eauctionmgnt
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posted on May 5, 2001 08:44:03 PM new
I am furious!! I listed an auction on eBay for a camera that I have several of to sell. The first one I had sold well for $24.99. The second one did not sell, but I plan to relist it. Then, tonight, I went to Goodwill.com to check out their auctions. (curious to see what they had to offer). Surprisingly... I saw that they were selling the exact same camera as I was. I decided to take a look at it... and what did I see??? They had copied MY WORDING from my eBay auction!!! How unethical is that?!? Admitedly, a lot of my auction description was information that is obtainable from an instruction manual... however, they copied EXACT two-three long sentence phrases of mine word for word that are NOT in any of the camera's literature! I am absolutely furious that a large company like Goodwill would do something like this. I wonder how many other eBay auctions they copy? Do you think when they get items in, they just do a query on eBay and grab the description? What should I do about this? Your suggestions and comments are greatly appreciated. Thank you!
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sparkz
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posted on May 5, 2001 09:03:13 PM new
They not only stole from you, they stole from Ebay. Once that text is pasted on Ebay's site, it is in essence their property also and I believe this subject about the fine print in Ebay's TOS came up on this board about a year or so ago. Also, Goodwill.com is a competitor of Ebay. I don't think Ebay wants anyone taking anything off their boards to make money (they want it all for themselves). Hell, they don't even want anyone on the outside using search engines on their site. I would contact Safeharbor and give them all the info including auction numbers, etc. Let their legal department handle it.
The light at the end of the tunnel will turn out to be an oncoming train.
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redskinfan
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posted on May 5, 2001 09:09:29 PM new
I tried to go to goodwill.com and got the message that the site could not be found.
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eauctionmgnt
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posted on May 5, 2001 09:17:13 PM new
Sparkz:
Excellent idea! Ebay definately has more money to spend on lawyers than I do! I am drafting a letter to SafeHarbor as we speak!
Redskinfan:
The actual website for the goodwill auctions is:
http://www.shopgoodwill.com
Sorry about the confusion!
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eauctionmgnt
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posted on May 5, 2001 09:55:34 PM new
I just found more proof that verifys my description was stolen! I had two mis-spelled words in my description... guess what? The SAME two words are mis-spelled (the same way) in the Goodwill auction. I am just simply shocked and appalled at this infringement. Anyone else have some suggestions on how to handle this?
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Libra63
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posted on May 5, 2001 09:57:07 PM new
I just came from ShopGoodwill and their prices are terrible. Ebay has better merchandise. I don't understand why people shop ther. Our Goodwill keeps all the local merchandise and sells it at the store. No internet for them. I also have to say our store is quite strict with their employees. They cannot pick, they have to wait until it is out on the shelves for 15 minutes but cannot buy until they get their break or lunch period or day off. The items are priced lower than the goodwills in the major cities by us, so I guess we are lucky. I do find quite a bit there and I vist maybe 3 days a week. I would like to go everyday but when I say to my husband I am going to the GW he says AGAIN! They just don't understand. 
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mcjane
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posted on May 5, 2001 10:15:58 PM new
I have a rather large book that I want to sell, so this evening I looked in completed auctions to see how it would do. I was impressed with a discription written by a seller. I emailed him & asked if I could have his permission to use some of his work. He answered me right away saying I was more that welcome to use any or all of his discription. My point is don't steal someone else's work, if you like it & want to use it, just ask.
You may be pleasantly suprized as I was.
Stealing pictures & discriptions is lower than low.
I hope you can nail Goodwill with this one.
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sparkz
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posted on May 5, 2001 10:41:30 PM new
Mcjane
I recently sold an item to a gentleman on the East coast. He has a web site where he displays a portion of his collection. He sent me an email asking my permission to let him use my auction pictures on his web site as he was going to display this particular item. I can't begin to tell you how flattered I was! I wasted no time firing back permission. I only wish I had know before I shipped the item. I would have taken a ton of pics for him. I suspect most sellers probably feel the same way including the originator of this thread. They could have sent him a nice email asking his permission to quote certain parts of his description. Instead, they stole the whole thing from him. If they're going to do that, will their morals be any better when it comes time for money to change hands after the sale? Doesn't sound like the kind of people I care to deal with.
