posted on April 21, 2006 10:51:39 AM new
Georgia may OK Bible as textbook
If a new law passes, it would be the first state to establish the Bible in its public school curriculum in modern times.
By Patrik Jonsson | Staff writer of The Christian Science Monitor
ATLANTA – Decatur High School student Kurt Hughes wouldn't call himself religious. He's never even read the Bible.
But he wouldn't mind taking a class on the holy text if it were offered at his high school in Decatur, Ga. After all, "You look at 'The Old Man and the Sea,' 'King Arthur' and even 'The Matrix,' all have biblical allusions," the junior says. "It'd be useful to know exactly what's in it."
The Georgia legislature seems poised to endorse just such a course. Though students in many states enroll in classes related to the Bible, Georgia would become the first to require its Department of Education to put in place a curriculum to teach the history and literature of the Bible. Schools would use the book itself as the classroom textbook. Specifically the bill would establish electives on both the New and Old Testaments.
It has overwhelmingly passed both chambers, but needs a final vote on a minor House change. The vote is expected as early as Monday. If it passes, the state's Department of Education has a year to establish Bible elective courses in the curriculum.
In the late 1700s, Congress thought enough of the Bible as a textbook that it printed 40,000 copies. But the bold effort here in Georgia to use the Bible in today's secular curricula may be about presenting it as a moral code rather than a foundation to better understand the biblical allusions in literature, critics say.
"Behind this is the tension around the country about how to go about doing a Bible elective, and a lot is at stake," says Charles Haynes, director of the First Amendment Center in Arlington, Va.
The Bible is already being used as a course study in as many as 1,000 American high schools, according to the National Council on Bible Curriculum in Public Schools in Greensboro, N.C. The US Supreme Court allows it as long as it's presented objectively, and not taught as fact. But the Georgia legislature's unprecedented decision to wade into what is usually a school district initiative has created concerns.
For example, the bill's use of terms such as Old and New Testament reflect a Protestant bias, some critics say. After all, Catholics and Jews have different interpretations and names for the tome. "To pick one is to suggest that is the right Bible, which is a school district making a faith statement," says Judith Schaeffer, a lawyer for People For the American Way, which works to maintain the separation of church and state.
Others worry that this trend - Alabama and Missouri are also considering statewide Bible study classes - is part of the broader culture war over the role of religion in civic life, and seeks to satisfy social conservatives rather than enlighten students.
"This is a political issue as much as it is a religious issue," says Frances Paterson, a professor at Valdosta State University who specializes in religion and public education. "I would guess that [its sponsors] hope that nobody is going to police this, and when people step over the line, it's going to be ignored, either because nobody's aware of it or they'd be intimidated into not objecting."
Its sponsors insist the bill aims to help students gain broader understanding about the underpinnings of Western culture, from Michelangelo to Hemingway.
"The biggest misconception is that this teaches the Bible when, in fact, it uses the Bible as the primary text to teach a course in history and literature influenced by the Bible," says a spokesman for Sen. Tommie Williams (R), the bill's sponsor.
The Bible was the most quoted source for the Founding Fathers, Bible scholars say.
The "New England Primer," with its heavy reliance on scriptural texts to teach reading and comprehension, instructed all presidents until James Garfield, according to Kenyn Cureton, of the Southern Baptist Convention, who studies early textbooks in US history.
"It's amazing that we have jettisoned the Bible from the classroom when it is the foundation of the Republic," says Dr. Cureton, a spokesman for the Convention with headquarters in Nashville, Tenn.
Many parents, however, may object to using the Bible as a textbook since doing so may expose their children to the book's various interpretations and criticism, some say.
"A great many people in Georgia are conservative Protestants who take the Bible literally, and that's going to be a problem if you have an academic study of the Bible...." says Dr. Paterson.
posted on April 21, 2006 11:03:46 AM new
Just another step in the CHRISTIAN TALIBAN'S crusade to establish a theocratic dictatorship in the U.S. based on their particular beliefs...
posted on April 21, 2006 12:31:49 PM new
Most introductory college classes in world literature include the Iliad, Homer and the Bible along with other mythology. But the class mentioned in this case in which only the Bible is taught and only the Bible is used as a textbook in the politically conservative Bible Belt is obviously a religious intrusion masquerading as a literature class.
posted on April 21, 2006 01:18:14 PM new
Does it matter? How will this effect the burger flipping skills of future grads? Will we be able to take the pictures off of the cash register buttons?
