posted on June 7, 2002 11:16:24 AM new
I think the aura and thrill of beta testing online auctions has worn off quite a bit. There were so many new auctions in the last year that beta tested that you may have a slight problem finding volunteers.
Good luck with auctionpie.
posted on June 7, 2002 11:19:32 AM new
If it has a bulk loading facality might do that or if it has Auction Tamer support would be there for sure then.
posted on June 7, 2002 04:18:56 PM new
Good luck on your new site. I hope it does well for you.
You may want to re-think this subscription thing however. I will not pay just to belong. I will pay for FVF's. I have no problem with that. If I am successful, them we all should get paid. If I am not successfull, then no one gets paid. That is the way it should be. And all auctions need to start at a minimum of $2.00. That would keep most of the junk out as well.
If you rethink this subscription thing, I am there. If not, I won't.
JMHO
posted on June 7, 2002 05:02:42 PM new
I missed the subscription part. I agree with caffeitalia that that is a bad idea. BV got away with that ploy because most sellers had invested a lot of time and effort in posting their auctions and telling former buyers and BV just 'sprung' it on them one day. A new site will have a tough time getting sellers to pay it without proven results.
The $2 minimum is a good idea too.
What'd I'd really love to see in a new online auction site is the banning of the hated 'reserve' auctions and playing up that fact. The site may lose a few sellers but it would make a lot of bidders very happy to see the 'trick' auctions not on the site. Many new bidders must really get turned off to the online auction expierence by the 1 cent starting bids with the tiny notation that says 'reserve auction'. They should have never allowed those stupid auctions on any site in the first place. At live auctions a second bid means that item must be sold at auction at it would never be popular to have any kind of reserve auction there, so why was it ever allowed at online auctions?
posted on June 7, 2002 06:07:50 PM new
yup I agree I have been running and promoting a site that offer 100% fee free selling and buying in hopes of getting some interest for nearly 12 month now and only one registered user who bid on and won one Item I had listed.
very hard to find users who want to belong to anything new on the internet today even for free or even if you offer to pay them how will you interest people already selling at online auction in a new subcription unproven auction service at this.
Look even a site like carnaby that came out of the gate as a great looking well organized auction site can't get attention it requires at this point.
posted on June 7, 2002 07:40:43 PM new
Well let me clarify a few things.
The subscription fee is only for sellers at this time.
It works out to almost 2 cents per listing which is pretty much near free! As a matter of fact, if we reach the 1000 subscriber base before the end of the year we will roll back the fees!
For any site to survive and grow you need funding. Stable funding.
The days of .com IPO's and oodles of cash are over.
And Auctionpie will never go public anyway.
Auctionpie is seller owned, operated, driven, and hopefully supported.
As a seller I spend almost $1000.00 per month on fees to Ebay and other sites. I don't know about you but I'd rather pay $24.95 than that.
For any site to work it has to advertise. Advertising costs money. And to succeed we need regular advertising in many places. We need to support out seller base if we want it to support us.
If you see our Banner at the top of this screen it is because we paid for it.
There's Ebay and then the Free sites. There are very few options in between and none that offer not only Auctionpie's low fee base but it's versatility.
You can have links to all your auctions on all of your other sites in addition to your website.
By going with a subscription fee your business isn't our business. And that's really good for sellers. We don't need to control how you sell and to whom? We don't need to stop you from off site sales. We also don't need your nickel for Buy it Now. We don't need your Gallery fee or any such fee. One fee, no hassles. No long term contracts. You can sell via Auction or Fixed price. Freedom!
There are many systems and no matter whether we went with a free system or a fee based one there would be some who like it and some who don't.
Why not sign up as a beta tester and see if you like it?
There are no fees. We don't sell or exchange any info in any fashion and never will. And if you finish the process you get a free one month subscription.
Auctionpie is a process. There are many sites out there that are deserving of seller support. We want to see them supported as the people that have built them up have worked very hard.
Auctionpie isn't out to steal their business or compete against them.
