posted on June 8, 2001 11:34:54 AM
I'm getting sick of fee increase after fee increase! It's bad enough eBay and the Postal Service continue to raise fees, but when unecessary services like PayPal do it, how the heck is a seller supposed to maintain sales margins and keep buyer costs respectable???
What kind of wording do you guys put in your auction listings to state no PayPal payment accepted? Are you blunt, give any explanation or what? I'd like to eliminate PayPal payments altogether!
posted on June 8, 2001 11:47:26 AMWhat kind of wording do you guys put in your auction listings to state no PayPal payment accepted?
My auctions say:
Personal checks and money orders OK. I also accept payment through PayDirect.
Occasionally, I'll get a bidder who asks about PayPal, but I just explain that since it now costs me $1.50 to have them send me my money, I no longer accept payment through them, and nobody has put up a fuss yet.
Are you sure you need to offer PayPal?
edited... speling
[ edited by mrpotatoheadd on Jun 8, 2001 11:48 AM ]
posted on June 8, 2001 11:53:05 AM
I stopped using PP about a year ago, and don't miss it one bit. As far as the verbage in my auctions, I just include the payment options that I do accept, BillPoint, checks, etc... No mention of PP at all. Occasionally, I'll have someone ask and I'll tell them that I don't accept PP becuase of some of their questionable business practices, and they are free to pay with any of the other methods I have listed. Once, in the last year I had someone pay with PP without asking, and I informed them to cancel payment, they did and sent me a check. In my opinion, if you include the word "PayPal" anywhere in your auction listing wether or not it is to accept or not to accept it, a lot of the time, people won't read the details and just assume that they can pay that way.
Nope, don't have any need to offer PayPal. My auctions don't even state I offer PayPal but sure enough some person will send me a PayPal payment regardless. I hate being a jerk and refusing the payment so I accept it. No more! I need some strong wording that will prevent any of these mishaps from occurring in the future. I want NOTHING to do with PayPal and their fees! I'll make do with BillPoint and Yahoo PayDirect for electronic payments.
posted on June 8, 2001 12:06:33 PM
These recent increase also has me a bit disapointed.
The new rate increase is making me reevaluate my payment options and will most likely lead to me opening a Billpoint account. This will provide me with more options and an opportunity to react when changes are made by either online payment company. I'll simply go with whoever offers the best deal for the level of service that is provided, subject to immediate change.
Paypal gets an average of 50-100 payments from us each week. If we open a billpoint account, you can bet that this number will be substantially reduced. The end result is that Paypal's increase will COST them money, instead of making them money. Shortsighted in my opinion. What else is new...
Another thing, if that *&+!#^& bidder notification doesn't get fixed in the next few days, I'm going to pull my business all together from these guys. I can't even get a straight *$^&@% answer on wheter or not it's working at all! Their "small bug" now seems to be effecting all users of this service. Is it working yes or no? Who the hell knows...
posted on June 8, 2001 12:18:00 PMI need some strong wording that will prevent any of these mishaps from occurring in the future.
I don't know- being harsh with your customers doesn't seem to be the best way to go. No matter what you say, there will always be somebody who will still try to pay you through PayPal without asking first. The best remedy, in my opinion is:
1) Change the email address associated with your PayPal account to one that bidders can't guess. If you decide to use the account, you can always tell them later, but they can't send money to you without first contacting you.
2) When the inevitable does occur ("You've got cash!" and somebody has tried to send you money to an email address not yet associated with your account, just tell the bidder that, because of the fees involved with PayPal payments, you've stopped accepting them in order to keep buyers' costs down.
This has worked just fine for me- not a single complaint since I quit using PayPal as a payment option.
posted on June 8, 2001 12:18:42 PM
I haven't read the latest PayPal terms, but if they're going to charge 2.2% on the total received INCLUDING SHIPPING, that has to be the last straw! What gives them the right to screw us out of necessary shipping fees??? I seriously hope eBay eliminates PayPal from their site altogether. Then again BillPoint may go Fee crazy using their newfound monopoly power!
posted on June 8, 2001 12:23:29 PM
eseller004 - if you don't want buyers to send payment to your PP account, then try this: They must have your email account in order to successfully send you a PP payment. The only email account of yours that buyers know about is the one that you have registered with ebay. Get yourself a secondary email account (like Hotmail, Yahoo, etc) if you don't already have one. Register the second email on your Paypal account, then remove the one used for ebay.
