posted on June 1, 2006 08:35:10 PM new
My e-bay preferences are set to allow buyer to change payment totals. Does that allow the buyer to add insurance if I neglected to offer it? I have buyer who alleges non-receipt of $40 item (I have PO receipt showing shipment) and says I have to refund in total because I didn't "offer" insurance. It's a large 23# item and definitely not breakable. Cost $17. to ship. Comments, please, on what my responsibility is in this situation.
posted on June 1, 2006 08:57:13 PM new
Please tell me that you did not ship a package without Delivery Confirmation. With all the fraud we read about here, that should be basic procedure for sellers by now.
If you did without DC, tell buyer to cool their heels while you have the PO put a tracer on the package. Even without DC or insurance they may be able to locate the package.
If not, you have just bought yourself a $57 lesson in CYA.
Auction contract agreement is for you to deliver merchandise. If you do not offer insurance on your auction, it will be your loss.
posted on June 1, 2006 10:15:36 PM new
Correct me if I'm wrong... If he paid by PayPal, you can kiss your money goodbye. Despite whatever verbage in your description, insurance is for the seller's benefit and up to the seller to purchase because PayPal will award the buyer compensation if there is no proof that the item has been delivered. That being the case, I refund non-delivery claims gracefully, having paid insurance for the more expensive shipments I don't want to eat.
posted on June 1, 2006 10:41:27 PM new
Thanks both of you. I know I was remiss and will change the way I operate. I'll always be sure I check "Insurance Required"
on more expensive items everytime. This buyer did not pay with PayPal (sent money order). I have over 2300 positive feedback and before this had only one package not delivered - so Delivery Confirmation and Insurance (except for breakables) have not been much on my mind. This transaction changed that mentality (I need to protect myself.)
posted on June 2, 2006 12:44:16 AM new
Since they paid with MO. don't sweat it too much?? If they did not get the package they would NOT know you did not insure it period. You might email them saying they need to go to post office and pick it up if not recieved but that PO says it is delivered. Heck even tell them you called their post office.. But if they swear you didn't insure it then you know they would have to have the package to know that. Then you might bluff them with post office says it is delivered. If they got it and are trying to scam you for money back they might just go away. You should be able to tell if they are not on up and up by how they respond to your polite innocent sounding slightly fibbed email about the delivery and insurance. You could have bought insurance through another company than the USPS. If they didn't get package you should be able to tell by how they reply, hopefully tripping them up. Then you can tell them you insured out of your own pocket and do not refund any shipping and if you wind up refunding (doubtful) tell them you deduct the insurance they didn't pay in first place. Besides if they didn't get package then they won't know if you insured out of kindness of your own heart or not.... You can really see how they react if you present it factually even if fibbed a tiny bit and make it sound very professional and like you know what you are talking about, make it very long it confuses them. LOL.
I have tripped people up by sending such emails that are long and detailed sound very savey about the whole process. BUT I use delivery confirmation on everything, even if it is a letter type package I have to stuff with peanuts to make it thick enough brown envelope only though.
**************
Some minds are like concrete,
thoroughly mixed up and permanently set.
posted on June 2, 2006 04:05:14 AM new
Too answer your Q I suppose they could, but I doubt if they would.
I agree with LtRay if after a reasonable effort to track down the package nothing turns up, say 2-3 weeks, send'em the 57 bucks. Assuming this buyer has good FB there is no reason to suspect a scam.
posted on June 2, 2006 05:13:33 AM new
shopchicly,
I know it's too late for this one... but you might want to stick something like this in your terms of sale:
"Seller is not responsible for lost or damaged items which are uninsured. It is the full responsibility of the buyer to request and pay additional charges for all insurance."
Not that it will protect you against Paypal chargebacks... but in cases like this, you could then point them back to your terms.
Bottom line is that you're always going to get customers that want to pay the absolute least amount... not get insurance... and then when something goes wrong, they'll demand the protection that the insurance would have provided. You can't win...
posted on June 2, 2006 05:39:42 AM new
With your low percentage of lost shipments, I'd think twice about requiring insurance. Think of how much the post office would make off of you at $1.30 per shipment! Maybe you should raise your s/h a small bit and then cover lost shipments out of pocket- buying insurance for only the more expensive items.
posted on June 2, 2006 05:57:05 AM new
WHAT IS 23#??
USPS seldom lose a big package,put a trace on it,it will probably show up someday.
Did you ask her to check with her post office,if a large package cannot fit into her mail box,she should get a notice from them.
/ lets all stop whining !! /
posted on June 2, 2006 07:06:23 AM new
I think I'm going to require insurance on any item over $50 or $100 now that Vendio makes it so you can do a different markup on each item. It's the only thing that makes sense these days.
posted on June 2, 2006 03:36:06 PM new
For the future, perhaps you should consider including insurance within your s/h fees. I joined OTWA, which then entitled me to insurance from U-PIC at an OTWA member price.