We want a safe and stable seller base where people can build their businesses without worrying about becoming some company's "Clutter."
posted on June 7, 2002 07:56:28 PM newcanvid13The subscription fee is only for sellers at this time.
I can understand a fee for sellers, but if that statement means your even remotely thinking of placing a fee at anytime in the future even for buyers then I'm 99.9% sure that would be disasterous. Forgive me if I'm reading things that you aren't saying.
I don't think you'll even be able to charge sellers for awhile honestly. The site will have to running and working before I'd be willing to 'buy a booth' so to speak.
posted on June 7, 2002 08:29:26 PM new
canvid13,
As I appreciate that you may spend nearly $1,000 per month in fees, but I personally only spend roughly $40 - 50 per month combined with all of the sites I am involved in. (Ebay, Yahoo, Amazon, Epier ect) Maybe someday, I may list more, but at $24.95 per month, just to be a seller with no guarantee of sales will not make me leave ebay. In fact, it will reinforce me to stay there. I don't mean to sound negative here, but only ebay is big enough to charge fees of that magnitude and still be called reasonable. Even Yahoo's fees are priced for the market they represent. I could list every item I have on Yahoo with relists and still be at or less then $24.95. No one disagrees that web sites need revenue. As I stated in my previous post, the way to do it is with FVF's. With FVF's, it is a win-win situation. When we get paid, you get paid and all is good. The problem with a subscription is a win-lose-lose. At first you win with money coming in with subscriptions. As a seller, I only win if I get a sale. If no sales, I still have to pay the subscription. (I lose). In the long run I cancel the subscription because of low sales. (You lose). The reality in third tier sites is sales tend to come bi-weekly or even monthly. Usually not enough to justify the subscription. Most of the people listing at third tier sites still want their items in the public view with the hopes that they can sell something occasionally. Change the fee structure and I will list everything I have on your site. Again, I gladly pay FVF's. (win-win) But I will not do the (win-lose-lose){Bidville}again.
Good luck whatever you do.
[ edited by caffeitalia on Jun 7, 2002 08:45 PM ]
posted on June 7, 2002 09:03:28 PM new
We will never charge buyers to be buyers. If we at some point have something to offer buyers that would benefit them they would have the "Option" to join. We would never arbitrarily do anything to buyers or sellers without a major consensus. Auctionpie is here to listen and work with sellers, not inflict policies upon them.
Caffeitalia: Every company isn't for every person. You can check out our site one day and if you see something you like you're always invited to join! Best of luck with your sales. There's room for sellers of all types in this industry.
posted on June 7, 2002 09:28:45 PM new
Now there is a canned response that doesn't answer the issue at hand. No one ever said anything about charging buyers. Only how the sellers will be charged.
[ edited by caffeitalia on Jun 7, 2002 09:36 PM ]
posted on June 7, 2002 11:25:52 PM new
You're site is 100% dead in the water if you believe any seller will pay to subscribe to an unknown site. There are far too many other sites out there that are modestly successful and growing at a respectable pace. SellYourItem.com comes to mind. Those sites are your competition, not eBay or Yahoo. Comparing eBay to any tiny third tier site is like comparing New York City to a three hut village in deepest Africa. There is absolutely is no comparison. eBay can charge sellers $1,000 per month in fees for one reason, results. To ever hope for anything major out of a foundling site is pure delusion and to try to charge sellers $25/month is even more delusional.
It works out to almost 2 cents per listing which is pretty much near free! As a matter of fact, if we reach the 1000 subscriber base before the end of the year we will roll back the fees!
If any of the established small sites were to try to charge 2 cents per listing they would die an instant death. And they are established.
I admire your choice to follow your dream but think your choice of tactics to achieve that dream are all wrong. JMHO.
SYI is not our competition. Sheila runs a super site. There are others also that are really good.
Auctionpie is not about competing with sites like these. It's about having a stable and safe place for smaller sellers to build their businesses from. Sites come and go, change their terms of service and this can really effect a small business.
