I'm sure this topic has been covered in another thread, but I couldn't find my problem specifically.
Last month I had a buyer on a $100 item who paid via PayPal with a credit card. The buyer didn't include a "confirmed address." This happens a lot to me and I always accept the payment. Well, the guy was pleased with the item and purchased another item for $150 and also paid with Paypal. Today I received 2 e-mails from PayPal saying the transactions were made with a fraudulent credit card, and they took the money out of my account.
PayPal seller protection says you have to ship to the confirmed address in order to be covered by the seller protection. Any ideas on whether or not I'll get my $250 back??? What should my next step be? I've already e-mailed Paypal with all the information they need.
posted on September 24, 2001 11:58:30 AM
Unfortunately, I don't think you'll see your money. I had this happen to me as well, although the buyer only hit me once and for a lot less than you're out.
This is not unlike what happens in the B&M world. I used to work for a mail order company a long time ago. When someone bought items on a stolen credit card, of course by the time we found out about it, the merchandise had long been shipped. And the company was out the money and the merchandise.
posted on September 24, 2001 12:18:38 PM
There's a reason to empty out your PayPal account EACH AND EVERY DAY! They can't swipe funds from your bank account for fraud and I'm guessing they can't charge your credit card either. They might freeze your account but that's another story ...
posted on September 24, 2001 12:49:41 PM
Actually, I don't think they'll freeze your account. What happened in my case was they debited my PayPal account in the amount of the chargeback. For example, in your case, you might see a minus $250 balance (if your account was zero), or let's say you had $300 in your PayPal account. Then you'll all of a sudden see that balance drop down to $50.00. So PayPal will get their money back one way or the other, just like any credit card issuing company who does a chargeback on a B&M business.
posted on September 24, 2001 12:59:12 PM
If you have nothing in your account and they try to debit $250, what happens if you never use or fund the account again? Is PayPal out of luck? It's easy enough to switch to another payment service like BillPoint, C2it or Yahoo PayDirect.
The Seller Protection Program is fairly clear on how to eliminate liability for chargebacks. However, if you did not, then you will have a liability for the chargeback, which can be deducted out of your PayPal account,charged to the credit/debit card on file, or through other means. Emptying out your PayPal account will not eliminate the liability.
My apologies for the issue you have had with this buyer.
posted on September 24, 2001 01:41:21 PMIf you have nothing in your account and they try to debit $250, what happens if you never use or fund the account again? Is PayPal out of luck?
In such cases, PayPal is about as out of luck as, say, a cell phone company is when you refuse to pay the bill.
Which is to say, it won't be long before it is turned over to collections. It's a legal debt, you have to pay it.
posted on September 24, 2001 01:47:01 PMThe Seller Protection Program is fairly clear on how to eliminate liability for chargebacks
Paypaldamon, shame on you. That statement continues the propagation of misleading information from paypal.
You KNOW that you cannot ELIMINATE liability for chargebacks, even with the seller protection program. You KNOW this program does NOT cover quality of goods chargebacks, which, as you well know, is often used as a reason to return goods you are not happy with for one reason or another.
Please do not continue to give false security, when chargeback liability CANNOT be ELIMINATED.
Edited for lousy html
[ edited by kidsfeet on Sep 24, 2001 01:47 PM ]
posted on September 24, 2001 01:57:26 PM
Hi kidsfeet,
My apologies for not being clear that the Seller Protection Policy only applies to claims of non-delivery/fraudulent credit card usage. Thank you for bringing it to my attention.
No, there is no way to completely eliminate chargeback liability, but there are ways to reduce your overall risk (from the above items). There is no way for us to control individual consumer behavior for quality disputes.
posted on September 24, 2001 06:18:35 PM
Well, I was getting ready to ask about the same thing...though I haven't had a chargeback but have a payment sitting there with accept or deny. It is only 45.00 and the bidder has 25 positive feedbacks. The account is unverified and the addressed is unconfirmed. Vote yes or no....would you accept? or deny? Thanks
posted on September 24, 2001 06:43:15 PM..."The Seller Protection Program is fairly clear on how to eliminate liability for chargebacks"...
And how does paypal propose that we use the seller protection plan when we encourage new customers to sign up and send money immediately. Not much we can do except send to unverified address.
posted on September 24, 2001 11:13:58 PM
If you want to eliminate chargebacks, DO NOT accept credit (or PP debit) card payments. This means you must only accept PP payments from the buyer's existing PP balance or as an EFT/eCheck from the buyer's bank account that is registered with PP.
Be prepared to eat a chargeback if:
1--The card was stolen/fraudulent and you didn't follow ALL the "Seller Protection" steps. (Note the long-running, bitter exceptions to even this statement in past PP threads...).
2--The buyer does a chargeback claiming a "quality of goods" problem. PP (with some justification) will NEVER get in the middle of a dogfight over a "quality of goods" claim. Problem is that this is also the perfect cover for buyer's remorse or worse.
posted on September 25, 2001 06:13:02 AM
paypaldemon, as long as you are on the line here, I have a question. I understand that if a buyer asks for a chargeback, for whatever reason, you immediately honor it without communication with the seller. Is the true? And if so, why?
posted on September 25, 2001 08:27:04 AMI understand that if a buyer asks for a chargeback, for whatever reason, you immediately honor it without communication with the seller. Is the true? And if so, why?
Chargebacks are granted by credit card companies, not by PayPal. The equivalent of a chargeback is granted by PayPal to a buyer only in some cases of non-shipment of the package.
PayPal absorbs most chargebacks for sellers who follow the rules. One of the rules, not surprisingly, is that the seller must have proof of shipment.
In fact, the occasionally discussed "quality of merchandise" chargeback can be avoided simply by accepting a return and refunding. Those complaining the hardest are sellers who think it is just fine to stick a buyer with a disappointing purchase. Some of them are in the business of selling merchandise already returned to a store, and they expect a buyer to buy the stuff "as is" with no right of return if it turns out to be dysfunctional. Credit card companies won't defend such sales.
posted on September 25, 2001 09:00:09 AM
Well said, roofguy. I agree and have had no problem with paypal. Thanks for the reminder, and that pretty much answers my question.
posted on September 25, 2001 09:30:51 AMThose complaining the hardest are sellers who think it is just fine to stick a buyer with a disappointing purchase.
So roofguy if I buy something from you and I find something kinda, sorta (but not the same size, quality etc.) like it for less money, will you accept a return and give me a full refund so I can buy that kinda, sorta (but not exactly) like it merchandise from someone else?
"Quality of merchandise" claims don't always involve "quality."
Sometimes buyers aren't really disappointed with the item's quality -- they're just disappointed with their own lack of homework and have a rip-roarin' case of "buyer's remorse."
posted on September 25, 2001 09:37:45 AM
This ain't about me, but I do exactly as you suggest. "You don't like it, I take it back, no argument, fast refund."
Secondly, on those occasions where a buyer complains, I begin my response with "Be assured, if you want to return this for a complete refund, no argument here". I find that this introduction:
1. puts the buyer in a relaxed frame of mind. No fight will be necessary.
2. allows me the option figuring the situation out, and when appropriate, refusing to do anything better than that.
It's easy enough to switch to another payment service like BillPoint, C2it or Yahoo PayDirect.
)