posted on April 18, 2007 10:48:31 AM new
by John W. Lillpop
In response to the tragic massacre at Virginia Tech, liberals were prepared to renew their clarion call for more strict gun control laws.
That plan was scrapped when it was disclosed that Virginia Tech already has a no-guns policy in place.
Perhaps Cho Seung-Hui was unaware of the stringent anti-gun rules on campus? If only he had known, things might have been different.
As if someone sick enough to subject 32 innocent people to cold-blooded murder, and then blow his own brains out, would stop to worry about violating gun control laws!
How about the assisted suicide gambit that liberals are constantly promoting?
If only Virginia had an assisted suicide law in place, Cho Seung-Hui would have been able to stroll into a physician's office and get whatever combination of pills and or injections needed to end his miserable existence.
Forget the fact that Cho Seung-Hui was only 23. He obviously deserved to die with dignity, and without all that humiliating news coverage.
Perhaps Cho Seung-Hui was despondent over the fact that he was not getting a tax refund from the IRS this year, even though he probably paid no taxes?
Another example of how the Bush tax cuts for the rich and powerful bite the little guy squarely in the posterior.
Further, one must not overlook the fact Cho Seung-Hui was a person of color. Being a little guy and a racial minority in America these days exposes one to constant discrimination and loss of self-esteem.
Finally, George W. Bush and his "shock and awe" swagger have caused impressionable young people like Cho Seung-Hui to rely on violence rather than diplomacy for conflict resolution.
What is the liberal solution to this quagmire?
First, repeal the Second Amendment, and replace it with a new constitutional amendment outlawing all dangerous weapons everywhere in the United States.
Secondly, require that assisted suicide be made available to any distressed person contemplating the murder of ten or more innocent people.
Thirdly, repeal all Bush tax cuts, retroactively, and revise the tax code so as to send every college student $1,500 on April 15 each year, and
Fourth, expunge the terms "shock and awe" and "war on terror" from the English vernacular.
Throw in the impeachment of George Bush and you have a perfectly consistent "solution" from the left to one of the most vexing issues facing contemporary America.
It is foolish and wrong to mourn the men who died. Rather we should thank God that such men lived.George S. Patton
posted on April 18, 2007 08:34:14 PM new
NRA HQ in Virginia have already stated that the prohibition on carrying guns on campus probably resulted in more loss of life. Had law abiding Virginians been able to carry guns on campus they could have stopped the gunman quicker rather than waited for the police to respond...
As for the huge disparity between gun-related deaths in the USA and Canada, the NRA spokesperson declined to comment, saying in closing that, "Guns don't kill people - people kill people".
posted on April 18, 2007 09:11:32 PM new
The Americans value their constitution and the U.S. Constitution's Second Amendment deals with the right to bear arms. Here is the price that ordinary Americans are paying for the privilege
- 8 children a day die in murders, suicides and accidents involving guns
- since John F. Kennedy was assinated more Americans have died from gunshot wounds at home than died in all the wars of the 20th century
- Osama bin Laden would need at least nine twin towers like attacks each year to equal what Americans do to themselves every year with guns.
- Murder rates in LA, NY and Chigago were approaching the hightest in the world (30 per 100,000) until moves were made in late 20th century to restrict access to guns to teenagers
posted on April 19, 2007 01:23:20 AM new
I for one believe we should get rid of all cars, trucks, SUVs, etc.
After all...thousands of Americans kill each other every year with those bad machines. Back to bicycles I say.
=====
The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration releases its latest statistics:
43,443 people were killed on streets and highways in the United States in 2005, the most since 1990, and overall fatality rate climbed for the first time in 20 years, to 1.47 deaths per 100 million miles traveled.
<snip>
In conjunction with the World Bank, the WHO forecast that by 2020, road traffic injuries would become the third most prevalent cause of worldwide death or injury-related disability and would rank sixth among all causes of death.
It is estimated that more than 1.2 million people die each year in traffic mishaps around the world.
That's 3200 people each day, 7 days a week, 365 days a year, year after year after - and that statistic doesn't include the some 50 million others who are injured in motor vehicle crashes.
And it's not just the people driving or riding in those vehicles who contribute to the traffic toll. Of the more than 40,000 fatalities in one recent year on American roads, 4700 of those killed were pedestrians and another 4100 were riding motorcycles.
Some 12 percent of fatalities involved collisions between light (cars, trucks, sport utility vehicles) and large (semis, buses, etc.) vehicles.
