posted on January 3, 2001 11:45:30 PM
I found a charming piece in a large frame with glass (its a fraternity photo of 1921 but it was hand designed with pen and ink, and each member's photo was cut into an oval and pasted on.) Its in excellent condition and I think it has great potentional on ebay. HOWEVER, it large (about 2 feet by 1 1/2 feet) and with the glass in the frame, makes me cautious about shipping. I'm afraid to take it out of the frame, as it is in perfect condition and may be fragile as I can't tell what kind of paper it is designed on. Any ideas on packing and what kind of a box might fit something such an odd size? Thanks!
posted on January 3, 2001 11:50:10 PM
The age of the glass they used to frame it may be part of it's value-if it was framed in 1921--so don't take it out of it's frame.
How to pack it?? I don't have a clue---good luck in finding the answer
posted on January 3, 2001 11:59:35 PM
Really? Glass can be valuable? All I know is its a charming piece and in EXCELLENT condition. (and some of the stuff from this fraternity does well on ebay.) I don't know what school it is from though. I'd like to be able to find that out.
I'll take a better photo for ebay of course, but this one shows what I'm working with!
http://www.geocities.com/jennshort1/sigma.jpg
[ edited by jenndiggy1 on Jan 4, 2001 12:01 AM ]
posted on January 4, 2001 12:19:45 AM
Get a box that has several inches of clearance on each side, wrap the frame with bubble wrap, put it in packing popcorn, and insure for the value the bidder paid for it. If it breaks, which seems to be what your concerned about, your still protected and still make a profit.
posted on January 4, 2001 12:21:47 AM
Original or older frame and glass would increase it's value.
and depending on the glass--some glass artists like the old wavy glass to work with. I know when older homes are being demolished ---the glass from the windows is frequently purchased by stained glass artists
posted on January 4, 2001 12:55:01 AM
That's very small compared to some of the items I ship. Just make sure you bubble wrap it and have plenty of packing peanuts in a good sized box. The problem with some pictures, by the time you get it packed in a box big enough to protect it, it's "oversize" and the minimum (for UPS) is 30# for the oversized box- so factor it in when you give the shipping cost. I have shipped many mirrors and pictures with no problem. You should be able to get this packed well in a "normal" box- it isn't that big
posted on January 4, 2001 04:18:35 AM
Unframe it, discard the acid-loaded backing material AND the glass. Glass from 1920s is NOT any part of the value of the piece, or I'd be selling the stuff out of my windows on eBay, although a nice vintage frame can be. And the backing should be replaced with acid-free archival material by you or the buyer ASAP to prevent it from eating away the photos.
USPS and UPS will NOT insure pictures with glass against damage from glass breakage, and it adds considerably to the weight of the piece. Slice a piece of 1-inch styrofoam (any home improvement store) insulation into two chunks at least 4 inches bigger on all sides than the picture. Also slice 2-inch strips of it to fit around the edges.
Wrap the picture in clean UNPRINTED paper. Make a sandwich with the picture in the middle, and use the strips around the edges to keep the picture in place. Pad with bubblewrap if the picture is thinner than 1 inch or add more strips if the frame is thicker than an inch.
Slide the whole assembly into a plastic trash bag, seal it with tape, and then slide it into a STURDY box. Slide chunks of HEAVY cardboard or 1/8 inch masonite along the large sides of the box to protect against puncture wounds.
The "bubblewrap and packing popcorn" suggestion WILL NOT WORK! The picture will be heavy enough to shove the popcorn out of the way and it will end up along the side of the box where it can easily be damaged. You need to immobilize it.
posted on January 4, 2001 07:19:27 AM
I would suggest having professionals pack it such as Mail Boxes Etc. and insure it. Any time I had a damage claim against UPS and I packed it myself, the claim was denied, if Mail Boxes packed it , the claim was awarded.
UPS hires big Gorrillas and they have contests to see which one can throw fragile boxes the farthest.And I think they despise the packages that are right up to the limit on weight and size. My opinions only and I don't mean to discredit UPS, but I trust the US postal service much more the UP's
posted on January 4, 2001 07:29:31 AM
Just a side note, is it possible that there are other greek letters anywhere near the crest? That might be an indication of which Chapter it came from, and then you could contatct Sig Ep National to find out where that Chapter is located. As an example, it could be Sigma Phi Epsilon, Gamma Chapter. Neat piece.
posted on January 4, 2001 07:57:46 AM
Definitely DO NOT take it apart. If it is going to be reframed or restored, let the new owner do it. Keeping it in it's original "as found" condition is the way to go. Glass and all.
