As usual, please direct praise, comments and criticisms my way.
X.com's consumer fraud protection policies as defined below are designed to reduce fraud by encouraging payments between Verified Users ("Verified Users" or "Verified User" of the Service and to increase the security of online transactions in our payments network. A Verified User is a registered user of the Service who has added and confirmed a bank account on the X.com website, thereby providing X.com with proof that he or she holds ownership of an account at a bank or other financial institution. X.com considers this verification process a secure and easy way to gain additional proof of a User’s identity without asking for additional pieces of personal information during the registration process. This process, in conjunction with our other proprietary authentication methods, lowers our company's financial risk and allows us to provide the Buyer and Seller Protection Guarantees listed below.
Buyer Protection Guarantee. Purchases from Sellers who are Verified Users will be guaranteed against fraud up to $5,000 per Buyer per year if the Seller fails to deliver the paid-for goods. This policy does not apply to disputes about the quality or attributes of delivered goods. The Seller's verification status is available on the Service website when a Buyer confirms payment.
Although this Guarantee only protects purchases from Verified sellers, all sellers – both Verified and Unverified – should be aware that they are liable for non-shipment of goods. Non-shipment of goods may constitute a criminal violation, and X.com will cooperate with law enforcement agencies to apprehend and prosecute offenders.
Buyers who do not receive their merchandise must make several documented attempts to contact the Seller and resolve the dispute on their own before filing a claim with X.com.
Claims of non-receipt of goods may be filed with X.com no sooner than 30 days and no later than 60 days from the date of payment or from the promised delivery date if the Seller indicates such date will be in excess of 30 days from the date of payment. Buyers may file claims via email by using the Web Forms on the Contact Us page of the website. Claims must include 1) your name and primary email address; 2) a description of the items that were purchased; 3) the email address of the Verified User to which the payment was made; 4) the timeline of events since the payment in question was made: a) date of payment, b) amount of payment, c) details of communication or correspondence between Sender and Recipient of the payment. X.com or its agents will investigate claims and X.com's determination shall be binding on all parties. X.com may require the Seller to provide proof of shipment, or a refund, in order to resolve the complaint. X.com seeks to provide full reimbursement up to $5,000 per year to defrauded Buyers within 30 days from the date the claim is filed, though such time frame may be extended to accommodate the investigation.
Both Verified and Unverified buyers are protected under the Buyer Protection Guarantee, and are protected for all methods of payment – credit card, bank account, or existing funds – available through the Service. The Buyer Protection Guarantee is effective as of 8/1/00, and applies to transactions paid on or after 8/1/00. The Buyer Protection Guarantee does not obviate any other consumer rights Users may have, including charge back rights that may be granted by the User’s credit card issuer.
Seller Protection Guarantee. Beginning August 23, 2000, X.com agrees to indemnify sellers for charge back liability resulting from buyer’s fraudulent use of a stolen credit card and/or false claims of non-shipment of goods for purchases made through the Service for up to $5,000 per year when the following conditions are met:
a) The seller is Verified;
b) The seller can provide reasonable proof-of-delivery which can be tracked online. (Most U.S. carrier companies offer this service, including the U.S. Postal Service.)
c) The seller accepted payment from only one PayPal account for the purchase. (Multiple payments from different accounts for a single item are a fraud indicator. Sellers should not accept such payments.);
d) The seller does not ship internationally (when X.com releases international payments (coming soon), this rule will be replaced with a list of approved countries).
In the near future X.com will provide tools for sellers to determine if a buyer is Verified and whether the buyer’s requested shipping address matches buyer’s credit card billing address. When these tools are available and notice has been given, sellers will be required to ship the purchases of Unverified buyers to the buyer’s credit card billing address in order to qualify for protection under the Seller Protection Guarantee. If the buyer is Verified, sellers will be able to ship to any address and qualify for protection under the Guarantee.
Charge Backs. The Buyer Protection Guarantee does not obviate any other consumer rights Users may have, including charge back rights that may be granted by the User's credit card issuer. X.com fully stands behind all credit card transactions by accepting disputes customers lodge with their issuing bank. The consumer is fully protected and as the merchant of record we accept final responsibility for all card transactions. As such, we afford customers all the rights and privileges expected of a credit card transaction. You acknowledge that X.com does not control the outcome of any charge back decision initiated through a customer’s credit card issuing bank.
X.com encourages all buyer purchase disputes to be filed and resolved through the Service's dispute resolution process, and reserves the right to restrict future account access or functionality of buyers who file charge back complaints outside the Service. If a charge back claim is initiated, whether as a result of a dispute or for any other reason, the parties agree to provide to any requesting party on a timely basis any and all necessary documentation to resolve any charge back or dispute. X.com DOES NOT act as the agent of either party in any transaction or resulting dispute, though X.com does control the outcome of disputes initiated through the Service’s dispute resolution process.
