posted on July 10, 2001 11:55:03 PM new
I received a New broken videotape. paid $2.50 +2.50 shipping. it was packed very poorly. when I unwrapped it from the new packaging it fell apart in my hands. i wrote the seller that since it was so poorly wrapped i think i should be reimbursed. he said he would give me a one dollar credit towards another purchase. i said i would never buy from him again so what good is a one dollar credit? I would love to neg this guy but i have zero negs and don't want my first. he has about 480 positives and eight negs. it was such a hard to find item that i didn't check his feedback or i wouldn't have bought it. seemed like such a minor purchase buy i never received a broken item before, even on terribly wrapped items.
posted on July 11, 2001 12:20:08 AM new
Feedback is such a sensitive issue, but I really don't understand why. You rate the specific transaction you had with the seller/buyer. Those who transact with that person after you have the opportunity to review the track record.
You mention the previous negative feedbacks for that seller, and how you wouldn't have bid if you had looked at them. Well, what if those 8 people were too chicken to give an appraisal of their experience with that seller?
If you want the advantages of knowing what others thought of their experience with that seller, you oughta be willing to provide the same courtesy to others. No?
posted on July 11, 2001 01:02:05 AM new
The feedback forum does not work at Ebay because people are too afraid to post negative in fear of receiving negative. Just like your sitution. We have all been in the boat at one time or another, I am sure.
I am assuming you had this item shipped without insurance. If you did, then you took the risk and you lost. You said he had it poorly packed. Is a neutral more appropiate, since if you would have had it insured, you could have a recourse to collect on it. If a buyer declines insurance, I do not think the seller should be held liable. In a neutral feedback you can state his poor packing job.
Also I am assuming he has left you no feedback yet. Why? I leave my buyers feedback when they pay. If a seller doesn't leave feedback until after you do, then that is a seller I wouldn't want to do business with. THAT WOULD BE A BIG RED FLAG warning to me. And you can check this before you buy, by checking feedbacks he has left, see if they were left after he received his feedback from that buyer. Do your homework before you buy from the seller and save yourself a headache later.
When checking feedback don't rely on reputation by amonunt of negative feedbacks because as I said earlier, like yourself, most are afraid to post them. So when you look at feedback, you really are not getting a true account of that person's trustworthiness or reliability. This is why the feedback forum is not working and why it will not ever work as it should. Ebay has alot left to be desired on their feedback forum.
I looked at a seller that had over 12,000 feedback and never has left a negative feedback. Wow! Everyone has paid him and no negative experiences. SORRY CHARLIE, NO WAY THAT I WILL EVER BELIEVE THAT! FURTHER PROOF feedback forum does not work, he didn't want negative so he didn't leave negative. By the way he has all positive and a handful of neutral feedbacks. NO NEGATIVES!
"We are all human and taught to stay away from what we fear" and that sums it up and gives you your answer concerning posting negative feedback.
posted on July 11, 2001 01:28:28 AM new
You definitely should leave a BIG FAT NEG for this seller. A seller has a responsibility to the buyer, insurance or no insurance.
As far as retaliatory neg goes, I am always able to tell that when reading feedback. That type of feedback is usually so emotional! If you make your neg cool and factual "Broken item, poor packaging, no resolution, buyers risk".
posted on July 11, 2001 02:16:48 AM new
Lets see... you paid $2.50 for a video tape. Bargain basement price. And $2.50 for shipping, which is about minimum charge, so this seller is not trying to rip you off.
You purchased this item without insurance, and automatically assume that it is the sellers fault when it arrives damaged. He probably used a small VCR tape box, with maybe a little paper padding. He's probably sent hundreds like this with never a problem.
He offers a 40% credit, and you still want to neg him? A tad bit spiteful I would say.
As the tape inside is probably OK, just get a screwdriver and switch cassette cases with an old junk tape. You now have a 40% refund, as well as a working tape.
Though I always try to pack well, even when it is just for appearance sake - I can understand shortcuts some vendors might take, especially if they feel the item is not fragile. But these people are simply unaware of the Magilla Gorilla Lunchtime Frisbee Team at the loading docks of their regional Post Offices.
A neg? NO! Friendly advice to pack a bit better? YES!
And I would also advise him not to sell anything under $5. At $2.50 he's working at mexican sweatshop wages so its small wonder if he cuts corners on packing time.
posted on July 11, 2001 02:42:05 AM new
snakebait, It is not this bidders fault that the item only sold for $2.50. They are still expecting an unbroken item. The seller needs to either send a replacement tape or a refund of at least the purchase price.
