posted on February 23, 2001 10:19:08 PM
I don't mind being wrong, but I dont think I am. I want your opinions. I will post the messages I have recieved from a bidder. I just want your oppinion if I am wrong here or not. This is long, but please take the time to help me out with this. eBay support sure wont!:
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HER:
Wow, Brian, 4.99 is a lot to ship one video. Would you consider shipping it
media rate?
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ME:
Hi -------. The reason why I charge $4.99 for a video is because I ship them priority ($3.50 - $3.95). I also put a certificate of mailing ($0.75) on all my shipments as proof of shipment. Also, I ship them in a bubble wrap package to protect the video from being damaged during transit. I will ship media rate if you chose, but the last time I did that it took 2 weeks to get to its destination. Regardless, as stated in my auction, I will still put a Certificate of Mailing and I still have to pay for the packaging that I ship the video in.
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HER:
There is no need to argue. Sending it media rate or priority rate does not
change your charges, it only changes my charges. I am paying media rate PERIOD.
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ME:
Hello ----- I do hate arguing about shipping rates. Every transaction I have is a great one but every few weeks there is someone who tries to tell me what they feel is a fair shipping rate and it really bothers me because you can't do things like that with Amazon or any other online retailer.
I make things so clear on my auctions just to avoid problems like this so we can all make out in the end and can have a pleasant transaction. I should not have to argue about my shipping rates at all. Its a waste of my time and effort. If I seem angry, its because this is not a fair thing to do to a seller. I am just trying to support my family and every time it starts off like this, the next thing I get is a threat that I will get a negative feedback if I don't lower my shipping rates and I wont put up with that anymore.
I did nothing wrong here. I posted my rates on my auction just because I want people who think that my shipping is too high not to bid on my items in the first place. The whole reason I charge those rates is to make sure that the packages I send come on time and in good condition and don't end up sitting in the back of a truck somewhere between my house and yours. I also use certificate of mailing as proof that all items I send are truly sent. Plus the packaging I use, materials, etc all cost money. All this is so clearly stated on my auction terms. You can read them by visiting...
If you become a seller, you will know how it feels when something like this happens. Sorry for my tone, but I should not have to be on the defensive because I did nothing wrong.
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HER:
I will pay media rate, that's all.
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ME:
I will send it media rate. I still have to charge for the Certificate of Mailing though. Do you know how much media rate is? Just add $0.75 on top of whatever media rate costs. I will check for you and get the total if you don't know the exact rate. I normally don't send media rate so I don't know the cost. Once again, sorry for my tone, but I hope you can understand that its hard having to constantly argue about things over and over that I should not have to argue about. It may take longer with Media rate though.
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That's fine. I am aware of how long media rate takes to get here and I do
not care about that.
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Great. You still have not answered a few of my questions in the last few emails. Hopefully you can understand my concern about this, especially since my rates are clearly listed on my auctions.
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Ok, a week passes by and I get no more messages but then I recieve a payment with PayPal in which I only recieve $1.25 for shipping. Plus, the address used was not a verified PayPal address. This is where the argument gets worse again...
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ME:
Hi Barbara! unfortunately I have to deny the payment and you will have to send it again. PayPal has a stupid rule that I must send it to your verified address. When you are making the payment it even warns you telling you to click on your address. If you do not, I can't send it to any other address even if you type it on the message.
The reason being is they have a charge back policy. All you would have to do is email them and say that you did not get the item. Even if I had proof I sent it to you, with your signature and all, because I did not send it to your "verified PayPal address," you would still get the money back. I hope you understand that my hands are tied and this is PayPal's policy.
Thanks for your understanding!
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HER:
Now I see that you are the ------- person who was so unpleasant to begin
with. I am going to pray for you so you can be more at peace with the world
and those of us in it who do not wish to rob you blind as soon as you turn
your back or extend the slightest bit of trust. First you want to gouge me
and profit off of exorbitant shipping costs, and then you do not want my
money because you think I am going to cheat you in some way. You poor thing.
