posted on February 28, 2008 07:31:40 AM new
I have a lot to say. I am a buyer and I stopped going to eBay the day these changes were announced and started searching the Web for alternatives. I found there is a whole world out there - it may be scattered, but it can be found. With a little more help from Google, it will be found easily, and we will have our world market back again - just not in the hands of a callous and foolish monopoly.
I deplore eBay's corporate mentality and horrible customer service. I adore all the sellers of the unique and hard-to-find items. What made eBay great was having a single place where millions of buyers and sellers could come together and FIND each other. What will kill eBay is forgetting that what made it grow was all the sellers, not just those that sell the most.
I believe that ANY seller that achieves whatever standard of quality is set should receive ALL the benefits of that, not just those that sell the most. The retaliatory feedback problem was caused by eBay itself. It directly told sellers to engage in this behavior, and now blames them for following eBay's own advice. There is a large community of concerned eBayers who help the victims of scams, despite all the difficulties of doing so - yet eBay will very rarely act on a single report of abuse.
eBay could be a wonderful place if it would remember its roots and stop trying to be the mega-mall of the ordinary, the fake, and the unwanted remainder merchandise. I will never go to eBay looking for stuff I can buy at Wal-Mart or Dollar General. It is precisely because it is the world's largest flea market that I did go there.
There was a well thought out thread on an ebay forum that posited that what eBay really wants is to become a centralized selling location for all the large on-line sellers. That post claimed that if one searched eBay for some item - jewelry, purse, not certain - you would find links down the page that look like eBay listings but take you to TJMaxx or some such. The deal with GM seems to support this theory.
This would be a true shame as I have NO desire to do standard retail shopping online except MAYBE at Christmas for media items, and then I would go to Amazon. I truly wish eBay had stuck with find IT and not Shop Viciously - IT is why I come to eBay, and if eBay is determined to change that, IF this supposition is true, eBay will fall. What I came to eBay for was vintage clothing (I HATE the Thou Shalt Buy New Clothes Every Season Even If The Style And Colors Don't Suit You 'fashion world' mantra), and items I liked that were discontinued, like a favorite coffee cup - in other words, IT.
Following is a fine example of eBay's "Customer Service" A detailed history of my experience with a problem seller and eBay support. For those that don't care to read it all, I will make my closing remarks here:
eBay keeps trying to automate their dispute resolution processes, but as in many things they do, the software is poorly conceived and badly designed. They continually utterly fail to enforce the most basic of their Terms of Service and User Agreement Provisions - except those that put money in their pockets. They will designate no human beings to ever intervene and have no plans to do so based on statements we have seen. Every process is designed to be unfair and abusive. They encourage through their own statements and policies the problems that have arisen. The following is one small example of an extremely simple situation with clear and compelling evidence of a problem, and they still muck it up. I utterly sympathize with the sellers who do not believe one word of the "new" Seller Protections.
THE EVIDENCE OF EBAY INCOMPETENCE
Item 120197331279
Bought & Paid for 17 Dec 07 expedited ship
. PP Transaction ID 4PS09672VM2751356
Shipment Status Inquiries Made 26 & 27 Dec 07
Refund issued by oddbanana 27 Dec 07
. PP ID 62A27779J92488243
Unpaid Item Dispute 153175757 opened 27 Dec 07
. An Unpaid Item dispute has been opened for the following item: Grave
of the Fireflies - New DVD LOW PRICE (#120197331279)
. Reason given for Unpaid Item: The buyer has not paid for the item.
. Buyer actions reported by seller: Other reason.
Proof of Payment provided 27 Dec 07 via Dispute Console
Item repaid through PayPal 29 Dec 07
. PP ID 96H717037G691931H
Above Abuse of Unpaid Item reported to eBay
Email from oddbanana stating Item Not Available 31 Dec 07
eBay responds suggesting I contact seller
Above Non-Performance Reported to eBay
Refund for Repayment issued 31 Dec 07
. PP ID 19F42151K1015692P
Same Item Relisted by oddbanana 31 Dec 07
Bought by me 1 Jan 08
eBay responds that they have my complaint but due to privacy cannot discuss it
Dispute closed and STRIKE ISSUED by oddbanana 8 Jan 08
. The Unpaid Item dispute has been closed for the following reason:
. The seller has ended this communication and filed for a Final Value
Fee credit.
Unpaid Item Abuse reported to eBay
Appeal of Strike asked and granted in 2 hours - eBay advises it is because I never asked before - not because I provided proof of payment.
eBay advises in response to Abuse complaint that I should talk to my seller.
oddbanana continues to list and sell this DVD - their 90 day neg FB passes the 5% mark which is supposed to remove Power Seller status. They remain a Power Seller.
