The saddest thing about YAHOO's demise is the fact that it is bound to put more money in Meg Whitman's pockets...extra fees and all!
The only site that really stands to gain from the sinking of the Yahoo ship is Ebay because, despite the good intentions and the friendliness of a site like BIDVILLE, the fact is the bidders are not there...(Maybe that is why Bidville's parent company is called NO BIDDING INC.)
I like the BIDVILLE interface, its friendliness toward sellers and willingness to adapt to sellers needs...but how do you get bidders that bounce between Yahoo and Ebay to go to a new site.......its just not going to happen!
posted on February 4, 2001 03:28:31 PM new
The bidders will come, eventually. It took quite a while for Yahoo to build up traffic on their auction site. Bidville will get more traffic and bidders, but it won't happen over night.
It will help if the sellers that move there list items at bargain prices. That will get the bids moving... When buyers come to a site and see bargain prices/lots of bids they bid themselves. If they see unrealistic pices and no bids, they go elsewhere (Ebay).
posted on February 4, 2001 08:14:20 PM new
No Bidding is a site where you list items at a SELL PRICE. There was no bidding on that site. If you saw something you liked, you bought it. Nice site, been doing business on it since it opened about one and a half years ago.
BidVille may be starting slow - don't most companies? When I started listing on Yahoo certain people laughed at me. That was 2 years ago and talk about slow bidding!!!!! It picked up and was holding steady (but nothing like eBay) until Yahoo implemented mandatory credit cards and my older, reliable customers were forced to quit bidding. Since then it has pretty well stunk!
Funny how credit cards, etc which were supposed to get rid of spam sellers, deadbeat bidders, etc did nothing to remove those people from the auctions but the good pay by money order immediately people could no longer bid. And when I tried to email Yahoo about this situation they told me not to worry - those older buyers would get credit cards and get with the technology or they didn't need them.
Looking back I realize that Yahoo did me a favor by throwing me overboard. (Rolllanotherone - maybe they didn't throw but I happily jumped when I realized they were sinking.) I decided to swim to a new site and am much happier and definately less stressed.
posted on February 4, 2001 08:29:16 PM new
>>>"despite the good intentions and the friendliness of a site like BIDVILLE, the fact is the bidders are not there..."<<<
I am not saying that BIDVILLE has as many bidders as Yahoo did yet. However, I feel that many people tend to forget one big thing. Bidville auctions make extensive use of the "take It" feature. I have had one auction close that way already, and I know of other sellers who set the "Take It" price at their minimum. So if you browse the auction listings looking for auctions with bids, you won't see these. They are successful, but as soon as someone bids the "Take It" price, the auction closes.
I urge people who are counting bids on auction sites to consider these BIN type of auctions involved and how they help to hide the true storyy of how many bidders there are.
The truth is that buyers are aware of Yahoo's suicide, and they are willing to to look at alternative sites also. they only reason they have not before, is they did not know about them. Also, a number of them like the idea that maybe they don't have to compete with dozens of other bidders for the same item like on some other sites.
[ edited by jimhhow on Feb 4, 2001 08:32 PM ]
posted on February 4, 2001 08:41:50 PM new
Actually bidville has been good to me. I found it after Yahoo announced fees and realized with the traffic I got at Yahoo wasn't worth it. I've been moving my close auctions over to bidville and didn't expect alot of action and have been pleasantly surprised. Some of my buyers have followed me over. The moral: instead of crying over my work at yahoo, pick up the pieces.
posted on February 4, 2001 09:49:13 PM new
Perhaps we should all start promoting AuctionWatch in our ads? Do they have a banner ad we can use? If more buyers knew about the universal search engine here, they would use it and could care less which site their search got hits on.
posted on February 4, 2001 09:55:31 PM new
>>>"Perhaps we should all start promoting AuctionWatch in our ads? Do they have a banner ad we can use? If more buyers knew about the universal search engine here, they would use it and could care less which site their search got hits on."<<<<
I now do most of my listing on BIDVILLE. AW does not have BIDVILLE on their search engine as far as I know. Why would I want to promotre them when they don't promote me?
posted on February 5, 2001 07:41:36 AM new
I hope AW gets BidVille on their list very quickly. It's growing by leaps and bounds. Sold 9 items over the night with the take it price and have 4 or 5 auctions with bids on them. It was slow for a few days (only 2 or 3 auctions at a time with bids on them) but things are moving along.
