posted on February 26, 2001 10:45:02 AM newdigitalmaster
You could cash the money order at your local post office and deposit the cash in your bank. Then there is no $3.00 fee involved. Time consuming I know, but it would work.
posted on February 26, 2001 11:00:43 AM new
Kraft, you said
Most Seller's don't post "International" rates in their TOS, so I'm kind of at their mercy at the end of the auction
I think you probably now have decided to not bid until you work out those details.
I invite and enjoy emails during the auctions to work out any questions. But, I get very few questions because my listing descriptions and TOS are very detailed.
My shipping charges are based upon a flat fee formula that cover all my expenses associated with shipping. In many cases it cost the same to ship a package to Canada as it does Singapore so my International rates are also based upon a flat fee formula. I will not ship International by Surface because in the past I've had too many things go wrong.
I do to offer a savings for my customers if they want to buy more from my large inventory and ship the items in the same package. My USA and International customers have accepted the shipping costs and most take advantage of my willingness to multiple ship items.
When a new customer comes along and would like an adjustment on shipping, I refer them to my TOS and stick with my prices but encourage them to do some more shopping so we can put more in the package and save them on shipping.
posted on February 26, 2001 11:18:00 AM new
It seems like this thread has turned into some kind of "justification process for shipping rates".
I don't care what your expenses are when I buy an item. I just want to buy the item and have it shipped to me (which I'M paying for) the cheapest way possible. Sending items to Canada by Parcel Post might take longer to reach me (which I don't care), but costs about the same as Priority on the U.S.
We are not in Asia or Europe...we're on the same continent. I think a lot of Sellers "presume" that the shipping costs will be double or triple, so they charge what they THINK without finding out. I'm sure if they knew the cost to Canada, they would write it down in their TOS to avoid us "cheapskates" trying to find a fairer way of sending an item. If you ship to Canada, why don't you put in your TOS what the cost will be and it will end the mystery.
BTW, this isn't a "Handling" issue....some of you complain because nobody reads your TOS....have you read my posts?? I'm talking about SHIPPING cost, not HANDLING. If I buy something for $10.00 and there's a Handling Fee of $2.00, then I figure the item is now $12.00 + shipping. If the Seller says "just add $6.00 shipping and the ACTUAL shipping is $3.00, what should I be doing to discourage this type of overcharging? This happens a lot just because people think that Canada is some foreign country.
Yes, I can neg Sellers for overcharging me, but I'd like to remedy the fact before this happens, or I'd end up with having to dish out neg's all the time (which I think should be my LAST resort!)
So, once again, this has nothing to do with HANDLING....! I'm only talking about actual shipping charges compared to what I've paid for shipping, and how I can go about trying to get (some) Sellers to be a bit more reasonable with their rates to Canada.
I appreciate you listing your expenses for me to see, but you "protest too much" trying to justify......
posted on February 26, 2001 11:19:25 AM new
First, kraftdinner, I will try and adjust my rates to make them fair for international customers. Thanks for your comments. I really do try and be as fair as I can. Once I sent pacakage to a bidder an declared insurance on it. Anyway, I guess some countries have to pay taxes when they pick up packages "he failed to tell me this" and he ended up paying a bunch of money in taxes. Things like that should be addressed before the auction. I don't know the laws in every country...
I am about to start putting "international customers contact me for shipping rates" again because I end up having to put a ton of information about international customers in my auction which adds to the clutter. I use to add the cost of shipping with the $3.00 that my bank charges. I Then changed to posting more accurate rates and put a note "if paying with international money order, please include an additional $3 that my bank charges..." Most international customers did not read that part and I ended up losing lots of money that way. If I sell an item for $3 and have to pay $3 to my bank, its a total waste of my time even selling to international customers. Plus, a lot of Canadians try sending Candadian checks which are worth about 50% less here and I get charged the $3. Its so much easier when international customers pay with BillPoint or something.
tapatti: "I'm currently cutting and pasting your message and adding it to my shipping terms... OK?"
posted on February 26, 2001 11:39:41 AM new
Kraftdinner,
It is kind of unfair for you to expect US bidders to list Canada s/h along with US s/h. If they're going to do that for Canadian bidders... why shouldn't they do it for UK, SPAIN, GERMANY.... and all the other countries out there with lots of eBay bidders. I don't see anything wrong with stating simply that international shipment will be higher based on the country it is being shipped to. If you have questions on what this will be... just contact the seller before you bid.