===
On second thought....maybe we should get back to riding horses.
posted on April 19, 2007 06:25:21 AM new
::I for one believe we should get rid of all cars, trucks, SUVs, etc.::
Damn... How is it that you accuse liberals of making dumb arguements and then somehow are able to garner the nerve to offer that up?
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
People put their hand on the bible, and swear to uphold the constitution. They do not put their hand on the constitution, and swear to uphold the bible.
posted on April 19, 2007 06:57:41 AM new
A firearm is a tool, just like many other items, all of which when misused is capable of causing death.
CC since you are a spouting statistics:
According to public records firearms are used 2.5 MILLION times a year for defense purposes, that is four times MORE that in criminal uses, equating to 2,575 lives saved and protected.
And National Safety Records show that the number of accidental firearms deaths is at its lowest point since records were first started a hundred years ago.
Also over 50000 people are bitten by poisionious snakes in the US each year, does that mean you advocate the extermination of all of those species of snake because of their potential to cause death?
World wide over 120000 people die each year from snake bites, I dont see the UN proposing a ban of snakes.
It is foolish and wrong to mourn the men who died. Rather we should thank God that such men lived.George S. Patton
[ edited by Bear1949 on Apr 19, 2007 07:02 AM ]
posted on April 19, 2007 07:20:36 AM new
::And National Safety Records show that the number of accidental firearms deaths is at its lowest point since records were first started a hundred years ago.::
Just out of curiosity Bear - do you think ythat is because peope are suddenly more voluntarily responsible or because access is more restricted and because in the absense of ability to pass more restrictive carry and ownership laws in many areas, lawmakers have at least been able to agree on laws regarding things such as childproof locks n such?
(Since I've noticed a tendency towards the loaded question while reading this morning, I want to point out - this is an honest question Bear. I really am curious what you think the reason is for the drop in those numbers)
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
People put their hand on the bible, and swear to uphold the constitution. They do not put their hand on the constitution, and swear to uphold the bible.
posted on April 19, 2007 07:23:32 AM newAlso over 50000 people are bitten by poisionious snakes in the US each year, does that mean you advocate the extermination of all of those species of snake because of their potential to cause death?
Absolutely. I think I would look fantastic in a pair of knee high Black Mamba boots.
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
People put their hand on the bible, and swear to uphold the constitution. They do not put their hand on the constitution, and swear to uphold the bible.
posted on April 19, 2007 07:58:46 AM new
For those that believe it is your right to own a gun - if the government said "we will issue you a gun that will meet your right to own a gun any other type of gun will be illegal", would you be happy, if so what type of gun would you expect that to be?
Absolute faith has been shown, consistently, to breed intolerance. And intolerance, history teaches us, again and again, begets violence.
---------------------------------- The duty of a patriot in this time and place is to ask questions, to demand answers, to understand where our nation is headed and why. If the answers you get do not suit you, or if they frighten you, or if they anger you, it is your duty as a patriot to dissent. Freedom does not begin with blind acceptance and with a flag. Freedom begins when you say 'No.'
Absolute faith has been shown, consistently, to breed intolerance. And intolerance, history teaches us, again and again, begets violence.
---------------------------------- The duty of a patriot in this time and place is to ask questions, to demand answers, to understand where our nation is headed and why. If the answers you get do not suit you, or if they frighten you, or if they anger you, it is your duty as a patriot to dissent. Freedom does not begin with blind acceptance and with a flag. Freedom begins when you say 'No.'
posted on April 19, 2007 08:40:44 AM new
Look who's back.
Good to 'see' you again, fenix. I was just talking about you, without mentioning your name, this past week.
Fill us in on what you've been up to.
And to answer your post....it's true. Exactly what Bear said. Guns are 'tools'....no different than cars or hundreds of other 'tools' that could be used to the same SICK end.
Bombs attached to their bodies comes to mind to me as the BIGGEST alternative that could be used.
posted on April 19, 2007 08:49:54 AM new
"Also over 50000 people are bitten by poisionious snakes in the US each year, does that mean you advocate the extermination of all of those species of snake because of their potential to cause death?"
Snakes are not weapons--they are part of the natural environment. This is a ridiculous argument---apples and oranges. Stricter gun regulations may prevent some of the gun deaths which occur year after year. This would not be a ban, but more careful record keeping and stricter rules. In some states it is easier to get a gun than a dog license.
posted on April 19, 2007 09:31:21 AM new
They MAY? coincoach?
