posted on September 15, 2000 07:45:46 PM new
I edited my previous posts, because, in rethinking, I realized they might have been hurtful, and that's really not my intention.
I think 99% of the people here realize how non-sensical this debate is, evidenced by this quote:
posted on September 15, 2000 09:18:48 PM new
heygrape I tried the "Have a nice day" route with this group.
I live by the Rule treat people as you would want them to treat you if this is any exsample of how they wish to be treated I then they are in heaven right now with this paypal terms change
aparently we have mistaken these threads as distress and stress realated and its just there Idea of A Nice Day.
WWW.dman-n-company.com
[ edited by dman3 on Sep 15, 2000 09:19 PM ]
posted on September 15, 2000 11:13:43 PM new
In case anyone is really interested-I contacted Mastercard AND Visa when I was told by Billpoint I could NOT hold out THEIR fee to me when making a refund through Billpoint. They quoted me a CC rule. I argued I was NOT accepting CC, I was accepting a payment THROUGH a 3rd party that just happened to accept CC. Didn't get to far with that one needless to say.
It made me wonder if CC companies would update/revise any of their rules since there are so many 3rd party payment services popping up.
Mastercard sent me a canned message that DID NOT address my question concerning their position on 3rd party payment services. They did direct me BACK to their website to re-read A MERCHANT CANNOT CHARGE A "USAGE" FEE FOR ANYONE WHO CHOOSES TO PAY WITH A CREDIT CARD. They also added you have the option INSTEAD of offering a discount for cash???
I was also told you cannot set a minimum amount for payment with a credit card.
Visa sent me a response that didn't answer my specific question, but they said YOU MUST ABIDE BY THE TERMS OF USE AGREEMENT FOR EACH 3RD PARTY PAYMENT SERVICE YOU USE. Well, eBay had flat out told me NO. I asked PP. They told me there is CURRENTLY nothing in the TOU, about whether I could add a fee or hold out the fee if a refund was given. Of course, that was over 2 weeks ago and we know how frequently the TOU changes, so maybe there is something there now. I haven't looked lately. They did, however, point out IT WOULD NOT MAKE ME A VERY POPULAR PERSON TO DO BUSINESS WITH.
I intend to ask Mastercard & Visa about 3rd party payment services on a regular basis to see if I get different answers depending on who's reading the "mail". I have an idea, we will probably see some changes or clarifications on the 3rd party payment services that ACCEPT "deposits" or "payments" with CC, especially since it seems new ones are starting up every day. We shall see.
As to the fees starting 10/1. I have had a merchant account since they first offered them. I have been paying fees on all payments SINCE I upgraded. So don't be surprised if you started getting charged the minute you upgrade.
posted on September 16, 2000 12:59:42 AM new
The only part of PayPal's upgraded-account fees that doesn't start until October 1st is the 25 cents per transaction fee.
The 1.9% of each payment received has been charged, and will continue to be charged to Premier and Business Account holders. But in October they'll start paying 25 cents per transaction, too.
Why does PayPal charge for receiving funds, even if the funds came from an electronic bank transfer (which I thought only costs them 1 cent each) or from existing funds in a sending member's account???
posted on September 16, 2000 07:00:22 AM new
Our County Tax Collector has just started offering to take MasterCard, Visa, & Discover for payment of property taxes.
When brought to their attention that this was against CC rules, they said we were wrong and they are continueing to charge a fee for using CC to pay property taxes.
posted on September 17, 2000 02:30:57 PM new
I know these people got me so messed up here
2% of $12 is .40 not $1.20
2% of $36 is $1.20
Ahhhh and where did the edit links go so we can edit our posts here
If you sell and Item for $12 over all including shipping and handling your fee would be .25 flat rate and .40 @ 1.9% or %2 in paypals favor your total fee .65 cents for this transaction.
Point was if you charged this extra .65 cent to the buyer would make the total transaction actually $12.65 and .65 is over .50 your fee to paypal will now be .66 there for passing these fees totally off on buyers who use paypal cant be done
On the other hand all these hate paypal for fees threads as far as I can see have been made obsolete.
Seems paypal will not be forcing anyone to sign up for these accounts at all at this time.
But are giving fair warning that they are working to define business to be able to sort out what is personal transactions and what is business.
As for me I am not jumping off the paypal wagon. Over this at all panic and name-calling will hurt everyone more then help.
So far my rate is 5 buyer a year use paypal fees or no fee they aren’t damaging my sales in fact if anything buyer bid higher since they can use there credit card and even bid on more then one or two items at a time and many bid weekly instead of monthly.
Remember no matter weather you call your sales business or hobby the bottom line is for buyers no auction purchase is a need its a want they wont let there mortgage or car payment light bill heating bill or anything else go to buy from the auctions credit cards have helped us all sell more and more often to our buyers.
We all do what we can to help make sales better even offer free shipping or free insurance to encourage a sale and to be competitive with others selling the same goods.
Heck if I get an Item that sells way over what I hoped it would I don’t even make the winner pay shipping at all this is good these buyer remember this maybe they bid again and again on my auctions huh?
Maybe my buyers are reading this message board and see my good spirit.
What does reading more fees to the buyers say to them?
What do they think of the name-calling?
If your gonna fight over something fight over protecting your buyer base. Paypal is looking to define this to add more protection and services for buyers and sellers.
