Linda_K
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posted on November 2, 2005 10:34:15 AM new
Ron - As with most things each state would have their own laws regarding the closure of juvenile records.
But I know in CA...once they reach the age of majority they can petitition the court to have their juvenile records sealed, if they have a record. Yes.
"Whenever the nation is under attack, from within or without, liberals side with the enemy. This is their essence." --Ann Coulter
And why the American Voters chose to RE-elect President Bush to four more years. YES!!!
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shagmidmod
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posted on November 2, 2005 11:04:21 AM new
Yep, Linda always making the neocons out to be the victims.
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Linda_K
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posted on November 2, 2005 11:15:14 AM new
LOL....it's TRUE. Does the truth hurt rusty?
It's the liberals that are always complaining about those of us who don't appreciate having to pay for supporting those young people who can't support themselves or the children they bring into the world.
YOU want no restrictions on sex at 12, 13 14??? Then FINE...YOU pay to support them and their children. I'll go along with IF they can pay their own way....THEN they can do whatever they want...if their parents don't care either. But as long as we're paying for them....BECAUSE of the liberal mind think.....then we have a good right to complain about it.
"Whenever the nation is under attack, from within or without, liberals side with the enemy. This is their essence." --Ann Coulter
And why the American Voters chose to RE-elect President Bush to four more years. YES!!!
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fenix03
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posted on November 2, 2005 11:31:40 AM new
Dbl - you go off on a journey into lala land about pork loin and I am the one who seems childish? Yeah...OK.
Linda - What do you mean "in Part"? What is it that you saw that you feel I left out? He brought the attorney for the girl on and argued against him. If he disagreed with the charges and law he would have brought the DA or the prosecuter on.
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
An intelligent deaf-mute is better than an ignorant person who can speak.
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shagmidmod
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posted on November 2, 2005 11:32:34 AM new
Linda, keep pretending the burden is so heavy.
The problem with your agenda is that you don't support the right of choice for someone to make a personal and health decision for themself. You want to push your neofascist agenda on other peoples lives. Abortions goes against your "moral" values. Then when a young person has a child and needs some assistance to maintain a healthy child, you don't want to help. So Christian of you. You don't bother to whine about some huge corporation getting tax breaks so they can make continue to make record profits, but you will get all pissy over another human being needed help. What??? Can't stand the idea that your Wal Mart stock didn't go up that extra penny a share? You are a very sick person Linda. You are selfish, spoiled, and Anti-American. You think contributing $20 to Hurricane Relief and $10 to your church collection basket each week is your ticket to heaven. Pretending to be a christian and actually being a good human are two different things. You are filled with so much hate it blinds you from any reasonable thought.
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fenix03
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posted on November 2, 2005 11:33:47 AM new
Again I have to ask myself... why is it that republicans want a government that is as small as possible but still large enough to fill the bedroom?
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
An intelligent deaf-mute is better than an ignorant person who can speak.
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Linda_K
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posted on November 2, 2005 11:48:33 AM new
LOL rusty.....dream on.
Not ONE sentence you ranted about is true of me. But we all know how you have no idea what you're talking about when you decide to tell others what someone else thinks. 
Try to speak for yourself for a change, and quit spewing lies about others.
"Whenever the nation is under attack, from within or without, liberals side with the enemy. This is their essence." --Ann Coulter
And why the American Voters chose to RE-elect President Bush to four more years. YES!!!
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WashingtoneBayer
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posted on November 2, 2005 11:52:19 AM new
Fenix?
So you are saying it is ok for a 13 year old girl to have sex anytime she wants and if gets pregnant get an abortion, all without any parental knowledge?
I think you are confusing size of government with laws, two separate issues.
Besides 13 year old shouldn't have any "bedroom".
Ron
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fenix03
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posted on November 2, 2005 12:01:45 PM new
I'm saying that it is a moral and parental issue and not something that should be legislated. Just because you do not like something, or that it makes you uncomfortable does not mean that it should neccesarily be illegal and I dare you to show me the aspect of the constitution that supports any law that would make it illegal for a minor to have consentual sex with someone their own age.
