"According to media reports Clonaid is set to announce on Friday afternoon that it cloned a baby girl who was born healthy."
"She said that the company would eventually allow independent scientists to check the baby's cells to verify that she was a true clone."
. . . and so it begins!
Identical Clones have only a couple of purposes:
1) to breed a new super-race
2) spare parts
3) a replacement body for the Super-Rich
Oh, sure! At first, it'll be a "person". But then, when they discover a way to destroy the mind of a clone during fetal development so that what is born is barely alive and can be classed as "not a person" but "a connected group of organically grown human replacement parts", that's when Evil really will have outgrown itself.
I can agree with making a superiour baby; one that does not have the genetic flaws that every family suffers from and inadvertantly passes onto the next generation. For instance, a hemophylliac can have normal children that are both born without the disease and without the damaged genes for the disease. I'm all for that sort of genetic cloning/engineering.
Now that the announcement has been made and the ice will have been broken (Pandora's Box opened!) it won't be too much longer until Bush will be trying to get American companies allowed to make their own clones.
Question: If Naturally Born Human Americans no longer have any Constitutional Rights, what Rights will company-created and owned clones have?
posted on December 27, 2002 08:38:03 AM new
Identical Clones have only a couple of purposes:
1) to breed a new super-race
2) spare parts
3) a replacement body for the Super-Rich
Oh come on....The overriding issue for people is still the will to have children. They are more interested in most cases in building their egos by having an identical child to themselves or a child that they lost to disease or accident and want to undo the loss.
When the real nut cases start having kids that have pit-bull genes, gills, or some such nonsense mixed in the "problem" of normal human clones will fade to insignificance.
posted on December 27, 2002 10:37:09 AM new
From New York Times....
Unbelievable.
Raëlians are followers of Raël, a French-born former race-car driver who has said he met a 4-foot space alien atop a volcano in southern France in 1973 and went aboard his ship, where he was entertained by voluptuous female robots and learned that the first humans were created 25,000 years ago by space travelers called Elohim, who cloned themselves.
Raëlians consider cloning an opportunity to meld religion and science and say they have 55,000 members. They have never named the scientists doing their work, where it is done or how it is paid for. In 1998, Dr. Boisselier announced that the group had signed up "about 100" clients who would have to pay $200,000 each to be cloned, and the group later said a couple who lost a 10-month-old child in 2000 had offered a large amount of money to resurrect their child's genes from saved tissue
posted on December 27, 2002 03:55:17 PM new
The article I read in the Palo Alto Times (similar to Helen's quote above) pointed out that in animal cloning, 98% of clones have severe birth defects/abnormalities. God knows how many freaks and "rejects" the Raelians discarded in order to produce a half-dozen viable human clones.
I agree with Borillar in that genetic engineering to remove defects is good science. But then, of course, "desirable" traits will be added and suddenly you are faced with a "superman scenario."
I imagine that there will be a revival of the "right to life" issue (with respect to organ farming), which will eventually be overruled by the interests of the scientific community. (IOW, money.) There is no longer such a thing as "pure science." Science is entirely devoted to the pursuit of monetary gain.
posted on December 27, 2002 06:04:07 PM new
According to a scientist (I think he was German in case anyone else saw him) on The Nature of Things, he says that human clones would only live for about 30 years max. I didn't understand a lot of what he said, but it was something like the DNA that's used has incomplete protein or something. His point was that it would become a mess if pursued.
posted on December 28, 2002 09:19:47 PM new
I just saw the leader on TV tonite... why do these alien encounter groups tend to have leaders that dress like they're from a cheap 1960's sci-fi movie?
posted on December 28, 2002 10:39:16 PM new Or an updated version might read... "there's an alien leader that goes for cheap polyester outfits born every minute".
[ edited by kraftdinner on Dec 28, 2002 10:43 PM ]
posted on December 29, 2002 05:32:01 AM new
They dress that way because stupid people tend to give their money to people that dress that way. That and televangelists.
