posted on November 30, 1999 03:13:52 PM
Hey everybody -- I'm sorry to bother you, but I'm having difficulty finding info at Auctions.com
Have you ever had a customer, who used the Bid$afe payment option -- with a cc..... then some 120 days to even 6 months later decide to tell their cc company that the mdse was NO good.
This is something I read about over at the EBAY OUTLOOK, and I am seriously disgusted as I'd thought that were I to set up special cc, etc/etc that MAYBE I COULD AVOID SHILLERS, but te Antiquarian Booksellers Association has iddentified a big problem with THEFT OF RARE BOOKS using cc's for Internet purchases, and so they advise ya to NOT sell rare, expensive books on the Internet via a cc but instead to accept a check or money order.
OOh greeeeeeaaaaT, just wonderful, right on ~ ya know, cuz there's been problems with bounced checks for plenty of sellers, and so I thought using bidsafe meant that I could be assured of SAFE PAYMENT, but that's not so, cause customers can charge stuff back.
No body wants to be the butt of a bad joke or a credit card chargeback six months after the fact.
Unfortunately ... for us ... our position as 'guarantor' of a good transaction with BidSafe puts us in the position of having to accept that risk.
Bottom line, a seller sells something through BidSafe and six months down the road the buyer pulls a chargeback, you the seller are covered.
Now we're insured and we don't like it but we don't come back at the seller saying that we need to get our money back (as per the agreements in place on Amazon or Billpoint.) Further, we don't -- at least at the present time -- charge any fee to the seller for the deal gone bad.
If (and when) the buyer accepts the merchandise and the seller is sent their check ... that deal is done.
If the buyer renegs on the deal with us... then it is between the flaky buyer and us. You as the seller have your money.
We are, in the eyes of the credit card company, the responsible party. Our BidSafe agreements do not make provisions about going back to the seller on the matter.
posted on November 30, 1999 07:43:58 PM
Well, thanks for this info.
VERY *interesting*.
I don't understand something, though, and I spent about an hour over at Amazon examining 1-Click, and I'm sure the info is there, but it's difficult to find anything there, so maybe I'd just better ask you, neomax.
When discussing cc chargebacks by bidders, which can evidentallly occur SIX MONTHS after the EOA, that Bid$afe takes care of this, NOT THE SELLER, due to insurance.
You said,
QUOTE, "Now we're insured and we don't like it but we don't come back at the seller saying that we need to get our money back (as per the agreements in place on Amazon or Billpoint.)
AND:
"Further, we don't -- at least at the present time -- charge any fee to the seller for the deal gone bad.
WHAT fee are you describing here? I've never had any returns, and I will go and check out Billpoint rules, but I hadn't heard of this fee-thing.
I just checked both One-Click and Billpoint for the information.
It appears to me that the Amazon, with their one-click program, claims to provide protection to sellers regarding chargebacks. This is reflected in their "seller text" promoting their one-click service.
Still -- and this is the provision I referred to -- their participation agreement states they retain the right to recover money from the seller for chargebacks.
The second paragraph of that agreement reads:
Amazon.com retains the right to seek reimbursement from Seller if we, in our sole discretion, decide to reimburse Buyer under the terms of the Amazon.com A-to-z Guarantee set forth in Paragraph 13 below or we receive a chargeback from Buyer's credit card issuer for the amount of Buyer's purchase from Seller.
Billpoint, which is doing the eBay pilot program is simply more direct.
. . . If the buyer chooses to initiate a dispute with the credit card issuer, you will be subject to a $15 processing fee. If the credit card issuer resolves the dispute in the buyer's favor, you will be charged the full amount of the buyer's original charge (in addition to the original $15 processing fee).
The processing fee and/or the charge for the full amount of the order will generally be applied to the next day's deposit. Please note that in some cases, this will cause the balance of the deposit to be negative, and Billpoint will debit any funds you owe from your account.
---------------------------
Radh, then you point to my statement that:
Further, we don't -- at least at the present time -- charge any fee to the seller for the deal gone bad.
That was a reference to the fee charged by Billpoint when a buyer disputes a charge and seeks a chargeback.
We don't charge such a fee now and we have no plans AT ALL to charge such a fee.
It is obvious that our policy is more seller-friendly than either Amazon's or Billpoint/eBay's policy. What I was thinking when I wrote that was that I sincerely hope our policy is not too friendly, if you know what I mean.
That is all that I meant by "At the present time."
posted on November 30, 1999 10:04:16 PM
Well, from what I understand, from reading over at the eBay board, is that accepting cc payments gives bidders SIX MONTHS to dispute a payment, and from what I understand, the bidder is FAVORED as being in the right, and like, I don't have FIFTEEN DOLLARS plus the original co$t of the merchandise..........
I mean this simply makes it absolutely unfeasible for me to use Billpoint, and I'm glad I know this NOW before I signed up.
Thanks for looking for the fee. I had noticed that Amazon's participation agreement specifically stated they MIGHT demand repayment from the seller for any claims they independently decide to settle. I had read that, just I did not know about any surcharge FEE, and frankly, I had not researched BillPoint yet.
Thank you for your assistance. I just do not have the brain power to wade through all these various and varying web documents - it just zaps whatever concentration, short term memory still left in my one functioning neuron.
LOL!
Thanks, Neomax!
p.s. Uhm, you got ANY idea why it co$ts FIFTEEN DOLLARS???????
p.p.s. Do you realize HOW EASY it would be for a competitor to get someone run out of business, or at least severely financially MAIMED?
You asked? Uhm, you got ANY idea why it co$ts FIFTEEN DOLLARS ???????
My best guess is that is how much lunch costs in San Jose
You asked? p.p.s. Do you realize HOW EASY it would be for a competitor to get someone run out of business, or at least severely financially MAIMED?
Yes, and I'm proud to point out and emphasize you're talking about the risk of dealing with Billpoint.
I do think it is sad that folks have to consider the potential abuse of these services. But I don't blame you for these feelings and concerns.
Frankly, it is Billpoint that wrote the rule that way. They did so to protect them because they fear it could happen and they just want to make sure that you, and not they, are the victim.
posted on December 1, 1999 09:53:32 AM
NEOMAX: LOL - That means there must be a free lunch in Connecticut, hey?
I just read over at outlook that Visa/NC charges merchant accounts these fees for chargebacks.
The other night a Big Expert on Net Security Esystems stated the TEN BILLION DOLLARS was stolen off the Net last year, alone, and I'm starting to understand HOW...
