posted on May 19, 2001 10:44:30 AM new
I would like to hear what others think it would take to be a challenger to ebay. I have read many of the complaints, but I would like to see what it was that made ebay so great in the begining and up till about eight months ago. We have been selling and buying for the past year and have done well. I agree that ebay is out of control and looks like it wants to squash the little guy, us. Look forword to replys.
posted on May 19, 2001 10:52:00 AM new
I think when buyers and sellers begin to diversify... list and shop at various venues, eBay will recognize whether or not (if they haven't already) Mom & Pop - individual sellers are an important part of it's venue.
posted on May 19, 2001 11:12:48 AM new
Although I wasn't at eBay in the "very beginning," and can't speak to what made it great then, I think what has made it the powerhouse is marketing, money, marketing, money, marketing. eBay was the first, and it was, and is, marketed incessantly, and has always had a huge influx of cash to keep it growing. Much like AOL, which is not by FAR the best way to connect with the internet, but they are omnipresent!
Unfortunately for those of use who fall into the "Mom and Pop" category, that kind of selling does not a fortune make, either for us or for "the venue" (eBay).
The amount of money that it would take for a challenger to be successful against eBay is astronomical. My guess is that the successes will be niche auction houses -- places where well-defined, non-mass-produced merchandise can be sold to interested customers without them having to put up with all the flotsam and jetsam of retail sellers. Such a site would obviously never be as big as eBay, and hence not as lucrative for the venue itself, but may be better for those of us who sell stuff other than newly produced items (antiques, true collectibles, etc.)
posted on May 19, 2001 11:25:53 AM new
Untill eBay does something to piss the BUYER off, nothing is going to change to help the "seller".
Realistically...what does the buyer care how they treat us sellers. They come to eBay to shop, find a good deal, find that long lost piece to their collection.
They (the buyer) really has no affiliation to eBay.
AND...there just is not enough of US sellers that want to leave Ebay that will make a difference. Because if we leave 10 more will hop aboard to take our place.
We(sellers) are in a NO WIN situation.
I still think the co-op idea had potential.
My idea to get the BUYERS away from eBay is to all of us pool our resources, money, ADVERTISE like hell and start ALL auctions at $1.00 to $9.99.
By golly give the buyers a REASON to come and look at what we have!
Until we give the BUYERS a reason to look somewhere else......eBay RULES!
posted on May 19, 2001 11:31:06 AM new
"Realistically...what does the buyer care how they treat us sellers. They come to eBay to shop, find a good deal, find that long lost piece to their collection."
That's exactly why eBay started. "In the beginning", it wasn't about sellers. It was about providing a place for buyers to get a good deal. The sellers, seeing this, started listing all kinds of stuff at prices approaching retail.
Now, many buyers are so addicted to eBay that they don't even bother to shop for price anymore - it's a lot easier just to click the button.
eBay is nothing more than a giant shopping mall now ...
posted on May 19, 2001 11:32:43 AM new
I keep hoping that the PTB at Yahoo will get their heads out of their collective a**es, and just charge a FVF. I think they're the only ones in place that could compete right now.
Mom & Pop's will always be important businesses because there are just some things that are not economies of scale. Are there antique chains?
People who sell antiques, collectibles, or quality one-of-a-kind items are often very successful, even with only one shop in one town. The beauty of eBay is that it gives this type of seller an international audience for a reasonable price.
I believe in the short run, eBay will be very profitable making it tough for small sellers. In the long run, however, if eBay only sells new items, what will make them unique?
posted on May 19, 2001 11:32:58 AM new
I agree that it can be done, but it will take money, marketing savvy and some adverturnesome sellers.
The most important part is the creativity to define and own a market niche in a way that ebay can't. So I would look at things (categories) they do poorly and have little skill (or interest) in promoting. There are quite a few of them.
Devise a unique shopping concept that none of the auction sites have at the moment, rather than simply duplicating what exists. You have to differentiate yourself to capture the imagination of the public.
Invite key sellers to participate for free for the first year, pay them a fee to share their buyers names and addresses (not email!) and send them incentives to shop the new site. If the focus is on just a couple of key areas, you can take out full page ads in the publications that cater to these collectors.
Say you wanted people who had champagne taste but lived on a beer budget, some of ebay's most active bidders. What would get their fingers tapping the keyboard? How would you create a marketing campaign to reach them? Once attracted, what would get them to browse and buy?
posted on May 19, 2001 11:34:11 AM new
Ebay's SAFE HARBOR is a joke. they won't even respond to email complaints re; fraud, theft, etc. unless it is over the $250.00 minimum. If a seller defrauds thousands of buyers @ $100.00. that is a tidy profit with no fear of investigation.. Further they raise the fees even though profits are at a all time high. they refuse to reverse or investigate fraudulent negative feedback. In short they take your money and provide less service..
It would take time to overcome the name familiarity, but if someone could provide similar service and be more responsive to consumer complaints, i think ebay would be gone.