__________
The raghead fig-puckers are fighting to spread their culture and religion, and to destroy ours
posted on April 21, 2006 02:59:31 PM new
Another step in the dumbing down of the USA... (sad, so sad) but fortunately China which will soon be the world's largest economy and largely educated! I'm glad I can read and write Chinese & Japanese
posted on April 21, 2006 03:26:07 PM new
And the religious beliefs of the Chinese and Japanese and all other religions including Hindu, Buddhism, Navajo etc etc will be taught- if taught - under the heading of Mythology. I for one could never understand why the bible is taught as the literal truth and others quite different are considered myths.
buyhigh
posted on April 21, 2006 03:51:30 PM new
I guess my main question would be... is it an english ellective or a history elective?
If it is a history elective, I have a problem. If it is an english elective and the classes focus on it as literature, I don't see the harm. If the circiculum goes into moral judgement, etc, then I have an issue.
Taught as a book, and offered as an elective I just don't see where it's any diferent than a class on Shakespeare.
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
People put their hand on the bible, and swear to uphold the constitution. They do not put their hand on the constitution, and swear to uphold the bible.
posted on April 21, 2006 04:09:14 PM new
Cannot see how it can be taught as a history elective since there is no proof that the occurances recorded in the Old Testament and the New for that matter ever happened. There is only faith that they occurred because the bible was written long after and no archaeological proof has ever been unearthed to substantiate the claims. Like The Odyssey and the Iliad,should think Literature would be more appropriate.
buyhigh
posted on April 21, 2006 04:23:59 PM new"I would guess that [its sponsors] hope that nobody is going to police this, and when people step over the line, it's going to be ignored, either because nobody's aware of it or they'd be intimidated into not objecting."
Ya think??
____________________________________________
posted on April 21, 2006 07:04:10 PM new
I totally agree with this being done in every state.
The liberals here who live in apparent constant FEAR of our children being taught anything MORAL....rather than taught to accept all the immoral stuff the left presses to teach them....are not acknowledging that this is to be "AN ELECTIVE course". NO one is being FORCED to take this class. So....imo, if they WANT to take it to learn more about the Bible....it should be offered to them.
All this garbage about that lawsuit filed by two gay professors because a student was given a 'recommendation list' of books to read...that isn't favorable, didn't PRAISE and offer acceptance] to the gay agenda.....shows that the left ONLY wants what THEY approve of to be ALLOWED.
Imo, that's nothing more than CENSORSHIP.
Let the students have a choice. Stop the liberals from taking away THEIR choices, one by one.
---------
And the State of GA has been making GREAT strides in the new laws they've been passing that will no longer allow illegals to be given most taxpayer funded benefits.
YOU GO GEORGIA....hope many states follow your WONDERFUL example. That's the way America should be....used to be...until the liberals started CENSORING what they don't agree with.
While the democratic party complains about everything THIS President does to protect our Nation:
What would a Democrat president have done at that point? Apparently, the answer is: Sit back and wait for the next terrorist attack.
Ann Coulter
posted on April 21, 2006 08:01:24 PM new
Sorry. I know you have an agenda but I fail to see where liberals even enter into the picture of what is being discussed. Lots of bible thumpers are liberals and as far as the President protecting our nation, I think he has sold the people out to his friends! I am an independent and have no party loyalties by the way.
buyhigh
posted on April 21, 2006 08:21:48 PM newYOU GO GEORGIA....hope many states follow your WONDERFUL example. That's the way America should be....used to be...until the liberals started CENSORING what they don't agree with.
Isn't Georgia the state that outlaws vibrators and didn't they also outlaw some body piercings? Are other states following Georgia's WONDERFUL example and outlawing vibrators also? Would you like to see them outlawed all across America, lindak? What about Arkansas? Do they still allow them there?
posted on April 21, 2006 08:56:56 PM new
I don't know Kiara but if you say so it must be right.
Yes other southern states are going to go the same route. Governor Purdue also said he was going to put the 10 commandments back up where they should be. Should be interesting to see what happens.
_________________
posted on April 21, 2006 11:38:46 PM new
Yes, Libra. I agree it will be VERY interesting as each of these issues goes before our USSC. Especially now with two more true constitutionalists on board.
We'll see what THEY think the constitution would think about having all these religious things banned from public life.
NOT forced....but banned....by the atheists and secular crowd.
AND it's still my hope that another of our USSC justices retires so that this administration can put another constructionist/constitutionalist judge in that court.
posted on April 22, 2006 07:27:45 AM new
::The liberals here who live in apparent constant FEAR of our children being taught anything MORAL....rather than taught to accept all the immoral stuff the left presses to teach them....are not acknowledging that this is to be "AN ELECTIVE course".::
Damn - and here I even used the word Elective TWICE in my very first sentence just to show that I really do understand that it's an elective course.
As for schools teaching morality - Sorry Linda but THAT is not the schools job. Besides, it seems that the schools are having a hard enough time teaching kids how to read and do math... why don't we let them work on succeeding at their first responsibility before we try to add more?