You might take it with you to a local frame shop that specializes in selling and framing art work and pictures. These stores almost always have boxes in odd sizes and special packaging materials. Explain your situation and ask if they have any recommendations as to how this item can best be packaged.
I've done this on a couple of occasions with excellent results and they've even given me everything for free. I make sure to send business their way if I can and I give them candy at Christmas time too.
Good luck to you.
edited to add: and yes, the original glass DOES add value to the piece.
posted on January 4, 2001 08:10:28 AM
I ship glass display cabinets all over the USA, and also have shipped pictures. One thing that is very important, make sure you use masking tape on the glass. Make an "X" on it, this eliminates breakage. UPS has shipped many of these for me, knock on wood none of them had broken glass. Just make sure to box the picture, then box again with clearance on each side to add packing around it. Also make large red labels for the outside of the box and place them on each side. " CONTAINS GLASS CONTENTS". I am sure that it will make it to its new home.
posted on January 4, 2001 08:33:15 AM
An x of masking tape will NOT eliminate breakage. All the tape does is keep the pieces from sliding around afterward. Don't believe me? Lay a piece of glass on a table, X it with masking tape and give it a good whack.
Glass from the 1920s was mass-produced. There's no "waves" in it from hand production, and it's not old enough to have "sagged".
Rather than decide yourself what to do, why not ask the high bidder whether s/he wants it shipped intact or dismantled?
posted on January 4, 2001 08:42:10 AM
There's no way we can know exactly how old the glass is. Not ALL window or picture glass made in the the 1920's was mass or machine produced and lots of older glass was still being used.
I agree it couldn't hurt to ask your buyer how he or she would like it packaged.
posted on January 4, 2001 09:15:22 AM
How are the glass and frame put together? I highly advise that the glass is taken out for shipping purposes (if they are not in someway bound together). Wrap the glass with a reinforced cardboard, tape glass with an X in case of breakage in shipment, wrap newspaper around glass and secure tightly with masking tape.
Photos & mat can be wrapped in unprinted newspaper and also reinforce with cardboard. Both items must be shipped upright. Bubble pack & use peanuts to ensure safe delivery. Shipping upright is the key.
avmom (not avmom on eBay) ~ who LOVES stained glass!
posted on January 4, 2001 12:04:10 PM
I guess I consider it big because I usually sell baseball cards and craft books. (What a combo!)
Anyway, I don't want to take it out because I'm afraid it will damage it. Where it has the Sig Ep crest is done in pen and ink, and probably not on archival paper, since it is from the 1920s. To move the piece to archival paper would ruin it.
There are no Greek letters near the crest. There are, however, first initial and last name of each man underneath his photo. Might that tell me anything in discovering what chapter it is from?
The way it is assembled is the piece next to the glass, then very heavy cardboard, then nailed in.
posted on January 4, 2001 12:11:33 PM
jenndiggy1 -
That heavy cardboard is not important to the value of the piece, and the acid in it is a serious threat in the long run. And the rusted nails are not why people buy prints. They want the visible part
Here is what art dealers do when they get an old print or photo: unframe it, discard all old backing and matting, remat with archival stuff, wash and rinse the glass and reframe with new backing.
The back of the photos or the paper they are mounted on might have something to indicate what year and school.
posted on January 4, 2001 12:34:36 PM
My advice is to just leave it the way it is and list it. Let the high bidder decide how they wish it shipped. Many buyers want things in original condition.
We have done this with all our pictures, prints, documents and frakturs. We give the buyer the option of having us remove the glass or backing and only one person wanted the glass removed and it was lots of trouble removing all the tiny nails or brads on the back without harming the paper.
We tape the glass in an X, wrap the item in tissue and put rigid styrofoam or cardboard on both sides and then wrap in heavy bubblewrap. We put it in a box with peanuts all around and so far all have arrived safely.
If the buyer wants you to remove the glass and backing, etc. make sure you get paid before doing it up because if he is a deadbeat you may lower the value for the next buyer.
Some buyers purchase old prints, documents, etc. hoping that they will find a more valuable picture underneath or that old money or stock certificates are hidden in behind.
posted on January 4, 2001 12:35:28 PM
Here is some interesting information about Sigma Phi Epsilon---2001 is their 100 anniversary---they are having a 'Conclave' this summer.
posted on January 4, 2001 01:14:27 PM
I purchased an old framed photo on ebay. The seller shipped it intact in a large box with the picture wrapped in brown paper, the whole thing wrapped in bubble wrap. It arrived in perfect shape.
I agree with some of the others, let the buyer decide how they want it shipped. It is always flirting with disaster to tamper with an old framed item.
Murphys' law will take over when you try to unframe it. Leave it alone.