You wouldn't let them off the hook if it was a $100.00 piece of glassware would you? We, as the seller, have a responsibility to the high bidder. We owe good packaging and a useable product.
posted on July 11, 2001 04:26:42 AM new
While I agree that it is not nice to receive a broken item.... I don't think that the seller's offer is too unreasonable. Let me crunch a few numbers to show you why:
If you had paid insurance for this item, it would have cost $1.10. This would have brought your total to $6.10. IF the USPS decided to honor your insurance claim, they would have paid you $2.50. (they won't pay for s/h or insurance costs... only item value). So.... out of the money you spent, you would have lost $3.60. The seller is offering you a deal where you loose $4.00. In all honesty, they're not that far off in comparison...AND the seller really isn't completely responsible for the USPS breaking your tape.
Of course... all this also depends on how exactly the item was packed. You said it was packed poorly... but you didn't explain exactly how it was packed. Was it sent in a padded mailer? A bubble mailer? A video box? Just wrapped in brown paper? With the exception of wrapping it in brown paper, all of the others should qualify for acceptable packaging by USPS standards, and if Insurance had been placed the item most likely would have been covered.
posted on July 11, 2001 04:35:07 AM new
One of my pet peeves -- to the point that I no longer buy videos on eBay or Yahoo!
The last 4 came shipped silly -- in paper envelopes! These were not cheap videos either: all were OP and at least $20.00 each!
When I ship a video, I ship wrapped in bubble-wrap in a box! Amazon sent me a video that was smashed in their cheesey shipping box! HOWEVER, they IMMEDIATELY gave me a choice of COMPLETE REFUND or REPLACEMENT!
I gave up on video seller BOZOS charging me $4.50 for shipping...only to stick the poor video in a PAPER ENVELOPE with MEDIA MAIL slow-boat postage!
posted on July 11, 2001 05:18:03 AM new
OK, so let me get this straight. I sell something to you ofr $100. I package it poorly. It breaks and is useless. You complain, I offer you a $40 credit on your next purchase. You should be happy, accept it and move on. Hey, you know, I think I've just figured out a great way to save money on ebay. Cut back on my packaging expenses!
Really. If an item is packaged poorly and breaks during shipping. The buyer should NOT have to take a compromise. This is the seller's fault. and they should refund the seller's money, in total. Amadika, you don't specify what the 8 negs were for, whether they were retalitory or not, but I can't help but wonder if some of them were not for poor packaging. I would negthe seller. Poorly packaged, damaged during shipping, offered $1 CREDIT for next purchase. Other buyers need to know the risk they are taking. As a buyer, I read feedback before I bid, (there have been occaisions where I haven't, and I have been burned) and this is something I would want to know.
posted on July 11, 2001 06:05:40 AM new
I believe that USPS accept items upto 75lbs in weight.
Was your tape packaged in a manner which could reasonably be expected to survive that load on it?
If not - Neg the !@#$.
I often get complaints about my shipping charges, but the consumer is comparing my price with the average 'inadequately packaged' price.
I think that any reasonable person can expect that it be packaged in a safe method, regardles of amount quoted, even if it is $2.50.
If you’re a buyer, don’t worry about a neg.
I’m sure that 99% of sellers wouldn’t cancel a bid by a neg’ bidder, even if they noticed in time, before auction close.
Sellers like that are like the car company that won’t recall 100,000 cars to fix the faulty brakes, but instead continue to provide the inadequate product because it’s cost effective.
MAKE’EM SQUEAL!!! NEG’EM
While amadika has stated that the packaging was poor...we really don't know what her opinion of poor is. I've known customers who would consider shipment in a custom plywood box, lined with fitted foam to be poor. That's why I think we need to know exactly how the item was packaged before we all assume that the packaging quality was lower than standard. If this seller has 480 positives... he's no rookie. He must have SOME experience in shipping items! I'm not saying that this couldn't be his first venture into video tapes and that he couldn't have made a mistake in choosing his packaging methods. I just think we need to know exactly how the item was packed before the rest of us make the conclusion that the item was improperly packed.
If indeed the item was packed so poorly that the USPS wouldn't have covered an insurance claim if insurance had been issued... then YES the seller SHOULD be responsible for the full bid amount (and probably the s/h charge as well!) However, if the seller complied with the USPS packing standards, it is partly the bidders fault for not requesting insurance.