The goal of that thread was to discuss the types of things that would make a great auction site, both for bidders and sellers, and which would actually be able to ATTRACT enough users to be viable.
Too many sites try to compete with eBay by becoming eBay clones or "eBay Lite". I think what's necessary is to come up with some new ideas that could actually work instead of just being "pie-in-the-sky" wishful thinking.
Regards,
Barry
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The opinions expressed above are for comparison purposes only. Your mileage may vary....
posted on May 19, 2001 11:41:19 AM new
Ditto to packer! I am still hoping for a co-op and if it comes to fruition I will do as he says and have many "loss leaders" to help bring in the buyers.
As to what made ebay so great,well, I came in 1997 so I wasn't in at the very beginning but back before it went public it was a real community and ebay did everything it could to please it's sellers. I can't even begin to list all the changes but most of them have been detrimental to the sellers. Some, of course, would happen with any growth company.
However, there really is no excuse for the amount of down time in a company with this much business. And since their bottom line for their shareholders is there God now, the small sellers are really just in their way so they can treat them any way they please.
posted on May 19, 2001 11:58:07 AM new
wpbf: There is one way and one way only for sellers to challenge eBay and that is to STOP LISTING ITEMS FOR SALE THERE!
I guess its just a lot easier to 'itch and complain rather than to do just that and support another site.
posted on May 19, 2001 12:25:00 PM new
Dottie: I'd LOVE to see ePier succeed!
However, most sellers are satisifed to keep listing their stuff on eBay which means that people who want to buy things (a.k.a. buyers!) will have to do just that on eBay.
>My idea to get the BUYERS away from eBay is to all of us pool our resources, money, ADVERTISE like hell and start ALL auctions at $1.00 to $9.99.
If that's what it takes, I can't afford it. No way can I list merchandise that is worth hundreds of $$ (and that I paid hundreds of $$ for) for 9.99 on a new, slow auction site.
I like the idea of a co-op, but this wouldn't work. We (or at least I) can't afford to give good merchandise away for the length of time it would to build up the traffic.
posted on May 19, 2001 01:23:31 PM new
"My idea to get the BUYERS away from eBay is to all of us pool our resources, money, ADVERTISE like hell and start ALL auctions at $1.00 to $9.99."
"If that's what it takes, I can't afford it. No way can I list merchandise that is worth hundreds of $$ (and that I paid hundreds of $$ for) for 9.99 on a new, slow auction site."
I agree, and as a matter of fact, if you check out BidVille you'll see that many sellers are listing at higher than average prices there.
This really amazes me.
You would think that because there are no listing fees (yet), that sellers would be willing to cut their profits just a bit to encourage bidders.
Personally, I don't think all the advertising in the world will convince buyers to pay a premium at a new site. As a buyer, and since Yahoo suspended me for reporting a bootlegger (!), I shop exclusively at eBay. I don't have much use for eBay itself (it's Directors, Drones or it's philosophy), but the selection is tremendous, prices are reasonable, and the sellers that I have purchased from are honest and nice people.
I only wish more of them would ship outside the USA
posted on May 19, 2001 05:01:10 PM new
I would LOVE to see an auction site - any auction site -- successfully challenge ebay (and I'm not talking about at multi-billion dollars). I'm so freakin' fed up with ebay it's not even funny.
But the problem isn't listings on all the other sites I've taken a look at (well, in a few cases it was), but BIDDERS. On many sites I've looked at things are listed at or near retail (or book value). No fun in that -- certainly not as a starting bid!
I haven't looked at epier in a while, and I'll try to do that this evening. I hope it looks promising, but I've been so disappointed in various auction sites so many times that I'm not expecting any change from the last time I looked at it.
But anyway, the point I was going to make is that if there's an auction site YOU want to see succeed, then do some BUYING on that auction site, not just listing. IMO this is what most sites need more of more than more sellers and more listings.
posted on May 19, 2001 06:33:28 PM new
I've read the posts.
Yes, I understand that starting high dollar items at $1.00 is VERY RISKY.
But what IF there was an "open house" for say a week or 2. to view all the auctions listeded.
ADVERTISE like crazy that in 2 weeks these auctions will be OPEN FOR BIDS.
AND...another thing, who says you have to put all your high dollar items on.
Gosh.....I remember way back when.....I went to Live Auction and got a box of "JUNK" for $1.00 and made $600.00 out of it.
NOW...get back into those dollar junk boxes and list them for a $1.00 ~ NO RESERVE and see what happens.
Come-on......you guys out there have a lot of smarts,.. there must be a way for an advertising gimmic to bring the buyers in.
I JUST CAN'T BELIEVE that by now someone hasn't thought of a way to DETHRONE eBay.
posted on May 20, 2001 05:48:09 AM new
I have been to epier.com and in my opinion, they aren't that good of a site for buying items. Many sellers have items listed at high starting prices, so it is not advantagous to bid. Also the items that are listed are few. There are many auctions for get rich schemes and assorted nonsense that clutter up the site.