Be sure to let your regular customers know where you have gone also. I have done that and have had many thankful emails. Good luck to all!
posted on February 5, 2001 05:54:51 PM new
I'm one of the 14 day bulk loader sellers who has 1500 items left on YaWho? I will be gone soon maybe a bit later tham most but I want to mention that my book sales have increased quite noticably in the past 2 weeks. This I find interesting because I always figured it was the horrible classification tree which made browsing almost impossible in this category where browsing is quite important....much more people would browse for a book not knowing what the title or author was if only there was a classification that would match their interests.
I'm guessing that the 80% reduction in book listings has given my books more exposure. Thus a more profitable solution to "improving the site" than listing fees would have been for YaWho? to charge FV fees and take a trip to the local used book store to see how they organized their books.
posted on February 5, 2001 08:51:51 PM new
Have people realized yet that sites that offer everything for free cannot make it?
Check out the ads you see on web sites. If they say "Ad Council", that means "no money coming in". If the site is advertising its own services, that means "no money coming in". Even if the site is selling ads, that means "almost no money coming in".
I feel bad for people that planned their business around Yahoo being free and now are left in the lurch. But I'll be glad when ALL the free sites are dead and people have realistic expectations from their web site partners. (Not that the web sites aren't to blame - they asked for it.)
When is the last time you walked into a service station and said "Could you fix my car for me - for free?"
Jim
[ edited by rubylane on Feb 5, 2001 08:53 PM ]
posted on February 5, 2001 09:31:33 PM new "sites that offer everything for free cannot make it" - ridiculous
The marginal costs of storage and bandwidth for a portal operation such as yahoo to run auctions are sufficiently low to allow them to realisticly offer them free or very close to free, even long term, should they so choose. Even optimistic estimates of the income which yahoo's new auction fees will bring in are dwarfed by the income they already earn from their free services, most of which there is little chance they will ever charge for.
yahoo auctions has added the listing fees under the impression that they are strong enough to become a more active marketplace with fees as a gatekeeper, rather than because they had to have them to pay the way. We can doubt it, but that doesn't mean it can't be true.
posted on February 5, 2001 09:51:29 PM new
I agree Figmente,
$291,000,000 profit for last year does not exactly give the picture of a losing proposition.
And anyone who believes that the fees are going to make the auction site better should really try and get in touch with reality.
The imposition of fees is not going to put Yahoo in a better position to compete with Ebay, it can only make their position more inferior because it cannot attract the entrenched base of bidders that ebay has.
Yahoo has already lost the number two position to a company that lost money last year.
If anyone had told you a year ago that this position switch could occur between BIDBAY and Yahoo, you would have laughed for months. And to be honest, I would have been laughing with you. I don't think anyone is laughing now, especially the wizards at Yahoo who came up with this brilliant plan.
posted on February 6, 2001 10:45:19 AM new
Yahoo makes its money from selling ad space and then subsidized its free auctions. If free auctions contribute significantly to the part of the business that does make money, then free auctions make sense.
The cost of bandwidth and servers is insignificant compared to the cost of people and operating expensese to keep everything running smoothly and keep the site competitive. So you can't say it's cheap to run an auction site because bandwidth is cheap.
Where will bidbay and bidville get money to pay for the service they provide? If they IPO and get money from the public, the public expects to be paid back several fold. Where does the payback money come from?
posted on February 6, 2001 12:35:03 PM new
Hi All,
There have been many threads regarding the creation of an online auction co-op. Why not share some of these ideas there?
From what I see, free auction sites will never be a solution. The ad $$ have to match up with the costs of running the site which increase with volume.
Ad $$ dropped and Yahoo decided it didn't warrant the cost of supporting its auctions.
There's no free ride, but what there could be is a site that's supported and governed by sellers.
And from this site we could all build our businesses in a stable enviorment.
It's up to you. No one person or small group can make it happen.