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Me:
Didn't you read? It's not my policy, its PayPals Policy!
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HER:
Well, you are the only one to deny payment because of this. Everyone else
has sent my items to my work address, the same as I gave you, without a
problem. I do not have things sent to my "verified address" because that is
my home address and I am not home during the day, and it is a hassle to have
to go and pick up the package at the post office.
Why in the world would you think I would say I didn't receive it if I did?
You must be very unhappy if you are this suspicious of everyone you deal
with. So what do you suggest I do? Send you a check? Send you cash?
Forget the deal?
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ME:
Its up to you. At this point, I consider this a bad transaction. Its not me who is gouging, its you who is complaining after you bid on my item. I did nothing wrong here. Gouging is raising the price after you bid. I did not do that! Second, its not my policy ONE MORE TIME. Its PAYPALS!!! When I received the payment it says:
"This payment does not include a Verified Shipping Address. You may choose to either Accept or Deny it. If you are a seller: We require that sellers ship to a Verified Shipping Address to qualify for our Seller Protection Policy. By accepting this payment, you are choosing to accept the risk of buyer charge backs associated with this payment."
As you see, its not my policy. It's paypals. Why would I not want your payment? I wanted to sell the video and I wanted money for it. I don't need the video for any reason! I have nothing to gain here. I denied your payment because that is the policy of PayPal. You did nothing but insult me this whole time and I have done nothing wrong here.
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HER:
"-------"
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Me:
I have a question. Did you only bid on my auction to cause trouble for me and my family? Seriously, look at this whole transaction and read every message I sent to you. I have been completely nice to you! How was I unpleasant? Didn't I list the shipping rate clearly on the auction in the first place? How did I do anything wrong here? I listed my shipping rate and you bid, win the auction then complain about my rate. Why did you even bid if you were going to complain? Then, I follow the rules of PayPal and you act like I did something wrong?
Really, what did I do wrong here? Your the one freaking out, not me. I sell on eBay to support my wife and baby. I don't sell to fight with bidders about my shipping rate. I even state in the auction "Do not bid if you don't agree with my policy or my shipping rates."
Why would you do this to someone? I really don't understand. I have done nothing to you and you are so angry. I would really like you to go back and read all of my messages and you will see I have been nice and calm the whole time until you started accusing me of Gouging and cheating you out of something. I really don't understand why someone who claims to pray would treat someone else like that. If you pray, what god do you pray to? I thought the rule was, "DO UNTO OTHERS AS YOU WOULD HAVE THEM DO UNTO YOU." Its a simple rule that I live by. I treated you nice this whole transaction. Do you every buy from Amazon.com and email them afterwards "I'm not going to pay that shipping price! I am paying this price.." No, so why would you do that to me?
If you want to call and talk this out, feel free to call me at -----------. If you chose to still yell at me, accuse me of things and argue with me, I would prefer we not complete this transaction because I have a wife and child to take care of and I don't have time to argue.
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Who is wrong here? I dont know what to do at this point. I feel I should neg her becuase this is just bull---- but on the other hand, I know I will get a retalitory neg back. What a great way to start my weekend. Just venting people. Sorry to lay it on you guys...
[ edited by digitalmaster on Feb 23, 2001 10:23 PM ]
posted on February 23, 2001 10:35:53 PM
Hi digitalmaster....don't hate me, but I think you are both right and both wrong...it sounds like your buyer has been ripped off in the past with high shipping charges and is taking it out on you. On the other hand, it sounds like you don't want to budge on your set shipping rate (which IMP seems a bit high for a video, but understandable if shipping Priority).
First of all, you can't take anyone's opinions personally. Yes, she might have a bit of an attitude, but it's only her opinion and you shouldn't get get yourself into the position of having to justify anything you do, or how it's affecting you (& your family) etc. Stuff like that only fuels the flame!
I'd send her the video as cheaply as possible and hope that she enjoys it. I wouldn't neg her for bad behavior....she might end up thanking you for carrying through....you never know!
posted on February 23, 2001 10:37:40 PM
Your buyer is in the wrong. You say you state in your TOS clearly what you shipping charges are. She *chose* to bid on the auction knowing what they are, but clearly planned to demand different service.
