3) Company #3: EXCELLENT CUSTOMER SERVICE & SHIPPING! Once, they shipped in 3 days, imstead of 2 & they refunded me the shipping fee! Really nice folks to work with! HOWEVER: since their items are available to ANYBODY & EVERYBODY, that means that ANYBODY & EVERYBODY is selling this "stuff" on feeBay!
Duh! You'd think I would have realized that right from the beginning -- but I didn't! Finally, Ralphie noticed that there are literally THOUSANDS of folks selling the same THOUSANDS of bric-a-junk on feeBay! YIKES!
Then we stumbled over our present company & have been EXTREMELY happy for past two years, as they ship QUICKLY & SAFELY & ARE RARELY OUT-OF-STOCK.
OOS does happen occasionally, but I usually am warned ahead of time & can take down the listing in time to avoid PO'ing any potential buyer. But, my FB is now OVER 2000, so, if I rack up 1 NEG/500 POS's, I don't think that will be too much of a disaster...
We also sell for a really EXCELLENT Canadian company, & we reallly had to work at it to convince them to let us represent them -- took a year & we're both pretty happy now...
We're now considering a THIRD (THANKS, Cheryl) company as well...
Important point to remember is that NONE of these companies advertised that they DS!
Anyhoo, RALPHIE'S RULE now is:
1) WE will NOT sell for any company that ADVERTISES that they DS!
2) WE will NOT sell for any company that charges a "MEMBERSHIP FEE" or charges to DS!
3) WE will not sell for any company that uses a catalog of JUNQUE called "WORLD of PRODUCTS"
4) WE will NOT sell for any company that targets eBay sellers! Duh! If thousands of OTHER sellers are selling the same MOUSETRAPS, what chance do ya think poor ole Ralphie & I have????
posted on October 12, 2005 06:25:53 AM new
Thanks Tom & Ralphie! Some very good points. It's great to hear there are some happy endings amongst the many horror stories of dropshipping. And yes, I know exactly who you are talking about with the "World of Products" junque. Tried that a couple of years ago. You buy their product for $24 and sell it on eBay for $18, while trying to compete with the hundreds of other sellers trying to undercut each other. And yes, they try to sell to eBay vendors.
That's about the extent of my dropshipping experience. I knew there had to be something better out there. The idea is great, just have to find a place that you can count on and where the eBay market's not saturated with that product. It's certainly cruicial to investigate each potential dropshipper. Interesting how the best place you found didn't even advertise they were a dropshipper, brilliant!
posted on October 12, 2005 08:26:35 AM new
If you accept credit card,you are obliged to ship within 24 hours.
With Paypal,it is within 7 days.
Now last year some one comes to this board and complained about Paypal-she used dropshipper for an item sold on Ebay for 3k,the dropshipper was late in shipping for whatever the reason and the buyer filed complaint with Paypal.
Since she cannot get online trackable delivery confirmation from her shipper,that 3k was yanked from her account.
It turned out that the shipper shipped on the 10th day,the bidder got the merchandise free .
posted on October 12, 2005 09:07:50 AM new"If you accept credit card,you are obliged to ship within 24 hours"
Please cite in VISA or MASTERCARD's merchant agreement where it specifically demands this? I've purchased from MANY online stores (AMAZON; eTOYS; MASON; etc) and I've NEVER received 24hr shipping from anybody!
PAYPAL does require shipping within 7 days. If one's drop-shipper is so incompetant as to be UNABLE to provide tracking after a purchase, then what kind of a FOOL would ever buy anything from such a company.
Your scenario seems to state that this person used a drop-shipper for a $3000 order and this drop-shipper does not provide tracking numbers. COMMON SENSE would demand that BEFORE utilizing this company (and accepting PP for eBay sales), one might do a LITTLE BIT OF HOMEWORK first???
BTW: the FEDERAL rule is that mail orders must be shipped within 30 days, or you have to offer a REFUND...
Regardless of drop-shipping or selling Aunt Maggie's prized antique chamber pot from one's garage, I'd NEVER accept a $3000 order via PayPal anyway!
My faith in the SELLER'S NON-PROTECTION POLICY stops at about $500 -- the maximum I could afford to lose without having to sell Ralphie's butt on a street corner!
I can practically guaranmtee you that EVEN IF YOU FOLLOWED ALL THE RULES, if PayPal gets a complaint from a CC company about a $3000 order (I don't care if ya have a VIDEO of ED McMAHON delivering the item to yer buyer or not), PAYPAL IS NOT GOING TO HONOR THE SPP!
PP IS NOT GONNA EAT A $3000 CC CHARGEBACK!