Start talking about this and spread the word and post threads on every message board you can with a co-op thread or start one yourself!
posted on February 6, 2001 12:40:46 PM new
rubylane,
You hit the nail on the head. I am glad there is someone other then myself who understands the point you made..
posted on February 6, 2001 01:30:34 PM new
"The bidders will come, eventually. It took quite a while for Yahoo to build up traffic on their auction site."
I don't think they ever actually did this! There were hundreds of thousands of items but very few bids compared to eBay.
"Bidville will get more traffic and bidders, but it won't happen over night."
It won't last long enough for this to happen. They say they will not be charging any fees ... EVER. Where is the operating money going to come from? Banners won't work because eventually (soon I suspect), buyers and sellers won't go there any more to see them.
"It will help if the sellers that move there list items at bargain prices."
That's the best advice I have heard about BidVille so far. There are very few good deals right now on BidVille. In the movies category, the majority of VHS tapes and DVD's are listed with starting bids higher than the brick and mortar stores, not even including the extra cost of shipping.
Canvid ... as much as I admire your efforts to create a co op, that is also a dream. Several years ago, a bunch of big time video tape traders got fed up with all the bad traders, porn, and junk that was cluttering up the newsgroups, so they branched off and formed their own little elite trading group (the co-op). That lasted for about 6 months then died.
Who puts up the bucks? Where do the servers reside? How are decisions made? Who makes the rules? Who enforces the rules? Who decides whether Canadians and Europeans and Asians are allowed to play in the co-op?
[ edited by RB on Feb 6, 2001 01:39 PM ]
[ edited by RB on Feb 6, 2001 01:40 PM ]
posted on February 6, 2001 02:05:53 PM new
DITTO to : rubylane & snoopyone & RB!
First off as in other threads folks compared to live auctions! These charge sellers a ?% as well as buyers premium of 10% and up to buyers!
Some of the services have classifieds! If items are listed or relisted 100's of times at non competitive prices they belong in a classifieds section! Not an auction format!
I will not list my items to attract bidders to other sites at lower prices and of better quality then the items some folks bulk load or auto relist if available every two days until their items sell!
Some of the same items have been on Yahoo for well over a year!
Another scenario for sellers are the Antique and collectible malls!
Seattle area a 4'X 8'X 6' space with three walls runs at a minimum of $200/month with at least 10% plus commision!
Now sell $1000 Gross
rent -200
commision -100
cost of items -400 (If you only paid 40%)
Profit $300
WHOOPS? Almost forgot the time too and from the mall and locating and buying items!
Arranging, cleaning, pricing at home and at the mall!
It is not a very profitable experience unless you are doing it for fun?
The above scenario was given to me at an AUCTION in Canada by a Canadian dealer who used to sell in malls as I had been doing!
Not the way to go unless you have high end items in high demand or very cheap rent?
posted on February 6, 2001 03:03:35 PM new
RB: "Canvid ... as much as I admire your efforts to create a co op, that is also a dream. Several years ago, a bunch of big time video tape traders got fed up with all the bad traders, porn, and junk that was cluttering up the newsgroups, so they branched off and formed their own little elite trading group (the co-op). That lasted for about 6 months then died"
RB Do you want a co-op??
Let's start right there. If you do I suggest you read and post to the co-op threads here all over AW and on our message board which has links to all of the other message boards.
As for your comment I can't answer any of those questions. We are advocating a non-profit, non-saleable, one member one vote co-op that would be governed by all of the members. It would not be exclusionary and is a real possibility.
It's up to all of us but if you wish please drop by our message board and I think you'll be surprised. It's not a dream, it's a goal and a very doable one.
posted on February 6, 2001 03:26:36 PM new
canvid ...
No, I am not interested in a co-op. I am (was) a casual buyer and seller only, strictly as a hobby and as a way to expand my video collection. I was kicked off eBay for listing a set of Columbia House ORIGINAL tapes citing "potential" copyright infringement, and since then, I have had zero luck with sales. I just ended the dozen listings I had on BidVille (no looks after the 3rd relist) and I asked them how I could have my personal info removed from their database. I've got a feeling they're going to need some operating money and I can envision them starting to sell their member lists to generate needed funds. I get enough SPAM and junk mail already!
I can tell you one thing though from almost 50 years of work experience in the real world, and that is you cannot make decisions by committee. It would be even harder to do this if your committee (the members) are scattered all over the world.