With Auctionpie sellers can list on a multitude of sites yet still have the ability have a central hub. They can link all of their auction sites and website.
I list on one site that has a lot of outages. It works great when it works but when it's down I have ZERO revenue. A good alternative is a good thing.
Strange you can come up with so decisive an opinion without having seen our site in action? There are many types of sellers. You can't please all of them all of the time.
I think sell through will dictate our success and sell through takes advertising and marketing and that takes money. If you want to sell you have to pay.
Sometimes it's not what you do but how you do it that counts. We are not trying to build another Ebay, but a different type of site.
I respect anyone's opinion but there are many ways to build a business.
I think the Auctionpie model will be very strong for sellers, especially once they try it.
posted on June 8, 2002 07:22:16 AM new
Okay, I went to the one page that is the clickable banner. Then all that Auctionpie is the the resurfacing of the failed seller co-op?
If the co-op could never fly what makes you think this latest reincarnation of it will? It's time to give up on the co-op idea. It sounds great in theory but will never work in application ( just like the United Nations is a great idea that barely works ).
It's time to go on to something else Jamie. Perhaps the coming dismal failure of auctionpie to attract sellers will help you realise that the co-op concept was never meant to be. A google search of your name reveals a brillant mind but your current efforts at this selling concept is a waste of time or an idea whose time has not arrived or has passed by already.
posted on June 8, 2002 08:21:33 AM newI think sell through will dictate our success and sell through takes advertising and marketing and that takes money. If you want to sell you have to pay. Sometimes it's not what you do but how you do it that counts.
canvid13
Did you listen to what you wrote? I never said that you didn't deserve to get paid. It is just the manner in which you think you will get paid. The way you have it set up now, you will have a hard time finding anyone willing to risk that amount of money on a site that will have a very low sell through rate. And if for some reason you do get a good sell through rate, (which I hope you can do) your revenues from FVF's would be much better than charging a subscription anyway. And the seller would also have less risk involved. (Win-win)
posted on June 8, 2002 08:51:56 AM new
Bids and CI;
Um, I'm not trying to win a point with you folks.
I have read and respected your opinions. I don't necessarily think you're correct though about Auctionpie (or all this time and money wouldn't have been spent!)and our response to date doesn't support your opinions either.
Again, I invite you to drop by when the site is live. Some folks will join sooner, some later, and some never. Nothing wrong with that.
CI: I understood what you wrote, but I did stress STABLE income is necessary for a site to grow quickly enough to keep sellers happy. Of course if sellers don't get results they won't pay $24.95 anymore than $2.95!
But they get frustrated about paying ZERO dollars on some sites too for no results and there are many that are frustrated with getting sales, but paying large fees and being restricted when not being called clutter!
Just my opinion of course.
Hi Bids,
Thanks for the kind words but Auctionpie is the evolution of the ideas from the co-op. It's not beating a dead horse in anyway.
I don't think any seller is against what Auctionpie is striving to become. The trick is going to be to make it happen the way we'd like it too.
PS! If you're interested I'd like to do an experiment with both of you. Simply email me what you sell and where and I'll send you back some surprising numbers.
posted on June 8, 2002 01:11:22 PM new
I guess the only way for you to see if your concept will work is to try it out. I hope it works better than the co-op idea did.
Good luck
posted on June 8, 2002 01:55:36 PM new
Good luck to ya you are a long way off.
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posted on June 8, 2002 10:27:53 PM new
I always get ignored with this.
If it has a bulk loading facality might do that or if it has Auction Tamer support would be there for sure then.
I pay as many eBay fees as you and I pay Yahoo fees. A couple free months to try something out and maybe investing in a couple months is no big deal. You know how much/long it would take to move my auctions to your site? Too darn long unless you have a better way than the old one at a time.
Yes, a bulk loader is in the works as is photo uploading.
Right now if you are a beta tester and complete the process you get a free one month subscription.
