posted on July 13, 2005 02:33:45 PM new
Anyone that is against the death penalty needs to read about the life form that kidnapped those children in Idaho.
What that eight year old girl went through is more than anyone should ever have to endure.
This thing needs to die.
posted on July 13, 2005 05:35:49 PM new
I'd like to volunteer to pull the lever, or switch, or inject the lethal dose..without a moments hesitation...Maggie
posted on July 13, 2005 07:34:54 PM new
Duncan stalked Groenes for days, detective says
2005-07-13
by Nicholas K. Geranios
Associated Press
COEUR D'ALENE, Idaho -- During six weeks on the run with an 8-year-old girl, convicted sex offender Joseph Edward Duncan told his young prey that he had driven around her neighborhood looking for children, according to court documents released Tuesday.
And when he found Shasta Groene playing in a bathing suit with her 9-year-old brother, Dylan, the documents say, he stalked their home for days, using night-vision goggles to learn its layout before bursting in, subduing their family with a shotgun and a hammer, and abducting the siblings.
The new details of the gruesome attack were in the minutes and a recording of a closed-door probable-cause hearing before First District Magistrate Judge Scott Wayman on Tuesday, as Duncan was charged with first-degree murder and first-degree kidnapping in the bludgeoning deaths of three people in the family home.
Duncan is expected to face federal charges in Dylan's death, as the boy's remains were found across state lines in Montana.
According to the minutes, Detective Brad Maskell told the judge: ``She described how Duncan told her he drove around looking for kids, saw her outside. ... He told her he watched her two or three days and at night would peer inside the home. He became aware of the layout of the home. We found night-vision goggles in the vehicle.''
Shasta was also insistent that Duncan was the only perpetrator, Maskell said.
The girl told detectives her ordeal began when she heard her mother call her into the living room early on the morning of May 16. There, she said, she saw Duncan wearing dark gloves and holding a shotgun. Her 13-year-old brother, Slade; her mother, Brenda Groene; and her mother's boyfriend, Mark McKenzie were bound with zip-ties and duct tape.
Duncan then bound her and Dylan and laid them on the ground outside, near a swing set. Shasta said she heard McKenzie yell out several times, and at one point they saw Slade stagger, bloody and incoherent, out of the home.
Few other details about Duncan's weeks on the run with Shasta were released, though Maskell said Duncan bragged to her about killing her family with a hammer and showed it to her. Authorities have previously said Shasta was repeatedly molested and that she saw Dylan being molested.
Duncan was arrested July 2, when he was spotted at a Denny's restaurant in Coeur D'Alene with Shasta. Detectives say he spent weeks with the children camping in Montana, where Dylan's body was found.
The six counts Duncan faces in First District Court all carry the death penalty.
State kidnapping charges against Duncan in the abduction of Shasta and her brother will be dismissed, Prosecutor Bill Douglas said at a news conference Tuesday. Those crimes will be handled by the federal court system because the youngsters were taken across a state line after their abduction, he said.
Duncan likely will appear in court here today to hear the state charges against him and to have bail set. Douglas said he will ask that Duncan be denied bail. Duncan has been held without bail since his July 2 arrest.
Under federal law, a kidnapping that results in a death is punishable by death, said spokeswoman Jean McNeil of the U.S. attorney's office in Boise.
``Ultimately I expect we'll bring a battery of charges,'' McNeil said. ``But we're not in a hurry. He's going to stay in state custody and they're going to deal with the murder charges in Coeur d'Alene first, so we've got time.''
Duncan, of Fargo, N.D., is a native of Tacoma, where he was convicted in 1980 of sexually assaulting a 14-year-old boy at gunpoint.
He was released on $15,000 bail earlier this year in Becker County, Minn., after being charged with molesting a 6-year-old boy. Police in Fargo, N.D., where Duncan lived, had been looking for him since he failed to check in with a probation agent there in May.
Police said he got the $15,000 from a Fargo businessman, Joe Crary, 51, who said he became acquainted with Duncan on bicycle trails around Fargo and believed his claims of innocence.
posted on July 13, 2005 10:19:14 PM new
Thanks Ron. That's awful stuff. I think it's obvious these kind of sickos don't reform, so letting them back on the streets is the first mistake. Although I don't believe in the death penalty, I think stiffer laws are needed for these predators. I thought castration might be an idea, but after watching a show on the subject, I learned a shot of testosterone is all they would need to counteract the effects.
The National Intitute of Mental Health has estimated that the average molester of boys will have 150 victims before apprehension! Since pedophilia is part disease and part crime and "treatment" is ineffective it seems that the only answer is prolonged incarceration of those who commit such crimes. I don't believe in capital punishment but in cases like this one, I would lock them up and throw away the key!
posted on July 14, 2005 08:51:41 AM new
Any liberal worth his salt cannot distance himself from the "sanctity" of a life. The same rational that makes it hard to conceptualize a leader who would kill millions just so he could be on top of what was left, cannot fathom the fact that a criminal cannot be redeemed and returned to society.
