posted on September 10, 2000 12:04:03 PM
Sure, eBay could do a lot of small things that would be of enormous benefit to users and e-commerce alike.
But eBay alone is not the whole answer!
What many Sellers and Buyers need to a low-costing, two-way US Postal mail confirmation of both shipment and delivery. If the US Post Office would offer such a thing, I think a *LOT* of Buyer-Sellers problems would simply vanish!
I would envision a cost of up to, but not including, $1. The Seller could simply paste a uniquely numbered sticker onto a package being mailed First Class. The Post Office would scan it at that time. That would prove that the Seller did drop off the package. Then, as the package was delivered to the destination post office, it would be scanned again to log the receiving of the package. Finally, the postal employee who delivers the package to the address MUST have it signed by whomever receives it!
Question: if such a service was available, as a Buyer would you pay 99-cents extra for this service to be sure what the deal is with your package, even though the item may have cost you $2 on eBay?
Also, would any Sellers reject and refuse to offer such a service if it existed?
This post is not a Troll! The first step in making a change is to see if it is wanted and workable.
I'm fed up with sellers coming up with new ways to protect themselves and expecting the buyers to just eat the cost ostensibly to protect themselves when the intent is clearly to make the seller's life easier, not the buyers. I pay for insurance to protect myself and expect the seller to take some responsibility in completing the sale rather than blaming everything on the USPS.
This would be extremely inconvenient for me as I'm not home to sign for packages, and have never had one lost or disappear from my home. At some point, these additional charges to protect the seller will become as much or more than the item costs, and I'm tired of the buyer being expected to take all the responsibility and pay for anything the seller comes up with.
posted on September 10, 2000 12:24:39 PM
We will never see it. The reason? Too labor intensive. Can you imagine how many people would pay an extra dollar to have confirmation that a letter was sent? The carriers would be scanning conservatively, I would imagine 1 letter in every 5. I doubt that the postal rate board would allow the post office to limit this sort of service to first class parcels only, first class mail has to all be treated alike.
Also, there would be no incentive to use certified or priority mail.
posted on September 10, 2000 12:38:44 PM
What you have described is signature confirmation which will soon be offered by USPS, though probably only on priority mail and possibly parcel post. As described by the USPS:
Signature confirmation provides the customer confirmation of delivery, plus a copy of the recipient’s signature. Electronic signature confirmation service would be $1.25. Retail signature confirmation service would be $1.75.
So much for 99 cents. You can also use Return Receipt for Merchandise which basically offers the same results for $1.40 and I beleive it can be used on first class mail as well.
As far as the buyer paying for it...I don't see it happening as it in no way benefites the buyer, only the seller.
posted on September 10, 2000 01:12:42 PM
I probably wouldnt offer this type of service to my buyer inless the win was for big $$ to protect us both with insuance as well.
I disagree that sellers blame the post office to much for problem after all we complete are side of a deal the moment we package an item put the package in the Post offices hand.
after that both sides are at the mercy of the postal delivery system.
my business is buying and selling my items, tracking payments and packageing.
the post offices business is shiping safely.
I can photo every package I take to the po showing quality box no dent dingds or collapeing.
the buyer on the other end send a picture of the package they got that is ripped drushed wet wraped in plastic banded tightly to the breaking point then these bands are used to tote or lift carry item crushing and squeezeing more.
the picture I get back resembles card borad and packageing that has been crumped like a letter we crumpled to toss in the trash.
not blameing the post office would be a diservice to all.
sellers dont have to blame the post office I can just as easly if not easyer arrange for UPS to give me home pick up service for a price.
please note all UPS pacages must be signed for by some one on the other end as well they some times bend the rule so a family member or neighbor could sign but if you or someone is not there after two or three attempts to deliver and call they ship back to sender. buyer would be responcable for this too if the shipping address on the package was right.