As far as the handling issue goes... please keep in mind that for a US seller there is CONSIDERABLY more handling involved in international shipments than domestic ones. The seller must research the postage cost, fill out the customs slip, and sometimes add the cost of packaging (you can't use free priority mail packages internationally!) Oftentimes, international shipments can easily have twice as much handling expense for the seller. Just a few things to keep in mind. As always... the best advice is to "ask before you bid"
posted on February 26, 2001 11:55:36 AM new
"This happens a lot just because people think that Canada is some foreign country"
huh? I must have missed the news about the USA annexing Canada. I might be physically closer to Canada than say Beverly Hills CA but that International Border makes all the difference. Here's exactly what the US Post Office says:
Typical 8 lb double-boxed Glass Collectable:
To Beverly Hills CA, USA
Priority Mail 2 Day(s) $9.65
Parcel Post 5 Day(s) $9.60
But to Canada:
Airmail Parcel Post 4 - 7 Days $20.05
Economy Parcel Post (Surface) 4-6 Weeks $17.25
Notice the differences? for the Beverly Hills package we would normally charge about $12.95 total s/h.
For the Canadian shipment I would quote (pre-bid) $19.95 and hope it doesn't scare them away. We would (and have) eaten the difference to send it Air since it makes no sense to save $2.80 and risk a 4 to 6 WEEK ground delivery time frame.
posted on February 26, 2001 11:57:41 AM new
I've put in a link to the USPS website and I list the weight of the item so that International customers can see the range of prices and options before they bid.
Maybe it depends on what you sell, but for me, I don't have considerably more handling involved with International shipments. It doesn't bother me at all to take a moment (not a lot of research at all IMO) to look up the rate and fill out the customs form. Also, I usually use my own packaging anyway since I ship many items Media Mail.
Forgive me if I missed it somewhere, but I don't recall reading anything that specified whether the poster is questioning the shipping after winning or not. Yet, many of the responses are taking that assumption. Is that the case here?
posted on February 26, 2001 12:20:11 PM new
Kraft: It's people like you that cause so many sellers to only sell within the USA.
I sell videos all over the world and am in Canada. It makes my job even harder.
I also buy videos online and resell them.
75% of my sales are to the US and less than 1% to Canada. I sell more to Japan or Australia than to Canada.
If a seller is open to shipping Internationally then it's up to you to ask them if you need cheaper rates.
And I have news for you and other cheapskates.
Most sellers ship in batches. We have stacks of products and our shippers pack them, sort them and get them going.
When one pain in the butt emails and asks for special service it costs us time which costs us money??
If you don't like the posted rates then email BEFORE. Most of us will put up with your request politely even though it's costing us time and some will even oblige you a bit.
Anything other than that is plain slime.
Sorry for not writing this in lighter hues but I'm just tired of whiny babies and there are lots of them posting of late.
Grow up and learn how business works and what the difference is between honest people who are trying to serve many many people and someone gleefully selling that horrible birthday gift they don't want!!
posted on February 26, 2001 01:18:25 PM new
Hi BJG....actually most of the posters are right in the fact that this is more of an "after the sale" question. I do agree that I should be asking more questions before I bid, but my point is....AFTER I've bought something, I'm not trying to "haggle", but just trying to ask for a fairer shipping rate if I know that the cost quoted is way too high...not fairer handling charges, etc.
Is it fair for me to ask a Seller what the ACTUAL shipping/handling charges will be beforehand, putting them through the time it takes to find out for me, even if I don't bid?
How should I handle being overcharged for shipping without using the neg?
tapatti...you are too geared up to understand what I'm talking about....the foreign thing just referred to Sellers that lump Canada in with Europe, etc...lighten up!
digitalmaster...what a sweetie! Your shipping & TOS are fine the way they are! I appreciate you even trying to re-think your rates, but I think you're more than fair with the way you run things now. And I agree with you 100%...some buyers will try anything!
pcalton..I understand what you're saying but if there aren't any shipping quotes for Canada, how can I refer to your TOS?
Again, I'm not referring to Handling charges, only the actual shipping price compared to what I've paid...if the two don't jive, then I want to know why and how I should handle it so it doesn't keep happening....that's all.
[ edited by kraftdinner on Feb 26, 2001 01:37 PM ]
posted on February 26, 2001 01:37:52 PM new
BJGrolle ........ I can relate, I have the flu.
Kraftdinner
Hola. YES, ask the seller *before* you place a bid. If they can't/won't get you a shipping quote, then DO NOT BID.
Most sellers that are set up to ship Internationally will either:
A. Have the various shipping prices quoted in their ad. or
B. Will look the price up after the auction is over.
If you ask nicely, before you place a bid, most sellers will have no problem looking the cost up for you.
OR, if you can get their ZIP code & the size & weight of the parcel, you can look it up yourself.