Proof is in the areas where they have banned guns....and their crime rates, using guns, is HIGHER than many of those where citizens are allowed their constitutional rights.
Why do dems/liberals want to take away our const. rights? The same rights that have just been upheld in court decisions?
Yet they CLAIM that other rights are being taken from them....those that are used to protect us against those who wish to destroy our Nation.
posted on April 19, 2007 10:27:58 AM new
Don't fool yourself, Linda. "Others" are not so dumb that they don't see who among us fails to provide links to reliable news sources or who refuses to answer questions or who can only defend themselves with personal attacks. Don't underestimate the intelligence of your perceived audience of "others".
If you respond as if you are being read by reasonable, thinking people maybe your remarks will make better sense.
posted on April 19, 2007 11:05:50 AM new
::Good to 'see' you again, fenix. I was just talking about you, without mentioning your name, this past week.::
Hopefully in a good way
::Fill us in on what you've been up to.::
I think when last I was around I mentioned that I had met an amazing artist that I was working with. We are still working together, and the business is really starting to fall into place. Unfortunately that is all coming to a halt for awhile while I deal with some medical issues that got dropped in my lap during a check up. Could be interesting. Next couple weeks will tell me if it is a non issue (wishful thinking)or if I may be able to give you some first hand stories of attempting to navigate the medical industry with minimal income, no insurance, and the need for major surgery. Life just doesn't seem to ever get boring... no matter how enticing the idea of boring may be at times
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
People put their hand on the bible, and swear to uphold the constitution. They do not put their hand on the constitution, and swear to uphold the bible.
posted on April 19, 2007 11:22:04 AM new
Linda, I never said anything about banning guns---that it impossible to do in this country. I am talking about strict gun control, a national system of some kind to make sure anyone with violent mental health issues, as well as felons, are not able to obtain guns legally.
posted on April 19, 2007 11:31:08 AM new
fenix - OF COURSE it was. I referred to our contests on who was the 'queen of run-on sentences'.
This was when some were AGAIN commenting on my spelling and typing errors.
Surgery? ooh. I hope you find a way. Others have...and depending on your circumstances you will be successful.
======
CC - I didn't say YOU did.
But others ARE doing exactly that.
IF you read this seung-hui story, in full, then you would know that those 'controls' are already in place. They just weren't used against him. No one had the guts to actually charge him with any of this previous 'crimes' and so there was no record of his past 'crazy' behaviors/actions.
So what I'm saying is that those laws are already there....they just weren't used as they're meant to be used.
posted on April 19, 2007 11:37:02 AM new
As to 2 favorite Left wing bleats:
1) More people are killed in the US with guns than in Southern Latvia, etc (fill in blank).
Psychological studies have shown that murder (as well as most crime rates) is dramatically less in homogeneous populations. A Japanese will rarely point a gun in another Japanese face and pull the trigger. In the US, everybody is "somebody else" and there is no such restraint.
2) XX people just got killed. We need 5 new gun laws. Since in almost all of these incidents a dozen "gun laws" are being broken, why do these people think the criminal will not break a dozen + 5??? Gun laws are like door locks, they only impede honest people.
posted on April 19, 2007 01:03:03 PM new
The man was in a mental hospital for several days. Why wasn't that information available to check by the gun seller? The controls ont he books need to be taken more seriously.
posted on April 19, 2007 01:50:26 PM newLinda, I never said anything about banning guns---that it impossible to do in this country. I am talking about strict gun control, a national system of some kind to make sure anyone with violent mental health issues, as well as felons, are not able to obtain guns legally.
Wow are you out of touch. Those laws already exist. New laws is not the answer here. This case is simply a case where this guy went nuts and he was going to go on a killing spree laws or no laws. There was nothing that could have been done in this case to prevent all of the killings.
Maybe there would have been less deaths had the police responded per protocall, but to put myself in their shoes, I probably would have done the same thing.
.
.
.
If it's called common sense, why do so few Demomorons have it?
posted on April 19, 2007 02:11:21 PM new
Fenix, I too was thinking about you, wondering if you had thawed out yet.
I believe that more people have become more responsible in allowing access of firearms to young children. Some of which is due to providing firearms handling and training and to many states and cities enacting ordinances requiring the firearms be placed under lock & key to prevent access by children (without adult supervision).
As to the knee high Black Mamba boots, please attach a photo.
Why wasn't that information available to check by the gun seller? The controls ont he books need to be taken more seriously.
