Islander
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posted on May 1, 2001 10:11:31 PM new
Let me thank you in advance for your help! Two questions:
1) How does a buyer withdraw a complaint at PayPal? One of my buyers filed very precipitously (without corresponding with me first), and now is realizing he didn't need to do that, but I can't find info at PayPal on how he goes about withdrawing the complaint.
2) Does a USPS Delivery Confirmation satisfy PayPal's requirement of proof of mailing to the confirmed address? "The seller can provide reasonable proof-of-shipment which can be tracked online. This documentation must show that you shipped to the Confirmed Address."
Again, thanks!
Edited to say, I've posted it under the PayPal header.
[ edited by Islander on May 1, 2001 10:45 PM ]
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RichieRich
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posted on May 1, 2001 11:14:09 PM new
I too have a question for you.
How can I not accept a payment from someone?
Is that possible?
I just have a personal account and do not want credit card payments? Is that allowed?
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bhall53
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posted on May 2, 2001 03:57:37 AM new
I am told by my postmaster that a delivery confirmation receipt will hold up in a court of law so I don't know why PayPal wouldn't accept it as proof. It should have your post office's stamp on it showing the date it was mailed. You can't fake that! Have you called the toll-free number for the USPS to see if the item was delivered? Every so often I have one of the dishonest ebay buyers to swear they didn't get a package I sent with delivery confirmation. I guess they don't understand what it means to send something delivery confirmation. I call the 800 # and then email them to tell them when it was delivered and to what address. I only send packages delivery confirmation and state that in my auctions.
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capotasto
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posted on May 2, 2001 05:44:06 AM new
PPD has said over and over and over that DC does indeed satisfy paypal's requirement of proof of mailing.
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packer
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posted on May 2, 2001 07:36:46 AM new
4,671½ times to be exact. Gosh don't you guys ever read the other threads before posting your question?
packer
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mrpotatoheadd
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posted on May 2, 2001 08:10:53 AM new
PPD has said over and over and over that DC does indeed satisfy paypal's requirement of proof of mailing.
The question "Does DC satisfy paypal's requirement of proof of mailing"? never seems to get a "Yes" or "No" answer. The response (over and over) has been "DC does indeed satisfy paypal's requirement of proof of mailing, as long as it is trackable online".
Here's one typical exchange:
_____________________________
posted by blacklabel March 22, 2001 02:30:35 PM
paypaldamon, I'm still confused. Is the Post Office Delivery Confirmation (little green form that costs 40 cents) acceptable for the PayPal Seller Protection? Thanks. Henry
posted by paypaldamon March 22, 2001 03:20:07 PM
Hi blacklabel,
Yes. That can be tracked on-line.
_____________________________
I'm not sure of the reason for qualifying the "Yes" answer, but since it happens with regularity, I'd guess it is important to PayPal for some reason to do so.
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packer
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posted on May 2, 2001 08:34:36 AM new
mrpotatoheadd,
What other kind of DC's are there?
I thought there was only ONE kind and IT IS trackable on-line.
I've never seen a problem with damon's answers. How many different ways must he say it before you are satisfied?
packer
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capotasto
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posted on May 2, 2001 08:50:29 AM new
The problem is, DC cannot be "tracked" online as can UPS shipments.
Mrpotatohead is right, PPD has never given a simple YES or NO, there is always some little qualification.
However, I interpret PPDs response "Yes. That can be tracked on-line." to mean:
"Yes, PP considers DC to be trackable on line."
the question remains -- why must we "interpret" PPDs responses.
Vinnie
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mrpotatoheadd
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posted on May 2, 2001 08:57:32 AM new
packer-
What other kind of DC's are there?
Maybe ones that never get scanned into the system- I don't know.
How many different ways must he say it before you are satisfied?
I find it curious when people ask a question which can be responded to with a "yes" or "no" answer, and the response is more complicated than that.
Question:
Does DC satisfy paypal's requirement of proof of mailing?
Answer:
Yes.
There is no possible confusion or ambiguity in this situation.
Question:
Does DC satisfy paypal's requirement of proof of mailing?
Answer:
Yes, as long as it is trackable online.
This sounds the same as the previous answer, but does it really nmean the same? With the ability of companies to use weasel words to make people think they are saying things they really aren't, I'm not sure. Does that necessarily mean anything? I don't know. If you think you might ever need to avail yourself of PayPal's "protection", you might wnat to be sure of the answer beforehand.
Try it yourself and see what happens. Ask PayPal to respond to this question:
Does DC satisfy paypal's requirement of proof of mailing?
with a "Yes" or "No" answer, and see what happens.
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packer
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posted on May 2, 2001 09:04:36 AM new
capotasto,
Your wrong! you CAN track Delivery Confirmation on-line, because I just did one that I have here.
I mailed it the 11th of April and it shows delivered the 14th of April.
Goto: www.usps.com to tracking/confirmation.
Besides damon has always said the issue isn't showing where the package ends up but rather that the SELLER did send it.
Trackable DC does indeed show proof that the package WAS SENT.
I think Damon has been very clear on this issue.