As for the PayPal/mailing address thing...technically you are in the right. And personally, I wouldn't go out of my way to do favors for this person--she can pick up her package at the P.O. if she has to.
I wouldn't have gotten into such a long, drawn-out argument. If the person refused to honor the commitment they'd made by bidding, I'd send(in proper time) a NPB, and then give a negative FB if that didn't do the trick.
posted on February 23, 2001 11:18:41 PM
You're right; she's wrong, and she's a bit of a nut.
I too wouldn't have spent as much time with this one. Void the deal and move on. Neg or not; she deserves one in my opinion.
And your charge for shipping is VERY reasonable, for PM with a .75 verification of shipping (how come you don't use the 40 cent DC instead?).
I try not to waste time with long dialogues with balking bidders. Talk is cheap-- either they pay as agreed, or they don't. If they don't, I close the deal out and move on.
posted on February 23, 2001 11:30:59 PM
Hi digitalmaster ... I commented on another thread not to let these cranks engage you in argument and waste your time over a few cents ... and now look what happened!
The only thing you have done wrong here is wasted a couple of hours of your life arguing with a kook!
Now, personally, I feel that $5.00 is high to ship a video so I can see the person asking you for a cheaper way. But it's certainly your prerogative to ship whatever way you desire and you are not "wrong" for strictly adhering to your process.
I have had a lot of people try to bargain with me on ship rates (and always AFTER they win the auction, of course). The first response should always (semi-)politely explain the reasoning behind the charge and state that the rate is firm. (And yours did just fine, IMO).
When the person tries to pick an argument, my response is always short and to the point: "I do not have the time or interest to quibble with you over an amount less than one dollar. My S&H rate is fair; it was clearly stated in the auction, and you agreed to it when you bid. If you do not pay it, then I will report this as a failed deal to eBay." Further antagonizing replies are IGNORED!
I don't care too much about getting a neg from these types because I know I've done nothing wrong.
Carrying on these long discussions just raises your blood pressure and feeds a troll. Just say no to the nonsense and get on with your life! You will feel better, and I promise people will still bid on your auctions even with negs from the cranks....
posted on February 23, 2001 11:37:08 PM
It is a fact that a percentage of a seller's buyers are going to be weirdo flakes with severe personality disorders. This percentage varies from seller to seller, depending on what kind of inventory the seller specializes in. I think it is safe to assume this buyer is such a person. Stick to the shipping costs that were stated in the auction. I think further communication with this person will be a waste of your time and energy.
Here is one thing I've learned. It doesn't do any good to explain your position to the weirdo type of buyer. These people read hidden messages into what the seller writes, meanings that are not there. That is why this buyer's responses to you are so off-the-wall. You write one thing. The buyer's brain processes your words into something else.
Next time this happens, just simply say that the shipping costs are stated in the auction, that you only ship Priority Mail, etc.
posted on February 23, 2001 11:40:23 PM
I use the $0.40 too. Certificate of mailing is actually only $0.25 if I ship more than 3 items. However, today, I only shipped 1! It's a bit slow lately. Anyway, that is still $0.65. I only got into a long argument because everytime this happens, I end up getting a neg or neutral and I can't afford to get any more that I don't deserve.
Actually, I really screwed up on an auction and even told the bidder that I expected, and well deserved a negative for my mistake (GoToAuctions posted double auctions and I only had 1 item!). Anyway, i would not have been mad if he neg'd me becuase I would have taken responciblity for that. But not for this.
By the way, kraftdinner, I actually did cave in and said I would ship media mail. Then the whole PayPal thing started. I was not going to cave on that after hearing about all the problems people are having on PayPal. I hate the verified address policy, but no way am I taking chances on getting my account locked!
posted on February 23, 2001 11:45:58 PM
digitalmaster - You are right and this nutty bidder is WRONG!!!