Item: 120204798944
Won through Buy It Now 1 Jan 08
Paid through Paypal 1 Jan 08
. My Transaction ID 3TG58714JC812854C
. oddbanana's Transaction ID 4PN372887C896052A
PayPal INR Dispute filed 26 Jan 08
. Case ID PP-410-631-847 - escalated to claim - requesting oddbanana provide shipping information or stop listing unavailable item.
Claim Refunded through Paypal 26 Jan 08
. My Transaction ID 4YL95485EU124412X
Unpaid Item Dispute opened 26 Jan 08
. Dipute Console Number 156523702
. An Unpaid Item dispute has been opened for the following item: Grave
of the Fireflies - New DVD LOW PRICE (#120204798944)
. Reason given for Unpaid Item: The buyer has not paid for the item.
. Buyer actions reported by seller: Other reason.
In an attempt to automatically clear the Unpaid Item Dispute
Repaid through PayPal 28 Jan 08
. My Transaction ID 4L249095U2546633W
Unfortunately, this did not work as the checkout page through
channeladvisor.com was disabled by oddbanana and the direct payment for
an ebay item (the same one through PayPal) did not link back into the
dispute console.
Now the seller states in the Dispute Console (04 Feb 08):
Because your order was refunded, Ebay recognizes your account as being
"unpaid." As a result, the
seller is entitled to a refund, from Ebay, of the listing and final
value fees for the transaction.
Ebay has been notified and your account is in good standing with us.
Thanks
TM
Then they close the dispute and issue a strike.
They are NOT entitled to FVF for an item they do not have, do not ship,
and continue to list, both as oddbanana and as bigrockmedia.
They are NOT entitled to make libelous accusations against honest buyers whose only fault is to buy an item they don't have.
Abuse of Unpaid Item Process reported to eBay
Non-Performance of Seller reported to eBay
Appeal of Unpaid Item Strike filed
eBay responds that the Unpaid letter was a test and there is no strike - another stupid robotic reply with no factual basis.
eBay responds with hints for a better buying experience and a suggestion I communicate with my seller.
eBay responds, with a copy embedded in the email of the receipt of payment I had provided that its not possible to remove the strike based solely on the evidence provided and suggest I talk to my seller or submit a receipt of payment.
Appeal of Unpaid Item Strike refiled with same receipt.
Strike removed by eBay with the implication that I should have communcated better with my seller and that I might not be so lucky the next time.
oddbanana sells and relists the same DVD. More buyers have left negative feedback for this same problem. 90 Day neg down to 5.8% and oddbanana is still a Power Seller.
posted on February 28, 2008 08:38:02 AM new
I logged in with my powerseller ID and reported oddbanana ~ powersellers like this are why buyers are leaving eBaY!
THIS is the kind of seller eBaY is now catering to?
posted on February 28, 2008 09:23:50 AM new
PowerSellers need to maintain a 98% positive feedback rating ~ for the last 30-60-90 days ~ heeck, for the SIX MONTHS ~ they have been below 96% positive!
So for six months they have been pi**ing off eBaYers ~ that's a LOT of bidders!
posted on February 28, 2008 09:35:54 AM new
They're right on the 4.5 DSR powerseller line too but that change doesn't go into effect until July so even if they drop another point they can still wear the logo until then.
They should not be selling anything they do not have in hand but they still qualify for powerseller status. (Such as it is.)
If every refunded buyer files a non-selling seller report they might be able to make a dent.
posted on February 28, 2008 10:44:15 AM new
zippy:
they are on the 98% line for feedback from inception, far below the line for feedback in the last year.
How are you calculating that they are on the 98% line?
The pos fb% on the FB Chart reflects "to date" positive feedback. When a seller is sliding down hill, it takes a great deal to have a realistic view for current transaction satisfaction ~
example:I could pi** off ALL of my next 200 buyers and still be above 98% AND a PowerSeller.
Another change that was mentioned a few months ago was that EBaY would use a sellers last two years transactions to calculate percentages(for exactly that reason). Although current NUMBERS of pos/neu/neg are on the fb chart, PERCENTAGES shown do not reflect the same timeframe (rating for last 30 days, last six months, last year). This is a disadvantage to buyers who are trying to find a reputable seller to buy from ~ the seller in question does not meet the criteria for powerseller.
The last announcement stated that fb percentages would be based on the last twelve months, I believe that is slated to start in May.