What's so hard about that? I'm sorry if this sounds harsh, but the only way sellers can charge you 2-3 times the "actual" shipping cost, is if YOU allow them to.
posted on February 26, 2001 01:39:32 PM newIt seems like this thread has turned into some kind of 'justification process for shipping rates....' I don't care what your expenses are .... I appreciate you listing your expenses for me to see, but you 'protest too much' trying to justify...."
Typical buyer attitude. Screw a seller for every penny, and then complain about the seller's attitude.
posted on February 26, 2001 01:43:45 PM newAFTER I've bought something, I'm not trying to "haggle", but just trying to ask for a fairer shipping rate if I know that the cost quoted is way too high...not fairer handling charges, etc.
So if I understand this right, there is no method of shipping Internationally stated in most auctions, yet the sellers are automatically quoting you the more expensive rates? Like Global Priority (which is really expensive if you can't use the flat-rate envelopes)? I don't know why a seller would object to shipping Parcel Post instead, unless they don't want to buy their own supplies. But if that's their method of doing business, you can't really change it.
Is it fair for me to ask a Seller what the ACTUAL shipping/handling charges will be beforehand, putting them through the time it takes to find out for me, even if I don't bid?
Yes. It used to happen to me all the time until I started putting a link in so they could check it out for themselves. Just make sure you give them enough time to respond. Assuming a seller might not check their email at but once a day, make sure there's more than 15 - 20 hours to go to make sure you get a response. Any less than that, you might get a response, but maybe not in time. Oh, and if they don't want to bother answering you even though you emailed well in advance, then do you really want to deal with them anyway?
How should I handle being overcharged for shipping without using the neg?
It depends on what your perception of overcharged is. You'll have to be more specific before I can tackle that one.
posted on February 26, 2001 01:44:06 PM new
LOL
Ask already.
I do.
After all the bait and switch on priority rates, I ask. (see tomwii's and other threads of this nature ad infinitum)
What's the worse that can happen?
Get a flame-on email from a seller who thinks you are impuning his dignity and rights in a free economy? Heck, aren'tcha glad he got it off his chest before you bid?
Otherwise they can say no, yes, or yes with a proviso (if it's lost, baby you are SOL, you know, that kind of thing).
Anyhow, it may be that the market makes shipping more tightly budgeted (see earlier post) than others. TApatti can call it gouging, but let's face it, it's marketplace. If I can get free packing from the neighborhood stereo store, and I can make a %400-500 markup I am not going to add $4 to my shipping price. It's already there. If I am selling a $14 book, I put media rate. or offer priority. I still don't add $$ to the shipping price. I don't like it, I don't add it. I may however, start my bidding at a little higher. Like $4...oooooh now you got me!
I am mean Kraftdinner...if they want me to strap it to the A$$ of a crow, well that's where I draw the line!
yet another typo edito
[ edited by Capriole on Feb 26, 2001 01:47 PM ]
posted on February 26, 2001 01:54:53 PM new
kraftdinner,
My ad's list US rates s/h charges for both priority and media mail. They also state for international buyers please contact me before bidding for rates and payment terms. There's no way I can list international rates on my ad by country. Most people do ask before bidding. I've had some assume what the rates are going to be and never bother to contact me and then when I tell them they want to back out of the auction and waste my time all because they didn't take the time to email me. I feel there are too many variables to do what you are hoping for. For example I sell videos, dvd's and books. A 5 ounce dvd cost 1.60 to ship air mail and 2.70 to ship ground to Canada. You are assuming that surface is always cheaper when it is not. The reason that surface in this case is more is because you can insure it and the airmail in this case can NOT be insured through the PO. Some sellers will not ship internationally without insurance. That is how they choose to do business. That is up to them. I can insure either since I use UPIC but other sellers can not. A 4 pound book in the US can be shipped surface for $2 - $2.65 and air mailed for 6.35. To canada it is 8.80 for surface and 11.75 for air. There can be big differences. I am not picking on Canadians but they are the ones who won't take the time to email me and just assume that if they pay US priority it will cover them which it doesn't in all cases. It wastes my time and theirs and costs them more for another MO and Postage. It would be too much work to break out actual shipping + a handling charge on my ad's as it is too time consuming and it is dependent on what I am selling. The reason is that for anything that is sent surface I charge the customer more for packaging materials than I do for priority since most of it is free. If I did that I believe I would be opening up another can of worms and the emails would come in asking if I made a mistake,why did you charge a handling fee of 1.00 on this ad and 2.00 on that ad yada yada which takes up my time.
posted on February 26, 2001 02:12:52 PM newreddeer....I appreciate your input and everyone else's, no matter how harsh you sound! Harsh away! I think because the shipping rates online don't always equal what the actual shipping rate is, it's hard for me to know whether the price quoted is actual or inflated until I receive the package. I collect and sell "antiques", so I know it's hard for a Seller to know exactly what the shipping rate is...that I can understand perfectly. And I'm not talking about a couple of dollars difference...that I don't mind, and like I said, I don't mind paying for handling, I just wonder if it's a good idea to ask for a less expensive way to ship if I think the rate is too high because I think I've been overcharged enough. Obviously, I should be asking before I bid....I can understand the logic in that and thank you for your opinions reddeer.
