jumpinjacko
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posted on May 6, 2001 11:29:21 PM new
FIGMENT...effect you practically accuse me of stealing from you for trying to bid on your item.
I AGREE WITH YOU...I HATE IT TOO...
AND THE BAD THING ABOUT IT IS IT WILL ONLY
SLOW DOWN THE MOST NOVELIST THIEF...
BUT IT WILL MAKE EAUCTIONMGNT FEEL GOOD...
JANE....HERE IS MY HOME PAGE..
http://www.reggaestreet.com/2/hopeless/
XXX
HOPELESS SINNER
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mcjane
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posted on May 6, 2001 11:45:53 PM new
Well since I don't know where jumpinville is I don't know what time it is there, but here in Pennsylvania it's 2:40am 
so "tomorrow is another day" I took a quick look & there is lots to see. Your web page is very colorful (love that)& I will visit Jamica & see the whole thing tomorrow. Can't wait.
Thanks for the address.
jane
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RichieRich
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posted on May 7, 2001 01:24:46 AM new
I know this is off the subject but JUMPINJACK you just got to know this:
I have read a few times now about your dislike for PayPal but when you go to your HOME PAGE..
http://www.reggaestreet.com/2/hopeless/
There is a pop up ad click on it...10 best things on the web ( or something like that) the 4th or 5th thing is $5.00 free from PayPal.
Kind of ironic!
[ edited by RichieRich on May 7, 2001 01:25 AM ]
[ edited by RichieRich on May 7, 2001 01:31 AM ]
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eauctionmgnt
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posted on May 7, 2001 06:44:58 AM new
JumpinJack & Sulyn:
I just want to clarify that I did NOT copy information from the instruction manual. I agree completely that doing so would have been copyright infringement, and that is why I developed my own wording (based on my own personal experience using and selling this model camera over the past 10 years) to describe the camera's features. I am sure you can recognize the time and effort it takes to do such a description. Hence, I believe I am VERY justifiably angry at Goodwill for copying MY description without asking.
I'd also like to thank those who posted their concerns about the tag JumpinJack suggested. Based on your comments, I do not think I will be using it in my auctions. I still have not heard back from either SafeHarbor or Goodwill, but I will keep you posted on the developments. Thank you all again for your help!
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eauctionmgnt
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posted on May 7, 2001 10:22:32 AM new
Well... still no reply from Goodwill or Safeharbor... but I checked Goodwill's auction site again, and guess what? They ended their auction early and retracted all the bids! That's a step in the right direction, but I'm still waiting for a formal appology. I am encouraged, though, that they do seem to realize the importance of this. It will be interesting to see what response (if any) I receive from my e-mail.
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Twelvepole
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posted on May 7, 2001 12:11:06 PM new
I say prove it!
All I see is ineuendo and suppositions.... nothing really actually concrete.
How do you know they didn't get the same information you did?
So what if they took a sentence or two from your description?
I hope they sue your ass for defamation.
Ain't Life Grand... 
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eauctionmgnt
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posted on May 7, 2001 12:44:32 PM new
Twelvepole:
Out of an auction description of 16 sentences, Goodwill copied 15 of them word-for-word (including mis-spellings of mine). The only sentence they did not copy was one where I described mine as a factory re-conditioned camera with a six-month warranty. They replaced this with a sentance of their own indicating that their camera was used and in good condition. This was an original auction description I had developed personally, with unique wording and phrases. I find your comment to be both insulting and inappropriate to this forum. Your use of vulgar language is unprofessional and uncalled for. I would like to request that the moderators issue you a warning.
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SmittyAW
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posted on May 7, 2001 01:02:38 PM new
Twelvepole..
Your comments are combative and disruptive as well as a violation of our requirement to treat fellow posters with respect and courtesy. Consider this a warning to not continue in this vein as it will put your posting privileges in jeopardy.
Smitty
[email protected]
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Twelvepole
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posted on May 7, 2001 02:33:30 PM new
I make no apologies... and accept my warning.
I will be emailing [email protected] to discuss this further.
Ain't Life Grand...
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Twelvepole
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posted on May 7, 2001 02:48:08 PM new
I still think that two auction people can come up with the same auction Description. Especially when one of the parties admits to using the instruction booklet for a guide, hmmm bet the other party is just as smart.