And one other thing that I am suprised no one has mentioned is the fact at how closely epier.com resembles eBAy. I would think that should they become a threat to eBay, eBay would slap a huge lawsuit on them and get them shutdown because of how closely they look like eBay.
I hope in the near future epier thrives, but as of now, i don't think they stand a chance of surviving.
Also since epier has low or no fees now, do you think that if they become a success they won't follow in eBay's footsteps?
Sadly, the topic didn't generate much discussion. Feel free to post your own ideas on that thread. The goal there was to come up with ideas that are actually practical [i.e., that could be done, that would attract both buyers and sellers, and would be successful] instead of just complaining that eBay has gone downhill and wouldn't it be nice if there were a better alternative somewhere.
I'm full of ideas, personally. What I don't have is the programming knowledge or capital to implement them. Care to donate a million dollars or two? Unlike the days when eBay first started, this can't be run out of somebody's garage until business picks up; nobody's going to come to a new site unless it is full-featured, fully operational, and fully staffed, and a lot of money will have to be spent on advertising it so people know about it.
Regards,
Barry
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The opinions expressed above are for comparison purposes only. Your mileage may vary....
posted on May 20, 2001 07:28:15 AM new
I would be interested in an honest show of hands ...
How many of you who dislike eBay have actually stopped listing or buying there?
I have found through many years of life, that most people are apathetic when it comes time to put the rubber to the road. For example ... Canadians ... did you know that if you stop buying gasoline at Petro Canada and Esso, you can force them to bring the price of gas down?
A lot of people know this but very few are willing to take the advice. Same for eBay ...
posted on May 20, 2001 07:41:54 AM new
Ebay succeeded and continues to succeed due to a positive feedback loop: the bigger the audience, the better a place it is both buy and sell. This dynamic squelches competition.
However, eBay does have some chinks in the armor, most vividly in their refusal to allow listing of legal, but controversial items. If another site allowed such items, and conquered that space, and built from that critical mass, a threat might be marshalled.
Without at least a vibrant, alive beginning, no such competition will be forthcoming, wishes notwithstanding.
posted on May 20, 2001 07:59:14 AM new
And it looks like the old Gold's Auction is alive and well again at www.sellyouritem.com
I didn't believe it at first, but went over there to take a look for myself. Was able to register on the SellYourItem site and IMPORT all of my GOLD'S AUCTION feedback, Stored Auctions and MY PAGE.
posted on May 20, 2001 08:06:45 AM new
I like eBay and as long as thats where the bidders go thats where I'm staying.
HOWEVER.....I certainly am open to the idea of helping a new and BETTER site grow.
With the other auction sites that are up and running now...I see no advertising done(only hear about them here)and I haven't heard where any of them have a HOOK to bring the bidders in.
And besides.....buyers will not return once they check out the sight and see NO POTENTIAL for a "bargin".
posted on May 20, 2001 08:06:53 AM new
Hi Dottie...
I never used Gold's, so I don't remember many details about all the furor. Why did they change their name? Sellyouritem.com doesn't have much of a ring to it...not for attracting buyers, anyway, IMO.
posted on May 20, 2001 08:07:48 AM new
I have gone for stretches neither selling or buying. I can afford to promote a new site by listing many items without making a profit on them, but it has to be the right site like maybe a not for profit co-op or seller owned co-op where I know my time and work will eventually be paid back and not a site which may raise it's prices (and change like ebay) after I helped them become successful.
Unluckily, probably less than 10% can afford to do this as they depend on ebay for their livelihood and I can't blame them for that.
It's a Catch-22 situation. The sellers have to raise their starting prices because they know there won't be any bidding wars on a small site and the buyers don't want to go to a new site with high prices.
Oh,well,maybe someone will win the lottery!(if it's not me then I hope it's you Barry, tho with that new chick catching car you may not want to waste time on starting an auction)LOL
posted on May 20, 2001 08:30:09 AM new
toke: I don't think it's the same owners as when it was Gold's Auction. Somehow, somebody has obtained the rights to use the old gold's pages etc.
I just heard about it late last night. I have no idea how long this "new version" of the Old Gold's Auction has been up. I don't know why they are calling it Sell Your Item .Com (SYI) - maybe they think it's something that folks will remember better... I dunno.
The listings are just now growing, as some of the old Gold's Auction community has gathered over there and are doing their part to grow the site. I noticed that somebody posted last night that they already had a bid.
When Gold's was up and running, I did quite well on that venue. I'll definitely be adding this SellYourItem.com AND ePier to my online sales activity. (of course anything I do on line is in addition to my website and in addition to my listings at eBay).
posted on May 20, 2001 08:39:51 AM new
Thanks, Dottie...I'll take a look. I DO remember there were a lot of people that loved Gold's and were quite loyal to it.