Also, there will be special subscription offers for the opening push and really special deals for Charter Members. (Charter Memberships are limited to 100 for the first year as there are voting rights involved.)
posted on June 10, 2002 06:17:55 AM new
Hi Jamie ...
First of all, best of luck on your newest venture.
Secondly, can you post the Beta testing details here rather than asking us to send you an email? The reason I am asking is, of course, the proliferation of email gathering schemes that result in a ton of new SPAM appearing in my personal mailbox has turned me off all of these "email me for info" things.
At least post the details on your front page along with your personal history
posted on June 10, 2002 01:00:52 PM new
Thanks RB.
We don't spam. We don't share your info with anyone or company in any fashion. There will also be no pop up ads on our site either.
The Beta testing is free. We'd like 300 beta testers. These would be sellers of different catagories of items and even a few bidders.
All a person needs to do is email us their Ebay (or other primary site handle) If we accept you as a Beta we send you a Non-Disclosure agreement related to the actual beta testing.
There are no fees and anyone that completes the process gets a few one month subscription.
All Beta testing will entail is filling out some questionaires about the site and doing some listing and bidding.
posted on June 15, 2002 08:19:46 PM new
Hey Canvid,
Although we don't agree upon how you should go about getting revenue, I must at least compliment you upon your advertising. Everytime I come to this forum, I see your ad for auctionpie.com. At this point you have done more advertising than bidville, auctiondiner, CYI and many other third tier sites. Personally I still cannot justify the membership fees, but at least you are doing something that most people on these and other boards say needs to be done. Advertise. Have you tried the Krause publication?
http://superseller.krause.com
e-mail
[email protected]
Good luck
Yes, we will be in Krause soon and we were covered in the latest Tagnotes.
We will be spending a minimum of 25% of our revenues after site costs on Advertising and Marketing as we feel this is why we are charging fees!
An alternative to Ebay will not be built overnight, but it won't be built without bringing in bidders and it's hard to bring someone in if they've never heard of you!
posted on June 15, 2002 09:13:15 PM new
I've been watching this thing play out for more than a year and the only thing I see is a page with a couple of banners on the top.
What ever happened to the message board?
If nobody is willing to pay the $25 per month membership fee, the site will go nowhere. Even if some do pay the membership fee how long are they going to keep paying. No matter how much advertising you do it is going to take time (at least a year) to build any kind of following. How many people are going to be that patient while forking out $25 per month?
Now if your site was built on a pay for performance basis (FVFs) a lot more sellers would think about it. Starting out with a membership fee is like putting the cart in front of the horse.
posted on June 16, 2002 04:18:57 AM new
Hi Feisty,
Hmmm, perhaps you could think about your post for a few minutes.
Sellers IMO (and a few others) are fed up with fees. They are tired of listing fees, FVF's, BIN, BOLD, FEATURED, etc.
There are many sites out there trying to emulate ebay by being fee driven.
Because of their sell through or lack there of they can't charge the same as ebay.
It's hard to build those sites without revenue. Eventually most free sites either go under or have to start some sort of scheme to bring in revenue.
These fees actually increase the costs, especially if a seller is succesful and I believe that online Auction and fixed price sites are actually about selling!
It's important to have marketing and advertising. It's important to have support of the site. These things cost money and they require a stable site.
If sellers truly want a low cost alternative this is their opportunity to support one.
Nothing is for free in this world that is any good except Air and Water and I'm not so sure that those things are even free anymore!
People don't like change, especially when it's not positive.
Our goal is not to have a site with low sell through.
Sure this is going to be a difficult project and in this marketplace hard to establish, but I think Auctionpie will offer an actual different product than the ones that exist and one that is attractive to a lot of sellers.
Maybe not to you or bids but we have had an awful lot of emails come in and most have been quite positive.
Sure there will be some sellers that come and some that leave, but that is the case with all sites including Ebay.
Our subscription fee is less than a table at most flea Markets and is good for a whole month.
For that you get world wide advertising and place for you not only to show your goods but also all the other sites that you sell from as well as your own website.
)and our response to date doesn't support your opinions either.