Put it this way Linda - if all teachers are just a bunch or liberal radicals trying to indoctrinate the youth of today as you so frequently claim... do you REALLY want them instructing the youth of today on morality?
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
People put their hand on the bible, and swear to uphold the constitution. They do not put their hand on the constitution, and swear to uphold the bible.
[ edited by fenix03 on Apr 22, 2006 07:29 AM ]
posted on April 22, 2006 08:09:29 AM new
Fenix, your patience and skill in dealing with inconsistencies and bad reasoning is invaluable here. Such lack of critical thinking ability can't be easily ignored when that is all there is.
posted on April 22, 2006 08:42:18 AM new
Fenix I don't agree. I do think most teachers are liberals. Teachers are unionized and follow the leaders of their union. Which are liberals. Teachers don't bend to help all they do is complain. Teachers are hired to do a job and should not put their perspective in the class. They are supposed to teach the curriculum and I find that most teachers, yes I said most, don't do that. All they worry about is their pay and their benefits. Now don't get me wrong all teachers are not like that but most are. The school boards are geared to those teachers. You never see teachers voting until the school board election and then they come and vote the person most likely to follow their agenda so they can get what they want. I wish I had been a teacher. They have good salaries, GREAT benefits a very good retirement and they dress like crap. They were dressing so bad here the administration had implement a dress code. They were dressing worse that the students. If they can't control their classroom then that is their fault and nobody elses. Teachers don't get respect because they don't give respect to the tax payer. The people that pay their salary.
_________________
posted on April 22, 2006 09:06:02 AM new
No fenix I would like the teachers to teach what they are supposed to teach, which I believe they don't. Why do you think there is so much home schooling? Because they don't want their children mixed in with the rif raf that are hard to control. As for schools teaching morality - Sorry Linda but THAT is not the schools job.
What is the schools job to tell a pregnant student where to get an abortion. Yes they do that without parents permission.
Have students bring letters home from the class room instructing the parent to vote a certain way. Yes, that also happens. Students wearing badges promoting the ideas of the teachers. Yes, that also happens.
Why do parents send their children to religous schools?
posted on April 22, 2006 09:21:10 AM new
LIbra - you just spent an entire post talking about how devoid of responsibility and the ability to dress properly teachers are but you don't have a problem with them teaching morality?
As for the second post.... Why do you think there is so much home schooling?
From what I have seen - because parents seem to think that locking their kids in the house and teaching them only what they want them to know is good way to prepare them for the real worlds. Don't even get me started on the stupidity of that concept.
What is the schools job to tell a pregnant student where to get an abortion. Yes they do that without parents permission.
Do you HONESTLY believe there is a teenager alive today that doesn't know about the existance of Planned Parenthood?
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
People put their hand on the bible, and swear to uphold the constitution. They do not put their hand on the constitution, and swear to uphold the bible.
posted on April 22, 2006 09:25:05 AM new
Thank you Helen
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
People put their hand on the bible, and swear to uphold the constitution. They do not put their hand on the constitution, and swear to uphold the bible.
posted on April 22, 2006 09:34:16 AM newFenix, your patience and skill in dealing with inconsistencies and bad reasoning is invaluable here. Such lack of critical thinking ability can't be easily ignored when that is all there is.
oh barf!!
From what I have seen - because parents seem to think that locking their kids in the house and teaching them only what they want them to know is good way to prepare them for the real worlds..
What Tv show did you seen' it on? Or should kids get shuffled around so much (like you) that the Media is their babysitter and only thing that talks to them? Its obvious you resent parents that actually want to raise' their kids and instill a foundation in them.
posted on April 22, 2006 10:04:44 AM new
What's wrong Dble - you afraid that no one would remember what a pathetic attention starved creature you are, so you decided to poke your head in for the morning just to show how completely irrlevent and desperate you are? Don''t worry... we remember. You can go crawl back in your hole now.
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
People put their hand on the bible, and swear to uphold the constitution. They do not put their hand on the constitution, and swear to uphold the bible.
posted on April 22, 2006 10:39:11 AM newDo you HONESTLY believe there is a teenager alive today that doesn't know about the existance of Planned Parenthood? Yes
If they knew about it why would they would go to the teacher for advice? There is an abortion clinic just over our state line where they are directed to. Not Planned Parenthood. It is a fact not a myth. The student tells a stranger because it is easier to face them than their parents.
From what I have seen - because parents seem to think that locking their kids in the house and teaching them only what they want them to know is good way to prepare them for the real worlds. Don't even get me started on the stupidity of that concept.