The light at the end of the tunnel will turn out to be an oncoming train.
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jumpinjacko
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posted on May 6, 2001 12:20:32 AM new
WHAT HARM WAS DONE?..DO YOU THINK THEY MIGHT HAVE TAKEN
A CAMERA CUSTOMER AWAY FROM YOU..?
IF SOMEONE STOLE ANY THINGS FROM MY WEBSITE
OR AUCTION.....A PHRASE ,SOME ARTWORK, A NAKED PICTURE OF MY WIFE ,ECT.ECT....I WOULD NOT BE UPSET.....I WOULD BE HONORED
THAT SOMEBODY THOUGHT IT WAS WORTHY OF STEELING..
BUT I‘VE BEEN WRONG BEFORE...
XXX
JUMPIN*JACK
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morgantown
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posted on May 6, 2001 12:37:27 AM new
"BUT I‘VE BEEN WRONG BEFORE..."
You are wrong this time too.
People put lots of work into auction descriptions, templates, and overall style. To have it copied in one second stinks. FYI, I put extra effort into my descriptions with lots of details, details, details - I get more money for same or similar items than others. I EARN my competitive advantage and do not appreciate thieves!
ed UBB
[ edited by morgantown on May 6, 2001 12:41 AM ]
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jumpinjacko
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posted on May 6, 2001 01:06:01 AM new
and do not appreciate thieves!
TOP OF THE EVENING TO YA.....MTOWN
I DON’T MIND SOMEONE STEALING MY STUFF..
DOES THIS MAKE ME A CRIMINAL FOR AIDING AND ABETTING THIEVES ? OR JUST A FLATTERED WEBMASTER?
YA KNOW I LOVE YA...
JUMPIN
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laptopper
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posted on May 6, 2001 01:27:58 AM new
I've got it aaaaalllll worked out:
I typically put minimal time in on describing old items I sell (as far as describing what it is). I spend most of my creative time describing the item's condition, which is not only what more sellers should do, but it also makes it hard to steal your descriptions, since old items vary greatly in condition and flaws.
After selling well over 1400 items, I have never had one complaint about condition--or anything else for that matter. My motto to my customers is "no surprises". You get exactly what I said you'll get. My condition descriptions couldn't be more clear or detailed.
Bully for me.
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bitofagrump
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posted on May 6, 2001 05:59:29 AM new
Ask Goodwill for a receipt for your donation-say it's an original work and you value it at $2000.
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rgrem
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posted on May 6, 2001 06:24:32 AM new
Why not "ask seller a Question..." and tell them what you think. Tell them to escalate this email to management. Perhaps it is not management's policy to do this, and the person doing the listing just thought it was ok. If they don't answer, then make life miserable by asking every 1/2 hour. At least give them a chance, and find out if that is management's policy.
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eauctionmgnt
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posted on May 6, 2001 07:58:15 AM new
Goodmorning everybody!
Thank you for all your responses. I thought I would give you an update on this issue. Currently, as suggested by Sparkz, I have sent an e-mail to Safeharbor informing them of the issue. I haven't heard back from them yet... but then they're not really known for their speed, are they?
I agree with many of you, that IF Goodwill had contacted me to ask if they could use parts of my description, I would have probably allowed them to. Although, I would have preferred them to do so only AFTER I had sold my remaining stock. I have no way of knowing if they have received bids on their item that would have been placed on mine otherwise. If they had contacted me first, I probably would have been flattered, as JumpinJack suggests. However, as they had absolutely NO intention of acknowledging my work in this, I feel very much violated and infuriated. I also do not appreciate thieves!
Finally, rgrem, you have another great suggestion. I am in the process of drafting an e-mail to Goodwill. In addition to using their "ask a seller" feature, I will also send the e-mail to their comments/complaints coordinator and to their Data Entry/ Photo Support specialist. Hopefully, I will get an appology and some sort of compensation for their infringement. If not... I suppose I can always contact the Media... I wonder what the public would think of a story like this!
