posted on August 7, 2000 04:17:09 PM new
toomanycomics, I don't really know what your cards are like, but if they have nudity and are somewhat erotic, I would definitely try them under the following category:
Adult & Erotica >> Collectibles
I took a look for you, and there are other trading cards and things listed in there, and there are bids. This way you can list them without editing the photos, and let people see exactly what they're getting. Don't you think?
posted on August 7, 2000 11:30:35 PM new
I would still list them with CENSORED photos, even if you put them in the Erotica category. Bidders will know what the trading card actually looks like uncensored.
posted on August 8, 2000 06:18:22 AM newgranee - yeah... I have thought of that and I was trying to think of a good phrase for it to put it in the description. you just gave me an Idea thanks
porcelaingirl - I think I better censor them just to cover my butt (actual term for it: CYA). What if a child try to look for a movie using the word 'Adult' for search? (Note: it was talked about at the Ebay Outlook forum)
I will investigate further under that category though.
posted on August 8, 2000 09:34:57 AM new
Adult categories are not suppose to come up through the search engine, and a credit card is required to enter the adult area.
posted on August 9, 2000 08:54:10 AM new
I also tried typing adult into the search engine while not logged in and came up with a few nude pictures, but none of them were listed in adult categories....(guess I'll have to spend some time with NW). Regardless of what you say your birthday is, a credit card is required as proof of age for adult categories.
posted on August 9, 2000 11:42:09 PM new
I just put "nude" into the search engine, and came up with over 1200 listings OUTSIDE the "adult/erotica" category, most of which have explicit nude photographs. I'm going to use the NW for awhile, too (first time I've ever used it, but I think it's certainly needed here).
When there's an "erotica" category to list in, WHY do people put their X-rated stuff in other categories????????????
posted on August 10, 2000 02:03:07 AM new
I'm certainly not condoning the practice and I don't think it's a cool thing for people to do, but I can understand why people list adult items outside of the adult category. It's mainly because they feel that people won't see their items otherwise. I believe they are largely correct in assuming so. I have often seen (mostly Ebay related) posts from adult-materials sellers saying that when they list their items in the adults-only categories they can't even get any bids, but when they list the same items in general interest, non-adult categories they get multiple bids & make huge profits.
There are multiple reasons why I rarely venture into the wasteland that is Ebay's adults-only category. #1 I prefer to "search", not "browse". There is no search engine that covers the adult section. #2 I am only an occasional purchaser of "adult" materials, and I have little reason to go into the category. #3 the credit card verification thing is a PITA!!!
As a Yahoo user of roughly 2 months, I have never even ventured into Yahoo's adults-only category & cannot speak from experience there as I have none.
If I saw an "adult" item that caught my eye I would probably bid on it, but I am not likely to see it in the first place.UNLESS it is improperly listed, that is. I assume that, although everyone is not just like me in their shopping habits, my experiences are probably not completely atypical.
While I'm in agreement that these sellers are seriously in error when they take the liberty of listing their items incorrectly, I can see their side of it. If my items don't sell the first time I often switch the category I listed them in to try to improve. An adults-only seller doesn't legally have this option. Apparently they're ignoring the "legally" part & switching categories anyway.
IMHO what they really need to do is just get together & create their own site. If I sold adults-only material I wouldn't put up with being treated as a second-class citizen, but nor would I blatantly ignore rules that were put in place for very good reasons- to protect innocent children & innocent easily-offended adults who have no reason to be viewing such materials.
posted on August 10, 2000 08:07:34 AM new
an interesting point CAgrrl
I agree about the sellers (mis?)placing the naughty items on purpose in order to pull in more bidders.
but some of them are like me, don't know where to put them
yahoo should either have their own site or tighten up their security for both sellers and buyers.
I think with my auctions I should accept just checks and credit cards since they require Driver's Id and other form of identification at their banks.
in some of the adult auctions, I noticed they accept Money orders.
kids under 18 can get money orders just about anywhere.
