posted on March 10, 2001 08:36:48 PM
What are the rules about listing on auction which offers several varieties (colors or styles) of an item (all the same value) to the high bidder? In other words, the picture will depict several items and the high bidder gets to choose their choice of one item from 3 or 4 pictured items for their high bid..... Ebay legal or not?
posted on March 10, 2001 08:46:41 PM
eBay prohibits choice auctions like you describe. But I can see why you'd want to run them for some items, where you have different sizes, for example. I'm not sure how strictly they interpret this rule.
*******
Choice Auctions
A Choice Listing occurs when a seller allows bidders to choose from a selection of items. Choice Listings can be problematic because the item agreed upon is negotiated offline and can lead to either misrepresentation or fraud.
Policy: Choice Auctions are not allowed and will be ended. The insertion fee will be automatically credited for that listing.
posted on March 10, 2001 10:00:39 PM
I don't believe eBay interprets eBay's rule quite like some posters do.
What eBay really doesn't like is the truly obnoxious "the picture shows four hand made quilts, high bidder is bidding on their choice of the four" (and seller is hoping that the 2nd place bidder is bidding on one other than what 1st place bidder takes, so that the process can be repeated).
I think they're tolerant of "high bidder can specify an alternative color if desired; robin egg blue, camel brown, and neon purple are available in addition to the basic navy blue shown in the picture". I also suspect that having a buy-it-now and 1st bid both at the same price avoids the appearance of evil, no "bidding up" going on.
posted on March 10, 2001 10:27:38 PM
<<I think they're tolerant of "high bidder can specify an alternative color if desired; robin egg blue, camel brown, and neon purple are available in addition to the basic navy blue shown in the picture".>>
Listing a choice of colors is usually a reason to end your auction, if someone reports you. Ebay says, that not only is this a choice action, but a fee avaoidance auction, since they feel you are trying to sell all of the items, with one listing. The only time I have seen Ebay make an exception is when something is for a wedding, and you offer to match the bridal colors. I had lots of auctions ended when I first started for offering a choice (I had about 5 widgets, of the same item, except for something that was added to each, to make it individual). I can offer a choice of personalization.
I still offer a choice of colors for my widgets but now I do it in my bidders follow up letter.
posted on March 11, 2001 07:40:07 AM
Thanks for all the input.
I have been offering hand crafted items. The high bidder gets to choose the style they want and I will hand make the one they choose. In the past I sold each individual one as an auction but these last two batches I offered a choice to the high bidder and I said I would make them on order to the high bidders specs. I listed each one at the same starting price as my BIN. In essence, I just sold them. They have gone well in the past for up to double that price but I feel better just getting what I usually sell them for off Ebay.
I was trying to be a bit more generic in my original post but it seems like people have slightly different interpretations of this type of auction. Could somebody please check out my past auctions (I don't have anything listed now) and let me know if this would be considered illegal by Ebay? I sell under [email protected]
posted on March 11, 2001 08:35:39 AM
I think offering the choice in your listing is a no-no (and will get you a warning or your auctions pulled) - but offering in EOA emails is probably going to get by.
I have a question to support on this issue right now - I'm making doll clothes and want to sell the outfit color neutral, and make it to buyer spec's after the fact - I read in a thread on Ebay that one seller has Support's OK to do that... I want to hear it from them myself before I do it though.
posted on March 11, 2001 08:35:39 AM
I'll be sure to post whatever I learn from support here for ya.. Email turned on.
[ edited by katiyana on Mar 11, 2001 08:37 AM ]
posted on March 11, 2001 09:40:36 AM
just- I crochet handmade stuffed animals. I know exactly what you are talking about. The way I got around eBay's rule was to state "You are bidding on my services as a crocheter of stuffed toys. I will make a stuffed toy to your specifications. Pictures of possible choices are included. PLEASE REMEMBER YOU ARE BIDDING ON MY SERVICES, NOT A SPECIFIC CHOICE. Ebay frowns on auctions that give choices.
When I ran it buy eBay to have it checked they admitted that it was not a choice auction. Just a suggestion. Right now I do not have that auction up for you to see. Sorry about that. Just too busy to crochet to order LOL
[ edited by grumteach on Mar 11, 2001 09:43 AM ]
posted on March 11, 2001 09:46:39 AM
My corrections are not registering. There should be a quotation mark at the end of the paragraph about what I wrote, and the word buy in following sentence should be by. Sjorry about that. Guess I do not edit correctly.
posted on March 11, 2001 01:16:26 PM
<<I was trying to be a bit more generic in my original post but it seems like people have slightly different interpretations of this type of auction. Could somebody please check out my past auctions (I don't have anything listed now) and let me know if this would be considered illegal by Ebay? I sell under [email protected] >>
I think if someone reported you, your auctions would be gone. You have the word choose through your description, and Ebay would rather make a fee on each item. To me, it's very obviously choice auctions. The person gets to make several choices. The key is if you were reported...maybe you never would be.
I think the crochett example someone else posted would be a choice auction as well. You can get several people bidding, and the end object ends up being different for them all..which means you are more likely to get a bidder..because they have a choice. But it's just my opinion, and unless someone turns it in, you'll neve for sure.
posted on March 11, 2001 01:56:28 PM
Some time ago I ran a book auction and in the description (not title) offered a choice of 2 (or 3?). Anyway, I received a polite email from Ebay which said "don't do it again". I asked if I should cancel the auction and they said not to bother but to refrain. It sounds like they aren't so polite now and just cancel.
posted on March 11, 2001 04:23:49 PM
I do like Grumteach's idea of auctioning off the service of my handsculpting an item. Any other thoughts on that?