[ edited by eauctionmgnt on May 6, 2001 07:59 AM ]
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Microbes
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posted on May 6, 2001 08:16:16 AM new
There are 3 ways to get rich in America
1. Marry the money.
2. Inherit the money.
3. Sue someone with DEEP pockets.
Looks like you have a chance of a lifetime 
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eauctionmgnt
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posted on May 6, 2001 08:19:44 AM new
Okay... here goes, I've drafted a letter to send to Goodwill... let me know what you think!
Goodwill Industries of xxx xxx,
I am writing to inform you of a matter of Copyright infringement. The description for your auction number xxxxxx was illegally copied from an eBay auction description that we developed. You may view our completed auction that was copied at the following html link:
http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=xxxxxxxx
Material posted on web-sites is not considered public domain. Copying of such material is considered by law to be Copyright infringement. We request that you end your auction immediately. We also request that you send us an offer of compensation for the inconvenience of the theft of our original work.
We have also contacted eBay of this matter, as the material was stolen from information we had posted on their site. We are also sending a copy of this e-mail to xxxx xxxx, of your comments/complaint department, and to xxxxx xxxxx of your Data Entry/Photo Support department. Your immediate attention to this matter is requested.
Sincerely,
xxxx xxxx
xxxx xxxx, xxx.
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jumpinjacko
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posted on May 6, 2001 09:55:19 AM new
LETS SAY EAUCTIONMGNT...TOOK A PHOTO OF HIS CAMERA TO ADD TO HIS AUCTION DESCRIPTION...DO YOU THINK
THE PERSON WHO DESIGNED THE CAMERA BOX FOR RETAIL SALES AFFECT ..WOULD
THINK EAUCTIONMGNT WAS STEALING HIS WORK BECAUSE EAUCTIONMGNT
WAS PROFITING BY IT..
IF THE GUY A GOODWILL WROTE HIS AUCTION DESCRIPTIONFROM PURE MEMORY
OF EAUCTIONMGNT’S AUCTION WOULD
THAT BE STEALING....IF SO ...THAT WOULD MEAN THAT EAUCTIONMGNT
WAS A THIEF WHEN HE ADDED ANY INFORMATION OFF THE CAMERA’S LITERATURE
CA YA
JUMPIN
[ edited by jumpinjacko on May 6, 2001 10:34 AM ]
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blueapple
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posted on May 6, 2001 11:03:37 AM new
I just wanted to make sure you saved a copy of the page with the misspellings (both yours and theirs) somewhere else. I don't know if shopgoodwill.com would resort to it, but couldn't they just go change those and claim you were lying?
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jumpinjacko
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posted on May 6, 2001 11:09:28 AM new
WHAT COMPENSATION DO YOU THINK YOU ARE ENTITLED
TO....IF THEY SOLD THE CAMERA FOR A WHOPPING 25 DOLLARS
HOW MUCH OF THAT ARE YOU GOING TO SUE FOR..AND WHAT LAW FIRM
ARE YOU GOING TO USE...I NEED THEIR NUMBER...THE BEST THING
YOU CAN DO IS ADD THIS TAG TO ALL YOUR FUTURE AUCTIONS
<script language="JavaScript"><!--
// No copy script
function click() {
if (event.button==2) {
alert(HANDS OFF..!')
}
}
document.onmousedown=click
// -->
</script>
EBAY NAME
JUMPIN*JACK
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eauctionmgnt
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posted on May 6, 2001 12:27:52 PM new
blueapple:
Thanks for the suggestion... I already thought of that and have saved copies of both the goodwill auction and my own ebay auction. Documentation is always helpful!