In the event a charge back dispute is resolved against you, and you qualify for the Seller Protection Guarantee, X.com will indemnify you for the charge back amount up to $5,000 per year. In the event a charge back dispute is resolved against you and you do not qualify for the Seller Protection Guarantee, you agree to hold X.com harmless for the charge back amount and to reimburse X.com from either your PayPal account or by other means. Although X.com will vigorously pursue debt collection of any amounts owed to it, X.com will never make electronic transfers from your bank account without your explicit permission.
II. Fraud Protection FAQ
What is the Seller Protection Guarantee?
Starting August 23, 2000, Verified Sellers will not be held liable for charge backs due to fraud (including payments made by stolen credit cards and false claims of non-shipment) when they 1) can provide reasonable proof of shipment, 2) do not accept payment for a single purchase from different PayPal accounts, and 3) do not ship internationally until X.com releases international payments (coming soon) and a list of approved countries. Please review the Consumer Protections section of our Terms of Use for details on our current and future plans for this guarantee.
What does it mean if a Seller or Buyer is Verified or Unverified?
A Verified Member is one who has added and confirmed a bank account on our site. This verification process is a secure and easy way for X.com to gain additional proof of a User’s identity in conjunction with our own authentication methods, and increases the security of our payments network for everyone. An Unverified Member is one who has not completed the bank account verification process. If you have not yet done so, click here to complete the process and obtain verified status.
Seller Protection Guarantee
X.com also wants to protect our sellers against fraud. As you know, we have never imposed charge backs due to fraud on sellers. This is our Seller Protection Guarantee and we plan to continue this policy. However, in order for us to absorb this major source of risk and expense, we need our sellers to play by a few simple rules. Here they are:
- Starting on August 23, 2000, sellers must be Verified [link to apprpriate FAQ above]in order to qualify for the Seller Protection Guarantee.
- Please retain reasonable proof-of-delivery from a service that can be tracked online. Most carriers provide this service.
- Please do not accept payment for a single purchase from multiple PayPal accounts.
- Please do not ship internationally until X.com releases international payments (coming soon) and a list of approved countries.
As long as you abide by these rules, X.com guarantees that you will always be protected against charge backs due to fraud.
The Buyer Protection Guarantee is effective as of August 1, 2000. This Seller Protection Guarantee is effective as of August 23, 2000. Both guarantees apply to transactions paid through the PayPal system on or after August 1, 2000. Buyers and Sellers are protected up to $5000 per year against fraudulent transactions. Please review the Fraud Protection FAQ or the PayPal Terms of Use to learn more.
posted on August 22, 2000 01:02:05 PM newd) The seller does not ship internationally (when X.com releases international payments (coming soon), this rule will be replaced with a list of approved countries).
I do hope this refers only to transactions conducted through PayPal, and not the entirety of my business!!!! If not, I'm already ineligible for protection, because I sold $13 worth of costume jewelry to a customer in Germany who paid cash, and I do offer shipping to Canada!
posted on August 22, 2000 02:23:11 PM new
Hi Damon,
I've jumped to this thread, and believe that reddeer brought up a good issue.
As sellers we have been struggling with finding the lowest cost of shipping for our buyers--and to increase bids. All buyers want the lowest possible shipping option.
It costs money to ship an item with Proof-of-delivery that is trackable. Even USPS CD adds .35 to a priority package, and .60 to parcel post! The buyers are going to croak!!
posted on August 22, 2000 02:37:53 PM new
HI Missmadi,
I can see that issue, but at the same time buyers and sellers are looking for protection when they use our service. The only way to provide these mechanisms while keeping costs low for us and our users, is to employ these measures.
As an Ebay and auction user, in addition to my work on these forums, most transactions occur without a hitch. The issues that are being addressed are worst possible scenarios and they are getting additional clarification. Whenever a policy change occurs there are questions that bring about further refinement. Most of the issues we are running into here are being addressed, something that appears to be lost in the discussion pieces.
posted on August 22, 2000 04:08:35 PM new
"The seller can provide reasonable proof-of-delivery which can be tracked online. (Most U.S. carrier companies offer this service, including the U.S. Postal Service.)"