If you think you have any real protection under the SPP, then Ralphie would be happy to show you where SADDAM has been hiding the WMDs all this time!
posted on October 12, 2005 09:54:10 AM new
One of the companies that I deal with will dropship anything in their catalog but you have to place the minimum order each time you call in,so it can get a little pricey. I don't like to do it on the big items around Christmas because they take for ever to ship or don't have the items. So I rarely do this.
**********************************
Two men sit behind bars,one sees mud the other sees stars.
posted on October 12, 2005 11:37:35 AM new
Tom,
merchant is expected to ship either immediately or within 24-48 hours AFTER CHARGING THE CUSTOMER'S CREDIT CARD.
If you have your own merchant account,dont forget proceeds is deposited into your bank account within 48 hours.
FTC said 30 days for mail order business,but if you notice,most catalog houses DO NOT CHARGE YOUR CREDIT CARD UNTIL THE ITEM IS READY TO SHIP.
Now with the seller who comes to this board to complain about that 3k item sold on Ebay,it is a piece of electronic product and the dropshipper is temporarily out of stock,hence the delay in shipping.
My point is to remind all those dropship wannabees some of the pitfalls of dropshipping,it is a brilliant idea on a piece of paper,in reality,it could be a nightmare.
Given the slim margin of selling on Ebay,especially with dropship items,this is something we all want to keep in mind.
NO more,no less!
posted on October 12, 2005 02:36:50 PM new
I agree with Tom on avoiding vendors who go after eBay sellers. I've considered drop shipping on eBay but would want to solicit the vendors instead of them soliciting me. My question to Tom: do you have an exclusive agreement with the vendor that prevents them from drop shipping for other online sellers or from selling the same items on eBay themselves? I would hate to develop a market on eBay and then have every Dick Tom and Harry cash in on it!
posted on October 13, 2005 07:41:16 AM new
After all this, I'm still intrigued to try dropshipping, but only after careful consideration of who the dropshipper will be. Sounds like it COULD be done successfully, even in a saturated catagory.
My main concern is saving time on packing & going to the post office, as well as stocking physical inventory, even if it means making a bit less per transaction. I don't have a credit card merchant account, but I do have a PayPal account, so that's what I'd use.
As mentioned above, a lot of places will wait a few days to ship, but don't actually charge your credit card until they ship, which could be several days, or even a week later. Had it happen to me personally.
posted on October 13, 2005 09:49:36 AM new
powerwebmedia said
My main concern is saving time on packing & going to the post office, as well as stocking physical inventory, even if it means making a bit less per transaction////////////////
I am afraid you may be making A LOT LESS per transaction.
It is just common sense,whoever does the most work,take the most risk and have the capital to stock up,make the lion share of the transaction and in this case it is your dropshipper!!
You may want to explain how Paypal works to your dropshipper -the 7 days shipping policy and the online trackable delivery confirmation.
Some bidders know the game too well on Ebay,this is how they get free merchandise .
[ edited by hwahwa on Oct 13, 2005 09:51 AM ]
posted on October 13, 2005 09:51:54 AM new
Most of my products drop ship, but I don't sell them on eBay - eBay only gets my returns. I try to charge my customers very close to the time the product actually ships and provide good information about how long it will take to ship. Some of the products are special order/custom and take 6-8 weeks to ship, so I have to have that written all over our website, and still some customers fail to read it. I don't charge for those products until they do ship. Have had very few horror stories, but I choose my suppliers carefully and most of them are the manufacturers of the products I sell or in a very short supply chain.
If you're looking for a supplier, find a product you like and read the tag - usually the manufacturer and address is printed on it. Contact them and find out how to buy wholesale from them and if they will drop ship. Easy as that. Forget about the "lists" - most of them are junque.
posted on October 13, 2005 10:54:50 AM new
Yes, I'll be careful to choose carefully, even if takes a few months to find someone reliable.
I understand I'll make less per transaction, but if the volume is high enough, it can still be profitable. Just hoping to get away from so much storing, packing and post office trips.
posted on October 13, 2005 11:18:22 AM new
the post office does not want to lose you as a customer,why cant you have to come and pick up the packages??
If you have enough for them,it does not matter if they are first class or priority,they will come.
just the other day,I handed over 20 small boxes ,none is priority mail.
posted on October 13, 2005 12:16:22 PM new
I'd still have to buy merchandise ahead of time and store it at my home. And, pack everything. I was kind of hoping to move away from that and go with dropshipping.
. My schedule is quite hectic with a fulltime job and elderly parents to spend some time with, and I need to make some more money. Thought dropshipping might be a good idea, so I wouldn't have to stock a lot of merchandise, pack the stuff and go to the post office (or UPS, FedEx, etc). Even if it means a smaller profit per transaction, it's a lot less work for me.
