posted on January 24, 2001 06:58:42 AM new
I've seen several references to this this morning. What sort of "lie" is being asked to put on custom forms?
posted on January 24, 2001 07:03:51 AM new
There are some overseas buyers who will ask you to either mark the "gift" box (as opposed to the "merchandise" box) or will ask you to mark down a lower value for the item than what they paid.
Both are an attempt to avoid possibly paying custom fees in their country.
I've been asked this on the rare occasion & I tell them this is against the law. So far, none of them have balked or refused to complete the transaction.
And w/regard to a statement made in the "priority box" thread, it's not people from any one particular country who are worse than others at asking, IMHO.
posted on January 24, 2001 08:00:03 AM new
I'm one of those "overseas buyers" that ask seller at eBay to check the "gift box" at the custom sticker. I don't feel at all ashamed about it. These constructed fees and taxes are nothing I like or support. Example: I bid and win an item at eBay, the price is 40 dollars, the shipping 10, a total of 50 US dollars. If the seller check the "merchandise box" it may happen that I have to pay: 25 % tax, 10 % custom (the percentage vary depending on what type of goods it is), 11 dollars to the customs for doing <u>their</u> job and 11 dollars to the Post Office for doing <u>their</u>job. So then the item that did cost 40 dollar from the beginning (50 incl. shipping) in the end costs me 89.50 dollars instead! No way I will pay that. Those things are constructed by politicians that I haven't voted for. And: if I buy within the European union, even for large sums, there are no tax, no customs, no fees whatsoever. But the procedure with sending and all that stuff is the same.
If I'm interested in an item that is above the "limit" (around 50 dollars is max amount that we can recieve as "gift", item+shipping), I email the seller before I bid and ask if they do agree to send it as gift. If not, well, then I thank the seller for taking the time to answer and then I don't bid. I don't force anyone to things against their belief/conscience...it's up to them. I sell myself (a lot) and I <u>always</u>mark the packages I send out of Sweden as "gifts", and it's many. Kaktus
posted on January 24, 2001 08:01:21 AM new
sorry for the <> signs, thought it was possible to use HTML here...meant to have those words underlined...Kaktus
posted on January 24, 2001 08:30:12 AM new
It's not just applicable to overseas customers. Customs charges also apply to shipments going from the USA to Canada, although duty is no longer an issue for most items. What "some" Canadians are trying to do is beat the 7% GST, their Provincial Sales Tax, and the $5.00 graft that Canada Post charges for "handling the transaction".
Kaktus ... Nobody supports these charges, including the people that have to collect them. Nobody likes paying income tax or property tax either. Fact is, if your seller makes a false declaration on a customs form because you have a philosophic problem with the taxes, both you and your seller are subject to prosecution if you get caught. The word "Gift" is a signal to Customs and they will probably hold and open the package. IMHO, it just ain't worth it to save a few bucks
All:
Marking the value down = less insurance if it goes missing. Not a good idea either.
Marking an item up to get more insurance if it goes missing = more taxes to be paid by your customer. Also not a good idea.
posted on January 24, 2001 08:45:18 AM new
Kaktus:
I totally understand your position. I also believe that many of us (not me) in this country really don't get the whole picture. They seem to be taking this customs thing a little too seriously. (nothing personal intended! really!)
And what may be construed as a "few dollars" by many is, in fact, much more than that! I know someone who shipped a jewelry item to the Ukraine and in order for the recipient to pick it up they had to pay a 100%, YES, ONE HUNDRED PERCENT, tax!!!
These customs "policies" are not laws that are made to benefit all involved, they are politically motivated and unilateral in nature.
______________________________
Sticks & stones may break my bones, but words can break my heart.
posted on January 24, 2001 09:30:12 AM new
"These customs "policies" are not laws that are made to benefit all involved, they are politically motivated and unilateral in nature"
In fact, they are "laws" and whatever the reason for their existence, we have to follow them (until some smart young lawyer decides to take the Big Guys on and get them changed, that is). If we chose to ignore them because we don't agree with them, and if we get caught, too bad for us.