If you want, I can run the exact numbers, but most of us who have been around a while and have strong feedback could pi** off dozens to hundreds of eBaYers over the next 12 months and remain over 98%.
posted on February 28, 2008 10:51:47 AM new
"How PowerSeller Feedback is calculated
The 98% or better positive Feedback rating for PowerSeller program eligibility is calculated differently than the site Feedback rating visible on the Seller Information and Member Profile pages. The Feedback percentage seen on the rest of the site is calculated based on Feedback from unique users. The PowerSeller Feedback score is calculated based on total user Feedback to reflect the fact that many PowerSellers have satisfied, repeat buyers. eBay calculates PowerSeller Feedback by taking the total number of positive Feedbacks and dividing them by the total number of Feedbacks (both positive and negative). Learn more about the feedback system."
I'm not defending them. I think it is wonderful that eBay is finally tightening up their low powerseller requirements. I'm just explaining why they are still entitled to wear the logo.
Edited to add link
[ edited by zippy2dah on Feb 28, 2008 10:53 AM ]
posted on February 28, 2008 11:00:13 AM new
zippy:
Using your calculation method:
last 12 months 97.89
last 6 months 96.63
last 30 days 95.09
This seller hasn't qualified for powerseller status for over a year and to call him one is to misrepresent him to buyers.
posted on February 28, 2008 11:02:07 AM new
there is also a flaw in the formula ~
if it is called a POSITIVE feedback percentage, neutrals need to be added in ~ the numbers above do not reflect the neutral transactions.
If they are neutral, they should count towards the percent of positive transactions v. total transactions.
(positive+neutral+negative comments=total comments)
posted on February 28, 2008 11:25:46 AM new
"Using your calculation method"
Not mine, eBay's. Did you read the quote I provided? It says nothing about 12 months. It says total.
As for upcoming changes, the DSRs will be judged on a 12 month basis and your feedback percentage will be based on the last 12 months but I believe powerseller feedback will still be calculated with your total numbers. I see nothing in the recent announcements that says otherwise but maybe I'm just not seeing it. Do you have a link?
posted on February 28, 2008 11:27:54 AM new
In my eBay dreams a seller like this would not just be removed from the powerseller program but booted from eBay altogether for consistently listing things they do not have in hand.
At the very least I would like to see eBay refuse to refund fees when they list invisible items or refuse to sell for whatever reason.
posted on February 28, 2008 11:52:26 AM new
link:
http://pages.ebay.com/services/forum/new.html
Feedback Changes in 2008:
C&P:
Recent Feedback (12 months Positive Percentage)
Why is eBay basing the Positive Feedback percentage on the past 12 months and not on lifetime Feedback?
Positive Feedback percentage will soon be based on only on the past 12 months. Here's why:
Recent Feedback is more representative of the experience a buyer should expect from a seller.
Twelve months is long enough to show trends and patterns and will enable buyers to make more informed decisions.
It is also a long enough period of time to prevent a single bad transaction from having an overly negative impact.
Please note that members will still be able to view the complete history and all comments will be available.
Will the change to the Feedback percentage, basing it on 12 months, also impact my Feedback score?
The Feedback score (count of all Feedback earned) will continue to be based on all Feedback earned by the member since registration, except those withdrawn, de-scored or removed.
How will eBay calculate the Positive Feedback percentage?
The Positive Feedback percentage will be calculated by dividing all positive Feedback earned in the past year by all positive, neutral and negative Feedback.
posted on February 28, 2008 01:17:16 PM new
eBay calculates PowerSeller Feedback by taking the total number of positive Feedbacks and dividing them by the total number of Feedbacks (both positive and negative). Learn more about the feedback system.....
***************
sorry had to edit this...I guess I will wait and see what happens when they calculate the REPEAT status feedback and eliminate the bad feedbacks.....
[ edited by rhpepsi on Feb 28, 2008 01:28 PM ]
posted on February 28, 2008 08:11:12 PM new
Zippy's right. When it comes to powerseller feedback, eBay uses that funny math. When there "real" feedback is at 94%, their powerseller feedback could be at or above 98%.
posted on February 29, 2008 03:40:51 AM new
The point is not how powerseller feedback is calculated.
WHY IS THIS GUY STILL A POWERSELLER???
zippy IS right about how powerseller feedback is calculated, no argument.
I was asked WHY I reported this seller to eBaY, to which I responded:
[b]PowerSellers need to maintain a 98% positive feedback rating ~ for the last 30-60-90 days ~ heeck, for the SIX MONTHS ~ they have been below 96% positive!
So for six months they have been pi**ing off eBaYers ~ that's a LOT of bidders![/b]
yesterday alone he got 18 negs out of 85 feedback.
this months "POWERSELLER calculated" percentage for oddbanana is now 92.8, six months is 96.5.
the guy has been going RAPIDLY downhill for over a year ~ what an exemplory powerseller.
His other id is at 97.8. The guy sells thousands of items a week between the two id's.
This guy shouldn't even be permitted to sell, much less be a powerseller.
Way to go eBaY...cater to the masses.