~~sighs~~ some of them never heard of lawsuits....
posted on August 10, 2000 10:53:16 AM new
Put your Olivia cards in SOME trading card category! Who cares? Olivia has TASTEFUL nudity, no hard-core stuff. I call this ART.
Ummm....let's see....Olivia cards by COMIC Images can be listed in the COMIC Previews Magazine but I can't list them in the COMICS>Trading Cards category? Who do you "Thought Nazis" think you are?
I hardly think some kid looking for my X-Men cards is going to accidentally happen across my Olivia cards by doing a search on X-Men. Maybe if they do a search on Comic>Trading Cards and look through ALL the listings they will find 'em.
Most searches are performed with a specific title in mind. "Adult" and "Nudity" doesn't HAVE to be part of the title! As long as they aren't being listed in the "Childern's Books" category, I don't see what the problem is. What is your problem with the category?
And furthermore, if they look-up my listings by my seller name, guess what shows-up along with my X-Men cards and Spider-Man comics? You guessed it! My Olivia cards! And my Heavy Metal cards! And my Double Impact cards! YOU DON'T EVEN HAVE TO ENTER ADULT "ANYTHING!" Duh!
Uh ooohhh! Go look-up my listings and have fun with your "Neighborhood Watch" trigger fingers! Ya cowards! Isn't anonymity GREAT?!!! You could at least e-mail the seller and tell 'em why you're pulling the trigger on 'em!
Refer to my rant on the "Neighborhood Watch" thread.
posted on August 11, 2000 12:11:42 AM new
hawkwand,
We've seen your "rant" on the NW thread, and read the "diatribe" (YOUR word, not mine) you sent to Yahoo about it.
On that thread you said, "I am a daddy the real answer is to kick 'em out and send 'em to the military!"
I guess that's why you consider softcore porn "TASTEFUL ART", would allow children to view porn on Yahoo as long as it isn't in the "Children's Books" category, and characterize everyone who disagrees with you as "Thought Nazis" and "Neighborhood Watch cowards". More like you we don't need.
CAgrrl, I never gave NW a second thought (having only dealt with it once, when I put something in the wrong category), and never even THOUGHT about whether Yahoo Auction has "erotic" listings until reading auctionee's post here about finding nude photos outside the adult category. I was shocked to see hardcore listings with extremely explicit XXX photos placed in every category IMAGINABLE on Yahoo (EXCEPT children's books), mostly by a few dozen sellers who KNEW they were violating the rules because they often listed these items in the Adults Only: Erotica category as well. They were in toys, women's and men's clothing, sports cards, movie memorabilia, antiques & collectibles, magazines, digital cameras, computer hardware, videos, computer games, junk mail, you-name-it.
toomanycomics, I agree with you that "Yahoo should either have their own site or tighten up their security for both sellers and buyers." It's difficult enough to make sure children don't come across all the pornography already on the internet, without having them stumble into it on Yahoo Auction.
posted on August 11, 2000 04:39:35 AM newhawkwand - well I do care about where I put these cards because I much rather NOT get in trouble and I respect pple's feelings on that subject.
I agree, it's artful nudity but I want bidders to come to look at them knowing what they are dealing with rather than sneaking my cards in different categories to force these cards upon pple who are not interested in or trying to avoid this type of subject. I do not desire to be a molestor.
posted on August 11, 2000 10:15:02 AM new
hawkwand - I get my information from the quote you posted, this quote (also from the bulkloader police) "Aside from decreasing your chances of completing sales (buyers have told us they do not trust multiple listings of the same product), Yahoo! maintains a zero-tolerance policy on spam and may take action to cancel auctions and/or Yahoo! accounts of users that we believe are misusing the service" and previous personal experience. You assume that because Yahoo has not closed your auctions based on the NW complaints that they must agree with you WRONG! If someone takes the time to send an e-mail to customer care complaining about what you are doing, I GUARANTEE you that they will close your auctions. NW is almost completely automated, but when an actual person from Yahoo looks at your listings, THEY WILL BE CLOSED! No, this is not my personal opinion, I have seen it happen many times.
posted on August 11, 2000 12:59:06 PM new
"(buyers have told us they do not trust multiple listings of the same product)" This is not what I'm doing. I have multiple listings of the same title. Please get it right. I want my customers to have a choice and bid in with the confidence they won't get into a bidding war on an item when I have several.