As for the abortion issue - I think that because of health concerns minors under the age of 16 should be notification but I don't believe that there should be mandatory consent.
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
An intelligent deaf-mute is better than an ignorant person who can speak.
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Linda_K
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posted on November 2, 2005 12:05:31 PM new
Not according to the radical liberals here, Ron. 
It's enjoy yourself...do whatever you wish to do....the nanny government will take the responsibility for your stupid actions. From 'cradle to grave government care' is THEIR motto.
That's part of why they haven't been getting elected in enough numbers to be other than a 'minority'.
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fenix - Linda - What do you mean "in Part"?
You offered no O'Reilly quotes...no transcript of what he said.....and we all know how you have such love for the man. I don't doubt he said something you didn't bother to mention. Him being for morality with our young people....for upholding our laws....is so terrible according to some here.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"Whenever the nation is under attack, from within or without, liberals side with the enemy. This is their essence." --Ann Coulter
And why the American Voters chose to RE-elect President Bush to four more years. YES!!!
[ edited by Linda_K on Nov 2, 2005 12:08 PM ]
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Linda_K
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posted on November 2, 2005 12:11:41 PM new
Yes, Ron...that's a reasonable thing for fenix to ask you to do. Go look up underaged sex laws in each of the 50 states Constitutions.
How funny you are, fenix. Why don't YOU look them up yourself?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"Whenever the nation is under attack, from within or without, liberals side with the enemy. This is their essence." --Ann Coulter
And why the American Voters chose to RE-elect President Bush to four more years. YES!!!
[ edited by Linda_K on Nov 2, 2005 12:15 PM ]
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WashingtoneBayer
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posted on November 2, 2005 12:13:11 PM new
So in your mind fenix
Child labor laws would be a moral issue and should not be legislated either?
Laws regarding statutory rape should be done away with? those are based on morals.
Your wanting of a "free" child has some consequences that I don't think you are prepared to deal with.
Laws are to protect children and sometimes punish. Both in and out of the "bedroom"
I think the parents of children should be held accountable. Punish them and maybe they will start doing their jobs.
I don't need to show you anything, minors do not have rights under the constitution for the most part or there would not be an admendment allowing 18 year olds to vote.
Ron
[ edited by WashingtoneBayer on Nov 2, 2005 12:18 PM ]
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shagmidmod
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posted on November 2, 2005 12:18:34 PM new
"I think the parents of children should be held accountable. Punish them and maybe they will start doing their jobs."
Just like the Bush administration should be held accountable. Maybe we should punish the voters of these fascist pigs, and maybe they will start voting for honest legislators with ethics instead of a bunch of pirates... Arg...
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WashingtoneBayer
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posted on November 2, 2005 12:21:14 PM new
How can you blame the voters when there was really only one choice to vote for?
My party received only a handful of votes and we did have a candidate.
Why didn't the democrats put a candidate up there that the people would actually vote for?
Ron
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Linda_K
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posted on November 2, 2005 12:27:15 PM new
LOL....because they DIDN'T have one. kerry was the best they could do....and he took both sides of EVERY issue trying to win. Just the smart American voters wouldn't elect a traitor to our country....and one who didn't know himself where he stood on most issues. flip flop....flip flop...
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"Whenever the nation is under attack, from within or without, liberals side with the enemy. This is their essence." --Ann Coulter
And why the American Voters chose to RE-elect President Bush to four more years. YES!!!
[ edited by Linda_K on Nov 2, 2005 12:30 PM ]
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fenix03
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posted on November 2, 2005 12:29:17 PM new
Linda dearest - I wanted to, I went both to the Fox site and to O'Reily's own site but not only were there no transcripts - there was no mention of the segment. Do you think I made it up?