I sell many different small items that range in weight from under a pound to 2 pounds or more. I always ship via priority mail. I finally started just putting a flat $5 shipping and handling charge in all my auctions to make listing my auctions simpler. I've never had anyone complain about it as being too much. I list the shipping and handling charge clearly in all my auctions, and if someone doesn't like it, they don't have to bid. That's what I do when I buy something on eBay...if I don't like the seller's shipping fee or TOS, I don't bid. What could be simpler?
posted on February 23, 2001 11:56:21 PM
i think you were both too quick to lose your tempers. IMO it's perfectly ok to ask a seller if he/she will send something Media Mail. If someone knows enough to ask then they probably don't care how long it will take. You have the right to say no, but I think your answer to her first question was too long and too defensive. It reminded me of when I used to ask my mom for something and she would say yes, but make me feel all guilty for asking her. It would have been better if you had either answered "No, I'm sorry, I'm only set up to mail Priority" or "OK, I can send Media Mail but it will take longer and the proof of shipping [which by the way I don't know why you bother to use] will be .75 extra." Both of those responses would have been "neutral" and avoided escalating the situation. Instead, you made a difficult situation worse by your attitude. Don't get me wrong: I can *understand* it, but it's not going to win you many positives.
As for shipping to a different address, I think you need to accept that many, many paypal-using sellers DO ship to non-verified addresses, because so many people are not home during the day (as your buyer pointed out). Again, I *understand* why you are standing on point of "law" but while Paypal may not advise it, shipping to a work address or relative's address is standard practice among many sellers, so you could at least try to understand why she is upset at being told she can't do this when she has probably done it many times before. I'd be upset too---items shipped to MY home address, during the day, are a huge hassle to retrieve and claim at the PO. I always have them delivered to a relative's house. Paypal rules do not say you CAN'T do this, they simply say that if you do, you are not covered under their protection plan--which isn't worth a rat's patoot anyway, by the way. Nevertheless... A rare chargeback is NOT worth the animosity of buyers like this one, in my opinion. Sometimes you just have to take the risk.
Also in my opinion, your buyer escalated to anger and namecalling too quickly and should have her knuckles rapped as well, so don't take this to mean I am against you.
I think if that many people are asking you to send Media Mail and/or lower your shipping, then you better think about giving them the Media mail option, skipping the proof of mailing, or other options that will stop their whining, cause they ain't gonna change. Otherwise you will have more incidents like these.
Media Mail is great, I use it all the time, and it makes buyers very happy to have a choice of a lower rate. I have lost exactly zero packages out of over 300 sent media mail in the last year and a half. Don't hate it before you've tried it.
And my final line is this: If you need to add on to your shipping to support your wife and child, you need to start selling something else that makes more profit.
My original email would have been more clear cut, "these are the terms, this is what you owe." Any further negotiation gets my nice, "thank you for your email, the shipping is ___" email.
She agreed to the terms by bidding on the auction.
Entering into a debate with a person over your shipping basically gives them the wedge.
Now had she emailed prior to, and you'd waived your normal SOP's then that's her risk.
But she is devolving into freak mode.
Good luck.
ps...I don't perceive your first reply as argumentative at all, merely a detailed response of your mode of shipping.
oh last thing...some auctions I do offer choices...others I won't budge from one method, because I feel safer.
[ edited by Capriole on Feb 24, 2001 12:08 AM ]
posted on February 24, 2001 12:36:03 AM
digitalmaster
If you are intending to make money with your postage/handling, than by all means, keep the $5 shipping. If you are not making money from it, than you can offer two shipping options on your auctions. For example $2 media and $4 priority.
Get rid of the certificate of mailing and offer optional insurance for $1. Make sure buyer understands that if insurance is denied, they are now responsible for any lost packages.
On people who takes out the insurance, self-insure the package. You will come out ahead in the long run. Preprint some labels indicating that the package is insured by private carrier. This will get rid of the complaints from buyers who requested the insurance and do not see insurance marking on the package. By the way, you will save some time at the post office from not having to do all those forms.
That should eliminate 98% of all complaints.
