posted on December 18, 2000 12:08:50 AM new
Sounds like the glum faces outnumber the smiley ones lately when the "How's business?" threads come up; I know my own experience tracks with the majority. There's a wing that says we need to work harder, change approaches, adapt, etc. But what about eBay's part...is it time to change or adapt their ad strategy (i.e. eBay's external media advertisements to draw new people in)?
Seems they've been doing it mostly on the cheap, with really targeted print ads (collector magazines, etc.) and Internet banner ads. Seemed like a great way to save money when they were growing, had novelty value and couldn't keep the system up to handle a greater load anyway.
But is that still the case, or have they picked all the low-hanging fruit already? How much untapped growth opportunity is left in the targeted places where they advertise vs. less-tapped places?
Might it be time to move on to radio or TV ads? Or change the media mix?
I suspect they need to make some changes or at least do some fresh research. Lately they seem more concerned with trying to load up on upfront fees that apply whether or not an item sells (thus creating more divergence between their interests and the interests of sellers)
posted on December 18, 2000 09:11:57 AM new
I don't really have an answer to the question, just some observations.
I saw an eBay truck (camper? don't quite remember the vehicle) at an air show a couple years back. I looked at it as I walked by, but didn't stop, so I'm not sure if they were advertising how many aviation items are up for bids, or just there as one of the several "general interest" type displays that were around. I don't know if they still run around the country like that anymore.
They have a magazine, which I saw at a book/magazine store once, but thumbing through, it didn't strike me personally as useful, since I understood eBay's bidding/procedural structure well enough, and already had good searches set up.
This year, I saw an eBay day-by-day, square pad-style calendar for sale in a retail outlet.
I have noticed, however, that of the people I know personally are online, every last one of them is already aware of eBay, and most browse or check it at least now and then, and maybe half have bought at least one item through eBay.
I suspect some people who aren't yet online know of it, either from bad publicity in newspapers or from having heard of it from friends already online. I suspect eBay is sometimes the "reason" people do get online (there often seems to be a particular trigger that "finally" draws a certain person online).
eBay already has enormous word of mouth and other presence, so in one sense, I'm actually kind of surprised sometimes that eBay even bothers much with advertising anymore.
OTOH, they should, if for no other reason than those who aren't yet online, needing a "good reason" to get online. So in that regard, I'm surprised I do not hear radio ads like Amazon's (or was it Yahoo's? the one that goes "attention, those looking for [a list of about four or five highly different items]), at the very least.
That's why I've wondered, since early this year when they brought in DoubleClick. Yes, they pull in some advertising revenue, but eBay is advertising itself on other sites through DC, and that is the part I wonder about, because it always seemed like once someone got online, it wasn't long before they became aware of eBay, by means other than such cookie-fat ads. Maybe eBay is trying to "shorten" that "window of ignorance," but it seems like it was a small window to start with (and in the cases of some people already aware of eBay before getting online, nonexistent), so the gains have never been clear to me.
----
What's being done in the name of direct marketing nowadays is crazy.
The above are all just my opinions, except where I cite facts as such.
Oh, I am not dc9a320 anywhere except AW. Any others are not me.
Is eBay is changing from a world bazaar into a bizarre world?
posted on December 18, 2000 09:44:46 AM new
Nice post, dc9a320.
In my view, eBay has reached the status of a monopolistic utility. As such, advertising should not be much of a concern. An occasional image spot, perhaps, featuring multi-cultural children playing in an open meadow, ending with a full screen of the famous logo and a stentorian "Ebay.....serving the world" type of thing.
I don't think, however, that eBay is content to exist as a utility. I would prefer that they did. They might then have as a primary goal a committment to enhancing service levels, improving the site, and providing a comfortable income to employees, vendors, and stockholders.
It appears to me that eBay management is concerned more with wringing every possible dime out of the business before the rug is yanked from under them. Advertising, then, has only "long term" value, and is consequently worthless.
posted on December 18, 2000 02:00:13 PM new
Maybe eBay has enough name recognition that they don't need to do ads for that purpose, but then many brands (Coke, Gillette) have been at that point for years and still must have a good ad strategy or watch sales fall.
I agree that the market share is large enough to lull them into complacency, especially with a fee/revenue structure they're trying to tilt toward more upfront fees. Eventually, though, sellers will close shop, all the ones left will be pros, category listings will have 95% the same stuff week after week, and the eyeballs will also leave in a downward spiral that feeds on itself. Sellers get wounded first, then...eventually...eBay notices.
posted on December 18, 2000 02:37:23 PM new
Well, I've seen a lot of negative advertising. Frauds, scams, fakes, shills, etc., have all grabbed more media attention than any advetising spots. I did see an eBay TV ad ONCE last month. Contrast that with Amazon's blanket Christmas ads. (It tells me Amazon is in this for the long haul. eBay is not.)