Now before you flame me....I too think that this is an inadequit way of showing proof.
And unless you yourself stand right over the Postmater to be SURE that he does get it scanned. Because I know for a fact that in the rush of things that those scans can be forgotten or overlooked.
packer
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roofguy
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posted on May 2, 2001 09:04:48 AM new
You guys derive some pleasure from pushing Damon around? They send Damon out into public to address real issues, and he encounters what amounts to vandalism.
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nofishing
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posted on May 2, 2001 09:09:13 AM new
I would take anything PayPal says with a grain of salt.
When you mail an item from USPS, you receive a receipt with the buyers town and zip code. That should be adequate.
DC is NOT insurance, so I feel it is a waste of money. Who has money to through around after paying those ever changing PayPal fees.
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mrpotatoheadd
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posted on May 2, 2001 09:10:09 AM new
packer-
You said:
Because I know for a fact that in the rush of things that those scans can be forgotten or overlooked.
Suppose this did indeed happen (the scan was forgotten at the shipping po), and the package was never delivered. Do you suppose PayPal would cover the loss on this item?
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roofguy
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posted on May 2, 2001 09:15:28 AM new
Ok. Here is the rest of this story, if you need to know.
DC is not always trackable. We know that, because it sometimes happens by accident. What is less discussed is that it is possible to "obtain" a DC certificate with any data you would like. This results in an opportunity for a thief to "ship" something to himself (under a different name), then claim non-receipt and chargeback. Thief-seller produces the DC and claims protection.
What online tracing offers, beyond the obvious, is tracing of the Postoffice clerk which entered the data into the system.
As I said before, if you're not a thief, you have nothing to worry about. If you are a thief, no one cares what Paypal does to you.
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vargas
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posted on May 2, 2001 09:22:39 AM new
As I said before, if you're not a thief, you have nothing to worry about. If you are a thief, no one cares what Paypal does to you.
Famous last words waiting to happen.
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tomwiii
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posted on May 2, 2001 09:23:34 AM new
I've used DC on over 800 items!
EVERY SINGLE ONE was trackable ONLINE!
Now that I use ENDICIA.COM it is scanned into the USPS databast automatically, & costs $0.00 for PRIORITY and $0.12 for MEDIA MAIL!
Other than for fun&harassment purposes of Damon, I truly don't understand why you guys are beating this dead horse!
He says: "It has to be trackable online!
It will be unless YOUR PO CLERK does not scan it into the system at the window or if you just drop your package into a mailbox!
I'm no longer a PP CHEERLEADER, but YIKES! give it a rest!
It seems to me that folks don't understand what Damon is saying because they DON'T WANT TO UNDERSTAND what Damon is saying!
[ edited by tomwiii on May 2, 2001 09:25 AM ]
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mrpotatoheadd
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posted on May 2, 2001 09:24:04 AM new
Ok. Here is the rest of this story, if you need to know.
I would think, if one wanted to be covered under PayPal's seller protection policy, that they would "need to know the rest of this story", if it would affect their coverage. I guess, if what you say is true:
DC is not always trackable.
the question would then be... Why doesn't PayPal make this clear to its customers? Leading your customers to believe that they are somehow protected when they may not be does not seem like the best way to insure goodwill.
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packer
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posted on May 2, 2001 09:25:38 AM new
Hi nofishing,
I don't get a receipt when I do my mailimg.
I live in a teeny tiny town with a teeny tiny post office.
We still lick stamps to get the correct postage on the package.
have you ever licked $60.00 worth of stams at one shot ~YUCK ~. Then they won't stick and you have to tape them anyway. We are slowly converting to the self stick'ems.
I agree DC is a total waste of money and I bet I've only used 3 times since they came out with it.
If the item is over $50.00 it gets insured(thats trackable) if is under $25.00 and is payed for with paypal, forget it....I'll do the refunding myself. I don't need paypal to interfer, its a problem between me and the buyer.
The only good I can see paypal's role in this is if we are talking high dollar items. Then you still don't need DC because the insurance would cover it. AND if its insured you still wouldn't need paypal because the insurance would cover the loss or damage.
Wait a minute I guess I'm straying from the original question....it was about chargebacks wasn't it?
ahhhh....its all a bunch of HOOEY anyway.
Maybe they get a cut from the PO.
packer
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sharkbaby
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posted on May 2, 2001 10:03:15 AM new
I just have one FYI to add regarding DC:
When you transact with the postal clerk, make sure that he/she scans the DC so that it does, indeed, get entered into the system as having been sent. Sometimes they either don't know to do this, or just simply neglect to do so because they are very busy. If they do NOT scan it at that point, there will possibly not be any traceable documentation of the parcel being sent if it does not arrive.
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Islander
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posted on May 2, 2001 10:51:59 AM new
Isn't it interesting that no one has ventured an answer to my first and primary question? Many (not everyone!) just jumped on the bandwagon to rag on me about asking a repeat question (like no one else ever does this?!?!)or bash PayPal. C'mon guys, I've got a complaint filed against me at PayPal that the buyer is willing to withdraw, but we don't know how!