On packages that do get lost and no insurance, make a judgement if you should still refund the customer. If feedback is excellent, you should be ahead on the self-insurance fund to refund those claims with no loss to you.
The above method will save you time, aggravation and negatives. For you see, you always will have some customers that may be 100% wrong. The trick is to deal with these customers as efficiently as possible.
By the way (please don't take this personally), I think you are a little bit paranoid. I shipped about 4,000 items last year, worldwide. I think I have about 3 lost packages.
Finally, another problem one gets from having negatives is that it entices future claims. A buyer sees those negatives and automatically have more suspicions and leads to more negatives if any kind of problems arises. Who knows what impact it is having on your final prices.
In my opinion, whether you are right or wrong is irrelevent. Being right does not help you to gain more sales. Maybe what is needed is a better way to prevent problems from occurring.
posted on February 24, 2001 01:23:39 AM
brighid868, First, you must not have read my message completly. No where did I say I was charging shipping to support my family. I used an emotional appeal to combat her emotional argument. Logic does not work with emotional people. In my daily life, I could be more compared to Spock by the way I think and act. I charge a flat shipping rate on videos that is fair. Its $3.50 to ship priority and with insurance or certificate of mailing it still comes out to about $4.50. Then, add $0.25 or whatever it costs for the packaging and its $4.75. That is not unreasonable! A lot of sellers say "just use the free packaging at the post office" almost every nuetral I have recieved had something to do with the free packaging at the post office. So I use more reliable materials to insure the protection of the item. This is not including lables, printer ink, etc, stamps.com which I use just to help make sure items are sent to the right place.
I have had bidders point out something they have disagreed with, Logicially, and I changed my stance because they made a good point. I never argue with bidders and most of my transactions go smoothly. She is the one who right off the bat told me what she was going to pay. She did not ask, she said she was paying media rate. Actually, she did ask at first, I explained my policy, then she just flat out said she was paying media rate "PERIOD." I will probably offer media rate now as some of you have made good points, nonetheless, its still in my TOS so I should not have to argue or change my policies after the auction is over.
Also, about Certificate of Mailing, I don't care how much people expect trust, I need to protect myself and limit my liability. That is how business works. A Certificate Of mailing can be used for PayPal, eBay, BillPoint or USPS in case I am ever accused of fraud. I use this to protect myself. In fact, I have a real clear message on all my auctions about using Certificate Of Mailing. I am not offering it as a choice. I did not make anyone bid on my auctions. Most people who do keep coming back. I have some repeat buyers who come back so much that if they were to leave me feedback I would top a few thousand but they don't becuase they feel its useless to keep leaving feedback if it does not up the rating.
Anyway, Thanks for your imput. This just really pissed me off because I hate arguing my terms after my auction. If they would have said something before the auction I would not have minded at all.
Oh, as for the PayPal thing, I hate to use this example but, "if your friends jumped off a bridge, would you follow them?" My point is, yes, most sellers don't pay attention to the PayPal policy and I hate it. HOWEVER, it takes one complaint and you could end up having your PayPal account locked and I just don't feel like taking that chance. All I am doing is following policy. I did not invent the rules, I just follow them. If I am on the freeway driving to northern california mid day and there is almost no cars on the road, I have to drive 70 or I will get a ticket. I prefer 90, because no one is on the road, but regardless, its not my choice because their are laws. If you ever owned a merchant account you would understnad that the credit card companies make certain requirments and if you don't follow them, your only risking your own business.
posted on February 24, 2001 01:25:02 AM
I think you are both wrong. She should have asked before bidding (key word there is asked not demanded), but I feel your emails agravated things.
My first response would have been a very clear "yes" or "no". Either "Sure, I am willing to send it media mail. With certificate of mailing and packaging it will come to $X.XX" or "I'm sorry, but my terms are stated in the auction. By bidding on my item you agreed to the terms in the auction. In the future it would be a good idea to make a request like this before you bid."
You both got way too personal. You say I do hate arguing about shipping rates, and then spend four paragraphs arguing shipping rates. Don't explain. Try to keep it short, professional and impersonal.