My buyers do not have a choice. All items are shipped insured for loss or damage. All items worth $50 or less are insured for 40 cents while those over $50 cost 80 cents. Insurance for international shipments is $1.20. The cost of the insurance is included in my posted s/h fees.
Now, if you are still hesitant to insure, be sure to add wording at the end of your statement regarding assumption of risk; to which you can hang your hat.
"The placement of an order, will indicate your acceptance of these terms."
I know, I know, the others will state that PayPal will ignore any such wording and refund. However, we should ask if they had the disclaimer along with the quoted statement in the item description, when a refund was issued by PayPal.
posted on June 2, 2006 03:59:22 PM new
Although most of everything I ship goes via FedEx, which includes insurance in their base rate, whenever I have an item that will go via the postal service, the price of insurance is included in the shipping charge I quote. In over 8 years on Ebay, I have never offered a customer the option of insurance on a shipment. When it is handed over to the Post Office, it's covered. The argument that the Post Office makes 1.30 off me for every one of those shipments doesn't hold water. They have never made a dime off me. The customer pays, not the seller. I spent too many years in the transportation industry dealing with people who would try to save a few bucks by not insuring their shipments, and expecting full coverage if something happened. I no longer play that game.
If Murphy's law is correct, everything East of the San Andreas Fault will slide into the Atlantic
posted on June 2, 2006 04:24:37 PM new
I guess it depends what you're selling and who you're selling to. It makes no sense for me to require buyers to add over 10% of the purchase price to buy insurance for a shipment that has less than a 1% chance of getting lost (I can't think of any of my competing sellers who do this). I really would hate to fill out over 100 insurance forms each week on the off-chance that this week one of the shipments will get loss. I don't have proof-of-delivery because most of my items are sent first class letter post. No disclaimer will let me keep PayPal funds if I can't prove delivery. I refund immediately when asked, $10 usually, out-of-pocket. The customers who get a refund almost always return with repeat business. For those times when an item sells for over $100 - I am thrilled to buy insurance.
[ edited by pixiamom on Jun 2, 2006 04:25 PM ]
posted on June 2, 2006 05:06:08 PM new
IT ARRIVED!!!! But the mystery deepens. Buyer wrote about an hour ago that she received it this morning - June 2. It was shipped May 8. From Phoenix to Kenniwick, Washington. And it is "broken" into several pieces. THE ITEM IS A SMALL DECORATIVE CAST IRON TABLE. CAST IRON -- and it was carefully packed. Weighed 23 pounds and shipping cost $17.56.
It would have taken a really special effort to damage it. Where could it have been for over three weeks? and doesn't the post office owe her an explanation/apology for their ineptness, even if it were not insured? TO EVERYONE WHO REPLIED - Thank You - It's been an informative discussion and learning experience for me.
posted on June 2, 2006 05:41:27 PM new
The very first damage claim I had on Ebay was a Griswold cast iron skillet. It was a small one so I shipped it Priority instead of FedEx. It went from here in California to Memphis. The only thing I can think that happened was that it went from 70 degrees at LAX, to 15 degrees at 32000 feet, to 90 degrees in Memphis, all in a 5 hour period, and received a bump before it thawed out. Cast iron is not as strong as you would think. In fact, it's quite fragile and has to be packed and handled the same as ceramics or stoneware.
If Murphy's law is correct, everything East of the San Andreas Fault will slide into the Atlantic
posted on June 2, 2006 09:25:11 PM new
ShopC, delivery took 3 weeks because a mail truck broke down in Death Valley and they used your package for a wheel ramp. Explains the damage and the late delivery
Just for the record, Sparkz makes a valid point. Many believe that since cast iron is hard and heavy that it is durable. It is NOT. It can act like glass if dropped or bumped, especially cheap import CI. For a 12 inche skillet, you need to add at least 4 inches of padding to protect it in shipping.
ShopC, if your table was disassembled, I would have bubble wrapped each piece and then seperated the layers with card board. Sounds like overkill, but it really is not.
posted on June 2, 2006 10:44:06 PM new
Special thanks to sparkz and LtRay re:
cast iron. I had no idea it could be fragile. I've benefited a lot from this thread and thank you all, again.
posted on June 3, 2006 05:25:09 AM new
USPS sometimes will inspect a package esp if it is heavy,noisy,smelly etc,hence the delay.
Question on cast iron -can they be made of powder iron?iron sawdust bought from the steel mill,melt down and poured into a mold??
/ lets all stop whining !! /
[ edited by hwahwa on Jun 3, 2006 07:08 AM ]
Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former. - Albert Einstein