Ron - don't put words in my mouth, personally I think statutory rape charges need to be ammended. I thionk that it's ridiculous that a guy can be prosecuted for having sex with someone less than a year younger than them but to tell you the truth I would rather see them done away with completely since more often then not they are used as retribution by vengeful parents upset that they are not able to control their child. I think they should be scrapped in favor of more stringently defined child rape laws that would enforce an age difference of at least three years between the offender and the victim under the age of 16.
As far as child labor laws... that is apples and oranges and almost as relevent to this topic as the Libby indictment.
::I think the parents of children should be held accountable. Punish them and maybe they will start doing their jobs.::
Possibly but we are not discussing any law that involves the parents and I am not sure how that would be deemed constitutional either.
I don't quite understand the contridiction among conservatives that demands that their judges conform strictly to the constitution but not their laws.
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
An intelligent deaf-mute is better than an ignorant person who can speak.
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WashingtoneBayer
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posted on November 2, 2005 12:39:02 PM new
Fenix you are so confused, where does it say this law is unconstitutional? Where?
It is now relevent because YOU brought morals into the topic.
Are you saying that there should not be laws based on morals and should be declared unconstitutional?
That would include all of the laws I mentioned earlier.
Oh I will put words where I see them, thank you very much. Those were questions that were asked of you.
Ron
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Linda_K
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posted on November 2, 2005 12:40:41 PM new
The law, again in CA, is that IF the parents can't control their child...the state takes custody. They then are responsible for the childs actions, even if left in the parents home.
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fenix Do you think I made it up?
LOL....no but as we have seen here time and time again....liberals and conservatives interrupt the exact same statements/see the issue MUCH differently. I'm saying that could be the case here.
Especially since you said you think he's insane [or something along that line] for what he said. I might totally disagree IF I could see his OWN words rather than your interruption of what you THINK he said.
"Whenever the nation is under attack, from within or without, liberals side with the enemy. This is their essence." --Ann Coulter
And why the American Voters chose to RE-elect President Bush to four more years. YES!!!
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classicrock000
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posted on November 2, 2005 12:47:30 PM new
"I thought you people were for law and order? "
Come on Ron, when did liberals EVER care about laws???? ROFLMAO!!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Beauty is only a light switch away
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shagmidmod
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posted on November 2, 2005 12:52:22 PM new
"Why didn't the democrats put a candidate up there that the people would actually vote for?"
I suppose we could ask the question about why the Republicans blocked investigations into voter irregularities in Florida and Ohio this last time around.
Why were voting machines tampered with? Why did they remove voting machines in heavily Democratic districts, where there are higher concentrations of people, particularly poor?
Why did the Republicans use cohersion and dirty tactics to dispute legally registered voters, only because they were Democrats?
Why did Scooter Libbey lie under oath, knowing that his actions would cost Bush the election, but by lying would postpone the investigation until after the elections?
Perhaps if you answer those questions, you will find the truth.
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WashingtoneBayer
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posted on November 2, 2005 12:57:33 PM new
You know rusty I just don't care.
I voted for our Libertarian cadidate. But I am glad the democratic person did not get in.
Ron
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fenix03
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posted on November 2, 2005 01:00:17 PM new
::Fenix you are so confused, where does it say this law is unconstitutional? Where?::
I'm not confused Ron - I am saying that I don't believe that when challenged it could possibly be found to be constitional. I have asked you to cite the aspect of the constition that would support such law buyt considering your notable lack of response to that question, I assume that you are not able to provide one.
::It is now relevent because YOU brought morals into the topic.::
Ah, but child labor has nothing to do with morality. It has to do with parents and employers that kept kids away from schools in order to put them to work dening them basic rights such as education. they also deal with the safety issues of handling machinery that would present a phsycal danger. Those are not moral issues, they are legal issues and they have nothing to do with a charge that would be leveled against a child.
