posted on February 8, 2008 09:57:06 AM
For a moment, let's put aside the injustices in eBay's feedback changes. Are you going to change your behavior in leaving feedback for buyers?
I no longer sell, but am curious.
I would never leave feedback prior to receiving it, and always recommended the same for others. Now, I'm not so sure.
If you leave feedback upon payment (or sooner, I guess), you might encourage a higher percentage of positives left for you. This higher percentage of positives would dilute any negatives left for you. Alternatively, perhaps leaving the feedback sooner would decrease feedback for you (the buyer deciding that they've already received pos, why bother).
If you wait until you've received feedback, you might encourage buyers to leave positive so that they can get a positive from you. You also retain the option of leaving a positive with a snarky comment.
Anyway, has anyone thought about this and what changes, if any, they'll be making?
posted on February 8, 2008 10:05:16 AM
you were in New Jersey i hope you got good will for your effort? were you looking to sell or did someone aproach you? i think you got out at a good time ?
I sold mostly for personal reasons (my family and I didn't like the hours). One of my qualifications for a buyer was that I would feel that they had a good chance of keeping it profitable, and I left some money on the table as a result. There was a dingbat who was willing to pay full price, but I felt that I owed it to my existing consignors (800+) and my self-respect (I live in town) to end negotiations with him.
All this and MORE in my book: eBay Consignment Selling & Drop Off Stores;
The Unofficial How-To Guide to Getting Started, Making Money, and Retaining Your Sanity
The book isn't up on Amazon yet, and I am having difficulties setting up discounts on createspace.com. I'll provide more information shortly.
I have a problem with "We do not participate in eBay's voluntary feedback system. If that is a problem for you, don't bid." I don't have a problem with opting out of the feedback system; it always was a joke, and now it's not even a funny joke. However, I wonder whether the way you've worded it will backfire.
Most reasonable people will take it for what it is, and either bid or not regardless of your position on feedback. Most negatives are left by jackasses, and I'm afraid that for them it would be a dare.
posted on February 8, 2008 10:32:01 AMMost negatives are left by jackasses, and I'm afraid that for them it would be a dare.
I could probably write six or eight sentences of pretty, flattering text that would say the same thing I did in two sentences. Maybe you could go that route.
However, I figure there's a better chance people will read the two sentences. I'm committed to keeping my TOS ultra-short. I am certain that most buyers appreciate that.
I learned long ago I can't control or even influence the behavior of jerks, so I don't even try. Are some people offended by my style? Sure. But there are people leap to take offense at anything. I don't see any point in pandering to them. YMMV, as always.
Now that negative feedback influences discounts on fees and search position, why do you continue to say feedback doesn't matter? Is it because you have repeat customers?
Or do you believe that these effects of bad feedback will be negligible on your bottom line?
Just wondering. BTW, I don't participate in the feedback either. I actually have customers that don't want feedback. In my notices it says that ebay has a system to leave them reciprocal feedback if they wish to get it then leave it.
Beth
posted on February 8, 2008 11:15:44 AM
Okay, how about this:
Our "Wow!" Guarantee
We will send you jewelry so dazzlingly beautiful that you will sit up in your chair, eyes wide, and exclaim "Wow!" or your money back.
Regretfully, because of recent changes made by eBay to the voluntary feedback system, we are no longer able to leave you feedback for this item. But we want you to understand that we value your patronage above all, so we're including a "Wow! What a great buyer!" card with every package*. We will do everything in our power to make this a transaction so satisfying you will sit up and say "Wow!"
Thanks,
The crew here at ClearanceClarence.com
*"Wow!" card not valid for a Starbucks latte, getting out of jail free or impressing your in-laws.
posted on February 8, 2008 11:24:18 AMdo you believe that these effects of bad feedback will be negligible on your bottom line?
Beth, here's why feedback (STILL) doesn't matter and here's why 99.98% of people steamed about the changes are missing the point:
You can still sell on eBay.
Even the broken-down losers who had 5% or more dissatisfied customers only had their auctions *restricted*; they were not booted off.
They could still sell.
As long as you can sell, you're still in the game.
Heck, I know of a seller who was still in the game six months after she died. Bad feedback piled up and she got some INR disputes with PayPal. One assumes there were eBay-side complaints, too; those count towards your 5% dissatisfaction quota.
Death isn't enough to take away your selling privileges on eBay. Now that is a mind-boggling concept.
posted on February 8, 2008 02:10:25 PM
"Now that negative feedback influences discounts on fees and search position, why do you continue to say feedback doesn't matter?"
Within reason, unless it would make you eligible for a discount on FVFs, feedback doesn't matter for most sellers. The levels required for discounts are so high, and are DSR-based anyway, that it is probably academic.
I think feedback below 95% might hinder buyers, but that shouldn't be difficult to get unless you really don't try at all.