I placed an adult comic book in the regular category and had no problem at all when Yahoo cancelled it. I simply resubmitted it into the adult category.
I do not abuse the system. If you go to my "booth" you can see by the majority of my listings the majority of my clientele is kids!
I guess I don't have a problem with it because my dad is an artist. From the time I was a small child I was seeing nude artwork. Nudity has never been an issue in my family. There is no shame in it. I guess I'm more broad minded than most. I would never try to force anything on anybody. Especially one who knows not the difference between porn and art.
But again, what ya gonna do? Even if I move my Olivia cards to the adult category, any kid browsing my "booth" looking for other comic trading cards is gonna see it. At least the cover of the unopened box is tasteful and doesn't have to be censored. I don't deal in XXX stuff.
posted on August 11, 2000 09:55:10 PM new
Hawkwand,
You wrote, "Even if I move my Olivia cards to the adult category, any kid browsing my "booth" looking for other comic trading cards is gonna see it."
Your statement is not correct. Many parents allow their children to look for comic books and cards on Yahoo using an account that is not Credit Card Verified (which is required to enter the adult area). So if you had your Adult material listed correctly, those items do not appear in your listing for anyone using an account that isn't credit card verified.
Try it yourself. Find a seller with a mixed listing of adult listed in adult, and non-adult items. Open an account, don't have it credit card verified, and then go to the sellers listings. While the adult auctions will appear for the cc verified account, they won't for the non-cc verified account. That's why many parents appreciate the sellers who DO list their adult items correctly.
There really seems to be an awful lot about Yahoo! Auction that you either don't know, or don't understand. Which I think explains the many problems you are currently having with your auctions. It seems to me that a responsible business-person would want to have a fuller understanding of the Terms Of Service they agreed to when they opened their account. Apparently you pressed that "I Agree" button without even reading what you were agreeing to. Now it seems you're learning it the hard way. Oh, well, to each his own!
posted on August 13, 2000 01:35:53 AM newtoomanycomics
Just felt I needed to mention that the form of payment is no surefire way of ascertaining the bidder's age! I've had a checking account with my Credit Union since I was 16 years old. My CU doesn't offer "Visa check cards" but if they did, then one could have what appears to be a "credit card" for all intents and purposes, yet be under 18.
I don't know how you know for sure, other than requiring someone to send you a photocopy of their ID or something.
posted on August 13, 2000 06:05:00 AM new
I had buyer send me a note to assure me that he/she is over 18 (or 21 depending on the subject matter of the adult items) and is well aware of what he/she is buying (along with signature.)
posted on August 13, 2000 06:17:43 AM new
BlackCoffeeBlues -
You are absolutely correct about the fact that someone under 18 can easily have a checking account or a credit card. However, the Supreme Court has ruled that a valid credit card can be used as acceptable proof of age...that's why all the porn sites require a credit card (other than to collect those big bucks of course).
So if your concern is strictly a LEGAL one, then a CC will cover your butt, I assume.
If you're concerned with the moral issues involved, the idea of possibly selling something of an adult nature to a minor, then there's no real way to know, really, who you are dealing with.
I'm not saying what's right either way or what anyone should or shouldn't do. I just know that, fully intending to sell some VERY adult stuff on Yahoo one of these days myself (i.e. hardcore stuff), I struggle with the moral issues. 'Course, I suppose I am hypersensitive about it after being corrupted at a very young age myself. Knew wayyy too much wayyyy too soon. I don't want to think I'm corrupting some other kid even unknowingly, but don't know how to reassure myself that the person is of age, ya know?
Sheri
[email protected]
[ edited by blackcoffeeblues on Aug 13, 2000 06:29 AM ]
I used the key word: "Adult" in the search engine and images that contains nudity came up.