I will admit that I haven't tried this myself - does anybody know if this will work? It's just an idea.
posted on June 8, 2001 12:48:51 PM
My imaging hosting service sent end of auction notices out stating that I did accept PayPal, so I was stuck. I do keep an account with a different email address for international bidders.
posted on June 8, 2001 01:06:04 PM
I am very satisified with my Paypal account - its been a great way to collect my payments and with my debit card, make purchases of supplies, inventory, and pay the USPS while getting the 1.5% cash back - this along with interest on the funds in my account helped a great deal to offset the fees I paid to Paypal.
I will be seriously re-evaluating my position as a Paypal Preferred seller on Ebay - the savings on fees of offering Billpoint may well offset the loss of 1.5% on my purchases via the Debit Card. While I've always offered Billpoint and Bidpay in my EOA notices, it may help bring more visitors to my listings if I allowed Billpoint back in...
Although I've heard a lot lately about Billpoint Nightmares re: chargebacks - so I really dont' know if they're any better.
posted on June 8, 2001 01:08:26 PM
Another possibility would be to open a Personal Account and allow Paypal payments to flow through that instead.... credit card payments could go to my business account when necessary.. Hmmmmm
posted on June 8, 2001 01:09:29 PM
I always put in my item description "since paypal isnt FDIC insured they are not accepted for your protection". I have had many customers thank me for showing them articles about paypal. Trust me you dont need paypal, they need you!
posted on June 8, 2001 01:11:25 PM
Well kids i hate to tell you this but i just went over to the pay pal home page, went to the "business" sign up link, hit it, went to the fees, saw that nasty new rate hike, hit the "see fee schedule" for reciving payments and quess what, there it was agian 2.2%+the 30 cents, so pray tell what's tat mean??thay didn't wait till june 29??? and where is pay pal damon???? is this legal to "just do it" and full speed ahead and the hell with the consequences??just amazing!!!
I realize fee increases are never popular, but I would like to mention that PayPal users can reduce the fees by going PayPal Preferred. In addition, users that are PayPal preferred are not charged for charge backs ($10.00) received, so there are still quite a few benefits and protections offered that you do not find with many, if any, other payment service.
I do appreciate your comments and I will be directing them.
posted on June 8, 2001 01:47:58 PM
Let's see here....
If I accepted 3 $10 payments from Billpoint - my total fees would be
At $.35 / payment = $1.05 and deposited into my account for no extra fee (because each payment was less than $15)
For the same 3 $10 payments via Paypal, assuming I then made a $30 payment via my Debit card to get the 1.5% cash back
$10 * 2.2% plus $.30 = $.52 per payment * 3 = $1.56
Less 1.5% cash back on $30 payment = $.45
Net fee to Paypal = $1.11 - so just 6 cents more - plus I get interest from the money market... (not MUCH right now, granted).
But look at 3 payments of $2 (that's the minimum Paypal Payment I've ever gotten).
Billpoint is again $1.05.
$2 * 2.2% + .30 = $.34 * 3 = $1.03
Less Paypal Preferred Discount 1.5% on $6 less 9 cents = $.94
Now Paypal has the slight edge...
Its just a few cents worth, but over 100's of transactions - with slim profit margins - this could be significant.
I do feel some comfort in knowing the Paypal Preferred Status protects me from the $10 fee, on top of the protection of the Seller Protection Program which protects me from Chargebacks as well...
Like a lot of sellers, I'll be increasing my handling fees a little bit come July 1 to cover increased Paypal fees and postal rates...
posted on June 8, 2001 02:15:52 PM
I use the Paypal Debit card for every trip to the post office to ship packages out, for purchasing boxes, bubble mailers, plastic sleeves, and toploaders for shipping, for paying my suppliers for inventory purchases, and for my Ebay fees.
You don't have to make a purchase within a time limit of the money being received to get the cashback....