Technically, this would rule out Delivery Confirmation as it only proves that the mailman claims to have delivered the package somewhere in a specified zip code...and then only in the event that he actually scans it. Also, DC cannot be "tracked", only confirmed. I guess it also means that insuring it is also not enough as it cannot be "tracked online". It also rules out the stamps.com and U-pic issues previously discussed. In fact...the only USPS option that provides what is actually required is Express Mail...and just about rules out international mail completely as International Express Mail is outrageously expensive and the only way to provide "reasonable proof of delivery" on international shipments. The buyers are really gonna like that.
posted on August 22, 2000 04:41:32 PM new
I am still waiting (patiently ) for the answers I have already asked on the "other thread" about this. Thought I would come over here and see if the answers had arrived yet. While I'm waiting:
I was told recently at my local PO that very shortly (already available in some areas) any package that is insured for over $50.00 which gets the BLUE FORM with the numbers will be trackable via the USPS site. The numbers will be scanned in at drop off and then when it gets where it's going and is signed for (which the BLUE FORM requires), the signature will also be scanned. If a problem pops up, you will be able to request a copy of the signature card showing exactly who signed for the item. If you insure for under $50 and use the GREEN FORM your out of luck. They aren't scanned and don't require a signature and are often "left on the steps", which I have NEVER understood!
Anyway if PP DECIDES PROOF OF INSURANCE WILL SURFICE AS PROOF ITEM WAS SHIPPED, then there should be no real problem with how many of us currently ship. If PP requires PROOF IT ARRIVED, then shipping fees for any customer requesting PP will have to be higher (for me anyway) to cover the "new policy".
Hopefully PP will put some kind of notice EASY FOR THE PAYEE TO SEE that states PAYPAL REQUIRES PROOF ITEM WAS SHIPPED/RECEIVED. Then maybe when you advise your buyer the shipping is higher they will at least understand why.
posted on August 22, 2000 04:44:05 PM new
Hi sulyn1950,
I am still waiting (patiently ) for the answers I have already asked on the "other thread" about this. Thought I would come over here and see if the answers had arrived yet. While I'm waiting:
I was told recently at my local PO that very shortly (already available in some areas) any package that is insured for over $50.00 which gets the BLUE FORM with the numbers will be trackable via the USPS site. The numbers will be scanned in at drop off and then when it gets where it's going and is signed for (which the BLUE FORM requires), the signature will also be scanned. If a problem pops up, you will be able to request a copy of the signature card showing exactly who signed for the item. If you insure for under $50 and use the GREEN FORM your out of luck. They aren't scanned and don't require a signature and are often "left on the steps", which I have NEVER understood!
Anyway if PP DECIDES PROOF OF INSURANCE WILL SURFICE AS PROOF ITEM WAS SHIPPED, then there should be no real problem with how many of us currently ship. If PP requires PROOF IT ARRIVED, then shipping fees for any customer requesting PP will have to be higher (for me anyway) to cover the "new policy".
Hopefully PP will put some kind of notice EASY FOR THE PAYEE TO SEE that states PAYPAL REQUIRES PROOF ITEM WAS SHIPPED/RECEIVED. Then maybe when you advise your buyer the shipping is higher they will at least understand why.
---------------------------------------------
I am trying to get clarification on what is needed. Proof of delivery or proof of shipping as we speak. The wording is not entirely clear and I need to make sure that it is clear.
I did see some older threads. Can you please email me with the questions? I can see if these are issues I am still waiting to be addressed.
posted on August 22, 2000 04:54:53 PM new
"The seller can provide reasonable proof-of-delivery which can be tracked online. (Most U.S. carrier companies offer this service, including the U.S. Postal Service.)"
I'm confused...is this is an actual quote from the TOU? If so, I don't see how it could be any more clear. The problem is that this is not what has been discussed in previous threads on the subject.
[ edited by auctionee on Aug 22, 2000 04:57 PM ]
I have not yet verified my Paypal account, I am one that is still trying to figure it out. When a seller has a Paypal account, has it linked to X.com as the "bank", has dealt with transfers and withdrawls for months there seems no reason. I have read your replies and I must be dense.
Notwithstanding the above, two questions if I may:
1) The new terms state ".......X.com will never make electronic transfers from your bank account without your explicit permission. "
My BANK ACCOUNT? Does this include x.com? Also, it does not say they promise not to withdraw from the PAYPAL account. In the case of an unfavorable chargeback, can you assure me they will not deduct funds from my Paypal account?
I had one instance where a stamp was sent to a buyer, buyer SWITCHED stamps and returned a faulty one to me. It was clear from the ebay photo this was done. Yet, had this customer paid with a credit card he could (and would) chargeback the purchase amount. What is Paypal/X.com position on such fraud against a seller?
2)This subject was touched on in another thread last week, but never satisfactorily addressed. It happened to me this week. When a buyer sends a Paypal payment to the wrong address (say hitmail.com instead of hotmail.com) what screen do they see? Mine says he saw nothing - verified OR non-verified. Since the email is done from Paypal, the buyer does not even know the email bounced. The seller is waiting on payment and the buyer waiting on merchandise - bad scenario. What I read was that in such cases Paypal keeps the money in limbo for 180 days before returning it to the sender. Can this be right? How on earth can you justify that? In your response last week you said something akin to not being able to police email addys. This is fine, but when an email BOUNCES its pretty clear there is a problem. In these cases Paypal should send immediate notification to the sender of the faulty email address, its only fair.