It's like my boss, who thinks I'm too old to play hockey, always tells me: "If you break your leg, don't come running to me!"
posted on January 24, 2001 09:34:19 AM new
sharkbaby -
"These customs "policies" are not laws that are made to benefit all involved, they are politically motivated and unilateral in nature. "
They ARE LAWS, regardless of the motivation, and if the buyer can't pay 100% duty on a purchase, they shouldn't be buying it.
posted on January 24, 2001 09:38:11 AM new
If I wrap the item in wrapping paper, stick a note on the front saying, "Happy Birthday" then how could a customs officer be suspicious that it's actually merchandise?
"My possessions are causing me suspicion." - Neil Finn
posted on January 24, 2001 09:42:37 AM newIf I wrap the item in wrapping paper, stick a note on the front saying, "Happy Birthday" then how could a customs officer be suspicious that it's actually merchandise?
If you do it once, they probably wouldn't be suspicious.
If, however, you are mailing packages 4 days a week, every week, and the only ones that ever have a "Happy Birthday" note are the ones going out of the country, they would probably have some doubts.
posted on January 24, 2001 09:46:48 AM new
It would make sense if these "laws" were followed per se, but in many, many countries the charges are assessed at the whim of the agent handling the parcel. I have seen parcels containing the exact same thing, weighing the exact same amount, etc...and whoever handled it at the point of customs charged a VASTLY different amount.
There are many things that most people in the U.S. take for granted! Having spent a lot of time in many different countries I am fortunate to have observed many things that are far outside what is actually stated as law. These are not occasional occurrences, but are the norm.
PS...I'm not trying to slam anyone else's opinion here. Just expressing my own opinion based upon my own experience. thanks!
posted on January 24, 2001 09:48:55 AM new
"These customs "policies" are not laws that are made to benefit all involved, they are politically motivated and unilateral in nature. "
Actually, you'd probably be hard pressed to find any tax or law that "benefits all involved" and isn't "politically motivated". But conveniently enough for you, you've managed to explain away your need to bother with those messy customs duties! Isn't rationalization wonderful?
But what do I know? I'm probably just one of those people (unlike you, of course) who just "don't get the whole picture"
posted on January 24, 2001 09:48:59 AM new
abacaxi: By the way, the law does not dictate that the parcel should have been subject to a 100% tax, but the person that handled the parcel decided to charge that amount...This is what I'm talking about here.
posted on January 24, 2001 09:52:32 AM new
captainkirk: please, get off me! Did you see me state in any of my posts that I choose to disregard the laws???
I simply stated my personal knowledge of the way things work outside this country in that respect. Now, I will not slam you because your opinion differs and would expect the same degree of respect in return.
I was discussing the point of view of the person living in a country outside the U.S. because of the way in which these "laws" are often treated in those same countries.
posted on January 24, 2001 09:58:37 AM new
"If I wrap the item in wrapping paper, stick a note on the front saying, "Happy Birthday" then how could a customs officer be suspicious that it's actually merchandise"
A "gift" is still "merchandise". And, the customs guys will assign a value to the item ... whatever they think it is worth. The onus will then be on you to prove otherwise. Meanwhile, they will have either the item or your money until the issue gets resolved. Like all governments operations, it could take months to sort out. In the end, you might save 40 cents, but ... is it worth it?
posted on January 24, 2001 10:02:59 AM newIt would make sense if these "laws" were followed per se, but in many, many countries the charges are assessed at the whim of the agent handling the parcel.
The failure of another country to apply their laws consistently is not my problem as a seller.
If another seller is willing to risk lying on a customs form, that is certainly his own choice to make. I'd be willing to bet, however, that the "customer" he is trying so hard to accomodate will be of precious little help should that seller ever be charged with any sort of customs violation.
posted on January 24, 2001 10:03:32 AM new
Here is what I do about. I live in the U.S. and will ship items out internationally on occasion.
I understand the customs fees are a pain. So, lets say I buy a Star Wars figure on sale at K-Mart for $2.00. I then sell it on ebay to someone living in Canada for $32.00. On the customs form, I put the value as $2.00, and I have a reciept to prove it. My Canadian customer is happy, and I have not broken any laws.