Also, if in a given month, things are slow and I have payments to make and haven't received many Paypal payments, I can fund my account via my bank account - $0 fees on that money coming into my account, and I can get the cashback bonus on it - so I'd actually be MAKING money on those kinds of transactions...
Paypal never (to my knowledge) said you could ELIMINATE fees via the cashback program, just reduce them - which it does.
And yes, not accepting Paypal would mean no fees, but I accept it as a convenience for my buyers, and they are still asking for it.
posted on June 8, 2001 03:14:04 PM
I closed my account with Paypal in November of last year. I haven't regretted it once, and my sales have not suffered at all.
Since then, I've tried EVERYTHING to *NOT* get those "You've got cash!" emails every week.
I put the NO PAYPAL logos with the red line through it in my auctions. I even made a MARQUEE of it once! I tried just stating "NO PAYPAL" in my auctions. I have tried not mentioning the horrible P-word at all. Nothing works. Every week I would still get "You've got cash!" emails from bidders that refuse to read and/or pay attention.
Lately, though, it's gotten much better and I only get about 1 or 2 of those stupid emails every week.
Yesterday I received an email from a customer who AFTER HE WON my auction, decided to email me and tell me how upset he was that I would not accept Paypal.
I responded to him, telling him how I felt about Paypal, and why I like and trust Billpoint.
Here is his email in response:
I do not need to hear your horror stories. I have been registered with 5 different auction sites, and still use 3 of them(the others closed). I have used Billpoint hardly at all, but have used Paypal countless times and have not had any problems. My transactions whether through a bank account, Paypal balance or credit cards have always gone smoothly, whether I was the buyer or seller. I am afraid your information is a bit messed up. I have checked out many thousands of auctions on eBay and find that Paypal is still listed as a payment option the majority of the time, much more so than Billpoint. Billpoint charges higher fees than Paypal, no matter what they try to say, and the funds are not as readily available for use as the funds in a Paypal account. Do not badmouth Paypal to people just because someone told you a horror story. You completed over a thousand transactions through Paypal, so closing your account seems a rather odd thing to do after completing so many successful transactions with them! Ever think the problems could be with people's BANKS and not Paypal? I will continue to look for auctions that list Paypal as a payment option, with actual shipping charges listed in the auction, and avoid all others. The majority of auctions fall into the categories I described, and sellers who aren't willing to use Paypal and list shipping charges w/o any ridicuolus handling fees will not get any more business from me, sorry. Your money order will go out within the next few days.
Keep in mind, this was AFTER he also asked me to send him a Billpoint invoice. After I sent him the billpoint invoice, he "decided" he's not comfortable using them.
I tried explaining to him, that out of the 1000 transactions I had with Paypal, I have SEVERAL problems with them myself. That these were not just "stories" I heard. I told him if he wanted to hear REAL horror stories about Paypal, to come to the AW message boards and read for himself!
Here is just 2 lines of his reponse:
I do not want to continue in any kind of e-mail argument with you. If that is what you are seeking, I suggest you go to the message boards and deal with those nasty people who do nothing but complain.
Needless to say, I did not respond to him again. I was just trying to clear something up, but some people you can't talk to rationally.
[ edited by ExecutiveGirl on Jun 8, 2001 03:17 PM ]
posted on June 9, 2001 11:14:35 AM
I noticed my buyers using Paypal less, they are paying me more with my regular merchant account, by money order and check. I think many buyers are just as annoyed as the sellers!!!
posted on June 9, 2001 12:58:07 PM
I've not had trouble with PayPal. I agree with the financial analysis above, except: I don't want their debit card or to leave money in there for 3.25% interest. I don't trust them, and if they lock my account, it will have a minimal amount in it.
It is still cheaper than Billpoint except for auctions between $2.25 and $15.
Billpoint feels more solid.
I'll continue to take both as long as some significant number of buyers want to use them. I think, though, that most buyers don't really care whether PayPal or Billpoint.
The most irritating factor:
I had to find out about the fee increase (could spit on the word simplification today) here instead of at PayPal!
and somebody has tried to send you money to an email address not yet associated with your account, just tell the bidder that, because of the fees involved with PayPal payments, you've stopped accepting them in order to keep buyers' costs down.