JumpinJack:
Obviously you and I have differences in opinion on copyright infringement. I do, however, appreciate your html tag contribution. I am sure that will be useful to both myself and others that read this thread. I honestly do not know what type of compensation I should be entitled to, and that is why my letter leaves that in their hands. My main objective is to obtain an appology from them and to educate them that their current business practice of stealing item descriptions is against the law. Just because they are a big company doesn't mean they should take advantage of smaller sellers such as myself. Copying an auction description is no different then copying a copyrighted piece of music, art, photography, or novel. They are all original creations that are NOT public domain.
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bid22win
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posted on May 6, 2001 04:39:33 PM new
Just the flip side of that coin.....
Realize please, they only hire the "Handicapped", a term that
encompasses multipliable difficulties. These Handicapped folks are
able to function at various levels, with minimal supervision. Amazing
really, if you were to go behind the scenes. That's probably why the
misspelled words weren't caught.....
To most, without employment at Goodwill, theirs would a life with little
or no dignity, my gentle reader.
Just another's thought.
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wbbell
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posted on May 6, 2001 08:46:32 PM new
Jumpinjack - anyone who does that in their auctions will NEVER get a bid from me! It's annoying as heck, right up there with the automatic music and video clips!
And, also, trivially simple to get around it by simply turning off javascript.
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engelskdansk
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posted on May 6, 2001 08:49:52 PM new
And you can easily bypass the javascript by going through View:Source.
And it's very hard to read the ALL CAPS. (So I don't bother.)
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jumpinjacko
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posted on May 6, 2001 09:00:44 PM new
Wb.....somebody copied eauctionmgnt description text and used it
on their own auction ...im sure that eauctonmgnt copied to
off the owners manul first.....who cares.....no reason to call
your lawyer.....
Jumpin
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figmente
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posted on May 6, 2001 09:14:06 PM new
I agree that that click interception is a PITA - I hit it once in awhile when going to copy the auction number to esnipe or to copy a minimum bid amount to bid, and find it quite irritating... In effect you practically accuse me of stealing from you for trying to bid on your item.
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mcjane
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posted on May 6, 2001 09:15:04 PM new
sparkz I think the seller I emailed to use his discription was flattered too. I think most people would be glad to share if asked. Nice of you to do that too.
jumpinjacko On another thread you invited posters to take a look at your auctions, so I did. Spent a lot of time there & read all your clicks & had a lot of laughs over eBay addiction. Now are you saying if I wanted to swipe your PayPal write up, I could. I still take PayPal, but only up to 100.00 a month so I won't have to pay for it. I see the day coming when I will drop it for good & I like your reasons.
Right on target & great to put in an auction.
Jane
mcjane on ebay
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jumpinjacko
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posted on May 6, 2001 09:24:24 PM new
JANE......YOU SOUND LIKE A REAL EBABE.....THANK YOU FOR THE KIND WORDS
FEEL FREE TO USE OR LINK ANY OF MY STUFF...
IF PEOPLE WOULD STOP THE HATE AND GREED
THAT COMES WITH THE INTERNET...THEY WILL FIND
A WELL INFORMATION AND MAYBE JUST MAYBE FATTEN THEIR BANK ACCOUNT IN THE PROCESS.
ONE LOVE
JUMPIN
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sulyn1950
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posted on May 6, 2001 09:41:33 PM new
Admitedly, a lot of my auction description was information that is obtainable from an instruction manual...
Did you have permission to use the text from the camera manual from the owner/s of that material?
I'm not trying to be troublesome here, I believe if you want to use someone elses copy or photos, you need to get permission. There are people who probably don't realize they need to do that. I think you are even suppose to get permission before you copy anything from a book, manual or catalog.
[ edited by sulyn1950 on May 6, 2001 09:52 PM ]
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mcjane
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posted on May 6, 2001 11:13:30 PM new
jumpinjacko I KNEW you would say that.
Thanks, will probably take you up on it when I dump PayPal. Just copied & pasted it for the future. It really IS good.
In the long run more money can be made on the internet the honest way. Crooks are too dumb to know that, they can't see beyond tomorrow.
By the way, are you in the picture? Which one is you?
You have some great bargains I just might be a customer when I find something I need. I didn't check all your auctions yet.
Jane
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