As serious sellers leave, more con artists move in to eBay because there is NO security. If eBay's copyright/VeRO policy is any indication, eBay is only concerned with maintaining appearances. (They'll only end an auction if the content owner complains, otherwise they ignore it.) eBay has publicly bragged about its new "shill detection" software, but how many shillers have they actually caught? Or do they ignore shills until the stories hit the national media? I have bought big ticket items at eBay in the past, but I wouldn't buy there now or recommend it to my friends.
Bringing in retailers may sound good as a projection, but it won't happen. No retailer would put up with a fraction of the crap us little guys go through. Constant system outages while eBay thinks up new ways to gouge us, a broken feedback system that puts sellers at risk, little or no enforcement of bids, etc. Can you imagine Wal-Mart doing business at eBay? They'd walk out in a week. Imagine making a purchase at Amazon, then being "on your honor" to send payment within two weeks, or else risk negative feedback? Pul-leeze, give me a break. Unless eBay adopts a policy of "buy now, pay now" via credit card no retailer will ever join eBay. How long will Topps continue to accept below-book value for its baseball cards, while at the same time fighting off counterfeiters? Not very long.
eBay had a successful formula but they botched it. I don't think they care anymore. eBay wants to go mainstream and then sell the site as quickly as possible. Before eBay manages to copy eToys, eToys will be out of business.
posted on December 18, 2000 04:31:07 PM new
All Ebay Really needs is less negitive press no matter how many millions they toss in to advertizeing one free media biltz about a single buyer even can kill the positive advertizeing.
Complaints about paypal exchangepath and other services reflect poorly on these auctions the PS2cart.com thing is in every local paper in this area auctionwatch.com even got its name in our local papers in this matter New York Times last week had 5 pages devoted to online auction fraud the PS2.com fraud ebay fraud talked about sellers on ebay ripping off people for hundereds more for PS2 then they are really worth pictures of some poor people who gave all there saveings for these video games and now no money for gifts cause they sent money orders for PS2s and got ripped off on the net not a small time rip off some 30 thousand people lost from near $300 to $1000 just since october in undelivered and that dont cout the people complaining of being taken for hundereds more then this game is worth.
My Guess by next christmas there will be some major Regulations on online auction sellers and Privite e-sellers in genral.
I can see one of these regulations being all auction purchases being done with Credit card only that offers the best chance of getting money back in cases of fraud.
I can see some type of state by state registration for online auction and E-sellers as well.
There may even be priceing regulations of some type or government ruleing about offering Items for sale you dont actually have to sell many many people are crying foul about prices as high as $1500 for a $295 PS2
I havent seen no words from sony them selves on this but this cant be to good for them there business or the Play Station its self.
There are some really sick greedy people out there and I think it has or will hurt us all big time by this time next year maybe not in sales but in state or goverment regulation and registration fees of some type.
posted on December 19, 2000 12:01:20 AM new
eBay wasn't built on advertising, it was built on word of mouth. As such it is/was a fad phenomenon and the fad has saturated.
posted on December 19, 2000 06:35:27 AM new
"eBay wasn't built on advertising, it was built on word of mouth."
That's what has DESTROYED ebay as well. Word of mouth.
When I tell people that I sell on ebay, they say one of two things...
1) Me too.
or
2) Oh. I thought everyone that sells on there were scammers.
I know that I'll get told that I'm a doomsayer, but ebay will not be around for long. At least the ebay we all knew.
The damage is too deep, and ebay prefers to NARU sellers for crossposting, then for ripping people off.
I predict that this time next year, ebay will be nothing more then a shopping portal, at best.
The staff at ebay are power hungry nobodys, that are too damn stupid to work at McDonalds, so they get jobs as support robots punching "reply with canned response #1" positions, and use the most ridiculously unimaginative phoney names. Hell, I got got responses from 3 different muppet names in one 24 hour period.
Maybe if they decided to run a legitimate business, instead of a playground for kids, scammers, and sellers who have to continually send erroneous e-mails to ebay to get their competition removed, they would have made it.
But it's too late, and ebay is done in my book.
I'm tired of dealing with such an amature and unprofessional site.
posted on December 19, 2000 09:33:45 AM new
Well, it's quite difficult to post following Pocono's "message" to eBay , but I just wanted to add the following point:
I remember the eBay radio spots & if memory serves, most were geared to sellers (eg. don't have a gargage sale, sell it on eBay type of messages)...We could do WITHOUT those!....
The ONLY TV spot that I've seen, is the one with the "Ugly" lamp, which I find to be quite ironic in that the whole concept of buying/selling to your own family members is/was against the eBay guidelines!....Besides the fact that the item is an eyesore that the seller is thrilled to get rid of!...
How about using some REAL sellers, explaining what they sell & why....OR Buyers who replaced their long lost widget with the help of eBay....OR...Buyers who save $$ using eBay, by buying previously owned items....There is a wide range of possiblites, if only eBay was inclined....