Can eBaY REALLY think this is the kind of experience their buyers are looking for when they purchase from the BIG sellers?
If 'powersellers' are permitted to give this kind of transaction, do you think the buyers will stay? VERY shortsighted thinking on eBaY's part.
Sellers like this are pi**ing off YOUR buyers!
posted on February 29, 2008 04:00:23 AM new
New Power Seller Requirements from link on Power Seller Portal page:
line Requirements
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PowerSeller membership is FREE to qualified sellers. eBay automatically invites qualified sellers via email.
Requirements
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To qualify and remain in the PowerSeller program, members must:
* Uphold the eBay community values, including honesty, timeliness and mutual respect
* Meet the following average minimum sales requirements:
o Three Month Requirement: a minimum of $1,000 in sales or 100 items per month, for three consecutive months
o Annual Requirement: a minimum of $12,000 or 1,200 items for the prior twelve months
* Achieve the following minimum average of items sold:
o Three Month Requirement: 2 items sold per month for the past 3 months (6 items)
o Annual Requirement: 2 items sold per month for the past 12 months (24 items)
* Achieve an overall Feedback rating of 100, of which 98% or more is positive
* Have been an active member for 90 days
* Have an account in good financial standing
* Comply with all eBay listing and marketplace policies
* New requirement effective July 2008: have maintained a rating of 4.5 or higher for the past 12 months in all four detailed seller ratings (DSRs) - item as described, communication, shipping time, and shipping and handling charges. In the case of PowerSellers that sell exclusively in Motors Vehicles categories or Half.com the following requirements apply:
o Motors Vehicles categories - the requirement applies to item description and communication ratings only
o Half.com - since Half.com does not use detailed seller ratings (DSRs), these sellers are exempted from the DSR requirement
PowerSeller program eligibility is reviewed every month. Sellers not meeting the requirements above may loose their PowerSeller status.
If you would like help growing your business to a level that qualifies you for the PowerSeller Program, schedule a free consultation with a Seller OnRamp program consultant today! Seller OnRamp consultants teach qualified business sellers how to effectively market their products on eBay. Provide the referral code "PowerSeller" to get started.
PowerSeller Levels
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PowerSellers are distinguished in 5 tiers based on average monthly sales. Benefits and services vary for each tier. eBay calculates eligibility for each tier monthly and automatically notifies qualified members through email.
Average sales volume for each PowerSeller tier:
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Tier Bronze Silver Gold Platinum Titanium
Sales $1,000 $3,000 $10,000 $25,000 $150,000
or
Items Sold 100 300 1,000 2,500 15,000
How PowerSeller Feedback is calculated
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The 98% or better positive Feedback rating for PowerSeller program eligibility is calculated differently than the site Feedback rating visible on the Seller Information and Member Profile pages. The Feedback percentage seen on the rest of the site is calculated based on Feedback from unique users. The PowerSeller Feedback score is calculated based on total user Feedback to reflect the fact that many PowerSellers have satisfied, repeat buyers. eBay calculates PowerSeller Feedback by taking the total number of positive Feedbacks and dividing them by the total number of Feedbacks (both positive and negative). Learn more about the feedback system.
How PowerSeller detailed seller ratings (DSRs) are calculated
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Because detailed seller ratings (DSRs) enable buyers to rate specific aspects of their transactions - item as described, communication, shipping time, and shipping and handling charges - these ratings provide the best measure of customer satisfaction and the best way for eBay to identify good sellers.
Starting in July 2008, the PowerSeller Program will calculate eligibility based on the DSRs for the previous 12 months. In order to become a PowerSeller or remain in the PowerSeller program, sellers will need to maintain a rating of 4.5 or higher in all four DSRs.
In the case of sellers that sell exclusively in the Motors Vehicles categories, the DSR requirement for the PowerSeller program applies only to the item description and communication ratings. Transactions in motor vehicle categories are not rated on shipping time and shipping and handling charges since vehicle shipping is typically arranged by the buyer.
Since Half.com does not use DSRs, sellers that sell exclusively on Half.com are exempted from the PowerSeller program DSR requirement.
How compliance with marketplace policies is calculated
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To comply, you must not violate the Shill Bidding policy. Additionally, violations of any eBay policies may result in the loss of PowerSeller status. The following limits apply:
• Bronze
4 violations in a 60-day period
• Silver/Gold 5 violations in a 60-day period
• Platinum 6 violations in a 60-day period
• Titanium 7 violations in a 60-day period
Examples of policies:
* Excessive Shipping and Handling
* Shill Bidding
* Misrepresentation of Identity - User (inc. Transaction Interception)
* Site Interference
* Accepted Payments
* Transaction Interference
* User Agreement violations that are not List Practices
