posted on March 25, 2001 10:04:01 PM new
I looked back and could not find the thread for this but here is some new information on the subject for you. This is from the PayPal site and was not sent out in an e-mail, at least not to me.
Notice Date: March 25, 2001
Effective Date: March 31, 2001
Under Visa and MasterCard regulations and the laws of several states, including California, merchants may not charge a fee to the buyer for accepting credit card payments (often called a "surcharge". In order to comply with these laws and regulations, PayPal has amended its Terms of Use so that, effective March 31, customers may not charge a fee for accepting PayPal. This restriction does not prevent you from imposing a handling fee in connection with the sale of goods or services, as long as the handling fee does not operate as a surcharge (in other words, the handling fee for transactions paid through PayPal may not be higher than the handling fee for transactions paid through other payment methods).
So case closed, as of the 31st (6 days) people can no longer charge for using the service.
posted on March 25, 2001 10:18:52 PM new(in other words, the handling fee for transactions paid through PayPal may not be higher than the handling fee for transactions paid through other payment methods).
Well, that would seem to effectively eliminate the strategy of offering a discount off the S&H for checks/money orders.
What's next--"opening bid price cannot be increased to cover PayPal charges" LOL.
posted on March 25, 2001 10:40:46 PM newWell, that would seem to effectively eliminate the strategy of offering a discount off the S&H for checks/money orders.
I don't see it that way, nor does eBay. If you want to offer a discount for a payment method that's up to you. The terms state you can't charge more for a PayPal payment. While the results are the same there is a difference between a surcharge and a discount.
posted on March 25, 2001 10:54:57 PM new
Thouse are both interesting comments. I read the first one and agreed psyllie on it. I read what uaru had to say and thought that might be away to get around it.
I have never heard of anyone giving a discount for cash unless it was one of those under the table transactions. That is just me now, it might be happening and be legal.
I would be interested to hear from more people on allowing a discount for cash/money order/other.
posted on March 25, 2001 11:00:48 PM new
I dunno, uaru, this is a brand spanking new term dictated by PayPal, not by eBay. Up until now it was eBay saying we could do this with PayPal charges but we couldn't do that...now it's PayPal saying what we can and cannot do.
If a seller says "$2.50 shipping and handling, with a 30-cent discount if paid by check or money order" then that's perfectly okay by eBay...but would that not be deemed by PayPal to be a surcharge to the handling fee for using PayPal? Cash/check/mo buyers would not be paying the extra 30 cents.
Doesn't mean much to me since I've stopped accepting PayPal for the time being. I just find it interesting to see all these conditions being dictated by "venues" and "services."
posted on March 25, 2001 11:24:02 PM new
As usual, PayPal has no idea what it is talking about.
When you use PayPal, you are not using Visa and MasterCard. That's why you do not receive the ability to dispute your transaction under the The Fair Credit Billing Act (FCBA) or the Electronic Fund Transfer Act (EFTA), for credit cards or debit cards, respectively.
This is why when someone loads their PayPal account with a credit card to pay you they agree under PayPal terms to not dispute the charge. Even if they tried, the bank or issuer would state that there was no transaction between you and the seller.
The transaction is between you and PayPal.
Additionally, for PayPal to start referring to Visa/MasterCard rules when all this time they have been insisting those rules do not apply is ludicrous.
In essence, PayPal seems to be conceding in its new policy that the transaction is between you and the seller - which means that their implicit policy of not allowing disputes/chargebacks is a violation of Visa/Mastercard rules and FTC regulations.
posted on March 25, 2001 11:27:06 PM newI have never heard of anyone giving a discount for cash unless it was one of those under the table transactions. That is just me now, it might be happening and be legal.
Do a search for "cash discount" on eBay. Discounts for cash, check, or money orders aren't all that rare on eBay. I don't offer them but some do.
If you feel you can't offer a discount for other payment methods then you shouldn't do it. I'm not going to debate words and intent. For me there is no question that I can and am allowed to offer discounts, it's just a question of it making any sense. For me it doesn't.
posted on March 25, 2001 11:41:09 PM new
I think loggia may have a good point. They can't have it both ways or say that only the terms they "like" apply.
This whole thing's shaping up to be the virtual version of the battle that's been going on in the brick & mortar world for some time. Especially with the likes of cards like Amex that charge high merchant costs. Go outside the U.S. and you find that in many, if not most, countries you get surcharged at a lot of places for credit cards.
Debit cards are the worst, since they carry merchant fees but don't have the advantage of tempting people to spend more as credit cards do. Consumers get higher prices passed along to them just for the "convenience" of not having to write a check and having the money taken out of their account faster.
posted on March 26, 2001 03:48:58 AM new
Charging for paypal, mastercard, and visa are not allowed on ebay, and are illegal in many states. Giving cast discounts is allowed on ebay because it is legal in those same states.
posted on March 26, 2001 05:14:39 AM new
If your ebay "business" is set up properly, eating the fees for PAYPAL SHOULD NOT BE A PROBLEM. You should welcome all methods of payment with open arms!! I think all should remember we are running businesses here. Another thing is I thought that if the person was paying with funds existing in their Paypal account the fees were not charged. There is only a fee if the person uses a credit card to pay thru paypal? I haven't used paypal for a while and at my advanced age (39) I forget quite quickly.
Prepare for the worst but hope for the best!! Spuddy98
posted on March 26, 2001 05:37:59 AM new
spuddy98,
You haven't used PayPal in a while. There are charges for both types now, the non-credit card is just a bit lower.
Everyone,
These TOS are NOT acceptable to ebay:
Payments by BillPoint/PayPal must pay 2% extra
Payments by BillPoint/PayPal must add $.50
These TOS are acceptable to ebay:
BillPoint/PayPal accepted. Buyer to pay $XYZ shipping/handling
(in this case, you use the handling portion to pay for the BP/PP fees)
BillPoint/PayPal accepted. Buyer to pay $XZY shipping/handling. $.50 discount for cash, check or money order payments
{again, the handling portion is used to include an amount for BP/PP fees but then the "discount" gives it back if the buyers pays by other methods.
. In order to comply with these laws and regulations, PayPal has amended its Terms of Use so that, effective March 31, customers may not charge a fee for accepting PayPal. This restriction does not prevent you from imposing a handling fee in connection with the sale of goods or services, as long as the handling fee does not operate as a surcharge (in other words, the handling fee for transactions paid through PayPal may not be higher than the handling fee for transactions paid through other payment methods).