posted on August 30, 2000 07:57:23 PM new
Hello. No, I don't listen to Art Bell. I am personally involved and was personally involved in remote viewing.
Do you mean Courtney Brown?
Courtney Brown of course received training from Dames, supposedly in a week or so. This is something which Dames now hotly denies. In my experience, I never knew anyone within or outside of the unit that was trained in less than 12-18 months. So, I don't think Brown's claims are very realistic.
I think they were both very excited by their exposure to remote viewing, as well as by some of the possibilities they think it could be used for. But the whole issue is a lot more complicated than that. Especially more complicated than the way they are presenting it. This can be very misleading to the public.
posted on August 30, 2000 08:01:07 PM new
Nope, meant Sylvia Browne.
Now, is this Courtney Brown the one who claims to have been harrased by Dames? (it's been awhile since I kept up with all that, so am trying to remember).
posted on August 30, 2000 08:26:39 PM new
Using psychics, at least in the eyes of the majority of the public, one has to look at the "giggle factor." It is an angle constantly played up by the media. Quite frankly, no one wants to hear what science might have to say about it, or what in reality actually happened. Certainly the people at the top of most of these agencies don't want to be viewed as "crazy." While they may support this stuff from the shadows, they wouldn't be caught dead standing next to the psychic that supported them. Regardless of authenticity, percentages of accuracy (however small or large), sticking by the program just isn't "politically savvy." Too much risk.
As regards some of these agencies (especially dependent on what else might be going on that's important to Congress), the may play one requirement off on another, just to display their power with Congress, and keep what they want or are in fear of loosing. Politics as its usual.
STARGATE was an easy target. Everybody makes out, but the STARGATE Program. Of course, there is one other possibility. Presume for a second that this psychic collection of information works even poorly to moderately well. This creates a real problem for us. In the past twenty-five years, no one has developed a real defense against it.
This is kind of scary, especially to people like me, Intelligence Officers. It means all our secrets are vulnerable. There are essentially none that can't be looked at. So what do you do if you can't really defend against this stuff, and if you are politically vulnerable using it. I would ridicule it, deface it, produce huge amounts of disinformation about it, in the hopes that people would just forget about it over time.
I think this position is unconscionable. If a vulnerability to our defense has been uncovered, then we need to address it. I believe there are defenses to RV but we just haven't learned enough to use them. Not pursuing a defense is like burying one's head in the sand and hoping for the best. It defrauds the American people.
posted on August 30, 2000 08:59:11 PM new
You have only to spend a single night reading the stuff on internet to see that the remote viewing field is filling up rapidly with some pretty radical elements. Many obviously feel there is a lot of money to be made in this area, and this has brought out the wheelers and dealers.
posted on August 31, 2000 11:56:30 AM new
Spaz: About what exactly? About remote viewing or about the poster?
Remote viewing is actually very interesting. I have always been amazed at the possibilities of expanding the mind. My guess is that most of the people involved are a bit loony, but one never knows.
As for the poster, I think you know where I stand on that.
Remote viewing is supposed to be a form of psychic ability that depending on who you talk to is innate in all humans and can be developed through training, or limited to certain individuals with strong psychic powers.
In any case, these psychics are supposed to be able to see in their minds images of faraway places that they have never been to before and can describe these places in varying degrees of detail.
Ted Serios, the remote viewer I mentioned, was supposed to be able to not only retrieve psychic images of faraway places, but then redirect that image onto photographic film. Some comparisons of the photographic images created by Serios bore some slight resemblance to actual photographs of the places he "remote viewed."
The military/intelligence community became very interested in this "remote viewing" because they thought that if it really worked, it could give them an edge. The idea: get a team of remote viewers to focus on foreign military installations, then give our military forces details, maps, etc. of those installations. The CIA or the Pentagon actually sponsored a program along these lines but it went belly up after two years.
Cheyenne,
Remote viewing, gypsies ... ever read the Necroscope series by Brian Lumley?
posted on August 31, 2000 01:43:26 PM new
I'm not a big fan of Sci-Fi, especially episodic works that move through 5 or 6 volumes. I think Brian Lumley is up to number six in that series?
I am familiar with the content of his works, vmapires, gypsies, mind control and the like. I have not read him.
posted on August 31, 2000 02:51:08 PM new
Question: Since you guys seems to follow this better than I.....
Has the question of 'seeing what you want to see' ever been addressed? What I mean is, I would guess that our preconseptions (hopes) of what a place or person would be like must, on some level, shape how we 'see' the event/person in our minds. So, how do you seperate what is and what we expect to be?
posted on August 31, 2000 02:54:56 PM new
Recently I was told by a friend who shares my interest in topics like these that Sylvia Browne was effectively debunked and exposed as a fraud on Dateline a few months ago.
I didn't see the report myself, and my attempts to find a reference to it on the Dateline site have been futile. Could be my friend confused Dateline with 20/20 or some other news magazine program. I just don't know.
I really would like to see it, though. Supposedly the reporters contacted some of the police departments that Sylvia has allegedly assisted and they said they never heard of her.
posted on August 31, 2000 03:02:14 PM new
Spaz: I believe your friend is confused. Dateline did do a story on a male psychic, although I don't know how much debunking was done.
