posted on May 26, 2010 05:56:50 PM new
Several weeks ago I heard or read a news report that BP was dropping advertisements until they got this oil spill under control.
Apparently, that was a half truth, or half lie. Over the last two weeks I noticed a huge bump in advertisements by ARCO, which in Oregon is BP. Their signs have the ARCO logo, but in smaller letters it says, "A BP Company (with the BP logo)."
Obviously, eBay doesn't really care... they will take money any which way they can.
posted on May 27, 2010 01:57:27 AM new
Well of course - they do it to us all the time.
Did you hear that Kevin Costner may be able to help clean this mess up. He took over an invention that separates oil from sea water. He's put $42,000,000 into it and has about 6 of these tanks ready to go to the Gulf. So I guess something good came out of Water World!!
posted on June 7, 2010 09:09:37 AM new
Kostner's machine is interesting. Looking at and how it works I kept thinking "that's just like my cream separator", and it really is. Basic old time farm tech taken large. Not new technology at all. A cream separator uses centrifugal force to get the cream (oil) to separate from the milk (water) and then ejects each substance out of separate tubes. Same thing. It's great to see these hollywood types putting their money where their mouths are.
posted on June 7, 2010 11:51:02 AM new
This week I put a sign on both of our vehicles.
Arco = BP
Boycott Arco
Yesterday I drove by an Arco station and noticed some protesters. I'm glad to see people starting to get it. Unfortunately, the alternatives aren't any better.
We just need to get off oil altogether. Had we followed Jimmy Carter's lead back in the 70's we'd all be driving alternative energy vehicles. Hindsight is 20/20.
posted on June 8, 2010 03:17:25 AM new
And eBay is at fault for.. well, what, exactly? Honoring a contract with an advertising agency or a corporation?
It's a pretty safe bet that this advertising is long term, x number of displays arrangement, and that eBay was not actively soliciting sponsors of environmental disasters.
As for BP's oil; any not used in their stations is available as part of the international commodities market - if you don't like buying it from Arco, it won't be thrown away - just sold through someone else.
So if you want a bumper sticker to have an effect, put it on your car, then don't drive it anymore. You are willing to do that, right?
posted on June 8, 2010 05:27:49 AM new
I'm sure BP would like us to dilute the responsibility for the disaster by spreading it out among all oil companies, or better yet, all car users. I'm not buying it.
posted on June 8, 2010 05:46:38 AM new
...but we are buying it.
We don't want the risk of oil, but we want to keep filling up our cars.
We don't want jobs outsourced, but we want to keep buying cheap stuff at Walmart.
We don't want undocumented immigrants, but we want .99 lettuce in the market.
We don't want online auctions setting their own rules and policies, but we wanted to take advantage of their market share.
posted on June 8, 2010 07:11:34 AM new
Yes, I'm buying it. Cost me $50 last fill up. I'm driving at a minimum to keep my fill ups down. Meanwhile, BP's profits (announced in April) were up 135% from a year ago. They aren't going to pass this on to the rest of us.
posted on June 8, 2010 08:43:44 AM new
Damari- your points fall flat. putting the blame on the consumer is absurd.
1) show me just how many alternative fuel efficient vehicles are affordable to the general public. there are none. i would be the first one in line to purchase one if i could afford it. 2 years ago I had to buy a cargo van for my business. i spent endless hours trying to find something that was efficient and cost effective. NOTHING. Do you know the options out there for a cargo van? Ford, Chevy, and Dodge/Mercedes Sprinters. Ford and Chevy are gas hogs, Sprinters are $30K+. Last year, Ford added a smaller more efficient van to their line...FINALLY!!! If you go to another country, you will find numerous options out there for fuel efficient vans. The same thing with cars. Not everyone can afford a Prius at $30K and you still have to buy gas for it. Yes, there are definitely people out there who care less, and go buy the biggest vehicle in the world to drive their kids to school and that is wrong.
2) Outsourcing and Walmart? I haven't bought a single thing at Walmart in a decade. In fact, I avoid Chinese crap like there is no tomorrow. I would rather buy something used, as 100% of our furniture in our home is used, nice but used. We have used glassware, used dishes, used lamps, etc. I believe in reusing, which is why we started the business we have. The real culprit... Corporations moving to other countries where labor costs are lower. They not only undercut American workers, but they burn fuel like no tomorrow because they move crap back and forth over the oceans. American workers are displaced, forced to take lower paying wages just to have a job, which means they can't afford to buy the few remaining quality items produced in this country. Last Christmas I bought everyone on my list something made in the USA, and in fact, made locally in the Pacific NW.