They aren’t looking to charge fees to get all your profit they are looking to get all buyers with have volume sales to help cover there volume. If I had heavy volume credit sales I wouldn’t want paypal to Subsidize this if I need to be Subsidized I would go to the small business admin and try for a grant or low interest loan wouldn’t you
Paypal is a leader in this online money beaming for sure but it cant Subsidize million of sellers who run high volume for ever anyone with real business sense can see this.
I think they have never lied at all and there service for personal use will always be free.
I do believe it was aimed at auction sellers as well as away to take credit card payments, what I do feel is that they never realized is that there were as many full time sellers with 20 to 100 credit cards transaction daily and weekly 500 to 700 monthly as there are.
Also I think that it was setup with the $5 to $20 transaction in mind as well.
And they were forced to create the business account to survive them sellers.
Remember we are millions of sellers here using this service they are one small company who very clearly states in their terms paypal is not a bank.
They were depending on float to make there return on this but float requires a good % of all money remaining in accounts for more then a day or two to earn money on float they need money in these accounts 30 days or more most request checks weekly or direct deposit as payment are received no money is made on this they never had time to invest it.
They now have protection on paypal balances though not FDIC insurance your covered up to an amount of $5000 I believe this was done to encourage leaving money in accounts longer my guess is this didn’t work out well enough cause many wouldn’t verify checking accounts to get the coverage.
You all can name call, you can all brow beat if you want. Who cares, with out naming names in the last week I have been called bonkers, 2/3 full of crap. Been told I am proof most people don’t have command of the English spelling or writing skills I been told to shut up go away and who knows what else on threads I never bothered following up on.
Well I am an adult and a parent all you tired and arguing kids just go to bed and I don’t want to hear from you till your attitude is better and your ready to Apologize for all the insults and to all you have included including the folks at paypal who has been Subsidizing your credit card sales over the last year
And when were all ready to help suggest ways paypal can define business transactions if they still are willing to work with our suggestions, then we can move forward with this issue.
To all I up set with typos and so on forgive me I will not post in any of your threads again so you wont have be up set no more.
For those I insulted sorry for them whose toes I step on cause my views are not yours forgive me I will never post in your threads again.
But just like on yahoo now for bidders who can look but not bid cause they don’t have verified credit cards and cant bid I will also not be viewing your threads either.
Fair is fair in order for me to get a successful business running here I must cut off all negative attitudes. So I don’t get one too.
I have to be positive and believe I can and the people I deal with must be positive as well. I cut off all reading and posting to these boards over the summer for this very reason guess what it works Surround your self with positive thoughts and positive people and things do work out for the good.
And I will do this again; these message boards are loaded with good tips and ideas but the negativity in my first month back still out weights any good that comes from it.
Typed in word97 and spelled checked to avoid upsetting the masses. Numbers checked by human math and calculator to avoid miss typing numbers, And human error.
Just wanted to add once you sign up for a Business account paypal is no longer a 3rd party service . your auccount becomes a merchant account provideing the buyer and seller with all the protection that credit cards offer.
there for the credit cards companys answer was valid you are paying for the right to accept credit card payments you now have a business account and you should live up to the standards.
Paypal Hasn't added this to there business terms yet but I questioned this in another thread directed at paypal if they dont fix this in there terms it could lead to state by state law suits after enough buyer get sick of paying to use there cards for purchases when the laws protects against this.
WWW.dman-n-company.com
[ edited by dman3 on Sep 17, 2000 03:06 PM ]
posted on September 17, 2000 03:12:04 PM new
dman--I have read and I feel benefited from your posts, so I would appreciate it if you would stay.
I don't agree that Paypal didn't lie to us though. In fact, I feel they not only lied to us, they pulled the old bait and switch and actually conned us. They have a huge fence to mend before I will decide to stay with them. At the present, I am taking a wait and see attitude regarding this, before pulling out. It's Paypals move.
That's what makes America great. We can all have our own opinions and agree to disagree.
For the most part I agree they mislead us all down the path with free transaction $5 bills and much more and mostly they were pointing directly at auction buyer and sellers.
I didn’t see them starting business accounts as a bad thing nor did I see this as bate and switch I do agree that calling all who sell anything in an on line auction a business and forcing all to update bate and switch.
What I disagree with is the fighting and name calling of the sellers with each other were all wrestling for the samething.
We are millions of people if we work together we can get paypal to do the right thing and get paypal to make better terms defining how many transaction or what dollar amount defines the need for business accounts.
I also think if we work together we can get this double dipping issue worked out either they get a flat fee or a percentage even if its just a flat fee up to a certain amount money per sale or per year.
I also believe that since there seems to be no rule as to if you can charge the buyer who uses paypal 3rd party services it should be up to them to add this matter to there terms not the sellers to decide.
If we the seller just decide to start charging these fees and there are consumer complaints at least the little guy will be covered, if its paypal terms paypal will have to answer to the complaints.
There is no real reason for angry people cause angry people cant reason.
And what is called for here is reason, I believe even though paypal said these accounts would be free they have tried to show just cause for the fees on accounts that are over the edge for free services.
Now what we need is reasoning as to what type of seller are over the edge is it the seller with a 5to 10 sales a month 5 to 10 sales a week or what is this business level granted there will still be upset users but not all of them.