I feel that the rate of sucessfull shipping through the Postal service as it now is better then fair. dont cost buyer or seller arms legs or frist born childeren. and works in the favor of every honest buyer and seller.
locks and alram system on your home will only keep honest robbers and theives out.
delivery insurance, dilivery comformation, tracking will only protect honest sellers who package carefully and honest buyers who will to pay for these items and packageing services.
honest mistakes can happen.
but if your a seller just selling for the cash dumping your Items in a box with weak or little to no packageing padding or protection depending on insurance you will be in trouble soon.
if your a buyer trying to snip an auction for a low price deal who wont pay fees for packageing and stuff eventally this will ad up in damage and claims too.
pay this seller $2 to $4 for heavy duty packageing and I can give it to you.
not talking bubble wrap or news paper. im talking foam packageing double boxing that will make a solid shipping box that if dented droped or tied up tightly it wont harm your goods.
I know many charge high handleing and dont give the service you pay for but like I said these services will only protect honest buyer and sellers.
posted on September 10, 2000 02:23:57 PM
Thanks for the responses so far.
The intent of such an idea as I have proposed is to make shopping at auction sites better. And the process of shipping the item is a weak link in the chain of events that also needs to be addressed.
Many times, Sellers ship the item perfectly packaged, perfectly wrapped, addressed and stamped and yet, the Buyer fails to receive it. Sure, Some nasty Sellers would try to cheat the customer by lieing that they sent it. Then again, there are at least an equal number of Buyers who make a practice of falsely claiming that they never received it. My contention is, is that the rest are all due to inaccurate addresses given or used and the US Postal Service.
By using my suggestion, it would eliminate much of the thievery and trouble Buyers and Sellers face in this part of the transaction. It would be a benefit to both Sellers and Buyers to have the transactions go much smoother.
As far as making it work the way I proposed is a different issue. With the rise of eBay and other auction/e-commerce Internet businesses, the US Postal Service now has many new customers. It is a Boom time for the post office - perhaps it's biggest ever. And in the midst of this Boom time, the USPS has asked for a rate raise that it does not need.
Shouldn't we get something for ourselves from that raise?
Making the online shopping experience better and safer is a benefit for everyone involved in the process, not just one party IMHO.
Anyone else who wishes to contribute to the discussion is welcome.
posted on September 10, 2000 02:47:13 PM
Um, isn't this pretty much what we're paying for now with Insurance and delivery confirmation. I, for one, am not willing to pay the post office more to do THEIR JOB.
Also, there are many sellers, myself included, who pay for delivery confirmation themselves for the peace of mind.
posted on September 10, 2000 03:02:41 PM
I think that the USPS is getting a bad rap. Maybe I'll change my mind with more experience on auction sales but;
I ran a business for 13 years whereby air samples were shipped to my lab for analysis. All by USPS. We received up to 300 samples a day about 1/2 1st class, 1/2 priority (not at the beginning of the business, consider it an average).
In all of that time ONE sample was lost never to be found. Others were late, of course, getting stuck in the bottom of a mail bag in some remote post office. Sometimes the device fell out of the box and the PO still got it to me because our address was on the device. They put it in a package and sent it to me with apologies. The most memorable one was a box, sealed with duct tape, received unbroken, uncrushed, with extra postage. The box was empty. Not receiving a sample was rare - and, yes, I would have heard about it. Every investigation ended up with the sender at fault.
Sellers, package it right, label it right, put the right postage on it and mail it. The buyer will more than likely get it. Given the number of mail pieces handled each day the error rate, no matter how small a percentage, will result in some loss. They're human too.
At one auction sale I was late getting it to the PO and I had promised delivery. The postmaster was going right by that address and delivered it on his way home from work. Cookies and milk for that crew.
By the way, will anyone out there pick up my package and deliver it for me from my address in MA to another address in CA? I'll give you $3.85 for your trouble.
posted on September 10, 2000 06:35:46 PM
I have been selling mail order for almost 20 years. A few years ago, UPS was my shipper of choice. They made three attempts, got the customer's signature and automatically insured ever package. Over the past year, UPS has screwed up way too many times, so I have been forced to stop using them. No loss. I now send it USPS priority for less money (my stuff is not heavy). For 35 cents I get DC. No package has failed to show up within 3 days even from NY to CA and Alaska. None have been lost or damaged. I send out at least 10 a week.
posted on September 10, 2000 07:00:25 PM
well just like I said I concider USPS to be fair and it dont cost you or your buyers an arm leg and your frist born.
accidents will happen.