Take it to court; would love to see what they say.
Ain't Life Grand...
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eauctionmgnt
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posted on May 7, 2001 03:20:28 PM new
Twelvepole:
As I posted previously, I did NOT copy this information from a manual. As posted previously, my description was based on my own personal experience using and selling this model camera over the past 10 years. My description included additional information not obtainable from any instruction manuals (such as the price we used to sell the camera for at our photography store when the camera was first released.) Your posts are continuing to be combative and disruptive. As the moderator has suggested, please don't continue to post in this vein!
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Twelvepole
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posted on May 7, 2001 04:03:13 PM new
eauctionmgnt
Please explain how may last post was combative?
I have an opinion and am expressing such, there was no vulgarities and if you are unwilling to debate the issue, please have it locked.
I guess it is too much to ask, that someone agree, that two individuals can come up with the same description for the same item using the same material.
Copyrighted material to begin with no doubt.
Ain't Life Grand...
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Libra63
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posted on May 7, 2001 08:46:11 PM new
eauctionmgnt-Thanks for keeping us posted. I think it shows that they knew they were wrong when they pulled their auction. In a previous thread quite a while ago a power seller said that they didn't have time to write their own descriptions so they take from other people, that is how they can maintain their power selling. I would be furious if someone stole me description because I do write my own. If I do use copywrited material I say it before I use it. I don't know if that is legal but no one has said anything to me. I would put twelvepole on block. If is obvious that they didn't read the whole thread. Auctionwatch board is here to help us, not condemn. Take Care
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eauctionmgnt
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posted on May 8, 2001 06:06:29 AM new
Libra63:
Thank you for your kind words. I am sure that those who read the entire thread will notice that I AM open to all opinions, even when I do not agree them.
TwelvePole:
I considered your posts to be combative for two reasons:
1) You stated you would not appologize - which in essence reitterates your previous post.
2) You continue to state that I copied the instruction manual when I have stated numerous times that this is not the case. My description was developed from my OWN personal experience with the camera. Please read the entire thread before posting.
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eauctionmgnt
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posted on May 8, 2001 06:12:30 AM new
Well... I just received a response from Goodwill.... I'm not sure exactly what to think though. I'll post their response, and would appreciate your comments on it.
Dear Mr. xxxx,
shopgoodwill.com is an operating division of Goodwill Industries of Orange County ("GIOC" . We accept postings from other Goodwill organizations throughout the country and internationally which have no direct affiliation with GIOC. The relationship between GIOC and other Goodwill organizations
is that each are members of the same umbrella organization, Goodwill Industries International.
The auction ad of which you complain was posted by one of the other Goodwill organizations. Until we received your e-mail communication, we had no indication that any of the content of the posting had been copied. Promptly upon receipt of your e-mail communication, and in compliance with both our obligations under the Digital Millennium Copyright Act and our own internal policies, we investigated the allegations. Upon making a determination that portions of the two auction ads contained language which was identical and could have been copied, we immediately removed this ad from the auction
block. At the time it was removed, no bids had been received and, accordingly, no sale was consummated.
The ad will not be reposted unless we receive information which leads us to conclude that it does not contain material which was copied from any third party source, including your own ad.
We have made no determination as to whether any copyright infringement or other improper copying has occurred.
We regret any inconvenience this may have caused you.
Sincerely,
XXX XXXXXX
Vice President, Marketing & Public Relations
Goodwill Industries of Orange County
It's not exactly a true appology, is it? Note how they won't admit that it WAS copyright infringement (rather frustrating in itself!) Also... they outright lied about their auction not having bids. It did have a bid on it, which was cancelled when they closed the auction. Also, notice that no offer of compensation was made. I'm not really sure to react. How would you?
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rca001
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posted on May 8, 2001 06:18:12 AM new
Their letter seems to be in the spirit of EBay's "we're just a venue". However you got what you were requesting - the auction was pulled. As far as your looking for some kind of compensation, I don't see that you have demonstrated that you have lost any money through their auction. And I think you'll get quite a bit of debate as to what the value of an auction description is (complete with misspellings).