Of course, this does not work if you want to insure the item.
posted on January 24, 2001 10:56:25 AM new
For those who feel offended at ticking the "gift" box, and for those who wish to minimise their taxation liabilities, I would like to suggest a possible solution. This works for me, in the UK.
I do not know if the figure of £145 applies to parcels or not. I tend to use a figure of about $50. If an item is merchandise, the value of the parcel for taxation purposes is the value of the goods plus the cost of the postage. If an item is a gift, the cost of the postage is disregarded.
When I once had to pay a small fortune to receive my Christmas presents from my family in the US, the Customs officer told me to make sure that the parcel is correctly addressed in future, listing each person who is receiving the contents of the parcel. This means that each person has a duty-free limit, and the number of recipients can be multiplied by the duty-free amount.
However, if you ship a diamond ring and a pokemon card, expect the recipient of the ring to be whacked for duty. A high-value item will always be taxed.
So... the gist of this is... if you are shipping/buying more than a single item, address it to more than one person. This will help minimise tax liability without having to have the seller feel uncomfortable.
Once again, I must express my disbelief that there will be anyone checking the "presents" that are exported, and keeping tally of how generous a single person can be. I cannot see the financial incentive to the exporting country, when all the tax goes to the importing country. But some people like to live with paranoia. For me, I am happy to stick within the rules and make sure my parcels are correctly addressed.
edited to add... But if a seller sends me a "gift" I don't argue with them, and thank them kindly.
and again for typos...
[ edited by mivona on Jan 24, 2001 11:12 AM ]
[ edited by mivona on Jan 24, 2001 02:49 PM ]
posted on January 24, 2001 12:04:03 PM new
Refusing to lie on the customs forms has nothing to do with my capacity for empathy. I do get "the whole picture" as I have a number of international customers, but my livelihood and integrity comes first.
Some of my international customers have third parties within the U.S. to whom packages are mailed -- an "agent" of sorts. Or for Canadians, they are able to make occasional trips to pick the stuff up. What those third parties do with the merchandise is their business. That might not be a good solution for international customers who pay by credit card (or Paypal/Billpoint), since the seller is required to ship to the billing address. But I do have several repeat customers where I am comfortable shipping to an alternate, U.S. address.
posted on January 24, 2001 12:06:04 PM new
I have to agree with RB....whatever your country's policy is on import/export, etc. is, shouldn't even be a concern to the seller.
I'm in Canada and buy from the US all the time. Everyone in Canada is aware of extra charges, so I'm sure overseas customers are just as aware.
Lying on a Customs form is an offence here in Canada.....why take the risk??
posted on January 24, 2001 12:30:22 PM new
I feel sorry for our oversee's bretheren who have to tolerate or be plain disgusted about some of the actions of their Customs.
10 years back, I sent a freind a Birthday Gift of several D&D modules, and a Fantasy Artwork Book of Julie Bell (which contained some nudity, but not in the sexual sense) to him in England, where he was studying.
My friend arrived one day at his flat to find a "bodybag" (as the carrier he talked to put it bluntly) with the remains of the Package I sent him.
3 of the D&D dice were gone, and the Julie Bell Artbook was missing (Good thing the Customs form that I filled out properly was intact, which listed all the contents, and I had marked as intended, a "Gift", otherwise, he might've blamed me for the inadequate gift!!).
He filed a complaint to British Post and the English Customs, and he was told that they can't be held responseable for the actions of the official!
He later found out that English Customs is notorious when it comes to Literature, especially Art and Pornography. If they see one exposed breast, crotch, or "thing", they "destroy it."
He also found out that the Customs officials sometimes "takes" the contraband home!!
Truth be told, sometimes, these countries have double standards.
And, I ain't too keen on US Customs either, after some items I purchased thru eBay could've been lost due to US Customs Negligence (I did make a thread on it a while back; do a search on it).
:\\\"Crystalline Sliver cannot be the target of spells or abilities.
posted on January 24, 2001 12:46:45 PM new
In some parts of the world lying on customs forms and bribing government officials is the accepted way of life. It is like jay-walking is in the US, and don't anyone try to tell me that they don't do that.
So, perhaps one shouldn't get upset at being asked. A simple 'no' is all that is needed.