3) Lettuce? I can't disagree with the illegal immigration problem... but again, this is most often a corporate issue. Huge agri-businesses are the most common culprit of hiring illegals. The other reality is that there are farms all over the country that offer jobs to Americans... but Americans don't show up for those jobs because they don't want to bend over in the hot sun for minimum wage all day. Free trade ruined the American family farmer. Now we are left with mostly giant agri-businesses that provide pesticide grown poor quality produce and meats. Government deregulation and agri-business lobbying have ruined the safety inspection mechanisms to prevent disease and viruses from spreading.
4) Auctions- Yes, it is a fact that we use eBay's market share... however, who do you think helped build that market share??? And the profits being made now are not by improving eBay's market share, it is by squeezing more fees out of sellers... but there are tens of thousands who are leaving eBay and running their own websites... often with great success and more profits than ever imagined on eBay. Have you ever considered what would happen if sellers didn't complain about the ever evolving changes at eBay? I would guess it would be much worse than it is now.
[ edited by shagmidmod on Jun 8, 2010 08:47 AM ]
posted on June 8, 2010 08:51:34 AM new
And yes... just like eBay doesn't allow people to sell Nazi memorabilia, it can control who advertises on its website. This reminds me of celebrities who promote products by horrible companies such as Proctor and Gamble. I wonder if someone ever discussed all that is bad about these companies before they signed that contract to advertise for them.
posted on June 8, 2010 09:21:23 AM new
When I speak of "we", I of course, am speaking of a population as a whole. I am sure I could find someone with a more environmentally sensitive lifestyle than you, but I would not use that as a rebuttal.
Why do Europeans demand higher vehicle efficiency? Because their goverments tax fuel heavily. Would you care to list the politians who get elected here by promoting higher taxes on gasoline?
Yes, everybody in America shops at Walmart except Shagmidmod. Is that OK now? (Actually, I should include myself as well, since I don't shop there, but not for moral reasons).
The growers (and as we have seen, meat packers and others) use illegal labor not just for direct cost savings in labor, but for the fact that they can run roughshod over other labor and safety laws, knowing that they will not be fought by illegals.
Still, as consumers we shop primarily by price, so there is no incentive for producers to avoid these practices.
Just as your sales on eBay (or anywhere, for that matter) are market interactions, changes to their policies will be dealt with by the market. They are not however, either a government agency or a public utility, but a service you may purchase or not. Will eBay survive (even though their most heinous crime is not worshipping the "little sellers who made them the giant they are today"? Who knows. But I have been following this board probably from its earliest days, and can never remember a time when the users weren't demanding that eBay change their ways or they would take their business elsewhere. Ebay seems to still be here, however.
posted on June 8, 2010 07:45:34 PM new
Damariscotta, I agree with about 90% of your last post. We each need to immediately take responsibility for saving our planet, saving our economy (I have some concerns about stamping out illegal immigrants) but I will not give BP a pass on the totally irresponsible, illegal and morally deplorable way they handled this disaster. Bill, I disagree, this is an eBay issue. What other mega websites would accept BP sponsorship at this time? I don't want the stench of BP advertising to turn away any potential eBay buyers. The number of buyers has been reduced enough, I can't see that the ad revenue justifies the number of users who will see the ads and boycott eBay. Edited to add, I buy a few supplies online (not on eBay). If a site I buy from had a BP ad and I could buy elsewhere, I would. Unfortunately, although buyers can easily snub eBay, many sellers, like me, can't.
posted on June 9, 2010 05:43:47 AM new
I went back to see where I was defending BP; I couldn't find it. Of course I think it awful what they did (although the regulatory agencies seem to have been complicit).
My primary point - yes "moderator" - eBay related - is that as evil as many consider eBay to be, I think it is unlikely that they sought out BP post-spill to become an advertiser, and that this was likely a contracted advertising program, and eBay may have no choice. If this is proved wrong, I would be happy to stand corrected.
My other point is that a bumper sticker/boycott will probably be as effective as those against eBay. We are, for now, habituated to and dependent on fossil fuels; whether we buy directly from BP or indirectly from BP is irrelevant.
posted on June 9, 2010 07:34:01 AM new
I will not now or ever in the future buy gas from a BP or Arco gas station. I am sure they will miss my business !!
posted on June 9, 2010 07:50:35 AM new
Hey - we should boycott oil, and all products made from, and with oil. Further, we should boycott all retailers, media outlets, and internet sites, that promote oil and oil by-products. Let's start with eBay.
eBay should create a few new categories - wind powered cars in the auto section, steam powered washing machines, paper log stoves, cow dung furnaces, and various brightly colored clothes lines.
And, eBay Bikes - both new and used bikes. I wonder about PayPal holds on payment?
My wife is not yet home from work. When she comes home, I am going to suggest that she ride a bike to and from work - 30 miles each way. Of course, she will have to do so after washing the clothes by hand, and drying everything on the clothes line.