You're the one with the eight page TOS, right? I'm sorry, but if you're serious about getting people to read and abide by your terms you really do need to whittle that down a bit.
posted on February 24, 2001 01:43:35 AM
laum1, I understand your point but I am not paranoid. I too have shipped in excess of 4000 items and have probably had the same amount of loss as you. However, when I first introduced COM I only used it for PayPal Payments. The whole reason I started using it was because I noticed the more you sell, and the more feedback you have, the more bidders try and push you around.
Anyway, I then started using it on all my items so that I can keep a dated record of when all items were sent. Since I started using it, I have been accused of fraud about 5 times. I have had a few people email me and say they did not recieve their item and even threaten that they were going to turn me into the USPS, eBay and PayPal for fraud. I sent a kind message back "I'm sorry you did not recieve your item. I understand your distrust but I assure you that I have proof your item was sent. I keep record and have a Certificate of....." I break everything down to them.
Out of all the people who threatened me, I have never heard a response again. I emailed all of them asking if they ever did end up getting their packages and only 1 person replied and said he did get it and even left me postive feedback. The other people never even replied. The point is, if they really did not get their item, why did not not report me as they said they were going to? Obviously they were just trying to claim they did not get thier item so I would just go ahead and give them their money back or something out of fear of retaliation.
Oh, also, don't get me wrong. I am not poor or anything. I do not make any money off the shipping at all and don't try to or need to as I stated in the above message I break even on all shipping. I only make about $2500 a month or so on eBay. Most of my money is made at my mastering studio. I have mastered many albums from many major artists. I also build customer pro-audio computers. I have been in business for myself for many years. I only use eBay as a tool to support my family. I use all the money I make from my other businesses to invest in other projects, pay car payments, etc. My point with her was strictly combating emotions with emotions. I should not let it bother me, I know, and I should lighten up. I should just point to the auction and say "here, read my terms." Regardless, I would still have gotten the same outcome and at least I would have been calm through the whole thing. Anway, thanks for your points.
posted on February 24, 2001 01:48:10 AM
Here's my take:
If she has a problem with following PayPal's rules, then she can send you a money order! That way you don't have to fuss with it. If she's not cool with PayPal's rules, then insist on a money order. Yes, it will take longer for the transaction to be completed...but like she said, she doesn't care how long it takes to get to her.
As for the shipping charges...I don't give a flying fart if the person said the shipping was $20. If they stated it in the auction and I didn't see it, then it's my fault, and I pay it. I missed the boat...that's MY problem.
If she continues to complain about the price, sucks to be her, because it's not worth responding to her negativity.
And just think...it's people like that who hate it the most when they can't rile you. Be the calm little saint I know you are, and it'll piss her off all the more. Don't you love it?
I would write her one last email, basically saying that if she read the auction, she would know the shipping charges, and if she didn't agree with them, then she shouldn't have bid. Give her total amount owed and your address, where she can send her money order. Inform her that once you receive the money order, you will ship the video to her place of employment, using the shipping method that was outlined in your auction. Also, make sure that you tell her that if she doesn't send payment, then you will be sure to inform eBay.
AND, if it comes down to the end and you're itching to neg...wait until those 90 days are almost up and snipe her with the neg. I think, with her attitude, she deserves it.
posted on February 24, 2001 01:49:05 AM
Hi BlondeSense. I agree and actually I have started using all my terms on my auctions and they are much shorter now. I now only point people to the "Full Auction Terms Dislosure" by choice. I took advise from another post about that. I summed up everything on my aucitons in bulleted lists which makes it easier to read (thanks to giftlimited).
I did not mean to write so many paragraphs, but that is just the way I respond to anything when I write. Everything I write is like that. I type like 60 words a minute and I end up looking back and realizing that I typed a whole full page after a short period of time. So, I agree with you with that as well. I just get iritated because I should not have to explain myself. See, I am doing it again...
posted on February 24, 2001 01:56:32 AM
Kimbonovich, can you snipe a neg? I thought the auctions are taken off at different times? Either way, I probably will just drop it.
