posted on November 25, 2000 03:21:32 PM new
Would anyone here be willing to look at a possible case of shill bidding? They sell the same items, have the same pics for their auctions. I have emailed ebay repeatedly about them, but they just keep saying that there is no conclusive evidence linking the 5 accounts. I would like to know if I am seeing something in nothing, or if someone else thinks this is a shill ring. Let me know and I will email you.
posted on November 26, 2000 12:19:18 PM new
Looks to me like some people who probably know each other and who do business with each other, but there's nothing to indicate anything illicit going on. Lots of people do business with their friends and associates. Heck, that's a big part of business! I'd rather send money to someone I know than someone I don't know!
They share pics too. Several people I know who are my friends and who also sell same or similar items have blanket permission to use any of my pics at any time. Sometimes we buy and sell from each other as well. It's really pretty normal for people in the same business to know each other, and to cooperate with each other.
posted on November 26, 2000 12:35:22 PM new
hmmmmm...very interesting that one set of sellers bids on the other sellers auctions, when they have sold the identical item in the past. Why would one seller bid on the other sellers auctions, not winning most of the time, of course, if they already have that item. Makes no sense to me.
posted on November 26, 2000 01:31:03 PM newsnowydays-
Why would one seller bid on the other sellers auctions, not winning most of the time, of course, if they already have that item. Makes no sense to me.
I often bid on items that I already have which are listed by other sellers, because I know if I win the auction at my price, I will be able to re-sell the item and make some money. Most of the time, I don't win because other buyers come along who are willing to pay more than me. Occasionally, I get a good deal, though.
Do you think that I am doing anything wrong? If so, why?
edited... spelling
[ edited by mrpotatoheadd on Nov 26, 2000 01:32 PM ]
posted on November 26, 2000 02:34:28 PM newsnowydays-
You might want to re-read my previous post. I did not say that I want to sell a bunch of (whatever), for a dollar or two then turn around and buy some more for that same price from another seller.
What I did say was that I sometimes will bid on (and win) items at a price that allows me to re-sell them at a profit.
You didn't answer me before, so I'll ask again... Do you think that I am doing anything wrong? If so, why?
posted on November 26, 2000 03:32:05 PM new
God forbid.
Snowydays, I can't see anything wrong so far. Slightly oddball, yes, but oddball ain't unethical. Yes, one of the persons involved is probably the same person behind three or four ids, but there is no intersection of bidding with those ids, or bidding and selling with those ids. As far as the picture thing, well? Like I said, oddball but not unethical.
posted on November 26, 2000 03:34:19 PM newsnowydays-
I didn't mean to jump down your throat over this. It's just that there seems to be a lot of activity lately regarding "auction investigations" by unofficial user groups, consisting of anonymous individuals, and I find this somewhat troubling.
There are those who seem to enjoy searching for evil-doers (netcops, or virtual dicks, perhaps. My new motto- Just say NO! to vd), and causing them as much trouble as they can. If this was as far as things went, I wouldn't be too concerned, but there is the distinct possibility that innocent people will be tarred with the same brush, and suffer for it.
The fact that some are breaking the rules does not justify actions that have the potential to harm the innocent.
edited to add... hit enter too soon
[ edited by mrpotatoheadd on Nov 26, 2000 03:36 PM ]
posted on November 26, 2000 04:14:35 PM new
snowydays
I'm against this kind of witch hunt. If you look at something long enough and hard enough you are likely to see a conspiracy in every corner. If you play MR Ed albums backward you are also likely to hear satanic messages.....
It is best, unless it personally involves you, that you just leave it alone....
posted on November 26, 2000 04:27:03 PM new
I can show you the sorted file of all the auction numbers. There is nothing there that is more than coincidence, as far as I can tell. I probably put far more time into it than someone in Safeharbor would be able to, and I found nothing extremely out of the ordinary.
posted on November 26, 2000 05:38:12 PM new
Hello MrPotatoHeadd,
I'll answer the question you raised. I don't think bidding on an item that you might resell at a profit to yourself is wrong.
I do think however, that a group of sellers who share pictures, auction descriptions and other auction related "materials" should not bid on each other's auctions.
If sellers share so much in common then they certainly share the knowledge of what those items might normally be expected to fetch at auction.
That being the case, your otherwise perfectly legitimate rationale of bidding on an item to resell for a profit comes very close to shilling the item up to or over its legitimate value.
In effect a group of sellers who bid on each others' like items amounts to price fixing. Or shilling. Or whatever term one cares to apply to the practice.
Hello SnowyDays,
If you have emailed eBay repeatedly about your suspicions and eBay has declined to reach the same conclusion you have about possible shilling, I suggest you give it up pending newer or more conclusive evidence.
posted on November 26, 2000 07:25:46 PM new
Sheesh, go away for a few hours and come back to an editfest. :lol
Bottom line~
There is nothing that looks like shilling going on with those accounts!
The standard of not engaging in any activity that might APPEAR to be illicit, whether it is or not, is not a reasonable standard. More information is available about online transactions than offline, and that CAN make things look suspicious, especially if you have a suspicious nature or lack a thorough understanding of the nature of business relationships and how there are many 'gray' areas in appearance that are completely reasonable and ethical in practice.
D