Because the drs released him to be treated on a out patient basis & THE FACT THE TWO WOMEN DID NOT PRESS STALKING CHARGES AGAINST HIM. Had he been committed to a mental institution or HAD THE STALKING CHARGES FILED AGAINST HIM, that info would have been entered into the FBI / NCIC database that is used to clear potential purchasers of firearms.
It is foolish and wrong to mourn the men who died. Rather we should thank God that such men lived.George S. Patton
posted on April 19, 2007 04:25:02 PM new
"Wow are you out of touch. Those laws already exist" I beg to differ...
A federal assault weapons ban that stayed on the books for 10 years outlawed clips with a capacity of more than 10 rounds, but Congress allowed that ban to expire in 2004
What is known is that when Cho signed his application at the gun shop to buy a Glock 19 handgun and 50 rounds of ammunition, he left blank the question that asked whether he ever been treated or examined for mental illness. There was no registry giving the gun shop owner that information because a registry had been rejected in Congress by pro-gun supporters.
Roanoke Firearms owner John Markell told the Pittsburgh Press-Gazette, "He was a nice, clean-cut college kid. We won't sell a gun if we have any idea at all that a purchase is suspicious."
Gun control advocates say that's the point: Shop owners can't read minds; a registry could have served as a warning.
posted on April 19, 2007 04:36:39 PM new
coincoach said:
"The man was in a mental hospital for several days. Why wasn't that information available to check by the gun seller?"
Because the liberals so wanted 'stricter PRIVACY laws'. No gun dealer can get information on anyone from their medical files....nor their doctors. They have to follow the 'process' set in place.
"The controls ont he books need to be taken more seriously."
Oh. but they ARE. The penalties to gun sellers are QUITE harsh....as Bear has mentioned above. Most aren't willing to take that chance.....and can cover their rears by FOLLOWING the laws.
posted on April 19, 2007 04:53:00 PM new
A federal assault weapons ban that stayed on the books for 10 years outlawed clips with a capacity of more than 10 rounds, but Congress allowed that ban to expire in 2004
Wrong, that bill outlawed in IMPORTATION of high capacity magazines. Those already in the US and those manufactured my US companies were not affected. During that time period I sold hundreds of "high capacity" (over 10 round capacity), for AK's, SKS's, AR-15's, FAL's and other semi auto weapons. The only high cap mags I (and others) could not sell (or purchase) were those marked "L.E.O,"
Another thing, before spouting you supposed knowledge of firearms, you need to learn the correct terminology. Pistols and rifles do not use "clips" to feed ammunition into the chamber. Clips are used to store ammunition and feed it into a "magazine", the magazine is then inserted into the weapon allowing ammunition to be fed into the chamber.
There was no registry giving the gun shop owner that information because a registry had been rejected in Congress by pro-gun supporters.
Wrong again, the shop owner follower procedure by clearing him through the NICS system. That system didn't show a problem because he had not been committed to a mental institution or hospital. Had he been committed or charges of stalking filed against him, that info would have been entered into the NICS database and his purchase would not have gone through. Had there been a question of his acceptability the dealer would have been given a "delay" by the NICS operator. From there NICS would have three working days to clear him or deny the transaction.
Granted the shop owner should have verified all the boxes were completed on the application, and IF the mental health section was blank, he should have had Cho complete that section with a Y or N as required.
So I'll ask you this CC, How many ATF form 4473's have you filled out or called into the NICS system? Believe it or not, I do speak from experience from years of firearms sales and dealing with the NICS operators.
It is foolish and wrong to mourn the men who died. Rather we should thank God that such men lived.George S. Patton
posted on April 19, 2007 05:45:41 PM new
I have not bought or sold any guns, therefore you definitely have more experience than I do in that regard. I know nothing about guns or gun terminology, except I don't like to be around them if I can help it. That post was directly from the Virginian-Pilot website. It cited the laws regarding gun control in Virginia as it relates to the VT shootings and I did not add or take out one word.
"Oh. but they ARE. The penalties to gun sellers are QUITE harsh....as Bear has mentioned above. Most aren't willing to take that chance.....and can cover their rears by FOLLOWING the laws." Then why did the gun seller accept a form with the box about mental illness empty? I don't know how serious that is or even if it would have mattered, but it sure did seem sloppy.
Look, I realize that even with the most stringent gun laws, these types of shootings will still happen. I know that guns will never be outlawed. They are here to stay. Can't help but wonder if fewer students would have been shot had it been impossible to obtain automatic guns and high-capacity clips (or whatever they are called) legally.
Are YOU a Bunghole?