Also, some of you missed the fact that the whole time I did not say anything indirectly or directly bad about her. She cussed me out a few times but I bleeped it out because I figured the message would get taken off by AW. She has since emailed me again cussing me out and I just told her not to bid on any of my auctions and forwarded the message to eBay support. They told me that was the best action to take anyway. I would not want to sell it to her at this point because I am sure we will just claim the item was broken or something and I would rather not give her the ammunition anyway. Whats funny about this whole thing is she won the item sold for only $5.00 and it usually sells for much more! I don't even understand why she was not happy she got the item so cheap in the first place.
In the future, before responding, I will probalby get advice what to say here because I do tend to write too much and it probably just confuses the situation worse.
posted on February 24, 2001 02:08:03 AM
I am not sure if you can, but I have heard of it. Luckily, I have not had to do anything like that yet, but I did have a customer the other day cussing me out...and boy am I tempted. I took a deep breath and responded...luckily when he cussed me out, he kept it short and sweet. I would just answer the question that he asked, in the middle of his curses, and be on my merry way. Some people are just freaks...it's a fact of life.
posted on February 24, 2001 02:20:27 AM
digitalmaster,
YOU SCREWED UP AND YOU ARE WRONG !!!
Not because of all the emails or any of that.
The one thing you did wrong was to compromise yourself in the beginning.
I would have told her right off the bat, NO I DO NOT SHIP MEDIA MAIL - PERIOD !
This would have taken alot less time and you would not be dealing with this blithering idiot right now.
So to answer your post, Yes, you are wrong for compromising yourself in the beginning and leaving yourself open to deal with a clearly disoriented moron.
posted on February 24, 2001 03:41:44 AM
digitalmaster:
I agree with CIX, your only mistake was allowing the dialogue to continue rather than ending it in a professional and final matter.
We also ship all of our small items via Priority Mail and occasionally receive requests for other methods. We reply with the following:
Dear Bidder,
Thank you for your fast reply. We ship all of our items via Priority Mail so that our customers can begin enjoying their purchase as quickly as possible. The 1 to 3 day delivery time also allows us to confirm that our customers are happy with their purchase, and address any issues or concerns in a timely manner. Our goal is to offer the fastest possible service to our customers, which is why we do not offer Media Mail as an option. Thank you again for your business.
posted on February 24, 2001 04:28:47 AM
I agree with bunnicula entirely. In my experience the buyers who want to haggle over the shipping costs seem to equate online auctions with buying from street vendors in Mexico. It is the one area in the transaction where they think they can haggle down the price. My shipping fees are stated in the auction description and if anything are on the low side. If I've just sold a bridle that should retail for, say, $60.00 to an auction buyer for $30.00, I've made money and given them one heck of a deal and they then turn around and want me to be cut them a deal on shipping? Sorry. Not happening. The buyer is just looking for a better deal than the one to which she agreed. I don't see that you did anything wrong here.
posted on February 24, 2001 05:00:18 AM
You are right but you are wrong.
The reason you are wrong is the old saying " you can't win an argument with a fool". You wasted way too much time on this nut and tho YOU were not arguing, that's what she turned it into.
Next time just stick to your TOS and as has been previously stated, a short reply.
posted on February 24, 2001 05:32:26 AM
As a buyer I have to say you are right. I don't bid on something if I don't want to pay the shipping. If I have a question I ask before I bid. Life would be so much easier for all of us if people would just ask before. I would rather get my item sooner so I don't mind priority rates.
I've never had an argument with a buyer on anything I bought, and I buy a lot.
I'm thinking of becoming a seller, just to sell instructions on How To Read TOS. Or maybe How To Read..Period.
posted on February 24, 2001 06:52:29 AMdigitalmaster
IMO, you seem to like the "friendlier" approach ~ as much bashing as I take for it on these boards, so do I. I haven't had any issues on shipping charges but I ran across a seller's TOS that addressed the issue to my liking if the need ever came up. Much better wording and actually a bit humorous, to the tune of: Shipping is $xx. Yes, I really do charge $xx for shipping. The fee for shipping this item is $xx. If you are the high bidder on this item, the cost to ship will be $xx.