I've posted this question over at the PayPal board, but no answer yet, so I'm pursuing it here.
Addendum: I could poke holes in the discussion about the USPS DC, but I don't give a da*n about that right now.
[ edited by Islander on May 2, 2001 11:01 AM ]
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paypaldamon
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posted on May 2, 2001 04:09:07 PM new
Hi,
Yes, as has been said in the past, delivery confirmation (or any other method of tracking that can be done on-line) is acceptable proof.
The vague responses, in some cases, come about from questions like:
What happens if the post office doesn't scan it? (not a PayPal issue).
Any method of confirmation that can be viewed on-line is adequate, regardless of what organization is used for shipping.
Tracking on-line=OK.
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mrpotatoheadd
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posted on May 2, 2001 04:28:25 PM new
If...
some items for which DC has been purchased are not scanned into the system
and therefore...
are not able to be tracked online
then...
the answer to the question
"Does DC satisfy paypal's requirement of proof of mailing"?
is...
not necessarily.
It would have saved a lot of time for PayPal to have just stated this...
In order for DC to be accepted as proof of mailing, it must be scanned into the USPS system. Items not scanned into the USPS system are not covered under the seller protection policy.
from the very beginning. The fact that people have been asking this same question for months now should have been some indication that there was confusion about the rule in the minds of many customers.
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paypaldamon
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posted on May 2, 2001 04:57:04 PM new
Hi mrpotatohead,
The fact that Delivery Confirmation is ok was stated numerous times.
Users were more concerned about the item not being scanned, which is not a PayPal issue, but could impact a potential claim against them.
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mrpotatoheadd
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posted on May 2, 2001 05:11:27 PM new
Suppose a PayPal customer were to ask:
I paid for DC and have a stamped receipt from the post office. Will I be covered by PayPal's seller protection program?
The possible answers are:
A) Always.
B} Never.
C) Sometimes.
There are three choices as an answer to the question. Every possible situation can be covered under the three choices given, and there is no need to provide any more than a one letter answer from the multiple choice list above.
Are there any PayPal representatives available who are willing to make a post consisting of nothing more than the one letter (A, B or C) which corresponds to the answer to the above question, reflecting PayPal's policy with regards to USPS delivery confirmation?
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packer
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posted on May 2, 2001 05:11:33 PM new
damon,
I'm with mrpotatoheadd on this one.
It should have been made clear from the get-go that DC was accepted PROVIDED it got scanned into the system.
As it were...everyone is going along their merry way paying $.40 to the PO and thinking YUP, I'M COVERED..NO PROBLEM!
The fact is unless you stand right over your Postmaster to see him scan it there really is no piece of mind as to being covered at all.
Now its...MAYBE I AM OR MAYBE I'M NOT!
Well for many it may not be possible to be present when the package is suppose to be scanned.
So, what it boils down to is for those folks, DC is a total waste of money and more importantly PEACE OF MIND!
packer
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paypaldamon
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posted on May 2, 2001 06:55:58 PM new
Hi packer,
I am not trying to be combative by stating this, but how can I make sure that a package is scanned by any company for tracking? I can only state what we will accept for proof.
I would like you to go back to that thread and count how many times I stated that DC is acceptable proof. I never contradicted this statment, as well as mentioning possible alternatives for tracking.
A stamped receipt is not proof.
The equation is:
Trackable on-line=proof for our purposes.
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mrpotatoheadd
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posted on May 2, 2001 07:05:04 PM new
C
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packer
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posted on May 2, 2001 07:18:34 PM new
Thank you damon,
I do understand that you have said that DC is acceptable proof 4,000+ times already.
Now for the next 4,000+ times in the future when your asked suppose you tell us "DC is acceptable form of proof PROVIDED it gets scanned" furthermore if it DOES NOT get scanned you are SOL!
Under those curcumstances if I were paypal I would take accepting DC out of the list of options.
Remember...I work for the post office and there rate for scanning on a daily basis is about 93%(that is just for our area) the other 7% DOES NOT get scanned.
So it goes....
packer
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capotasto
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posted on May 2, 2001 07:22:57 PM new
And just WTH does "trackable" mean?
UPS has real tracking: you can find out WHERE the package is at any time.
USPS DC is not "tracking" -- it merely states where it was accepted (IF it was scanned) and where/if it was delivered. Period.
BUT I guess DC is acceptable IF you stand over the postal clerk and make sure he/she scans it in to the system.
Geez!!!!
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mrpotatoheadd
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posted on May 2, 2001 07:38:10 PM new
Here's the answer you should have been giving your customers all along. Feel free to start using it any time now.
Question: Is USPS Delivery Confirmation acceptable as proof of shipping?
Answer: USPS Delivery Confirmation is acceptable as proof of shipping, provided the package is scanned into USPS's system and can be tracked online.
Caution! Sellers need to be sure that the package is scanned at the time of mailing. Failure to do so may result in loss of coverage under the "seller protection plan".
NOTE!!!! This is mrpotatoheadd's suggested response to the above question. PayPal chooses to answer differently, so do not base any decisions on anything included in this post.
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