posted on February 5, 2007 01:41:30 PM
A buyer from Germany purchased a $100 item from us on January 23, and paid via PAYPAL. We shipped to them on January 26.
Today, feb 5, PAYPAL placed the $100. funds on hold. The buyer is stating they haven't received the item as yet.
It isn't even two weeks... i don't understand how paypal can do this... We state in our listing that all overseas orders are done without insurance at buyers risk, unless they do REGISTERED mail.
posted on February 5, 2007 02:51:07 PM
You sure dont know how Paypal works? DO you??
You have no business accepting Paypal payment if you dont understand how it works.
Well,he filed a complaint with Paypal,you log on to your account and click on the case and tell him to be patient .(Did you write down the US customs form number ,it is now trackable on USPS website?)
Stall him and hope the package will show up soon.Either one of you can opt to escalate the case to get Paypal involved so do everything you can to stop him from doing so as once Paypal gets involved,it will ask you to provide an online trackable number which I assume you dont have .
Just pray your package arrives soon or this guy does not know how Paypal works either,after 30 days if he does nothing like escalating it,Paypal will close the case.
Then you can throw your rules at him like why dont you buy insurance??
(my guess is that if it is a big heavy package,it is taking longer to deliver because the German customs have the package)
[ edited by hwahwa on Feb 5, 2007 03:10 PM ]
posted on February 5, 2007 04:51:18 PM
Not to pile on, but I'm not sure that having a tracking number would help. PP loves it when you let them off the hook; they don't like paying their people to manage disputes, and they for sure don't like running the risk of eating a credit card chargeback. So, if you let them off the hook becuase of a) shipping to an unconfirmed address, which by definition a German address is to a US seller, or b) not having a tracking number, or c) not shipping within 7 days, or d) not being paid in one complete payment: sorry, refund granted, NEXT!
posted on February 5, 2007 05:44:32 PM
kidgalahad,
Welcome to the wonderful world of international PayPal sales. It's a place where sellers are always guilty and buyers can do no wrong. Where delivery delays and charge backs are part and parcel of life... but you probably already know because you signed up with PayPal. (You did read the TOS you agreed to - in particular the section on pledging your soul or first born to PayPal should you ever default.)
Let me reiterate about PayPal's "Seller Protection": very few international sales qualify for it - first check your eBay listing to see if it qualifies. Also sales must be made only to the UK or Canada. Item must be sent Track-n-trace, and signature required on items over $250, etc...
You sent this item to Germany so no PayPal "Seller Protection" is available. Slam dunk - you lose. Buyer gets your item for free.
The only way of getting your $100 back is to ask the buyer to contact you when the item arrives and pay you again. You are at the mercy of the buyer. There are other options available but to be honest PayPal is about the easiest way of getting robbed if you want to sell internationally. If you check on Google you'll discover that there are numerous websites that explain the myriad ways and methods scammers and assorted low-lifes can rip off sellers that accept PayPal.
p.s. be aware that insurance is for the seller's benefit - not the buyer's.
posted on February 5, 2007 06:00:47 PM
From my experience: German buyers are impatient but honest. I'll bet that you get the payment when the shipment arrives.
posted on February 6, 2007 06:24:53 AM
there's good news here. Not sure exactly what happened, but last night (after posting the tracking number and responding to the paypal dispute AND sending the buyer an email), the buyer reversed the dispute and I have the money. SO... he either got it or decided to be honest after the fact... he didn't explain why the he reversed the dispute but I'm happy. thanks for the info here.
posted on February 6, 2007 07:44:44 AM
Good that it worked out.
But why is it that international buyer can't have a confirmed address? Why doesn't it work with them like it does here in the USA? I've never fully understood this.
posted on February 6, 2007 08:01:12 AM
A confirmed address is the address where your credit card statement is sent,it can be your home,your office or a mail box.
To confirm this address,Paypal or any merchant account provider will go to an online data base manned by an organisation which keeps the data current such as name and address,line of credit ,status of the card etc.
All that information is constantly updated by the credit card issuers who participate,a few do not such as your local plumber credit union.
UK and Canada date bases are now available to us ,but not the rest of the world.
May be some day it will be.
BTW,AMEX is worldwide and you can call your AMEX office and ask about any member anywhere in the world and they will tell you.
If you have your own merchant account to accept credit card,and you want to know if the foreign card is any good,you have to call the issuer usually a local bank,and long distance call is not cheap and the bank may not speak english.
posted on February 6, 2007 01:00:28 PM
For a US seller, only US, Canadian, and UK buyers are covered. The last time I looked, it wasn't completely reciprocal (I think UK sellers weren't protected with Canadian buyers).
AFAIK, every other country protects only their own (Aussie buyers, for example, are covered for Aussie sellers, but not US).
posted on February 6, 2007 02:07:51 PM
'So UK and Canada are covered under seller's protection but not the rest of the world/
ONLY IF THEIR ADDRESS IS CONFIRMED AND YOU SHIP WITH ONLINE TRACKABLE DC which can be expensive.
posted on February 6, 2007 05:30:28 PM
One more question:
hwahwa wrote, "Just pray your package arrives soon or this guy does not know how Paypal works either,after 30 days if he does nothing like escalating it,Paypal will close the case. "
so my question is... once the case is closed, the buyer cannot reopen it, right?
posted on February 6, 2007 05:51:25 PM
right,once the case is closed,he cannot reopen it.
BUT,
if he used his credit card to pay via Paypal,and the item never arrive,he could go to his cc issuer and file a dispute.
Then Paypal will be forced to deal with it .
posted on February 7, 2007 10:42:00 AMhwahwa wrote, "Just pray your package arrives soon or this guy does not know how Paypal works either,after 30 days if he does nothing like escalating it,Paypal will close the case.
This is false. The transaction will hang there until the person on the other end does something. I presently have a chargeback that is going on 14 months. I am not going to let PayPal know or even the loser that filed. If I can't have the money, why should I let them know it's there for the taking.
so my question is... once the case is closed, the buyer cannot reopen it, right?
Correct, unless he files with his credit card company. At this point, since you have the money, leave it alone. Out of site out of mind is you best choice here.
posted on February 7, 2007 11:09:16 AM
If you go to the detail page of that dispute,there is a small line which said this case will close in 30 days and it will give you the exact date when it will be closed,if it is not escalated to get Paypal involved.
I dont know when they make the change,back then once you file a complaint ,Paypal is involved ,now they want you to work it out between buyer and seller and if it does not work,then escalate it to get Paypal to be involved.
Paypal can really suck sometimes