It went on, but you get the point. The seller sold all of the same item (as in video tapes) so it was a flat fee. Since there really weren't any other TOS, it was actually quite humorous and made the point without being nasty or sarcastic. You are an excellent writer (not just a fast one!) I'm sure you can play with it to try and minimize the time you spend on the wackos ~ your wife and daughter are much more fun to play with!
Best of Luck!
chepi*
posted on February 24, 2001 09:04:04 AM
Her: Wow, Brian, $4.99 is alot to mail one video. Would you consider mailing it Media Rate?
Brian: Sure, no problem. Just send $2.00 shipping plus the cost of the item.
The end.
There is no right or wrong here. It is all about money. What do you care how much she sends for shipping? You don't make any profit off it. What do you care how long it takes to get to her? She asked for Media Mail so she can wait for Media Mail to arrive. If you did anything wrong it was to put so much energy and emotion into a simple and reasonable request. I send everything I can Media Mail or First Class to save my buyers money. Occassionally I will get a 'Where's my book?' question. I respond that '...Media Mail (aka Book Rate) can take 10 to 14 days for delivery so please be patient. If you prefer Priority be sure and request paying the difference next time you buy a book'. I have had Priority take up to 6 weeks to arrive so there are no guarantees anywhere. Also, if you really follow PayPal rules strictly, you would have told her she must send you a check or money order as PayPal requires Priority shipping. Yes, it's true. One of PP's new rules is the seller must provide on-line tracking for each PP transaction. If they contact you and say a customer is complaining they never got their item, you better have the on-line tracking number for them. It costs 40¢, but the Media Mail on a video should only by $1.30 (that's why I said tell her $2.00). It is my understanding you cannot do USPS on-line tracking for First Class or Media Mail. When someone gives you trouble take a deep breath and answer with as few words as possible. Life is too short for e-mail spats.
posted on February 24, 2001 09:13:23 AM
I understand what you are saying, but what *I* am saying is that your attitude is just not going to be successful with certain types of customers, and you should know this. In retail (and auctions are a form of retail) you will ALWAYS have to explain yourself. Period! And people who think that large mail order houses don't have people questioning their shipping rates and terms are wrong. When I worked for a large department store we had people haggling, questioning tax, questioning delivery fees, and on and on. I, personally, DO write to online stores that I consider to be charging exorbitant shipping fees (I am not calling yours exorbitant) and complain and/or explain that I am not going to buy from them and why. Just because other places pad shipping is NO REASON for some sellers to pad theirs! Again, I'm not saying you are "padding" (although I still think 5.00 is too much to ship a tape and you would be better off to skip the POM and just refund the occasional complaint.) You will always have to explain as long as you are in the sales field and charging more than the norm. And from what I've seen, a choice of Media or Priority is the norm.
I do NOT agree with the idea that the TOS is not to be questioned. A politely worded inquiry (which is what her FIRST question to you was) is NOT a crime. Her STATEMENT "I will send media mail only" was wrong, and rude, but you also helped bring it on by your whiny (if technically polite) response to her first question.
posted on February 24, 2001 09:24:14 AM
1. Buyer was wrong to question shipping after winning the auction.
HOWEVER:
I would have shipped the video Media Mail (it only costs $1.30 and that info. is very easily gotten from the PO) and to the address she requested. That is how I do business anyway. I offer low cost shipping and I'll ship to any address, regardless of what PayPal or anyone else tells me to do. It's my business if I want to take the risk, not theirs.
I've had many customers request that their packages be shipped to their work address. I've also had many people buy Large Print books for their elderly parents who happen to live in another state. According to your policy, those people would not be able to buy from you and that's your business, but I think it's a shame.
Too many people, both buyers and sellers are taking the attitude I know someone is going to try and rip me off so I'm da** well going to make sure it can't happen! It's a shame.