I have had one badly damaged package in nearly 200 sales not to awfull really but still frustrating.
posted on September 10, 2000 07:36:27 PM
There alrady is a delivery confirmation service for Priority Mail & Standard Package. Buyers who pay using Paypal don't have to worry about dick.
posted on September 10, 2000 08:34:34 PM
UPS will leave packages without someone signing for them if:
(1) The customer requests this option, and
(2) The seller does not state that a signature is required.
Dman3 - My apologies - Of course USPS screws up big time ever so often, and I shouldn't have made such a broad statement. I have seen your posts as to your selling philosophy, I know you are customer-oriented, as well as extremely trustworthy and I know that even if you said your dog ate the package, that would be the absolute truth.
(Friend's dog, a lab, once ate one of his owner's collectible beer cans, this thread reminded me of that for some reason).
Provides maximum protection and security for valuables. Available only for items paid at Priority Mail and First-Class Mail rates. May be combined with COD, restricted delivery, or return receipt. Postal insurance is provided for articles with a declared value up to a maximum of $25,000. Only items with no declared value may use registry service without insurance.
For items valued from $0.00 to $100.00, the additional cost for Registered Mail is $6.20.
I'm sure you offer that to your customers.
posted on September 11, 2000 10:17:42 AM
Good morning, krs! Yes, I was trying to be a bit funny with the overkill last night.
It seems that some feel that there could never be a low-cost solution like I propose, many don't want to pay for it, and without further discussion of the details this thread is likely to die out.
SO . . .
krs:, you said last night, "By the way, I'll give customers whatever they want, but I don't jam anything down their throats."
My Response: Pah-LEE-se!
The only way that Sellers will have more Buyers and Buyers will have a much better service is to improve the entire process. The hue and cry that improving the shipping transaction by my suggestion is only a benefit to Sellers, I'd like to point out the Watch Feature on eBay, where that doesn't do a thing for Sellers, but is very helpful for Buyers. My point: not every improvement is going to improve the process for all parties. Yet, without certain pieces of progress, no one will see any improvement in the process, period!
For instance, for a long time, we offered Buyers the opportunity to purchase insurance if they wanted it. Naturally, no one wants to spend money on most intangible things like Protection (who enjoys paying Life Insurance?) However, since reading many complaints on AW and since learning about bulk insuring of packages that we mail out, we now advertise the fact that we automatically ship Insured. Our business has doubled since we did that and no customer has complained about having to pay the extra 40-cents.
Now krs, if in your auctions, you do not charge your customers for what you paid for the item, eBay selling and listing fees, other costs involved in getting the item and preparing it for shipment, your time, the materials used to ship it to them, and the postage, then you take a loss. Do you offer your customers the choice to either pay for postage or not? How about offering them shipping materials or not? I'll bet that's not a choice! You draw the line at some point where you feel the Buyer must pay and where it could be optional.
The point is, is that the consumer always pays all costs and fees in the final price. With auctions, this fee is usually a separate fee (unless the Seller can hide it in the profit). Therefore, in order to be absolutely assured that the process goes smoothly, there must be some way to track: a) that the Seller actually put the package into the mail; b) the Buyer's local Post Office isn't sitting on it in some forgotten pile; c) and proof that someone signed for the item delivered.
Who benefits from this and How?
The Seller has proof that it got shipped, the Post Office is held accountable at each and every step, the Buyer can see if someone else signed for their package and stole it or is hiding it from them.
a) the Buyer KNOWS that once the package is in the mail - they will receive it or know why! Oh sure, The Buyer and Seller could always wait 30 days to begin a postal investigation; that is, unless the First Class package is happens to weight under 12 ounces, in which the post office will refuse to investigate and trace it.
b) the Seller knows that once they drop the package into the mail, there will not be any hassles for non-delivery. They won't have to fear a Negative Feedback on their record when Buyers hold them responsible for a failed delivery. Nor will Sellers have to refund to avoid the hassles that go with a missing package.
c) Insurance companies who insure these First Class packages would love the information of where it got hung-up and would pay out a lot less claims!
d) the Post Office gets to collect a bit more funds in order to hire more delivery persons in order to accommodate the occasional package or two on their route that requires a signature.
And if we get it for less than a dollar, I'll happily add that guarantee to my auctions to double again the amount of business that I already receive!