If I were you, I'd let it rest - you got more than most people whose descriptions or pictures are stolen.
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Twelvepole
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posted on May 8, 2001 06:31:00 AM new
I think Goodwill.com deserves a big hand... took the high road with just some persons word... you know a potential customer...
Kudos to Goodwill.com.
Ain't Life Grand...
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topdog12
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posted on May 8, 2001 09:42:02 AM new
I can't believe the effort some people put into something thats no big deal. This sort of thing happens everyday. You resolved it, now get over it & get on with your life. What really blows my mind is that you want compensation, FOR WHAT & from a charity no less. Unbelievable.
Yes I read the entire thread. Yawn
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Valleygirl
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posted on May 8, 2001 10:15:39 AM new
I guess it all comes down to ethics and morals. I understand the original poster's frustration at having their description stolen. Some people feel this is not a big deal, their ethics/morals are not the same.
When I feel I've been wronged in Real Life, I've taken on big business. Sometime I win, sometimes I don't.
What saddens me is the steady decline in ethics and morality that I've seen the last 40 years.
Not my name on ebay.
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jacqueg
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posted on May 8, 2001 10:23:56 AM new
Valleygirl,
Ditto! Excellent post.
Not jacqueg on ebay.
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marble
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posted on May 8, 2001 10:39:45 AM new
bitofagrump says: Ask Goodwill for a receipt for your donation-say it's an original work and you value it at $2000.
Oh yeah, I love it!
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rca001
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posted on May 8, 2001 11:51:00 AM new
Valleygirl-
I don't appreciate your casting aspersions on my moral and ethical judgment, because I think eauctionmgnt should drop things now. I don't agree with stealing auction descriptions, I think it is stealing, and I think its wrong. However, after eauctionmgnt's complaint, Goodwill removed the offending auction. Eauctionmgnt asked what further actions, if any, they should take. I think the idea of trying to get some kind of monetary settlement from Goodwill for the use of an auction description is carrying this way too far. It is part and parcel with the tendency in our society today to litigate everything, and look for money for every little thing that might happen to you.
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Valleygirl
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posted on May 8, 2001 11:56:17 AM new
It's too bad you took my posting personal, I don't believe I directed it at you. I was commenting on the original posters' position and adding an opinion.
Not my name on ebay.
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topdog12
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posted on May 8, 2001 12:14:16 PM new
rca001 Good post. Valleygirl I still don't think it's a big deal, it's not the thing to do, but there are worse things than using someone elses discription such fraud, misrepresentation, shilling even a NPB. This is far down on the list to me & the fact that someone thinks they should be reimbursed blows my mind. People are robbed of hundreds of dollars & get nothing & here someone wants money when none was lost. If Goodwill chose to use one of my discriptions I would just consider it a donation & hope they do well with it. The only big deal here is what the poster is making over the whole thing. If it wasn't pathetic it would be funny.
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kenlee
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posted on May 8, 2001 12:16:19 PM new
I think I'd be sending Goodwill a thank you note at this point.
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Libra63
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posted on May 8, 2001 12:20:10 PM new
valleygirl- I agree with you 100%. Morals have gone away like the wind blows. I am to old to figure out what to do but maybe someone will. I hope so for the future generation.
I don't think shopgoodwill.com took eauctionmgnt word for the auction, they just had to go in and look for themselves and they realized their mistake Someone said Goodwill is just a charity organization. Yes, I agree with that but when they charge the prices that they do (at least at our store)they are more like retail.
I only launch about 4 auctions a day because it does take me a while to do my descriptions. I do not list duplicate items so I have to do many different ones. I wouldn't steal someone elses and I sure hope no one steals from me. Maybe the sellers that don't care should announce that their descriptions are for the taking. Take Care
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Twelvepole
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posted on May 8, 2001 03:51:57 PM new
Only mistake I see is that they didn't use enough different descriptions to mix the wording around.
I will use 2-4 different descriptions to come up with one I like.
I always use my own photos.
Ain't Life Grand...
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sulyn1950
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posted on May 8, 2001 04:12:08 PM new
My vote goes to sending Goodwill a thank you.
They pulled the offending auction. They did so without delay. They did it without making you sign up as a VERO member first! I am impressed.
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