I'm not out to screw anyone twinsoft?????? And I'm not complaining about anything.....how does asking a Seller for a better rate (which I have only done 3 times) equal complaining?? I've said nothing about any Seller's attitude.....I just have gotten 2 out of 3 Sellers that didn't seem happy with my request, so I dropped it and am asking you all for an easier way to go about it, without offending anyone. How does that come out to me being a jerk?
posted on February 26, 2001 02:23:53 PM newNOT COMPLAINING????
Sounds like complaining to me.
I think I'm going to UP my surcharge for shipping to Canaduh so I can factor in all of the time I'll waste searching for the best rate so I can save you 63 cents.
GEEEEEEZ!
Isn't the sellers TIME worth SOMETHING!!??
My advice: Don't buy online and quit eating TV dinners out of aluminium trays. (Alzhiemers)
You still don't get it, do you??
S = Shipping (this is the cost of SHIPPING!!!)
H = HANDLING (this is for HANDLING)
S+H = SHIPPING AND Handling. THAT'S WHY YOUR SHIPPING CHARGES ARE ALWAYS MORE THAN THE ACTUAL SHIPPING CHARGE THE PO STICKS ON THE BOX!!!!
***********************************
The more PEOPLE I meet.........
The more I like my DOG!!AND I THINK HE IS SMARTER!!
[ edited by whinecooler on Feb 26, 2001 02:28 PM ]
posted on February 26, 2001 02:25:18 PM new
Kraftdinner,
If you're just looking for a nice way to ask sellers... you could try something like this:
Dear Seller:
Thank you for your prompt respone with the auction total of $x.xx, complete with the s/h of $x.xx to Canada. The s/h charge on this is slightly higher than I had anticipated. Is there any less expensive way you can ship it to me? If not, I completely understand and will send payment for the above total immediately. Thank you for your assistence. It is a pleasure doing business with you.
posted on February 26, 2001 02:37:46 PM new
kraftdinner
<<.....how does asking a Seller for a better rate (which I have only done 3 times) equal complaining??>>
You know it could be something as simple as how you are asking. When I read the above it sounds like you want to haggle and that sets me off and puts me on the defensive. From reading all the posts I don't believe you want to haggle, you just want to know whether you are paying for surface or air and what it is going to cost you and if the seller would ship via another method.
posted on February 26, 2001 02:55:05 PM new
This is what I've said in my emails after I received their shipping quote, but I have to admit, this is after the fact....all 3 were.
"Blah, blah, blah.......would it be possible for you to send the "item" by Parcel Post as I'm not concerned by how long it takes to reach me. If not I fully understand!"...blah, blah....
You have me sounding like I say "Hey loser, what's with the rip-off shipping & handling charges? I'm not paying your stupid fees!"
Nothing could be furthur from the truth.
And whine....I don't think attacking me personally is fair. You've called me names and referred to Canada in non-productive ways.....what's with you??
posted on February 26, 2001 03:02:24 PM new
whinecooler; I don't think of myself as shy or prudish, and at the risk of getting attacked myself I found your last post inappropriate, in poor taste and offensive. And no I am not Canadian, just a human being.
posted on February 26, 2001 03:03:35 PM new
whinecooler,
Your posts are insulting and some are very personal. I'm issuing you an informal warning at this time. Please use the Members registered name, not one you chose to make up yourself. It's insulting.
Everyone,
Personal comments are not necessary. I encourage you to stick with the subject and keep away from the personal jabs.
Don't take it personally.
I just think it's all so trivial.
Pay it or don't buy it.
I do seem to get an inordinate amount of odd requests from Canadians though.
The Moosegooser thing was just for giggles and squirts, EH (for those with a sense of humor and not meant to insult anybody)
***********************************
The more PEOPLE I meet.........
The more I like my DOG!!
[ edited by whinecooler on Feb 26, 2001 03:06 PM ]
posted on February 26, 2001 03:06:01 PM new
Here's a confession. I'm a Canadian seller and I hate selling to Canadians, especially like this whiny baby.
You're in Canada? Can't I pay in = C$$$
GST?
Geez, I hate selling to Canucks!!
Frustrated in Canada!
Why are we still giving him his 5 minutes of AW fame?
Don't we all have something better to jabber away about??