::Are you saying that there should not be laws based on morals and should be declared unconstitutional?::
No, I do not believe that laws should be based on morals simply because there is no uniform standard of morality. In fact, when a judge bases thier decision based on person moral beliefs as opposed to constitionality it is generally reffered to as judicial activism and is something that conservatives consistantly argue against.
::Those were questions that were asked of you.::
Yes dear, but the big difference is that I actually answer the questions put to me and explain the rationale behind my answers as opposed to the general avoidance of relevent conversation.
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
An intelligent deaf-mute is better than an ignorant person who can speak.
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fenix03
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posted on November 2, 2005 01:08:45 PM new
LInda - Here's the only thing I could find. Unfortunately it does not include the actual text of the conversation.
Those that believe that this would never be upheld by a judge, please note that it states that the 12 and 13 years old involved were CONVICTED on first degree felonies.
# Impact Segment
Jessica's Law and Utah
Guest: Attorney Randy Richards
The Factor has been investigating states across America, urging them to protect children from sexual predators. The situation in Utah is unique - the state is lax in its attitude toward molesters, but extremely harsh on children who have sex with each other. Last year a 13-year old girl and 12-year old boy were convicted of first-degree felonies after engaging in intercourse and having a baby. Attorney Randy Richards, who represented the young girl, accused Utah authorities of having warped priorities. "I don't think they should punish the children - they need to help the children with counseling and classes. To slap a first degree punishment on these children is absurd." The Factor countered that some punishment is warranted. "I agree with you that these children are troubled and have to get help. But society has to send a message that this is just not permissible."
Edited to add.... O'Reilly is not the one I think is insane. I think he a bit self righteous and self serving at times but there are actually some things on which I agree with him. Sean Hannitty is the one whose brain I often feel has left the building (but I actually think that much of it is an act).
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
An intelligent deaf-mute is better than an ignorant person who can speak.
[ edited by fenix03 on Nov 2, 2005 01:09 PM ]
[ edited by fenix03 on Nov 2, 2005 01:16 PM ]
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WashingtoneBayer
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posted on November 2, 2005 02:03:45 PM new
Why do I need to support it? It is already law?
The constitution is not the be all end all, it is a guideline of what laws should be be, there is nothing in the constitution saying that this law cannot stand.
When someone is trying to tear something down the usual burden of proof is on them, not the other way around. I challenge you to find something in the constitution that would say this law is unconstitutional.
The majority of laws for children are nothing more than morals put on paper. Should we protect children- Yes, should they be punished when doing bad things- yes, Should we expect more from today's parents-yes.
Laws are for a reason. Somewhere or sometime someone decided this law needed to be enacted.
This child could be the example to other children there is a price to pay for something you should not be doing.
"But society has to send a message that this is just not permissible."
Ron
[ edited by WashingtoneBayer on Nov 2, 2005 02:05 PM ]
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dblfugger9
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posted on November 2, 2005 02:19:44 PM new
OHHH its UTAH! and OHHH, a third party (a baby) is involved (that their parents cannot support because they themselves probably cannot get a work permit.) What else is missing from this story? Are either one of them in jail, and if so, what has happened to the child?
And whatzamatter with you? You dont like the deal you got for the Pork Loin? Thats the 'other' white meat ya know! 
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fenix03
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posted on November 2, 2005 05:50:15 PM new
They did not say what happened to the kids. The baby is being cared my the parents of the mother, they did not say if the mother is at home or not.
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
An intelligent deaf-mute is better than an ignorant person who can speak.
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colin
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posted on November 3, 2005 01:22:23 PM new
Here's something all may find interesting.
It's the age of consent, worldwide and in the US.
[urlhttp://www.avert.org/aofconsent.htm[/url]
Personally I like them real young...Like in there early 40's.
Amen,
Reverend Colin
http://www.reverendcolin.com
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colin
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posted on November 3, 2005 01:27:38 PM new
Check out Canada. Them perverts.
Amen,
Reverend Colin
http://www.reverendcolin.com
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