Who would I contact at Ebay to get a clarification on such a specified service type auction? I would love to have an email on file saying it is OK before I go on listing auctions like that.
posted on March 12, 2001 11:01:12 AM
Having an email "on file" is only slightly more a defense than "the kids over at AuctionWatch said it's ok". EBay changes its rules regularly, and the next person is not at all bound by some previous interpretation.
It couldn't hurt to submit a test case to SafeHarbor however.
I predict that offering a "crochet service", with the first bid price and BIN price being the same, high bidder allowed to specify what color thread is used, does not conflict with eBay's interpretation. That eBay's intent is to block auctions where 2nd place bidder MAY have been bidding on a different item than the one bid on by first place bidder (the auction description doesn't make it clear that that can't happen). The service description does not run afoul of that interpretation.
A picture of a red one, a green one, and a blue one, with buyer offered a "choice of red, green, or blue" in no way rules out the potential that 2nd place bidder was bidding on "the green one" while 1st place bidder wants "the blue one".
I'd be interested in any Safeharbor communications which is contrary to this interpretation. Post here, or in a new thread if desired, but I think the results would be interesting to the originator of this thread too.
posted on March 12, 2001 12:43:10 PM
<<Generally, if you want to offer "winner can specify an elephant or a giraffe", I think you'll be safer with 1st bid and BIN being the same price.
If it's elephants only, with "winner can specify varnish or grey paint", >>
Well, let me be more specific with wha they wouldn't let me sell:
1. Car wall clock, either the Ford Model T, or the Ford Model A
2. (I then put just the model A up). You may pick either a black, white, or dark blue frame.
Both of these auctions were ended. Reason? Choice auctions. So now I offer one car clock at a time, and the color choice goes out in my after auction letter. I am allowed to offer personalization..such as a name o the clock, and I got that in writing, which if another safe harbor person get a report on me, they'll see it in my record). It would cost me a lot less in fees, if I could put a couple of clock choices up.
posted on March 13, 2001 07:05:21 AM
"That is so weird.
I just won a "you pick" auction."
And I successfully closed several choice auctions before I even thought it might be a problem. I think it was just because Ebay didn't catch me and your seller first.
I will modify my future auctions offering my "services" to sculpt. I will list this under one specific dog breed. I will also offer "suggestions" of the different activity options rather than offering the buyer a "choice" of activity options.
What would be the best way to get this through Ebay? Should I actually list the auction and send the # to Ebay for their input or should I just describe what I want to do without listing the auction? Finally, should I send this test case to safeharbor or is there somewhere else it should go?
posted on March 13, 2001 11:18:58 PM2. (I then put just the model A up). You may pick either a black, white, or dark blue frame.
Did the auction rule out any potential that the 2nd place bidder might be bidding on something different from the winning bidder?
For example, if you had 3 frames, one black, one white, and one dark blue, then the auction would clearly be "bad" (and most of us applaud eBay's enforcement in such cases). If the description left the number of frames available as ambiguous (as the current posting does), it leaves eBay to interpret it as they choose.
Setting first bid and BIN to the same amount might have helped move their interpretation in the right direction.
posted on March 14, 2001 06:08:06 AM
As in any choice auction, this does not rule out a runner up bidder, or an off-auction bidder..which is the point I was making. Ebay doesn't like choice auctions that mean they may not get all their fees. I'm not saying it shouldn't be like this..just commmenting on another posters question, who said they were able to offer color choice. I don't see how the BIN and the price being the same would help, because you are still letting people looking at your auction know that you have more than one of the same items up for sale..I know, because lots of people emailed me and asked if they could buy off-auction. I think offering a service does the same thing..people know they can email you and offer to buy, since you are selling something they know you can offer to more than one person. I have fixed my auctions to match Ebay's rules, since It's their house, and I'll play by their rules in the listing, so I don't have a problem with it (didn't know the score when I first started), but I do know that if I could list them how I would like to list them, I would save a fortune in listing fees. I did just the two weeks I had it up with a choice.
<<Did the auction rule out any potential that the 2nd place bidder might be bidding on something different from the winning bidder?
For example, if you had 3 frames, one black, one white, and one dark blue, then the auction would clearly be "bad" (and most of us applaud eBay's enforcement in such cases). If the description left the number of frames available as ambiguous (as the current posting does), it leaves eBay to interpret it as they choose.
Setting first bid and BIN to the same amount might have helped move their interpretation in the right direction. >>
posted on March 14, 2001 07:48:33 AM
Received a reply from Ebay regarding this issue. With handcrafted items you can provide a choice to the buyer as long as you don't provide the available choices in your listing.
I.E. "These hand-knitted gloves will be customized per winning bidder's specifications. Please email me at XXXX with questions."
That is allowed - so I will be able to offer my knitting/crocheting services and provide buyer choice while not breaking Ebay policy.
posted on March 14, 2001 08:29:52 AM"These hand-knitted gloves will be customized per winning bidder's specifications. "
"I'm very pleased to be the high bidder on the gloves, it's rare in life that one can specify personal customization, and at such a low price, too. I'd like to specify a seal skin palm insert, and my boyfriend thinks I look cute with a black patent leather wrist band, about 3/4 inch above my wrist, 2.5 inches wide please".
posted on March 14, 2001 08:49:30 AM
"Thank you for your winning bid. At this time the following types of customization are available:
Size
Color
Style
Additional materials beyond the knitted glove are not available at this time. Attached are pictures of several style possibilities - if you'll provide hand measurements from wrist to middle fingertip and color preferences, I'll put together your PO"