He is now a multi-millionaire whereas he was a struggling part time reporter before his cult started.
If you ever read his books there is a distinct "LOGAN'S RUN". They even had a picture and endorsement by Michael York on the back of one of their books!
They are loonies, but very smart and rich ones now.
I believe they were charging between 50-200K per cloning client.
They take advantage of people. Like car salesemen!
posted on December 29, 2002 07:08:29 AM new
Now, the leader of this group is looking forward to a clone with a rapid growth feature so that he can produce an instant adult, along with the ability to download brains. LOL!
I hope that this negative publicity does not slow the goal of good scientists to cure disease by cloning stem cells.
posted on December 29, 2002 11:40:46 AM new
LoL canvid!!! If Jerry Falwell would dress up in one of those suits maybe people would understand where he's coming from a bit better.
"Paris, January 3: The head of the company claiming to have created the world's first cloned human told French television that a second cloned baby would be born somewhere in Europe in the next few days."
"Interviewed on France-2, Brigitte Boisselier on Thursday said that the child would be born "in Europe before Sunday." She declined to name the country."
posted on January 3, 2003 12:29:12 AM new
Kady, from that link that you provided, it doesn't insinuate that at all.
"Clonaid has refused to identify the parents or offer any proof that the child — nicknamed "Eve" — is a clone. But the company had promised DNA tests to confirm their claim by the end of this week."
"Boisselier told France-2 the parents were reconsidering whether to submit to testing because of legal action taken in Florida that could result in the cloned child being taken away from them."
"Earlier this week, a court in Florida was asked to turn the baby over to state care if it found the baby's health was in danger. Though Clonaid has kept secret the baby's whereabouts, the company held its news conference to announce the clone's birth in Florida, which could give the court jurisdiction, argued lawyer Bernard F. Siegel."
I'd concider that a good reason to deny anyone a chance to snatch the baby away. Maybe after the child has been moved to aa more friendly country, then scientists can get all of the DNA proof that they require. Certainly, under those conditions, they are more than willing to prove their claims.
posted on January 3, 2003 09:10:42 AM newCertainly, under those conditions, they are more than willing to prove their claims.
If past history plays out, you'll be waiting a long time for any "proof". This is a publicity stunt to raise cash for a nutty cult. They've had plenty of time to "prove" their claims, yet continue to be "unable" to do so. We will never see the proof from Clonaid.
posted on January 3, 2003 11:11:39 AM new
That's always possible.
But, if they don't, they'll be railed at throughout the world as complete frauds. Countries will not allow them to operate within their national boarders, like they do for other cults like the Rahjneesh who proved just as unreliable.
posted on January 3, 2003 03:41:18 PM newBut, if they don't, they'll be railed at throughout the world as complete frauds. Countries will not allow them to operate within their national boarders, like they do for other cults like the Rahjneesh who proved just as unreliable.
That should backfire, wouldn't you think?
Unfortunately, it will make them even more credible in today's idiotic society. The lack of "disproof" is much more believeable to a mass society than scientific fact....
It is like the analogy of the invisible floating dragon. If you can't see it, feel it, taste it or smell it, it can't be disproved. Therefore it must exist....
.................................................
We call them our heroes...but we pay them like chumps
[ edited by mlecher on Jan 3, 2003 03:42 PM ]
posted on January 6, 2003 03:38:20 PM new
Well, it looks like the "cloned" baby is being outted as a hoax.
The science journalist who organized a team to evaluate claims of the birth of the first human clone has suspended his review and now says the announcement by Clonaid, a company tied to an unconventional religious sect, could be "part of an elaborate hoax."
Guillen said he made it "very clear" to Dr. Brigitte Boisselier, the head of Clonaid, that he would accept the offer only if there were no strings attached and that the actual testing was performed by unbiased DNA specialists.
So much for the "no strings" promise. http://www.cnn.com/2003/HEALTH/01/06/cloning.scientist/index.html