This is not a "perfect example" for the death penalty. Kill somebody to rob him or collect the insurance money--that's the death penalty. This guy is the special exemption clause. The one about "cruel and unusual". Slow garrotte, watch the body for a few days afterward to make sure he's not faking, then pound a wooden stake through his heart. Film everything to show at movie night in prisons.
posted on July 14, 2005 09:53:12 AM new "Helen and kraft, why wouldn't you want these "people" dead?"
Mingotree, I have no understanding or sympathy for this murderer. But a support for the death penalty in his case is a support for the death penalty in all cases. Even if you have no scruples against the death penalty in this heinous crime, you should consider the number of innocent people who may be wrongly convicted and executed for a crime that they did not commit.
posted on July 14, 2005 10:46:45 AM new
Helen, I agree completely with --the number of innocent people who may be wrongly convicted and executed for a crime that they did not commit.--
Administration of the death penalty is very skewed towards the poor and minorities and many innocent people have been put to death(especially in Texas!) but this is one cut and dried case.
I really don't want my tax money going for food, pornos, health care, kidney dialysis, library, education, toothpaste or anything else for this walking piece of garbage.
In this case I strongly believe in the death penalty.
posted on July 14, 2005 10:51:48 AM new
I simply do not believe in the Death Penalty. Taking a life as a means of retribution makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. I do find it amusing how many "christians" advocate the death penalty. It seems a bit hypocritical to me.
They should most definately serve a life sentance in a maximum security prison with zero chance for parole. How does the old saying go... What happens in prison, stays in prison. Oh, sorry that is Vegas.
Nothing can reverse the horror that was caused, but should we stoop to the level of a killer to make a point? Death penalties do nothing to deter this kind of behavior. Why? Because this person has a mental illness that causes these behaviors. They don't shy away from doing things like this because they know they could fry.
He should be punished according to the laws of his state, but I don't agree with or support the death penalty.
posted on July 14, 2005 10:56:12 AM new
Quote: "I simply do not believe in the Death Penalty. Taking a life as a means of retribution makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. I do find it amusing how many "christians" advocate the death penalty. It seems a bit hypocritical to me."
Really, apparently you haven't read the bible very thoroughly.
[ edited by etexbill on Jul 14, 2005 10:56 AM ]
posted on July 14, 2005 11:10:27 AM new
The wonderful thing about being Christian is you get to pick and choose your bible verses to suit your own brand of Jesusism. There's plenty of pacifism in there, or you can find all sorts of justification for taking a life, especially in the Old Testament. Not that the folks in the Old Testament were Christians, of course, but let's not put too fine a point on it. Want to justify outlawing the death penalty? The bible's your book. Want to justify cutting off the hands of thieves? We can help with that too
I do think, that in the interest of closure for this little girl, this man needs to die. I can't imagine growing up knowing that the individual who did such horrible things to me and my family is alive somewhere.
____________________________________________
Fue por lana y salió trasquilado...
posted on July 14, 2005 11:13:19 AM new
mingotree, we are in perfect agreement on this one! Some lawyer will get him out on an insanity plea and he'll do it again.
Parasites shouldn't be supported. They should be exterminated.
posted on July 14, 2005 11:21:19 AM new
"I do think, that in the interest of closure for this little girl, this man needs to die. I can't imagine growing up knowing that the individual who did such horrible things to me and my family is alive somewhere."
Prof, everyone is different. In the case of the drug addict kindapping, twice raping and strangling and shooting the Wal-Mart employee in our area, the district attorney wanted the death penalty and could easily have gotten it as the man pleaded guilty. The girl's family said no, if he would serve a life sentence with no parole if he told them all the grisly details of exactly how the murder took place and her last moments. He did, they confronted him in court and told him off and he is gone to prison for life as of last week. Not the way I would have done it if she were my daughter. I would have been in the front row at the death chamber.
posted on July 14, 2005 11:37:49 AM new
Come on Tex, that passage has been used by so many to justify the death penalty. It's not to be taken literally, like if I punch your teeth in, you should punch mine in. The meaning is that the punishment should fit the crime.
posted on July 14, 2005 11:41:56 AM new
kraft, there is a great disagreement over the meaning of that passage. It is listed in several chapters of the old testament. But that is exactly what it says, and anyone can put his interpretation on it.
Didn't know you had a theology degree and were saying what the meaning of a bible verse is. You would do well on TV.
"The meaning is that the punishment should fit the crime. "
If that is your interpretation, then you have just proved our point. He should be killed.
Edited again for spelling.
[ edited by etexbill on Jul 14, 2005 11:43 AM ]
[ edited by etexbill on Jul 14, 2005 11:45 AM ]
[ edited by etexbill on Jul 14, 2005 11:46 AM ]