If all else fails, hire the Amazon advertising co.....I could sit & "sing along" to their commercials all day!...Especially the one bout the guy who never saw the gift, didn't sign the card & didn't have to get outta bed...Thanx to Amazon dot com!
posted on December 19, 2000 10:27:59 AM new
I can only go by my inner circle, which has seen 2000 be the Year of Ebay. I think many of us had heard of ebay before. It never occured to me to actually visit the site. What's an online auction anyway?
Then last January while looking for presents for my baby girl, friends on an email list said "try ebay". Whoa, hello there! Saw lots of great stuff. Got sniped for the first time, never knew what hit me. Learned how to snipe. Tried selling a book, got good money for it. Started selling AND buying regularly, especially lego toys for my son.
Told a friend. Now she has 100+ FB and I have 500+. Buzz started happening at work, next thing I know another friend has bought a clock she always wanted. Other friends started shopping routinely. Found out that my SIL is buying collectibles.
True, maybe in 2001 we'll all decide we don't need any more clocks or collectibles or legos. But I doubt it. Birthdays are coming up, and I'll always want selection, convenience, a good deal, and a package at my doorstep. My friends want the same thing.
What I do NOT want is to essentially shop Walmart on ebay. Forget it, I can go in person or to their web site. I just want an interesting selection and the chance to get a good deal. As long as ebay provides that, I'll stay a shopper as well as a seller.
Meanwhile, my FB tells me that what MY buyers value is, again, a good deal, plus attentive customer service and good packaging. I think if we provide that, there WILL be a great market on ebay.
posted on December 19, 2000 01:18:20 PM new
I heard a radio ad for ebay disney.
That's it.
I found ebay by clicking a banner ad.
Then I got shilled, sniped etc and now I'm selling some items.
If you look at the ugly lamp ad you have to wonder if they are advertising to potential bidders or sellers!
The only happy person at the end of that ad is the seller.
I diversified. Amazon is great for books, I am patient with Yoohoo (yahoo) and ebay is still the place to go for a few of my fave items that I buy. But I am seeing a glut of unrelated auctions in one catagory that has always been kinda small and I am bummed, because the good sellers are getting pushed out.
I wish they would get off the stick about security because that is the biggest achilles heel for them and customer perception.
2 years ago you heard tons of warning stories about buying online. Now with the big names out there, that's gone. Guess what ebay, you are still a minefield!
So as someone said before, I think it will be a huge Mall.
Us little dudes may have to get all professional and s**t! Kind of a bummer when all you want to do is sell off the things you just want to find good homes for!!!
Grrr...security ebay!! UR blowing it!!!!
posted on December 19, 2000 01:22:20 PM newrancher24: I forgot about the ugly lamp one, probably because it is a credit card company's commercial, though it does feature eBay, so I guess I've seen half a commercial for eBay. Yes, there were so many things they could have advertised; I don't think they bothered much at all.
hardoutfit: Well, I don't know about everyone else, but you're the first person I've heard of that first found eBay because of an ad rather than word of mouth. Sorry, no prize for that.
xardon: Thanks, and I too would prefer they enhance their service. eBay might have seen more growth had they not gotten bad publicity for so many things, and had they made improvements, such as: not showing buyer email addresses to anyone but sellers, not turning blind eyes to both counterfeiters and then to sometimes excessive VERO actions as well, updating searches within an hour or less, instead of 6-36 hours, and so on, more stability). Whether that would be enough to make for the lofty goals they apparently claimed, well, that's another story (and another thread, http://www.auctionwatch.com/mesg/read.html?num=2&thread=301624 ).
ploughman: Sounds like a boring future for the buyers -- one I wouldn't bother hanging around for.
twinsoft: Speaking of copying... it has struck me for sometime that while many have tried copying eBay's formula, with only limited success, eBay is busily trying to copy the other "etailers" out there, most of which aren't even profitable. Oh, the irony!
keziak: I too have zero interest at shopping at online versions of big retailers I can visit in person, where I can also pay in cash and not wonder whether they're selling me out to direct marketers, are going to have their CC database hacked into, whether the item will arrive in a timely fashion, or other nonsense I can avoid by just getting on my feet and going to the local store, and getting some fresh air on the way -- but I don't know how many other buyers feel this way.
posted on December 19, 2000 05:28:28 PM new
Ebay did mention that word of mouth advertising wasn't enough anymore and they'd start doing more advertising. I'd like to see ads in magazines like "Home and Garden," "Sports Illustrated," "PC, "and "O." I came across ebay for the first time in a collector magazine, but that market of collectors probably has been reached. Time to reach out to new markets.
Ebay a fad? Are garage sales a fad? Are thrift stores a fad? I searched online this Christmas for my holiday shopping. Tried Best Buy, Circuit City, Walamart, JC PennyBuy.Com and so forth. It was a problem on every site as far as selection, description, check out, and navigation. I went to ebay, which should have been my first stop, and completed my holiday shopping with total success. I see a very bright future for ebay.
\"It's lonely at the top, but you eat better.
\"
, but I just wanted to add the following point: