posted on May 26, 2001 03:35:05 PM
How about a new negative feedback category. Any negative feedback tied to a nonpaying bidders refund be put in a separate category.
Feedback should show that if a person did not complete their transaction properly than they should get negative feedback. Too many sellers don't neg the deadbeats for fear of retaliation. So how about a retaliatory negative feedback category for transactions where the auction is not completed due to nonpayment. These feedback should not effect the sellers overall feedback numbers.
If a seller files a non paying bidder and then a final value credit that feedback would go in a separate category for negative feedback. Then buyers will know if a seller is living up to his or her TOS.
This would only apply in non payment situations. This would provide a more honest representation of a seller. Save a buyer from looking through hundreds of feedbacks.
posted on May 26, 2001 04:06:32 PM
We've been asking for separate feedbacks for a long time. Don't know why they can't do it, but the best thing for a bidder is, if you see negatives, look for the reasons. It's well worth it. No one should go by the feedback # alone.
posted on May 26, 2001 04:08:33 PM
I am in that situation right now. A zero feedback bidder was a deadbeat. He has also bid on and won at least 15 of the same item. I filed an NPB but don't want to leave a neg because he could retaliate. I recently received a neg from a nonpaying bidder. She has since been NARU but ebay, of course, won't remove the neg.
I would love to leave a neg especially to help warn the other sellers but won't because of retaliation.
No other sellers have left feedback either.
He keeps bidding and winning. One seller that I was in contact with reported him to safeharbor. They basically said there was nothing they could do.
posted on May 26, 2001 04:13:31 PM
Here is the reply from ebay in response to reporting that this bidder is bidding on a bunch of the same item and not paying. Not much help at all as you can see.
Hello,
Thank you for contacting us about this situation.
As a seller, you do have control over your auction and the types of
bidders who bid on your items. Below I have listed some steps to
consider to assure a successful auction experience.
1. You may want to consider adding to your listing that you aren't
accepting bids from members who have a pattern of negative feedback. You
will want to specify what you consider to be excessive, such as members
with 5 negative feedback comments in the last month, for an example.
2. Follow through with that specification. Check the feedback profile
of the bidders on your items. This will give you an idea of the type of
member you are planning to conduct business with.
3. If a member who you feel is not qualified to bid on your auctions
(based on the standards you posted in your listing) or a member that you
are not comfortable dealing with has bid on your item, you may want to
consider canceling their bid. Before you cancel the bid however, please
consider emailing the member first to get their side of the situation.
If you still wish to cancel their bid, you may use the link I have
listed below:
http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?CancelBidShow
You may also reach the Bid Cancellation screen from the bid history page
of your auction.
posted on May 26, 2001 04:17:51 PM
Nothing they can do until you and the others do the right thing. Neg the person. 4 and the bidder is gone!
Don't ever be afraid of retaliatory feedback.
First of all, even if he does leave it, you can explain it. Secondly, if he does leave it, one look at his and one look at yours and people know why it was left for you.
All you have to do is leave factual and unemotional feedback.
Good luck and don't let a deadbeat intimidate you.
posted on May 26, 2001 04:46:37 PMIf Ebay had any guts, they would make this an administrative negative feedback for nonpayment.
They could tie it to the Final Value Fee refunds.
Amen.
Don't ever be afraid of retaliatory feedback.
First of all, even if he does leave it, you can explain it. Secondly, if he does leave it, one look at his and one look at yours and people know why it was left for you.
All you have to do is leave factual and unemotional feedback.
Nope. Won't work. Most bidders (especially newbies which comprise 85% of my bidders) won't even read the comments. They just see a honking red negative.
I've never left a neg for a deadbeat and I never will under the current feedback system. Wouldn't be prudent.
Most newbies don't click on the feedback number beside your ID. They don't read anything except the number and if you have 200 or 10 or 500, that's all they see. It's important to read feedback, but they don't.
I only received one retaliatory and that was from a seller who stole my money when I first started on ebay! The other negative was left in error by a newbie. Nothing I can do about that one.
If everyone was afraid of retaliatory feedback, the feedback system might as well go by the wayside.
posted on May 26, 2001 04:58:01 PM
Of course, eBay could do it, if they wanted to. They don't want to...simple as that.
They want the onus to be on us. No thanks. Since it's no longer a community...I don't have to pretend I'm a member. I don't have to police their site, either. And I won't.
posted on May 26, 2001 05:25:59 PM
If I did leave the neg that this guy deserves and he retaliates that would mean I would have 2 negs in the past month. Both unjustified! If ebay removed the negs once they investigated, I could live with that. But we all know, that is not how it works.
In addition, Ebay keeps getting listing fees for all of these relisted items!
posted on May 26, 2001 05:28:38 PM
Pal, you can respond to those negatives in your file.
You can also plead to ebay billing and ask them to refund your listing fees. Sometimes you can get someone who takes pity and does refund. It's worth a try.
posted on May 26, 2001 05:41:37 PM
I just got negged twice, from a deadbeat who won over 100 auctions in the last month. I gave them every opportunity to pay. I gave them two negatives, they came back the next day and got me, they said that they were in the hospital for several days and was unable to send payment. That is intersting because they managed to bid every single day for a month, they even said I refused to take payment. It is not so bad, you get over it. They have received 9 more negs and are on their way out the door, till next time.
Complaint: very rude does not care at all about others offered to pay and refused
Complaint: was in hospital, very rude, made me realize that there are horrible people
I was in the hospital for a week last month, I managed to have my auctions taken care of.
posted on May 26, 2001 05:57:53 PMDid it ever occur to any of you...
that you cannot have a separate category for what you perceive as retaliatory negs because you are going with the presumption that the seller is in the right and the buyer is in the wrong. We know the games buyers can play, but what's to stop a dishonest seller from filing an NPB and negging an honest buyer who has complained about lousy service? Nothing.
The inability to actually know what happened and who is right is the primary reason why Ebay, rightfully, does not get in the middle of these feedback squabbles.
I can honestly say, after several years as a buyer and seller on Ebay, I am not sure whether there are more unscrupulous, inconsiderate buyers OR sellers.
The feedback system is about as fair as it's ever going to be.
posted on May 26, 2001 06:15:08 PM
I recently saw a seller who had a blacklist of buyers with whom they would not deal. They posted the blacklist in their TOS. I also checked to see if they left negative feedback on those people. They had not. I am not sure that the blacklist is such a bad idea.
Yes, there are unscrupulous sellers and bidders. The buyer who was given negative feedback and had a NPB filed against them for negative feedback because they complained of bad service, has recourse.
All they have to do is file their receipt, copy of their check, credit card statement, history from pay pal, or any of the other services with safe harbor to prove that they paid. That seller should be kicked off for filing an illegal NPB.
posted on May 27, 2001 12:09:18 AM
I have suggested to eBay many times that once you file an NPB alert, both parties are prevented from leaving each other feedback. If an FVF is filed, then the seller is permitted to leave a FB in the winners account, but no feedback is permitted in the sellers account.
Conversly if a buyer files a non delivery complaint against a seller, neither are allowed to leave each other FB until it's resolved.
Obviously they didn't go for it, because it makes sense and it's too easy to implement.
If you'll re-read Stingray777's post above, you'll realize that your idea--and the reason Ebay didn't fgo for it--is because it doesn't make any sense.
You are basically giving the advantage to whomever strikes FIRST--without regard for who may actually be RIGHT vs. wrong in the transaction.
I don't know why so many people have such a difficult time understanding this concept.
The ONLY people who really know what took place in a transaction are the buyer and the seller. A bad seller, fearing a neg, could easily strike first and make an accusation against an honest bidder, and an honest seller can easily fall victim to a dishonest buyer who may strike first.
Don't you get it?????
Ebay CANNOT pick sides in feeback, because Ebay really cannot know who was right and who was wrong.
The feedback system is about as good as it's ever going to get.
posted on May 28, 2001 07:02:43 AM
Ah feedback, everyone's favorite gripe!
Pal, don't worry about whether folks are leaving negs for this buyer, what is important is that the sellers all file FVF's. After 3, he is gone. (Allegedly, according to eBay... )
I personally would like to see another number on the feedback page, one for FVF's filed against a user. They could list the reason stated, and not include the one's like "Both parties mutually agreed not to complete sale".
I would also like to see users get an administrative suspension for 2 NPB's instead of 3. 30 days for 2, permanent for 3.
How about immediate suspension for the yahoo's that do BIN and never pay?
NO feedback should be able to be left for at least 48 hrs after an auction closes. For those kids who bid and immediately leave negs.
Appletime / Stingray has some good points. We are stuck with the system because ebay can't always tell who is telling the truth. BUT, if you have proof, like threatening email's, reciepts for payment and the like, they SHOULD be able to do something about it. If that weren't the case, then why does the $15 square trade option even exist?
posted on May 29, 2001 06:13:51 AM
I like yahoos feedback system for one reason-you can "click" on the negative feedbacks. Ebay should have this feature also.If i see some seller who has a 600 feedback,do i really care about reading postive feedbacks-NOT. I only care about the negatives and what problems hes had in the past-that goes for buyers and sellers.