What have you seen fenix. You move around so much and you are such devoted to your business you have no concept about home schooling. No I don't believe that about home schooling. Do you know they have to follow a curriculm as dictated by the state? They do take the test the public school students take. Iowa Test. They home school so that the child gets subjects they need to succeed in life. Who knows better than a parent as to what the child should learn. You have some problem with home schooling. Obviously you don't know what home schoolers do. How they conduct their classes and what they do about extra curricular activities. Granted some do it for convenience most others do it because they want the best education for their children. They don't get that in Public school because there are to many interruptions.
I believe there should be NO electives in schools. You can't go to Charter School and take what you want and you can't go to religious schools to get what you want. But the public school lets the student take stupid classes and then wonders why they can't pass the test.
Evidently fenix you know a lot about nothing. Why not have children so you can see what happens. Why not get involved in the education of the children as you seem to know everything. Well fenix when you get educated about the public school system you can crawl out your hole.
posted on April 22, 2006 12:57:07 PM new
Libra - what are you now - Dbles alter ego - you think you know something about me?
I move and so it's impossible for me to know people? Interesting concept you have there. And since you have "known" me I have moved exactly I believe three times - two of those moves were within the same square mile (into a loft and then out because it flooded every time it rained) and the third was back to an area where I formerly lived for 13 years.
Evidently fenix you know a lot about nothing.
I think you might want to re-evaluate who that comment applies to. You did a whole lot of assuming of what I do and don't know about home schooling there girl and you know what they say about assuming.
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
People put their hand on the bible, and swear to uphold the constitution. They do not put their hand on the constitution, and swear to uphold the bible.
[ edited by fenix03 on Apr 22, 2006 12:57 PM ]
posted on April 22, 2006 02:52:51 PM new
Yes we know a lot about you as you come into this board and tell us. It is no secret.
What I have learned about you, from you is that you are always right.
I see you didn't comment on what I said about Planned Parenthood and teachers directing students to abortion and not either to their parents or Planned Parenthood
I also didn't see comments about Home Schooling. Is is because you know nothing about home schooling.
Yes I know about assume but I don't know about assuming.
posted on April 22, 2006 04:39:03 PM new
Libra - I cannot tell you how amusing I find it that the woman that lives in Utopia is sitting at a keyboard telling me about why lack of knowledge about the real world.
Anyone that believes that teachers are a young girls first source of information on sexual related matters is just flat out not living in the real world.
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
People put their hand on the bible, and swear to uphold the constitution. They do not put their hand on the constitution, and swear to uphold the bible.
posted on April 22, 2006 07:20:29 PM newWhat's wrong Dble - you afraid that no one would remember what a pathetic attention starved creature you are, BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH
Youre the pathetic one fenix..you live your fricken young life through tv and the media. Then you claim to be a liberal but your idea is a million bucks to you for your ebay ahem ahem consultation fee, like a republican.
I thank God everyday I am not a creep azz fuxed up abused child like you! Get back in your box jacko-isnt there something you should be toying with inside one of them??
ewww!!
[ edited by dblfugger9 on Apr 22, 2006 07:27 PM ]
posted on April 22, 2006 07:24:15 PM newLibra - what are you now - Dbles alter ego - you think you know something about me?
Tell you one thing that is not hard to know' or read about you fenixdickless -- you, who has no children, the oh so gay liberalese', cannot stand the fact that people have the right to raise their OWN children they way they see fit. You just cant fuxing stand it! because YOU -- are the real control nazii freak and it if not your way its distasteful. You-- who lives inside a media incoming box of some 24/7 kind an thinks she has half a clue about social commentary of any thing in a Real life..ppfst....
posted on April 22, 2006 07:42:04 PM new
Oh I've agreed, in the past, that schools SHOULD just teach the basics. Even put a link on here one time, not that long ago, that was in regard to some schools districts that are doing just that. And the lefties had a FIT.
-------
As far as teaching Biblical history....it WILL automatically teach morals, imo.
And since the liberals and the teachers unions are so fixsated on teaching MORALS already....THEIR morals...then I see no problem with introducing the 'other' side.
Like now in Mass...the teachers are reading books to their elementary students about 'gay families'.....gay unions....etc. Condoning THAT lifestyle and treating it as 'normal moral behavior'....when to many it's NOT. AND the parents don't HAVE an opt-out choice when they don't agree with that being taught to their children. NOPE....since the 'all knowing, self rightous LIBERAL JUDGES decided to allow 'gay marriage' in their state' NO parent can object to this being taught in their schools.
So I won't be believing our children aren't already being taught the liberal morals/values....because we can clearly see that they ARE.
While the democratic party complains about everything THIS President does to protect our Nation:
What would a Democrat president have done at that point? Apparently, the answer is: Sit back and wait for the next terrorist attack.
Ann Coulter
didn't PRAISE and offer acceptance] to the gay agenda.....shows that the left ONLY wants what THEY approve of to be ALLOWED.