Yet, when you consider the numbers I crunched earlier... it is rather foolish to put insurance on such low priced items anyhow! That is why low-ticket items ($2.50) are much different in comparison to high-ticket items ($100.00) when insurance is considered. At $2.50... you would in essence receive 56% of your bid after insurance costs ($1.40). While at $100.00, you receive 98.9% of your bid after insurance costs ($98.90). When you consider how low a return you have on lower priced items that are insured... it is no wonder why many bidders choose not to insure their low-ticket items.
posted on July 11, 2001 07:04:14 AM new
Without a doubt, Neg the Seller if in fact the item was poorly packaged. The lack of insurance has nothing to do with the responsibility of the Seller to see to it that the item is packaged adequately for shipping.
Offering a credit is a JOKE! Why would anyone want to repeat business with a Seller that failed his responsibility the first go around?
Lack of insurance should not be an excuse for a Seller's negligence of poor packing. If Sellers so readily recognize the shoddy treatment of Postal Worker's with packages, shouldn't they take precautions to ensure the items they ship make it through such rough housing?
tomwiii Amen! I agree and had similiar experiences with video & cd purchases from eBay Sellers. I too will not purchase either items off ebay again unless I am familiar with the Seller & know how they pack.
posted on July 11, 2001 08:13:31 AM new
I have to side with eauctionmgmt on this one. Until we know what "poor packing" really means, it is hard to say what is right.
Amadika---
Please tell us exactly how it was packaged. Box? Enevelope? Bubblewrap? Etc.
posted on July 11, 2001 08:24:51 AM new. he has about 480 positives and eight negs i didn't check his feedback or i wouldn't have bought it
are you really saying that the fact that someone has a 98% positive with 2 % negaative would keep you form Biddding?
posted on July 11, 2001 11:03:40 AM new
Sorry, but with or without insurance, it is the SELLER'S responsibility to make sure the item gets there, and in working shape. If the seller wants to avoid paying, they should charge for insurance in the fees. Sending a video should cost $1.33 using media mail, and $1.10 for insurance is $1.43
$1 credit is a joke! The seller deserves a neg
I agree that the system is stacked against the seller. This is why I have 2 ebay accounts, one for buying, and one for selling. On my buying account, I would issue a neg. If I get one in return, I really would not care! Who cares if you are a buyer, is the seller going to cancel the auction because you have a neg? The feedback system needs serious work. It does not make sense to leave negative as a seller, but as a buyer (on a buyer account) there is no reason not to!
posted on July 11, 2001 11:35:01 AM new
"IF the USPS decided to honor your insurance claim, they would have paid you $2.50. (they won't pay for s/h or insurance costs... only item value)" - this is an incorrect statement if the item is destroyed. The post office refunds the price and the item and the cost of the postage. You are out the insurance and any handling the seller charged.
If the item can be repaired, then the PO doesn't refund postage. Just the cost of the repair up to the ceiling for which the item was insured.
Sorry... but I don't buy that the seller is ALWAYS responsible in cases where items are damaged during shipment. Have you seen some of the ways "professional" shipment services such as UPS and USPS treat their packages? Even the best packing job can get damaged in transit. That's why insurance should be requested it the buyer is concerned about the carrier being used. However, to include the insurance in the s/h costs just causes inflated fees for those bidders who choose to rely on the carriers service.
Another point I'd like to make is that your calculations are off. First of all $1.33 + $1.10 = $2.43... not $1.53. Already, that cost is almost as much as was charged for s/h. $.07 isn't much for a handling fee! Secondly, insurance is not even available for media-mail. You need to send the item at least first-class to qualify for insurance.
Again, I would like to know exactly how the item was packaged before judgement is placed on this seller. So far, I see him as covering all but $.40 of what the USPS would have covered IF the item had been insured. Considering that the item WASN'T insured... that seems to be a pretty nice offer, in my opinion.
[ edited by eauctionmgnt on Jul 11, 2001 11:39 AM ]
posted on July 11, 2001 11:37:52 AM new
Insurance is available for Media Mail. I do it all the time. But if you don't agree, please go to the domestic rate calculator and put in a fictitious item. When the list of options comes back with the rates, click on the one that says Media Mail, and you'll see that there's an option for insurance.
[ edited by sadie999 on Jul 11, 2001 11:41 AM ]
posted on July 11, 2001 11:43:08 AM new
Actually, both our math is wrong! It is $2.43 which is what I meant to say (and insurance is available for media mail!)