As a consignment seller, high feedback ratings meant something, but it was a marketing tool directed to consignors rather than bidders. For whatever reason, it made a difference to them that we had 99.8% positive.
posted on February 8, 2008 02:39:57 PM
Sellers pay a service to leave their feedback to their customers?
I am not playing dumb -- I have never heard that.
eBay has a free automatic preference that will do it.
posted on February 8, 2008 09:42:50 PM
I think we can thank this debacle to those who claimed "a transaction's not complete until the buyer leaves feedback". Thanks a lot. Bet you'll rethink your policies now.
How's that? While retaliatory feedback can, be definition, only be left if you're not the first to leave it, I don't understand your reasoning. Just because something is necessary (by definition) for a condition to exist does not make it causal. Photos & video are necessary for porn, are they responsible for porn?
If you think that a transaction is complete just because someone paid, you've obviously never encountered a buyer who tries to get a partial refund, a full refund without a return, claims that the item was damaged in shipping, claims that they never received it, etc. Lucky you.
In addition to paying in a timely manner, I believe that a buyer is responsible for:
1 - Behaving reasonably if the item is not everything they had hoped for, due to shipping damage, a difference of opinion about condition, etc.
2 - Being honest about whether they received an item.
Whether or not the buyer leaves feedback is immaterial, but it is one way to know that the transaction is complete. The other way is that they don't contact you with a complaint, but that takes longer
In case I haven't been clear, I do not take responsibility for causing the eBay changes because I leave feedback second. Perhaps those who leave retaliatory feedback are responsible, but I don't know how eBay decides what is retaliatory and that sellers leave 8x more than buyers. Just because the usual feedback after a negative is a negative in response doesn't make it retaliatory; it's just an indication that most often both parties are displeased by a transaction rather than one thinking it's hunky dory and the other not. For example, if I receive a negative from someone who never contacted me that there was a problem, who didn't try to work it out before leaving the negative, is it retaliatory for me to leave a negative? I don't think so.
posted on February 9, 2008 06:33:28 AM
I think we can blame this debacle on the sellers who proudly posted on the ebay boards that they gave negative FB to people who they THOUGHT gave them bad star ratings. INSANE! Star ratings are anonymous and eBay has stated that the ratings are delayed. Also the DSR is rounded so that if you were teetering between a 5.0 and 4.9 and don't have that many ratings under your belt, a good "4" rating could bring you down to a 4.9. It wasn't just one person giving you a "1".
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"At one point, though, Bargainland was at 89% and people were still bidding." True enough, but their feedback was enough to keep me from bidding, and I'm sure that I'm not alone.
I use Toolhaus whenever feedback is not stellar. You can learn a lot by reading the comments and responses; some people are unlucky enough to have jackass customers, but some really do seem to deserve their negatives.
By the way, since I've opted out, you need not send me a "Wow" card I will give you a 5 on communication regardless.
posted on February 9, 2008 10:29:12 AM
Fluff - I have to agree with the group here. Buyers actually pride themselves on their feedback numbers. Many don't think it's silly at all. They like to see their stars change. It's important to them - no matter how meaningless that is. Because it is important to them I think it's not a good idea to belittle the system in a snappy sentence in the auction. Your longer version (with explanation) is much better.
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posted on February 9, 2008 10:32:01 AMWhy say that? It sounds like you are encouraging people not to bid...
Have you ever seen my auctions? I've always had stuff in there that could be construed as urging people not to bid.
Funny you should mention that, though. Just this morning I was working up a concept-seller project: The seller who says he doesn't want to sell and actually begs people not to bid on his stuff. If done in a sufficiently entertaining manner, it could grab a lot of eyeballs.
Other concept-sellers you may remember: The guy wearing his ex-wife's wedding dress, the Barbie dealer who put all those elaborate tableaux in her auctions, etc.
posted on February 9, 2008 11:26:07 AM
My FB won't change. I don't leave any unless the other person does.
I think very shortly the FB system will be history and those star thingies will be the only rating sellers get and all buyers will be prefect 10's.
posted on February 10, 2008 09:41:36 AM
For me, I leave feedback when you are suppose to. When you receive payment. I haven't had a negative in over 5 years now and my stars are perfect. I'm not a PS, nor do I have plans to be.
Bottom line in this whole situation is are you going to become a reputable seller or continue to wallow in your retalitory feedback ways?
posted on February 10, 2008 10:06:37 AM
Hi Stone, that is fantastic to have perfect stars!! The problem I have with not being a PS (and I am not) is that there will be no discount for us and I think also less visability on the site.
posted on February 10, 2008 12:02:25 PM
I also am not a power seller, haven't received a negative in several years, and I ALWAYS give feedback when I receive payment. I do not nor will I ever hold feedback hostage. I also will NOT leave feedback for a seller if they don't for me first, I will email them and tell them that the package has arrived and I am pleased. My stars are all perfect except for the shipping costs(4.9 - 5.0), to bad, so sad, for me.
edited to make something more clear.
[ edited by deichen on Feb 10, 2008 12:04 PM ]