Thanks and I will wait patiently for your reply - I am not upset with Paypal like so many seem to be.
posted on August 22, 2000 06:51:41 PM new
paypaldamon-I was trying to show you that I understand it takes time. I wasn't trying to be rude to you. I have emailed you before and gotten very quick responses. Sometimes, I don't think I make myself clear to you, so that's why the response doesn't always answer my question. If I appear "#itchy", I'm sorry. Since the other thread is closed now, do I need to re-post my questions here? You have already told me they have been sent off for clarification. Would it be better for me to email you directly later to see if the answers have arrived yet? Thanks-sulyn
posted on August 23, 2000 10:25:07 AM new
Hi sulyn1950,
I have no problem with any of our users contacting me directly to remind of an issue needing clarification. The email address is [email protected]
Many of the issues brought forward for all of the users are being clarified at the moment and I am trying to (hopefully) get it built into the FAQ to help more.
posted on August 24, 2000 11:47:04 AM newDelivery confirmation is good.
Then the terms should say that, rather than asking us to take your personal interpretation as overriding the terms.
Delivery confirmation is not proof of delivery, as called for by the terms. It is evidence of delivery, but far from proof. We've discussed the cracks at length before.
posted on August 24, 2000 11:53:09 AM new
HI SG52,
Sellers are being asked to provide sufficient proof. Yes, someone could, in theory, steal the package from the front door, but the seller has the proof of shipping/delivery in the confirmation. The buyer could claim not receiving it, but the proof is there.
This is what the verification is protecting the seller from.
posted on August 24, 2000 12:28:04 PM new
As someone who accepts CC directly and had three attempted charge backs, I am not sure DC is sufficient for a CC company if customer claims non delivery. All it shows is that an item was delivered in a certain zip code. If it was left by the door and someone took it, there is no signature. Fortunately, my charge backs were for packages sent UPS and I was able to print out the delivery notification from the UPS web site which includes the name of the person receiving them.
I send out about ten boxes a week USPS. I have been doing this for over a year. Not a single one has been lost. Not one customer claimed no receipt. So by the time it does happen (if it ever does) my loss percentage will be .1%. Is that a reason for me to worry about charge backs and pay extra for special shipping? Not at all. That .1% is an acceptable business risk. And it is more than compensated by the over a thousand dollars I made with PP, in saved CC fees and referral fees.
If you dont want to take ANY risk, open a store and accept cash only. Wait, it might be counterfeit. Accept gold only and have an appraiser standing by to make sure it's real.
posted on August 24, 2000 12:47:43 PM newIf you dont want to take ANY risk, open a store and accept cash only. Wait, it might be counterfeit. Accept gold only and have an appraiser standing by to make sure it's real.
LOL -- I can just see an increase in the number of appraisers in the job market now.
I'm wondering, is there a difference between the DC being acceptable to PayPal vs. your CC? If the CC won't accept DC as proof, but PayPal states they do, would a chargeback still be possible?
posted on August 24, 2000 05:21:12 PM newThe buyer could claim not receiving it, but the proof is there.
If you're going to do this kind of thing, the rule you suggest is not bad.
However, the implication of The buyer could claim not receiving it, namely that the buyer did receive it but is lying. This implication does not follow.
Three issues.
There is a grey area between the law and credit card rules involving packages which were delivered to buyer's house but which were never actually seen by buyer, perhaps because they were stolen from buyer's front porch. Credit card companies usually protect buyer in such contexts, and indeed, mail order companies will reship even in cases where they have proof that the package was delivered to buyer's house.
Secondly, by far the most common story in this context is that the package was delivered to the inside of buyer's house, where it still is, but buyer has not seen the package, nor was notified of its arrival.
Lastly, "delivery confirmation" by the USPS is highly dependent upon an individual postoffice and individual mail carrier for accuracy. We've had many reports of inaccuracy, in both directions, but in today's context, very much including packages reported as "delivery confirmed" but which were actually delivered several days after such confirmation.
So buyers are usually telling the truth when they report non-receipt, even when seller has "proof".
And surely, a buyer who has never received his stuff is unlikely to "negotiate" or "work toward a resolution".
of the Service and to increase the security of online transactions in our payments network. A Verified User is a registered user of the Service who has added and confirmed a bank account on the X.com website, thereby providing X.com with proof that he or she holds ownership of an account at a bank or other financial institution. X.com considers this verification process a secure and easy way to gain additional proof of a User’s identity without asking for additional pieces of personal information during the registration process. This process, in conjunction with our other proprietary authentication methods, lowers our company's financial risk and allows us to provide the Buyer and Seller Protection Guarantees listed below.