I still think it is the seller's responsibility to get the item there, and undamaged! No matter how careful you are, damage does occur. Can you imagine buying from JC Penney Catalog, having something broken, and them telling you sorry, but it is not our fault? You would be outraged! I know you are dealing with one person and multi million dollar company, but the principle is the same!
Now, if the seller had terms that said $2.50 shipping, and $1.10 more if you want insurance, and if you do not want insurance, we are not responsible, then it is the buyer who is stuck. They waived their right, but unless that right is waived, the seller is 100% responsible! I still think offering $1 credit is a poor decision by the seller. Chances are an unexperienced buyer may not try on-line again. If I were the buyer, I would neg the seller unless they either replaced the item, or made a full refund (and I know you can not insure shipping costs, but that is an expense the seller will just have to make, I've made it before as a seller) - I would not expect anything less from other sellers.
My appologies to you and ahc3! My tellers at the post office always told me this wasn't available. I guess I should have known from reading posts here that the postal clerks aren't always on top of things. I checked out USPS.com and you are absolutely correct, you can insure media mail. You learn something new every day!
posted on July 11, 2001 11:44:39 AM new
eauctionmgmt..........
You are wrong about your statement that insurance is not available on media mail, as it most certainly is. I just mailed out a $100 book via media mail and insured it.
Sorry to correct you on this, but apparently your post office doesn't know the rules.
posted on July 11, 2001 11:50:41 AM new
I no longer trust what they tell me at the post office! One of the clerks at mine thinks media mail is only for books! Of course, the web site says:
"Generally used for books (at least eight pages), film (16 mm or narrower), printed music, printed test materials, sound recordings, play scripts, printed educational charts, loose-leaf pages and binders consisting of medical information, and computer-readable media. Advertising restrictions apply. "
posted on July 11, 2001 08:40:45 PM new
The tape was packaged in a paper envelope, not padded, with a piece of cardboard loose on each side, sliding around in the envelope. For all I know the tape was broken before it was shipped because you couldn't tell it was broken until I opened it and removed it from the sleeve. then it fell apart. I hesitate to neg because I am a seller and know from his emails that he will give me a retaliatory neg. I'm going to have to have two accounts because this really gets me. when I sell I always get feedback on my good packing. he paid 1.33 for the shipping and obviously nothing for his packaging. what does it cost for a padded envelope $0.20. I assumed someone with so much feedback would be experienced enough to pack it right. he mentioned in his email he would talk to his packer about the packing. it's probably his kids. I always insure an item for more than what the buyer paid including the shipping because I figure the ebay price (usually) is way less than what the item is worth. I never had to collect on packages that I've sent so I don't know what the post office will pay. But I am sure the post office would not have covered this. Also, this is not a commercial tape but an off the wall health tape so I doubt that the seller paid anything for it. I found one by the same doctor in a thrift store and was looking for the followup tapes. he probably got it for a quarter at a garage sale.
posted on July 11, 2001 08:54:35 PM new
A video should be packed as well if you sold it for $2.50 as it would be if you sold it for $10.00,thats a sorry excuse. NO video should be sent in just a paper envelope,thats a sorry Seller.If you can't give good customer service selling at cheap prices,then don't sell cheap.This seller would get a neg from me.
posted on July 11, 2001 09:38:00 PM new
Hearing how it was packed makes me think the seller was definitely in the wrong. I am sorry that you had to deal with him.
posted on July 11, 2001 09:59:00 PM new
It is not your responsibility to insure the package. Insurance is for the shipper. If the PO decides it is due it goes to the shipper. One of the things they look at is the packing job, if they look at all. $2.50 media rate is a 3 lb box. that is quite alot of packing. Granted I am not taking into account his "& handling". Even a small box just under 1 lb is failly safe. No way an envelope cuts it. Yes as sellers we are resposible for gettig product to the customer. If we are not comfortable with the way the PO handles our packages we need to get out of the business or insure them ourselves. If you do not build enough into your overhead to cover this type of accident then you need to rethink your method of doing business. It is part of the game. It is the professional thing to do. For the cost of a couple of bucks you have a happy customer.
posted on July 11, 2001 10:18:43 PM new
THIS IS VERY EASY TO ANSWER
NO INSURANCE ???? SORRY NO REFUND
WHEN MY AUCTIONS CLOSE I STATE THREE TIMES THAT INSURANCE IS AN OPTION
ONES WHEN AUCTION CLOSES WITH TOTALING
TWICE WHEN THEY PAY
THIRD PRODUCT SENT
WHAT DO I SELL MIRRORS ...AND WHY DO I GIVE THE OPTION FOR INSURANCE ....BECAUSE MOST BIDDERS WANT THE LOWEST SHIPPING THEY CAN GET!!!