I'm not sure that I will be able to post her reply here.
posted on June 9, 2010 08:19:10 AM new
Damaris- I don't think you were defending BP, but you do heavily weigh consumers as culprits in this mess. On top of that, you insinuate that boycotts/bumper stickers are likely ineffective. This is where I disagree with you.
Believe it or not, many people in Oregon and wherever else ARCO sells gas are unaware that they are the same company. I believe a majority of Americans are quite upset at BP and as merrie, pixia, and myself state, would never buy BP gasoline again. I imagine you are likely with us on that as well.
My point in adding such signs to both of our vehicles is to educate people that these two names are the same company so that people can make that distinction themselves. I have had several people stop me and say things such as, "I never realized we had BP here in Oregon". Chump change in the grand scheme of things, but if more consumers spoke with their dollars we might be more effective overall. The reality of ARCO is that they offer cheap gas. They are generally 10-15 cents less expensive than the major brands of Shell, 76, Chevron.
BP deserves ALL of the negative backlash from this mess they created. They have billions of dollars at their disposal to advertise their way out of this PR nightmare. It is the least I can do to challenge that.
posted on June 9, 2010 09:50:53 AM newI believe a majority of Americans are quite upset at BP
Really? I don't get that sense at all.
Concerned about the mess in the Gulf, sure. But around here -- and Californians pride themselves on their extreme albeit highly irrational ecosensitivity as much as anyone -- ARCO stations are just as crowded as ever. They tend to have the lowest prices consistently. No matter what they say, people always act in what they perceive to be their best interest.
The reason why oil boycotts never work is that gas is a fungible commodity. It doesn't matter what name is on the pump. When you buy gas, you have no clue where it came from. If you boycott your local station on Wednesday, you'll buy it somewhere on Friday...until you figure out a way to "Fred Flintstone" your car.
posted on June 9, 2010 08:24:34 PM new
Since the advertising on eBay appears to have been initiated after the spill, I'm, assuming (perhaps I'm wrong) that ads were shifted from a declining site to one hungry for cash.
posted on June 10, 2010 04:30:14 AM new
The problem with these assumptions, even my own, is that we do not know the "what and when" of the advertising contract, or even if is under the direct control of eBay (an advertising agency may contract for placement, etc., then use the availability for their own clients).
In spite of what is happening in the gulf, like it or not, BP is still in the business of selling petroleum products, and until they should cease that, they will continue to pump gas, purchase advertising, hire/fire staff, buy copy machines, etc.
There is still the question of whether seeing BP advertise on eBay will affect buyer behavior (although with the comments about the lack of buyers, I don't know how it could get worse), but I think most adults in today's world realize that any connection between advertising platform and the client, at least on a moral basis, is tenuous, at best.
[ edited by Damariscotta on Jun 10, 2010 04:31 AM ]
posted on June 10, 2010 05:49:36 AM new
I understand the inclination to be angry at BP and from what I've read there safety record is atrocious and they really need some major improvement there. As a matter of fact one of my first thoughts was that I hoped that this would bankrupt them. But maybe we should all be wishing them economic success - because if they don't continue to make money, there's no way they will be able to pay for all the clean-up and restitution they pledged to pay for.
edited to add - I really haven't seen any bp adds on Ebay - but I tend to ignore all of the ads on Ebay.
[ edited by cherishedclutter on Jun 10, 2010 05:50 AM ]
posted on June 10, 2010 08:25:19 AM new
The ads for BP aren't actually BP, but ARCO... which is part of BP.
I think the issue I brought up was that BP claimed to have suspended its marketing campaigns (http://www.brandrepublic.com/BrandRepublicNews/News/1003870/BP-suspends-marketing-activity/?DCMP=EMC-DailyNewsBulletin) after the leak began, yet they really didn't. They just shifted their marketing away from the green and yellow "BP" brand to their other company, ARCO.
Not to mention, ARCO has now removed the BP logo from their site at www.arco.com. The only mention of BP is in small print at the bottom. If you go to the frequently asked questions, they tuck the info on BP all the way to the very bottom. Obviously, a total embarrassment to their brand.
Whether eBay had a contract or not, if BP was suspending these ads... then suspend them, don't lie.
posted on June 10, 2010 11:19:01 AM new
It is a terrible mess and I had difficulty even imagining the extent until I looked at this site. It is quite amazing. If you plug in your Hometown you can really see the size of the spill.
posted on June 10, 2010 11:48:32 AM new
The effects of the BP oil spill is terrible!
Because of this mess,people,animals, sea life,water, and plant life are in dire straits.
? Who knows. But I have been following this board probably from its earliest days, and can never remember a time when the users weren't demanding that eBay change their ways or they would take their business elsewhere. Ebay seems to still be here, however. 