SO INSURANCE IS AN OPTION FOR BIDDER TO CHOOSE ...
NO CHOOSE NO REFUND ....SAME AS THE STORES
AND YES I AM FLEXABLE I OFTEN GIVE A PORTION OF A REFUND IF THEY EMAIL A NICE LETTER
AND FOR THE PERSON WHO WROTE THE LETTER ABOUT AMAZON...WELL THAT'S GREAT FOR A COMPANY LIKE THEM TO GIVE YOU A REFUND ON THE TAPE...BUT GUESS WHAT ???? THEY ARE STILL IN THE RED....EVER WONDER WHY??? , I THINK YOU NAILED IT ON THE HEAD WHY THEY ARE IN THE RED...SORRY BUT I AM RUNNING A BUSSINESS
posted on July 11, 2001 10:33:19 PM new
eauctionmgnt, not a problem. I've learned tons on these boards.
What I find appalling is that so many postal workers are "experts." Instead of just saying that things change daily and it's hard to keep up, they claim they know it all. I'm very fortunate in this instance to deal with a very capable Postmaster in a very small town. (Del. conf. is also available for Media Mail, but it costs 50 cents instead of 40.)
As to the original post, and others:
The statement that the seller has all the responsibility to get an item in good shape to a person and is liable even if the person opted out of insurance is very convenient if you sell a lot of like items. It's a nice way to say that buyers who are too cheap or too ignorant of how the USPS or UPS, etc. handle packages should be rewarded.
I have refunded twice when I made an error. I have also bent over backwards getting the paperwork, etc. to two buyers who had to file breakage claims. But if I offer insurance, (and I do for seventy cents), and the buyer wants to gamble on the carrier, I'm not responsible if that gamble doesn't pay off. Buyers and sellers should be accountable. There are just too many adults who behave like children when they take a chance and then it doesn't work out the way they want. I'm not going to help them stay developmentally retarded. Poor packaging is another issue, and that should be addressed.
Still, I firmly believe that if it's worth bidding on, it's worth insuring.
[ edited by sadie999 on Jul 11, 2001 10:35 PM ]
posted on July 11, 2001 11:43:59 PM new
Amazon refunds because they rely heavily on repeat business not because they have some moral obligation.
I find it interesting that when people ride on a commericial jet, and the plane crashes and kills all aboard, the surviving family sues the airline. Maybe the people on board should have worn a crash helmet. But when you ship a package, the shipping company is not at all held accountable for the damage to the packages. Ironic? Perhaps.
What standards is this seller being held to anyway? In years past I did my shopping from major companies, not once was my expensive items packaged properly, meaning risk from damage. Plus the s/h was very high. One item was in fact damaged.
You seem really bent over $5. Why not bust your butt and drive all over town shopping at garage sales looking for this video (you did mention it could be found at one for .25¢). I bet you'd spend well over $30 in gas before you found it though.
Did you really think everything in life is risk free? Why didn't you just pay for insurance if $5 means that much to you? This buyer is lucky to have received a $1 credit on a $2.50 item. I would have just told the seller the problem so they can make the approproate changes in packaging. Do you like wars that much to neg the seller?
posted on July 11, 2001 11:53:47 PM new
Neg!
Neg!!
Neg!!!
Neg!!!!
You can live with a neg as a bidder.
Easy Peasy.
Nothing worse than stinky sellers who don't wrap worth crap. OR who don't stand behind their merch.
Sounds like he has enough negs to know better.
I just got an item that was a in bubble wrap and a box: IT WAS A CAMERA STRAP!!!! I could KISS the damn seller for being such a dreamboat!!!!!
saaaaamooooch!!!!
Edited to add
You seem really bent over $5. Why not bust your butt and drive all over town shopping at garage sales looking for this video (you did mention it could be found at one for .25¢). I bet you'd spend well over $30 in gas before you found it though.
Gee Quickdraw, it's still the principle of the thing: $30.25 and she'd have a copy that wasn't landfill!
So, I still say Neg his sorry A$$.
Expect a retaliatory one, and so the freak what, y'know?
[ edited by Capriole on Jul 11, 2001 11:58 PM ]
-- in paper envelopes! These were not cheap videos either: all were OP and at least $20.00 each!
But when you ship a package, the shipping company is not at all held accountable for the damage to the packages. Ironic? Perhaps.
